Incentives come into many forms, monetary is but one of them.
And saying the USSR failed because there was no incentive to perform shows a complete lack of historical understanding.
Wealth & Income Inequality
- Thread starter Eboue
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Incentives come into many forms, monetary is but one of them.
And saying the USSR failed because there was no incentive to perform shows a complete lack of historical understanding.
There is no "hoarding" in the way you mean it. Billionaires do not typically have billions in cash stored away in a storage facility. They typically own stock and other assets. Taxing them does not put anything "extra" into the economy. And even if they did "hoard" cash, putting it back into the economy would be equal to changing the money supply which under "normal" circumstances would lead to an adjustment in prices. The "economy" as a whole is not missing anything because of billionaires' "hoarding".
There is a need, of course. If a person wants to keep control of their company, they need to own a controlling share which may exceed 100b. There is nothing wrong with it.
Well put, an very good argument can be made for increasing taxes for more even distribution of wealth, however it should never be capped.
You are going to side with @Eboue and his execute the rich side?
Do explain how giving no incentive for people to work/innovate isn’t like communism?
The counter arguments being people shouldn’t be allowed to get ultra rich? I just cannot agree with that. As pointed out many times, even if you tax at a higher rate like Sweden, people still get ultra rich.
I'm not falling into this Rush Limbaugh trap. I've made my arguments very clear with a tonne of links and evidence backing them up. You keep repeating rubbish strawmen about "communism" when not a single post or argument I've (and almost all others) ever made relates to communism.
''From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs'' - Some German bloke. Socialism/Communism isn't about equality.
You have repeated time and again that profit motives does not help innovation. One of your links pointed out that people work harder motivated by money.
Some German bloke
I'm not saying socialism is about complete equality, I'm saying there are extremist in that corner that are for complete equality and extreme is never the way to go.
In the case of equality it neglects to put the human condition into the equation. Communism is fantastic on paper. We all get enough to get by, no one is rich and no one is poor, but our minds don't work that way. Humans want to excel, they want to be better than their neighbors, they think their race is better than other races, they think their iPhone is better than your Samsung. These are things we can not change. The system is only as shit as the humans using that system.
On the other side, extreme capitalists who talk about everything should be completely based on merit or success are forgetting that even though on paper everyone can be anything he ever dreamed of being is nonsense too. We are not all born in to equal opportunity. Some of us have wealthy parents with a lot of connection, making it easy to become successful, whilst others are born in to a poor family without any real chance to make it.
The ideal is somewhere in between. In my opinion the USA leans too much to the right, capitalist side of the spectrum. I think a more center left approach would be ideal. Without trying to sound like a broken record, I think The Netherlands are doing it quite well, equality, taxes and social security wise.
This post shows you aren't even trying to read and understand the actual research but you just resort to a Sean Hannity argument. Literally all your arguments here are from the_Donald
I suggested taxes should be increased on the ultra rich. Very Donald argument.
I suggested taxes should be increased on the ultra rich. Very Donald argument.
Yet you use the same fallacy to try to dismiss dozens of posts with your nonsense "communism doesn't work" narrative. That is Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity plus you alway add the smilies like all the_Donald posters.
How would you increase taxes on the ultra rich?
It’s true that communism doesn’t work, China only developing since they got rid of communism.
I have said many times the higher tax rate and more even distribution in norther Europe would be better, but that still results in plenty of billionaires. No?
Increase taxes on capital gains and dividends?
Nothing anyone has suggested had anything to do with communism. You just used a completely bullshit red herring to dismiss a bunch of posts.
The only difference between you and Donald Trump is that you support an "increase" in taxes on capital gains and dividends?
You have people wanting to execute people for getting rich and others suggesting Bill Gates who’s given 10s of billions away and pledged to give away most of his money is being evil.
How about I don’t agree with any of The Donald’s biggest policies
The conservative SCOTUS
The reversal of Obamacare
Withdrawing from Paris
Withdrawing from TPP
The list is endless
I literally cannot think of ONE thing he’s done that I agree with
If that's actually true then you need to read up, learn more and think about other people's posts a lot more before you spam your bullshit "communism" crap when it doesn't apply in any way whatsoever. Go read up
https://authors.library.caltech.edu/22080/1/wp1059[1].pdf
So based on what I’ve said, please point out which Trump policy I support.
According to you there should be lots.
Civilisation was a mistake.
So based on what I’ve said, please point out which Trump policy I support.
According to you there should be lots.
Did you read that article yet or are you just posting more strawmen?
Amazon is the best company on the planet tbf. Bezos can have all my money.
I may if I have the time, I’m not going to read a 40 page article on my phone just to continue this pointless argument.
One last question, do you agree with eboue?
First against the wall.
Not before extracting all his worth in the gulag.
Then you shouldn't comment on topics you don't understand. Its offensive for you to just to dismiss all the nuance with your fecking ridiculous "communism doesn't work" strawman. Nothing I have posted has anything to do with communism so either learn up or don't comment bullshit on what you don't understand.
Communism.
feck off with that strawmanAnd I love my iPhone so much I'm more than happy for the money it cost to pay for some gilding on the taps of an en suite bathroom in a billionaire's 10th house.
You do realize you decided to weigh in halfway through and spammed the thread with your endless articles?Then you shouldn't comment on topics you don't understand. Its offensive for you to just to dismiss all the nuance with your fecking ridiculous "communism doesn't work" strawman. Nothing I have posted has anything to do with communism so either learn up or don't comment bullshit on what you don't understand.
Communism.
The way this thread turned out was initially due to my disagreeing with Eboue’s views.
I’m not interested in a theoretical debate.
That isn't remotely what happened
You kept strawmanning posts and mispresenting opinions in multiple different threads and this was spawned off after the fact since it went off topic.
Care to elaborate on the bolded part?
But is this truely what we're arguing about? I'm also more than happy to pay for my Samsung Galaxy, however if the price is unnecessarily higher than it could be, then yes that bothers me.
Hating someone just because they are rich must take an awful lot of effort.
Nice.
I was just being glib. What we're actually arguing about seems to be mainly silva/eboue's pathological hatred of rich people.
I thought it was about countering Cal's claims about billionaires actually producing innovation but maybe I am drunk
But for every 1 Bill Gates there’s 10 who just want to accumulate as much wealth and power as they can. Bet they have small dicks
A little from column A, a little from column B.
I think I did. My understanding from Revan's post was that he thinks billionaires keep billions of actual cash out of the economy by "hoarding" it, i.e. keeping it away from the economy, and taxing them would bring that "hoarded" cash back into the economy. That's not correct. Billionaires typically don't actually own billions in cash and thus taxing them doesn't bring back extra cash into the economy as a whole.
You're considered a billionaire for those living in africa and bangladesh. What you made in 1 week is what most of Indonesian gets for a month of hard labour.
So you're actually the evil you describe. No way a couch potato collar worker gets 10x the salary of another human being just because your passport is of a different color
I know that man, I am not 5 years old. Though to be fair, I think that a lot of them own billions in physical assets, it isn't all the money they have being stocks.
There could also be alternatives to taxing stocks, and questions should be asked do we really need companies who are worth 1 trillion. I don't think we really do.
Oh, and stock exchanges in the current form are one of the worst things that exist and the main reason for the extreme inequality.
Ah. So how about taxing corporations?
Communism has never actually been attempted at the State level.
What doesn’t work is State Capitalism.
Civilisation and the vast majority of people in the world are in a much better position than their ancestors were 300 years ago. A lot of that is due to capitalism.
Of course that doesn’t mean there aren’t a myriad of things which can and should be improved. But it really wouldn’t hurt for some people to be more rational and less short sighted when critiquing the evils of contemporary society.
Of course that doesn’t mean there aren’t a myriad of things which can and should be improved. But it really wouldn’t hurt for some people to be more rational and less short sighted when critiquing the evils of contemporary society.