What can we do about the team's lack of pace?

It would help if we had an established rest defence in possession; one that was more focused on covering spaces than going walkabout.

I think Ten Hag wants the players to be quite fluid in handing off and picking up defensive responsibilities to help us be more unpredictable in the build-up phase. But the result is that you've got Dalot and Nous infield and in high (yet weirdly unthreatening) positions with DMs who want venture up the pitch at the same time. We don't exactly have an abundance of 'eye of the needle' players, so conceding turnovers is just gonna happen as a fact of life, and because of how we're set up, we either win the ball on the initial press or the opposition are running at two centre backs who are trying to cover half the pitch.

Somebody has to stay back with them to help cover the width of the pitch, and another player or two need to be sat in front of them so that we can apply a second wave of pressure after the initial press fails. We won't look so slow in defensive transitions if we're successful at slowing the other side down with two lines of pressure while everyone is regrouping. So we'd be somewhat covered when we inevitably give the ball away, even if we aren't winning it straight back.
 
Make pace a priority when recruiting. I mean its kind of simple isn’t it?
 
Hammondo said:
I have seen them live, Garnacho is faster when I've seen him, Rashford has lost a lot of pace.

Zirkzee is big, and I'm not saying he's fast, but Bruno is really not that fast outside of his first few steps, and even then he's slower than mainoo.
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Bruno is quick enough, average speed probably relatively speaking, and he wastes a lot of energy running about like a headless chicken, but it's an absolute myth that he's a slow player, definitely not slower than Mainoo who often looks laboured.

I also don't know where you've come up with the view that Rashford has lost pace. He maybe chooses not to run about as much as he did, but when he goes, he's still rapid. Would bet he's still our quickest player, Garnacho is no slouch though.
 
Blood Mage said:
Go back to a low block and Oleball counter-attacks? How do we stop our slow defence and midfield from being exposed?
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This is the easy way that can get you immediate results (i.e. turn us into a top-four side again), but will only get you that far.

The other way is a little more complicated and can be summarised with broad strokes as follows:

  • Make sure to have enough players who can be trusted with the ball at their feet. What does that mean? Obviously not dithering on the ball for an eternity (build-up), so when all doors are shut off, you can pick the "safe" option that takes the heat off you, but ultimately results in the team passing the ball around without purpose. Because we do that a lot. Another bad habit that needs cutting off is, when under pressure, treating the ball like a responsibility you don't want on your shoulders. So, you either hide from it (off the ball movement or the lack of it) or you kick it backward/forward without much thought. We do a lot of that, too. When you control the ball, the opponent can't score. Control of the ball means you're the one who decides the rhythm of the game. And you decide the game with passes that can create tempo. As Sir Alex aptly put it (from Maulesteen's training book): "Think forward, look forward, play forward". 1 2 3. Sure, the manager must devise a plan able to help matters and/or go back to the drawing board when the tactics seem "too demanding". But what good is a backup option when it becomes a cop out? SAF mentioned that he was blessed to have such players. Great teams rarely stay in their shells, terrified of their weaknesses. Fergie's United never did.
  • Make sure to have enough players who possess "in-game intelligence". Players who can read the game and their immediate opponents' movements on the pitch. It's connected with decision-making, and it can be applied on both ends of the football pitch: Defending and attacking. You kick the ball with your feet, but you play the game with your brain. There's no point trying to force the issue every single time or looking like a deer in the headlights. The ultimate goal is to arrive at the right place at the right time. Don't just act, think. Don't just react, anticipate. There's a strange feeling in the air when you watch this United side surrendering leads or conceding goals in quick succession. When the first thing that's on their minds pays off, the players look like world beaters. If it doesn't and the opposition adjusts, relying solely on instinct becomes inadequate. And all the pace in the world won't save you. Again, the manager has to shoulder a lot of the blame, mainly because he insists on specific tactics when he should be prioritizing the creation of synergies between the players at his disposal. But even when the positioning, (defensive or attacking) is good, we have never looked beyond "first instinct". So, chances are it won't go simply away with the next gaffer. People on here are obsessed with pace and physicality. To cite the late Johann Cruyff: "Speed is often confused with insight. When I start running earlier than the others, I appear faster".
  • Versatility. The success of any decent system depends on it. Or rather, the execution of the system. Things like the infamous 316 can create issues, but they are not the main problem. Stop thinking about players who can "unlock" other players. United has won football matches with Phil fecking Jones and Fabio in the midfield. Choose the players the intricacies of your tactics (if there are any) will cater to. If such a player's highlights reel consists mainly of one thing, you should consider ways of taking the best out of him and of slowly moving away from that. Ferguson did it with RvN. A midfield where one defends, one passes and the other creates isn't a three-man midfield, it's a midfield of "1+1+1". Versatility brings fluidity, and fluidity leads to unpredictability. Of the good kind, the one that derives not (solely) from the skills of a maverick, but from more options opening up because the ball moves fast (=with tempo), exactly because the shape remains (mostly) intact. KdB isn't a superior player to Bruno because he has 0.5% better passing percentage, but because he can occupy any position on the pitch (even find himself among the back three in the build-up) and you won't see a glitch in the system. And if you have more players who can do that (instead of needing the whole side to gravitate toward their needs) across the pitch, something miraculous can happen (under the right manager): The team becomes better than the sum of its parts. Remember the good ol' days when Fergie would throw players (especially youngsters) into the deep end and demand of them to perform? United won a CL final with Beckham starting in the midfield and Giggs on the right, yet here we are talking about key players who should only perform very specific roles.
In any way, be careful what you go back to. There's a thin line between simple and simplistic. Something that, sadly, applies to ETH as well as to Oleball. As Cruyff (again) argued: "Playing football is very simple, but playing simple football is the hardest thing there is".
 
Cassidy said:
Make pace a priority when recruiting. I mean its kind of simple isn’t it?
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Sure that needs to be our scouting priority moving forward but the reality is for now we're stuck with players like De Ligt, Ugarte and Martinez due to the money we've paid and the contracts they're on so ideally we need to try to make them work.
 
Possession football would help with a lack of pace, alternatively hire a sprint coach im sure most could find an extra yard, Usain is a utd fan im sure he could share a few pointers.
 
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Wolfbot said:
Bruno is quick enough, average speed probably relatively speaking, and he wastes a lot of energy running about like a headless chicken, but it's an absolute myth that he's a slow player, definitely not slower than Mainoo who often looks laboured.

I also don't know where you've come up with the view that Rashford has lost pace. He maybe chooses not to run about as much as he did, but when he goes, he's still rapid. Would bet he's still our quickest player, Garnacho is no slouch though.
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Hojlund was our fastest player last season I believe
 
Lay said:
I swear pace and physicality has been a problem for a decade. Why do we sign the most unathletic players we can find?
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Eric Bailly is lying in his bed somewhere wondering if the United fans still remember him. The answer is no, sorry.
 
Wolfbot said:
Bruno is quick enough, average speed probably relatively speaking, and he wastes a lot of energy running about like a headless chicken, but it's an absolute myth that he's a slow player, definitely not slower than Mainoo who often looks laboured.

I also don't know where you've come up with the view that Rashford has lost pace. He maybe chooses not to run about as much as he did, but when he goes, he's still rapid. Would bet he's still our quickest player, Garnacho is no slouch though.
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I think Bruno is one of those players whose legs are going 100 miles an hour but he's barely moving! The opposite of players like say Van Dijk, who look like they're barely jogging but are covering the ground easily.

That's why every time Ten Hag moves him to the right wing he's totally ineffective because he doesn't have any pace to take on a full back.
 
Blood Mage said:
Sure that needs to be our scouting priority moving forward but the reality is for now we're stuck with players like De Ligt, Ugarte and Martinez due to the money we've paid and the contracts they're on so ideally we need to try to make them work.
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We see it all the time when managers want to play a system that the players are not suited to but that is usually 1st season managers that haven't had a chance to change the team. Buying players who don't fit the preferred system seems a little crazy.
 
jeff gurr said:
We see it all the time when managers want to play a system that the players are not suited to but that is usually 1st season managers that haven't had a chance to change the team. Buying players who don't fit the preferred system seems a little crazy.
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This is the same manager who coached Kudus and Gravenberch at Ajax and decided not to bother signing them and signed Antony instead.
 
They need to learn to pass and Bruno needs dropping. This is the biggest reason we can’t retain the ball. Sort this and speed isn’t so important. We can keep the ball higher up the pitch for longer.
 
Wolfbot said:
Bruno is quick enough, average speed probably relatively speaking, and he wastes a lot of energy running about like a headless chicken, but it's an absolute myth that he's a slow player, definitely not slower than Mainoo who often looks laboured.

I also don't know where you've come up with the view that Rashford has lost pace. He maybe chooses not to run about as much as he did, but when he goes, he's still rapid. Would bet he's still our quickest player, Garnacho is no slouch though.
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Bruno is pretty slow. Slow first few steps and then little pace after he gets going. This is why he can't beat a defender with the dribble. Most AMs have that ability and if they don't they better be great passers. Bruno is a great passer once every 10 matches. Hence a real problem.
 
Blood Mage said:
This is the same manager who coached Kudus and Gravenberch at Ajax and decided not to bother signing them and signed Antony instead.
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It's really quite mind blowing... There is no explanation for it
 
Change the manager. He is the one who exacerbates this issue with his ridiculous style of play.
 
diarm said:
And Walker is elite fast. Having one epically fast recovery defender can make a huge difference.

Back in the day we’d often line up with Neville, Vidic and the likes of O'Shea or Silvestre in defence. None of them were fast but Rio’s pace covered for them.

At the moment we have nobody to cover.
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Vidic is one of my favourite defenders of all time and it's hard for me to pick between him and Rio but what you said is correct. I remember a game where Vidic was really struggling at Anfield and Rio's recovery pace kept getting him out of trouble time and time again. You can get away with one slower centre back I feel but two is just asking for trouble.
 
Yup I have always wondered why we never had a super fast centre back. The last ones I remember was Rio, silvestre and maybe Smalling
 
Considering that Eredivisie decided to buy 2 CBs who are hardly lightening quick to compliment a nearly purely Ajax defense (Onana, Martinez, Mazraoui and De Ligt) then I suggest a mid block defense at best. Alternatively we play Yoro alongside De Ligt.
 
Its not just speed but the ability to decide when to employ it, is also crucial. We don't seem to have coaches to implement that, last time i saw that wqs mason. After that every new signings will have it for a while, and i think they coach that aspect out. They all now stand and move a yard or so to receive the pass and turn like a lorry before passing it straight to the opposition
 
We don't lack pace, at least not defensively. Teams with high line and high press don't rely on pace, they rely on disturbing the transition and forcing the opposition into making less than ideal passes/runs. Our pressing forces the opposition to take the optimal routes with little pressure. Defensively our issue is 100% structural and not individual, of course we could bring a bunch of speedsters but it wouldn't fix a thing.

Now where we lack pace is when it comes to ball carrier that have the ability to beat their opponent 1v1, all top teams have these type of players because they alter defensive shapes. We have players that can run fast without the ball and maybe one decent dribbler in Amad but that's about it.
 
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