And if I remember well Krychowiak is mobile and can run for days.
What CDM?
- Thread starter Silverman
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And if I remember well Krychowiak is mobile and can run for days.
Aye, he's got great stamina as well. Jose likes those midfielders.
Sign Kante and our problem of exposing the defence will be sorted.
I'm convinced Schneiderlin will prove his worth next season.
We just paid 24m for schneiderlin to play there.
Is there such a thing as a LDM or a RDM?
He'll be fantastic under Mourinho. Back like he was at Southampton.
We don't need a defensive midfielder, either. Schneiderlin, Bastian and Blind can all play there, with differing styles to combat different opponents.
Our midfield needs dynamism, foremostly. A box to box Barkley type, with a burst of speed, that can dribble. Hopefully this Sanches fella'.
Our midfield needs dynamism, foremostly. A box to box Barkley type, with a burst of speed, that can dribble. Hopefully this Sanches fella'.
Yea, this thread is irrelevant to our problem in our squad. We have several players who can play their and be useful. If we want combative type, we can put Mensah or Jones in that position. Schneiderlin is also combative aswell.
A box to box would be an ideal signing to compete or replace Fellaini and Herrera. Sanches of Benefica is what we need as he will provide tons of energy and gives us a player willing to drive forward from the midfield.
I remember Dembele before going to Fulham was my ideal signing for Manchester United. This season, Dembele has been the best attacking box to box midfielder in the league or even Europe. Sanches reminds me of Dembele and he will provide that drive we lack in that role.
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Blind for games when we face teams parking the bus, Schneiderlin when we need more protection, both when we need to park the bus.
Schneiderlin will be top class under mourinho. He will play him and probably Sanches in a midfield 2 with Rooney ahead of him.
Still think Schneiderlin can do the job, but we should do all we can to get hold of Kante. Don't know how he does it, but he is everywhere on the pitch.
To use an old expression, Kante looks like he is powered by Duracell, just keeps going...
Dont think Kante be suited to the holding role, especially in a 433. As you said, he's everywhere on the pitch. If we were to get him, he'd be much better as a box to box midfielder.
He definitely can, especially if Mourinho becomes our manager, but he isn't enough even if he returns to his Southampton form.
Fosu Mensah?
I think we do. Yes, we have Schneiderlin there, but he's been on and off the team so far this season and hasn't been at the level he was at Soton(yet). Hopefully he'll be great next season though. Bastian is extremely injuryprone and not really a DM in my eyes, and his getting older aswell. Blind could play there yes, but it's definetly not his best position. He's slow and pretty weak too. Plus, it's not really enough with 1 DM when you think about many matches we play a season. I'd say get both Kante and Sanches, then we'd get both a DM and a more dynamic player.
To be honest, I think we need another established central midfielder. In truth I want us to sign 2, mostly because I think there are very good players actually available and none of ours have consistently played well. I've said this before, but Fellaini should be sold and one of Schweinsteiger and Carrick shouldn't play for us anymore. Fosu-Mensah is a very talented player, but I think it's asking a bit much to improve our midfield just yet. He can obviously play there, but I wouldn't mind giving him chance in defence as well. IMO we need someone who's going to improve our passing. Carrick can't do it regularly anymore and Schweinsteiger won't be fit all the time.
I was genuinely pleased at the prospect of Schweinsteiger pitching up at OT, but to be honest, I think you can see why Bayern let him go. Hopefully he will go and have a great season next year, but he has at times looked pretty average at United. I expected him to come in, settle, and be a driving force in the United midfield, maybe under a new boss and/or after a year to settle down he will be that player next season.
Xhaka.
Fergie loves Kante. Sounds like a tap-up.
Blind as the #6 with 2 box to box CM's ahead of him might work, at least for next season while we evaluate Blind in the role.
Would you want that though? I don't think there's much to evaluate. He'd be good in that role, but not as good as others. Kroos for example is a much better passer.
I think most of us was pleased with that really, even though we know he had been pretty injuryprone the last few years and been getting older aswell. And yea, Bayern did absolutly right in letting him go, specially when they got Vidal as his replacement...If he's going to have a great next season at us he really need to stay fit and away from injuries, which I think is easier said than done. I don't really expect alot from him now, but he brings lots of experience to our side of course, but we need him on the pitch and not the sideline. Still I'd prefer to get Kante and Sanches.
I think that now Blind has had 2 seasons to get used to the PL it would be interesting to see him in the role for a sustained period. One of the big problems with him in it during that early spell was that he often wanted too long on the ball and needed to release it forward quicker. Now he's used to the PL's tempo and has physically improved I think we could see more from him in the role. If he struggles then I'd like to see us try for Weigl next summer. I don't see Kroos as a #6, he lacks defensive qualities in the role to screen the back 4, so he'd only do half the job and leave us exposed IMO.
Well, you didn't answer the quesion really.
Would you be happy with him there? I don't think you are wrong, but I don't think Blind is that good defensively in midfield either. It's not his ability on the ball I'd be worried about in that role, but rather that he isn't that good protecting the space in front of the defence. I don't trust his positional discipline. It's a similar issue to Kroos. Could be wrong, but I think we can do better.It will most likely have to be Schneiderlin even though it's not the most optimal based on his season.
If we search for a new one it should be Xhaka. We have more urgent needs though.
If we search for a new one it should be Xhaka. We have more urgent needs though.
Well, you didn't answer the quesion really.
Blind wouldn't be my first choice, but I don't see us buying 3 CM's in one summer and I think we need a couple of box to box CM's with creativity added, especially if Rooney is going to be lumbering around as a false 10 or whatever his latest bid to stay relevant is being titled. For the #6 role I don't see a tonne of great options out there, not if we want the full package that both defends and has the passing quality from deep. I know you like Xhaka for the role but he's heavily linked with Arsenal and isn't really mentioned with us. After that there is Weigl and Neves but both are very young and unlikely to move this soon.
Saul Niguez can play that role, too. And if it's Mourinho, we probably won't play with a sole #6.
I know Saul has played a number of roles but he's not got the passing game for a proper #6 IMO, he's excelled in a box to box role this season and had his best form there. I hope Mourinho doesn't try to play the crappy 4-2-3-1 here, we have players that are better suited to 4-3-3 or a diamond system, Martial for instance is a wide forward or inside forward, he's not a winger, and we don't have a proper #10 either, getting the pieces to improve 4-3-3 or the diamond style system will be much easier and require less recruitment than trying to make the 4-2-3-1 work IMO.
I think he has. Or at least in a team that's set up differently than Atletico, he'll be better in that regard. One of the first things I noticed, when I watched him was his passing. He was playing for Spain's under 20s as a #6 and did well there, if my memory isn't deceiving me. If Mourinho had Saul and Schneiderlin as his defensive midfield in a 4-2-3-1, he'd probably allow one to get forward, while the other shields the defence.
Edit: The 4-2-3-1 is also the system to get the best out of Roony IMO.
Overall point I'm trying to make is that I'm not looking forward to Blind in midfield again, because IMO we'll need him in defence. Rojo should be sold and Jones is mostly injured. Fosu-Mensah isn't enough to cover that area, I think. I'd rather sign 2 midfielders than 2 centre-backs.
Fair enough mate, the things that impress me with Saul are his drive, agility and technique, he's always seemed a more basic passer to me than the type that threads it through the lines with consistent accuracy. i think Rooney benefits from the 4-3-3 as he gets to share the attacking duties with the other #8, him and Fellaini alternating in the current set up is a blueprint for where we should go IMO, basically replacing Fellaini with Saul.
So Blind as a CB back-up? I think we need 2 CM's as well but it's complicated by the fact you know Rooney will play and we seem hellbent on signing Renato Sanches as one of the CM's. That's why I was thinking a midfield 3 of this -
Saul---Rooney
-----Blind
I think I misinterpreted what you meant regarding Saul and his passing. IMO his passing is quite good, but not as good as to replace Carrick's. I'm not sure though. I thought Schneiderlin would do better with his passing than he has. So what do I know. Maybe @Invictus could help out. What do you think of Saul's passing? Would he be able to improve our midfield in that regard or somewhat replace Carrick's passing?
Your 4-3-3 thoughts with Rooney make sense. Good points. Either way it isn't ideal, sadly. I'm not sure what Blind's role will be. It also depends what kind of centre-back we sign. For some reason I wouldn't be surprised if Mourinho doesn't fancy him and he becomes a back-up right away. I wouldn't mind, if he continues his partnership with Smalling for another season and the centre-back we sign gets slowly eased into the side. One way or another IMO he shouldn't regularly start for us, if we want to compete with Munich, Madrid, Barcelona and so on. He definitely should have a place in the squad. At the start of his United career I compared him to O'Shea, a very useful squad player. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Shaw is a better left-back. We should sign a better or potentially better centre-back and like I said, I'd prefer several central midfielders to him.
Invictus is definitely the one to ask on Saul, from my conversations with him I think he sees Saul as a box to box that could be good for 10-15 goals a season over time.
I agree it's not ideal, our constant shoehorning of Rooney into the side is hurting the chance to build the best team possible. I had the same opinion on Blind when we signed him but he has went up in my estimation in the time he's been here. For the record I wasn't thinking of Blind as the #6 long term, but if we buy Saul and Renato I can't see us buying a #6 as well so I'd imagine Blind/Schneiderlin/Schweini would share the role next season and we'd make the long term choice the summer after.
Anyone think a bid big for Busquets could be a potential option? Seems to be open to a move...
That's really tricky to assess right now because Carrick is one of the best central midfielders of the modern era when it comes to passing at most levels of the pitch, and was the silent architect of United through the years. Can Saúl somewhat offset the void produced by Carrick's decline? Absolutely. But trying to replace him altogether would be a tall order. I'd be skeptical because Saúl is still young, and doesn't quite have that type of ability right now, though I do think he could develop into that kind of player with a bit of refinement given his improved composure on the ball - he's coming along qite nicely, and you can see subtle improvements on a regular basis - which should bode well for the future.
IMO, he's a couple notches below the likes of Thiago, Óliver, Sergi Samper regarding that particular trait - and that's hard to teach on a fundamental or technical level. In the medium to long term, he can go a couple ways - the coach could either keep developing him as a defensive box-to-box, or he could evolve into a holding midfielder - which is where a lot of top shelf box-to-box players end up once their in-game and tactical intelligence goes up a notch or two.
IMO, his best role next season would be as a young Javi Martínez type defensive box-to-box (Javi was excellent in that role at Athletic Club to start out) with the potential to develop into what Martínez became under Bielsa (where he could play almost anywhere in central midfield or defense), or his first season at Bayern Munich where he was the perfect foil for the better distributor (Schweinsteiger).
Yep, that would be his best position in the short term because that'll utilize his athleticism, and ability to carry the ball forward - until he learns the nuances of playing in a deeper position (and to be fair, even the likes of Carrick developed that ability over time). Though his evolution would depend on what the manager/ coaches' long term plan is.
This is why he'd be such a good buy for us, he can contribute immediately and give us options with his development as we continue to shape the squad in future windows and through the Academy.
Yas! On another note, Goretzka has similar qualities too - but slightly better passing ability. And given that Mourinho has generally preferred a 4-2-3-1 in recent years, a double pivot consisting of him, and Saúl could be really tasty once they develop further - in terms of awareness and discipline and chemistry. Or even Weigl for that matter, though that would eliminate the need for converting Saúl in into a deeper playmaker.
And even though I prefer a 4-3-3 like you, and a lot of other United supporters for that matter - a well executed 4-2-3-1 can admittedly be devastating, much like Bayern 2012/ 2013 - which was an evolved form of Klopp's Dortmund in terms of pressing off the ball, and getting the wide players to put in a defensive shift (Heyneckes getting Ribéry and Robben to track back, to go with Lahm and Alaba bombing up and down was decisive in terms of their overall structure).
We have certain elements in place already so the cupboard isn't exactly dry - especially on that left flank with Martial and Shaw - which could potentially be a mouthwatering combination in years to come. Though fixing other areas of concern (particularly through the spine - #9, #10, CMs; and the right flank) will take a bit of time and patience, and detailed recruitment for the system in terms of schematic fits - which we haven't always evidenced in recent seasons.
I like Goretzka as well, another excellent young CM in Germany, a league rife with quality in that department right now. I know Jose has gone 4-2-3-1 a lot but I'm really hoping he sticks with 4-3-3 as I think we are closer to being able to get that up and running at a high level.
Now I know Rooney is none of our ideas of the right #8, but realistically it's gonna take another season to phase him out. The DM role can be shared between Blind/Schweini/Schneiderlin for a season and then next summer we could move Joao Mario to Rooney's position and buy in a top #6.
If we add a young versatile attacker like Gabriel Jesus or Adam Ounas this summer we can develop them in the forward positions as a back-up along with Rashford with potential to take over as #9 and a wide forward role in a couple of seasons. That just leaves the choice of #9 to get right.
4-3-3. Schniederlin - Kante - Pogba.
Blank cheque's for everyone!
Blank cheque's for everyone!