Who replaces Ten Hag?

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Lash said:
They were going to be with the squad for the season, he couldn't just freeze them out and in the case of Maguire literally had no other choice but to play him recently. With Scotts form, was hard to not play him and has played well against city previously.

The squad is the squad for the season though. I don't think they should be in the team, but the suggestion they shouldn't have played is a bit naive as well, when trying to manage an already shaky, squad morale.
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Yes. It makes no sense to complain about the manager using depth players when he is in need of using them, due to circumstance. Because they are, well, the players the squad consists of, for better or worse.

However I will complain about starting Jonny Evans over an available Varane against City for explicitly "tactical reasons".
 
stefan92 said:
I tend to agree that Favre as a coach could be a good fit for this squad. As we see they can't turn high turnovers into goals, and Favre would likely defend much deeper than EtH's first line does - should also give Rashford the space he needs and currently rarely gets. Sancho is a valid idea at least - but don't expect them to be buddies, Favre benched and banned him from the squad as well, albeit never for long.

Favre also is a manager who has proven that he can quickly stabilize struggling teams and considering how focused he is on details he should be able to improve a lot of players individually.

But the downside definitely is that he never appeared to have talent to deal with media circus and a lot of attention.
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I realize that. But they do not need to be buddies, I could only hope there would be some basis of mutual trust and appreciation that might be enough to open the door. And Favre has funnily shown that while he is a stubborn and sometimes prickly character himself, he has gotten the best out of difficult characters without buddying up. Max Kruse excelled under him too (not so much Pantelic though).
I am stubborn to the idea, let us call it desperate hope, because contrary to what most posters here have convinced themselves of, Sancho was THAT good for Dortmund, and that we could not utilize him at all continues to be just fecking depressing and tragic to me. It just hurts. That Sancho would be the best we have, heads and shoulders above. But I do not know whether Sancho's head and mindset is not too far gone already to turn it around, it seems to be the case.

Surely the club's overall policy should not be shaped to cater to a rogue player. But if Ten Hag fails anyway and we need a caretaker, this aspect would be a little bonus argument for Favre, among loads of other arguments to be weighed for and against.
 
I championed Gallardo as a wildcard and Ancelotti as more of a sure thing yesterday but I also just want to add Ruben Amorim. Apart from a difficult season last year, he's done really well at Sporting. I actually think his 3421 formation could work pretty well at United. Amorim has a huge release clause though (circa £20m/£30m) and, given our history with managers in recent seasons, it's a big gamble.
 
Does it matter who replaces him... same shit you get.
VAR wont change whoever is in charge. . ETH won't get the sack , not yet anyway.. just suck it up this is how it's going to be welcome to the late 70s early 80s Utd .. at least those teams won a few FA cups.. ..
 
Didnt Pep basically say after the derby game that even he wouldn’t succeed at United without having the right structures & vision in place?
 
There is no one available who could turn this around, ETH deserves time because of his first season performance and literally there is not a manager out there who is both qualified for the role and willing to come.

We have these big players on big wages, long contracts.... player power is rife....dressing room leaks.... off the field antics,....not to mention the owners-- there is real toxicity around.

I still feel ETH is the man to take us forward in the long term but he must look at his in game management and also look at what he says to the press which are two areas i think he has lost fans support in recent weeks.
 
Rams said:
Didnt Pep basically say after the derby game that even he wouldn’t succeed at United without having the right structures & vision in place?
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Guardiola plays with and takes the piss out of our fans. He'll dangle exactly the right carrot to rile up our fanbase.
 
ayushreddevil9 said:
Do you really call scoring 2 goals in a 5 minute cameo when we were throwing the sink at Brentford at home 'good form'? He played well against city in...january last year? How many times do you wanna get let down to understand that this guy needs to be kicked out?

Its utter naivety to believe that these had 'good' form against Sheffield, Brentford and Copenhagen. We barely won these games anyways so not sure what good form is these days. These have always let us down in important games, and will continue to do so.
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It's relative though, surely you can see that? He's currently our top scorer in the league, how can you not play someone who's the only player actually scoring for us at the moment? There's no one who you could hang your hat on in big games currently, so it's right that he played. That speaks to the state of the team's form and squad in itself, but I think your being harsh on both of them here.
FortunaUtd said:
Yes. It makes no sense to complain about the manager using depth players when he is in need of using them, due to circumstance. Because they are, well, the players the squad consists of, for better or worse.

However I will complain about starting Jonny Evans over an available Varane against City for explicitly "tactical reasons".
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I think that is a valid criticism, if that is the case, seemed an unwise choice. I think Varane will start Wednesday though, so I think it will be in part to fitness too.
 
If the first team manager is replaced and the current structure around the manager is left in place then we will just be back in the same place in a year to 18 months time. I'm afraid that is where the club is now, in need of reform.
 
Would Sir Alex walk out onto the training grounds and look Scottish at the players once more?
 
There seems to be a feeling Ratcliffe would appoint Potter,however the Chelsea job makes me worry he couldn't manage big players and the pressure of this club.

I will admit I know very little about the likes of Amorim/Gallardo/Rose,obviously Nagelsmann has just took the Germany job after Flick had a bad time with them.

Really not keen on Simeone due to his style of football,however he would certainly get players buying into him. Again Zidane is a huge name but think he has no desire to manage in England whatsoever.

Now Alonso is an interesting one because much like Arteta he has that Spanish style,however feels like he is waiting for Real/Spain or maybe even replacing Klopp eventually.
 
croadyman said:
Now Alonso is an interesting one because much like Arteta he has that Spanish style,however feels like he is waiting for Real/Spain or maybe even replacing Klopp eventually.
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Bayern also like him a lot and will sitely try to get him when they need a new manager.
 
yamo123x said:
There is no one available who could turn this around, ETH deserves time because of his first season performance and literally there is not a manager out there who is both qualified for the role and willing to come.

We have these big players on big wages, long contracts.... player power is rife....dressing room leaks.... off the field antics,....not to mention the owners-- there is real toxicity around.

I still feel ETH is the man to take us forward in the long term but he must look at his in game management and also look at what he says to the press which are two areas i think he has lost fans support in recent weeks.
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How does he improve in game management?
 
stefan92 said:
I tend to agree that Favre as a coach could be a good fit for this squad. As we see they can't turn high turnovers into goals, and Favre would likely defend much deeper than EtH's first line does - should also give Rashford the space he needs and currently rarely gets. Sancho is a valid idea at least - but don't expect them to be buddies, Favre benched and banned him from the squad as well, albeit never for long.

Favre also is a manager who has proven that he can quickly stabilize struggling teams and considering how focused he is on details he should be able to improve a lot of players individually.

But the downside definitely is that he never appeared to have talent to deal with media circus and a lot of attention.
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I like Favre a lot, but he has a small club mindset (e.g. "a draw is always a good result") that wouldn't work at United. He needs an underdog club.
 
Clearly because if how inept our directors are, the main priority is we need a manager that has a track record of being good within the transfer market and judging a player's character, none of the managers have got this right since being here, moyes dithered and had mid table tactics, lvg has never been good with transfers, same with ole who struggled to be good judge of a player character, mourinho was OK but was only ever thinking short term and brought in a few players at the end of their peak, ten hag recruitment has been real mess.
 
Some of the names bandied about are Farcical. Potter / Amorim. Geez. Sir Jim if he decides on a change will have done his homework. If results don’t improve we may be forced to act. Who is the question but get real folks.
 
Jaae said:
Carlo Ancelotti - The Don - is the only one.
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His laid back style wouldn't work at current United.
It works at RM because players start to slacks, fans would boo them, wait after matches and Perez would sold them to the first bidder.
 
SparkedIntoLife said:
I championed Gallardo as a wildcard and Ancelotti as more of a sure thing yesterday but I also just want to add Ruben Amorim. Apart from a difficult season last year, he's done really well at Sporting. I actually think his 3421 formation could work pretty well at United. Amorim has a huge release clause though (circa £20m/£30m) and, given our history with managers in recent seasons, it's a big gamble.
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I love Ancelotti. One of my favs of all time but he’ll absolutely bomb here. It’s setup for failure. He’ll be pulling his hair out in the league but if he brings in some better coaches I’m all for it.

We’ll attract better players with him as manager too but yet again we’ll have him 10 years too late. Like everything we do we are behind the times.

If we could get Nagelsmann after him I’d be okay with it… We aren’t winning anything of note in the next half decade so Carlo would be good vibes at least.
 
Amsterdam Devil said:
Maybe with some really experienced assistents then, Meulensteen or others.
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Can we not go back in time please. United should be looking for best in class and experience now.

We need to stabilise the club and bring in quality footballers if a manager change is made. Carrick would be an awful choice as he doesn’t attract players and has zero credit in the bank.

I saw what him and McKenna did in the Ole reign and quite honestly wasn’t strong enough. He’s Prem level maybe but it’s laughable to say he’s United manager level (if we even still class ourselves as a CL side…)
 
FortunaUtd said:
However I will complain about starting Jonny Evans over an available Varane against City for explicitly "tactical reasons".
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Lash said:
I think that is a valid criticism, if that is the case, seemed an unwise choice. I think Varane will start Wednesday though, so I think it will be in part to fitness too.
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Actually I have to row back a bit here. I had not seen Ten Hag's detailed explanation for the 'tactical' decision of Evans over Varane, which he gave in the post match presser.
His reasoning was that with City expected to press our buildup, he was not comfortable with Maguire or Varane as left CBs as you would "end up playing only long balls", so that is apparently where Evans comes in, and he also said he thinks Maguire is better on the right.

So basically Varane had to be sacrificed in order to accommodate Maguire at right CB.
That means
a) that he trusts Varane even less at LCB than Maguire
b) he trusts Evans there over both
and c) for some reason he also then preferred Maguire at RCB next to Evans rather than having Varane there and Maguire on the bench

I cannot sit here and claim to argue against Ten Hags tactical deliberations and reasons for b), they will be important, and what do I know.
But c) seems puzzling. Not to mention then having a right-footed CB in Lindelof playing left back over Reguilon.

But it also goes to show how throroughly fecked we are with the simultaneous absences of Martinez and Shaw if these are the dilemmas Ten Hag is facing.
My opinion has settled down, it is not the right time to sack him, we will have to wait and see a bit longer. The decision will have to be made once the season progresses for next summer.

However he seems rattled, defensive, and disheartened, and he is not the souvereign and resilient figure of last season. The feeling is that he is failing and he knows it.
 
If the rumours of Paul Mitchell come to fruition then the only outcome i'd like to see - out of the current crop of managers out there - is Julian Nagelsmann, correct me if i'm wrong but he brought Nagelsmann to Leipzig in 2018 - and even if he didn't he at least worked with him there - he's still young and I think he's a great manager that still has somewhere to go in his career. He can be enticed from the German national team, I think he's there too young he will want to come back to club football soon.
 
L1nk said:
If the rumours of Paul Mitchell come to fruition then the only outcome i'd like to see - out of the current crop of managers out there - is Julian Nagelsmann, correct me if i'm wrong but he brought Nagelsmann to Leipzig in 2018 - and even if he didn't he at least worked with him there - he's still young and I think he's a great manager that still has somewhere to go in his career. He can be enticed from the German national team, I think he's there too young he will want to come back to club football soon.
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Nagelsmann has been with the national team since... September this year? Doubt he's ready to leave just yet.
 
yamo123x said:
There is no one available who could turn this around, ETH deserves time because of his first season performance and literally there is not a manager out there who is both qualified for the role and willing to come.

We have these big players on big wages, long contracts.... player power is rife....dressing room leaks.... off the field antics,....not to mention the owners-- there is real toxicity around.

I still feel ETH is the man to take us forward in the long term but he must look at his in game management and also look at what he says to the press which are two areas i think he has lost fans support in recent weeks.
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There may be no one out there better qualified right now, but sometimes it takes a change of voice and a new tactical direction.
Whatever ETH is having them doing isn't working.

I think it INEOS come in before Christmas and the results and performances have not improved, he is gone. Ratcliffe wont want to start his tenure with a manager who is in the mire.
 
GreatDane said:
Nagelsmann has been with the national team since... September this year? Doubt he's ready to leave just yet.
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Nagelsmann's NT contract ends when the Euros are played. He has only taken over the job for this tournament and I don't think he will continue in it if he has offers from big clubs. I would be fully behind getting him in then if Ten Hag does not turn it around soon.
 
gaffs said:
There may be no one out there better qualified right now, but sometimes it takes a change of voice and a new tactical direction.
Whatever ETH is having them doing isn't working.

I think it INEOS come in before Christmas and the results and performances have not improved, he is gone. Ratcliffe wont want to start his tenure with a manager who is in the mire.
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100% on the first paragraph.

I think the whole Ratcliffe/Ineos thing is very much up in the air, but unless things improve soon then it won’t matter at all. ETH won’t be here for Christmas if on the 12th of December we’re out of the CL and still outside the top 6. He has about 4 weeks worth of football (given the international break) to fix this or he’s out. The only difference would be, if that Ineos thing is still a possibility, that we’ll have an interim manager instead of a permanent appointment.
 
SparkedIntoLife said:
I championed Gallardo as a wildcard and Ancelotti as more of a sure thing yesterday but I also just want to add Ruben Amorim. Apart from a difficult season last year, he's done really well at Sporting. I actually think his 3421 formation could work pretty well at United. Amorim has a huge release clause though (circa £20m/£30m) and, given our history with managers in recent seasons, it's a big gamble.
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I know he refused several offers from Europe, since he's waiting for an offer from a club who wants to win titles. He is a very good manager, tries to make his teams press hard and play with intensity.
Tactically it fits out squad the most
 
FortunaUtd said:
Nagelsmann's NT contract ends when the Euros are played. He has only taken over the job for this tournament and I don't think he will continue in it if he has offers from big clubs. I would be fully behind getting him in then if Ten Hag does not turn it around soon.
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Ah interesting, didn't know that.
He's certainly interesting and should be researched by our very, very competent board.
They should look into his countryman Hansi Flick too, you must do something right with a 81% wins and a treble.
 
GreatDane said:
Ah interesting, didn't know that.
He's certainly interesting and should be researched by our very, very competent board.
They should look into his countryman Hansi Flick too, you must do something right with a 81% wins and a treble.
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Actually a sextuple. But on the other hand this was the only successful spell as a manager Flick ever had, and it's not like he is a young manager working his way up. So I would be careful before signing Flick.

Nagelsmann himself is an interesting name and most likely will want to take a club job again after the Euro, but I also would be careful about him. He definitely is a good manager, but he has to step up to reach the absolute top of the game. He got amazing results for Hoffenheim, he got very good results in Leipzig (and yet already there Leipzig won their first titles just after he left - twice the DFB Pokal), and he got good results with Bayern, yet couldn't deliver the biggest one. Still should be worth a try, definitely one of the better options.
 
stefan92 said:
Bayern also like him a lot and will sitely try to get him when they need a new manager.
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Alonso negotiated a release clause in his new contract that can only be triggered by Madrid, Liverpool or Bayern. That gives some indication of his future intentions.
 
GreatDane said:
Nagelsmann has been with the national team since... September this year? Doubt he's ready to leave just yet.
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I meant like in the Summer, I doubt we'd replace ETH mid season and upheave everything immediately - unless of course things become completely untenable
 
Stack said:
We should have a squad capable of competing, not just the 11 best players.
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Of course we should. But we don't. It takes years and years to build a squad and plan a squad's transition between older players and younger ones. Most of our squad players are still the failed signings of previous regimes.

What do we do, hand it over to somebody new and pray he can get a tune out of them, only to realise the several ten hag signings are not suited to this new managers style. It's the same cycle over and over. He needs time.
 
SER19 said:
Of course we should. But we don't. It takes years and years to build a squad and plan a squad's transition between older players and younger ones. Most of our squad players are still the failed signings of previous regimes.

What do we do, hand it over to somebody new and pray he can get a tune out of them, only to realise the several ten hag signings are not suited to this new managers style. It's the same cycle over and over. He needs time.
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Fair enough.
I had given up on him, will give him some more time.
 
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