[Sky1981]

I hope to own a company one day.
My feelings towards an under-performer would be based on whether I can prove that they chose to be lazy and under-perform, or if (like Rooney) they just aren't up to it anymore (which isn't his fault, unless people here can prove otherwise.)

Fortunately for me (in that scenario) dealing with employees would be different to dealing with footballers who've signed four/five year contracts that can't be matched elsewhere.

It's difficult to really compare other industries to the football world, because people don't tend to lose their ability to cook, talk to customers, teach, make business decisions, stock-take or whatever. Whereas footballers can drop off at any time, without warning.

As for the bit about junk food - there's little evidence that he leads an unhealthy lifestyle and it's not really relevant.

If you're not a boss then how'd you feel if your colleagues earning 3 times your salary while selling much less sales than you. He got that salary by his big giant sales he made 5 years ago.

You can get lousier in your job. Any kind of job.. For many different reason : getting old, changes of era, bad luck, changes of boss etc. But the rules of the game is they dont pay you to sit around, anyone in rooney position will get highlighted, it comes with territory.

Being a nice guy that licks the fans ass or being a cnut just add a bit of extra leeway, but it's a performance business at the end of the day

 

[00ivatsa]

You haven't explained yourself thoroughly, you've been asked three times if you actually watched us regularly the last few years and have yet to answer it. Now you're playing the victim card saying people felt the need to get on your back when it was you that tried to belittle other people's opinions with talk of random posters on a forum, salty, bitter and delusional comments because they dared to not feel the way you do.

What do you want people to say to show him respect while feeling he is past it? You seem to want to live in a fantasy land where the past never happened and we just pretend he's that kid full of potential. He's not, he's the man that kid grew up to be and like it or not the good he's done for us doesn't wipe away the disrespect he's shown the club nor his current hindrance to it and people are going to have different levels of tolerance/forgiveness. You can cling to your happy memories all you want, but you can't force other people to accept your delusion when they watch him fail to deliver week after week.

You talk about him having the right to retire here and that he should be shown respect like his interests are above the clubs. It's football, you only have the right to anything if you're performing.

Because you were being a dick about it, that's why I didn't answer you! What kind of pathetic question is that, especially since I've been lurking on this forum long before I registered?!? It's very obvious why you asked and I'm trying to keep it civil here because I don't want to get banned.

Please, from now on, don't try to instigate a conversation with me as you clearly have an issue with what I'm writing and there won't be anything healthy about such a debate. I expressed THOROUGHLY what my opinion was and why it is like that, so if you have a hard time understanding it, that's not my problem. Some people understood it, even without agreeing, while others, like yourself, continued pushing their angle on me. You're clearly using the fact that English is my second language and it is harder for me to defend myself here.

 

[Black Adder]

6 pages of moaning and he hasn't even kicked the ball yet this season, good to see people on the Caf merit their opinion on performances only.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Because you were being a dick about it, that's why I didn't answer you! What kind of pathetic question is that, especially since I've been lurking on this forum long before I registered?!? It's very obvious why you asked and I'm trying to keep it civil here because I don't want to get banned.

Please, from now on, don't try to instigate a conversation with me as you clearly have an issue with what I'm writing and there won't be anything healthy about such a debate. I expressed THOROUGHLY what my opinion was and why it is like that, so if you have a hard time understanding it, that's not my problem. Some people understood it, even without agreeing, while others, like yourself, continued pushing their angle on me. You're clearly using the fact that English is my second language and it is harder for me to defend myself here.

It was already explained to you why you were asked it and why it had nothing to do with where you're from. You also didn't answer the people that apparently weren't being dicks about it. Stop playing the victim card. You came in trying to belittle the opinion of everyone that didn't agree with you. The people that aren't agreeing with you have his performances of the last few years to point to, while you seem to be talking about how good he used to make you feel and how that's earned him the right to retire here. You can't see why that would lead to people asking if you've actually watched what they've been watching? The fact you're trying to play some sort of victim in order to deflect everything away speaks volumes.

I don't give a shit where you're from, what language you speak or how big your victim complex is. You implied that everyone that didn't agree with you was wrong on a public forum which opened you up to have people reply to that.

 

[00ivatsa]

It was already explained to you why you were asked it and why it had nothing to do with where you're from. You also didn't answer the people that apparently weren't being dicks about it. Stop playing the victim card. You came in trying to belittle the opinion of everyone that didn't agree with you. The people that aren't agreeing with you have his performances of the last few years to point to, while you seem to be talking about how good he used to make you feel and how that's earned him the right to retire here. You can't see why that would lead to people asking if you've actually watched what they've been watching? The fact you're trying to play some sort of victim in order to deflect everything away speaks volumes.

I don't give a shit where you're from, what language you speak or how big your victim complex is. You implied that everyone that didn't agree with you was wrong on a public forum which opened you up to have people reply to that.

Why would you ask such a stupid question? Tell me. Who the feck would join a Manchester United forum and bother to post if he doesn't watch the games? You're just a prick, mate. No wonder every English person I know has a bad opinion on Irish people.

Learn to read as you clearly missed the part where I explained everything that you continue to ask me.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Why would you ask such a stupid question? Tell me. Who the feck would join a Manchester United forum and bother to post if he doesn't watch the games? You're just a prick, mate. No wonder every English person I know has a bad opinion on Irish people.

Learn to read as you clearly missed the part where I explained everything that you continue to ask me.

How thick are you? You played the victim card because of your nationality and now you're attacking mine when I pointed out it has nothing to do with that? Well done, you've well and truly shown your true colours. Idiot.

I tried to explain to you why several different people asked if you even watch the matches or the highlights, but you're too thick to get it. The only thing you've said that might indicate you've watched recently is that you agreed he was poor, which doesn't mean you've even watched. Plenty of people can't afford to watch the matches or don't have access, it doesn't exclude them from signing up and posting. It would have taken a simple yes or no after you'd inspired three or four people to ask you the question instead of claiming your a victim. Now stop being a bigot with a victim complex.

 

[00ivatsa]

How thick are you? You played the victim card because of your nationality and now you're attacking mine when I pointed out it has nothing to do with that? Well done, you've well and truly shown your true colours. Idiot.

I tried to explain to you why several different people asked if you even watch the matches or the highlights, but you're too thick to get it. The only thing you've said that might indicate you've watched recently is that you agreed he was poor, which doesn't mean you've even watched. Plenty of people can't afford to watch the matches or don't have access, it doesn't exclude them from signing up and posting. It would have taken a simple yes or no after you'd inspired three or four people to ask you the question instead of claiming your a victim. Now stop being a bigot with a victim complex.

Didn't attack your nationality, just saying what feelings your neighbours have for you. And don't give me that bullshit that people register here, but don't have time to watch the games. So you have the time to post but not watch the games? Are you okay in the head and brain department? You tried winding me up - you succeeded. Well done. Very cnutish behaviour and comments to go with it.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Didn't attack your nationality, just saying what feelings your neighbours have for you. And don't give me that bullshit that people register here, but don't have time to watch the games. So you have the time to post but not watch the games? Are you okay in the head and brain department? You tried winding me up - you succeeded. Well done. Very cnutish behaviour and comments to go with it.

Yeah trying to wind you up, nothing at all to do with questioning your posts about football on a football forum and you for some bizarre reason trying to turn it into battle of nations while working yourself into an impotent rage. All because you didn't want to answer a question that people kept asking you. Have a word with yourself.

Why wouldn't people sign up just because they don't have time or money to watch the matches at the minute? They can always get the highlights. They are still United fans even if current circumstances don't allow them to see matches and here is as good a place as any to get news and talk to other United fans.

 

[00ivatsa]

Yeah trying to wind you up, nothing at all to do with questioning your posts about football on a football forum and you for some bizarre reason trying to turn it into battle of nations while working yourself into an impotent rage. All because you didn't want to answer a question that people kept asking you. Have a word with yourself.

Why wouldn't people sign up just because they don't have time or money to watch the matches at the minute? They can always get the highlights. They are still United fans even if current circumstances don't allow them to see matches and here is as good a place as any to get news and talk to other United fans.

I haven't heard of one person who watches only highlights of his favourite team's matches. Even when it's not on any TV channel I have available, I try to find streams on the Internet. It's very rare occasion that I can only watch the highlights.

Whatever. I'm sorry to everyone else for derailing the thread. I will not ever question again a fellow United supporter's hatred towards a United player. But I feel like the thread title should be changed to "Wayne Rooney / 2016-2017 Bashing thread".

 

[drdoityourself]

6 pages of moaning and he hasn't even kicked the ball yet this season, good to see people on the Caf merit their opinion on performances only.

You are probably having a dig at those criticizing him. It's actually the other way around, we have been witnessing worse and declining performances for three years now. Yet some still find excuses for him year after year, with no correlation to performances.

 

[clarkydaz]

And if he's looking out for himself only - good on him. It's a ruthless industry. He owes nothing to United, the fans or anyone else.

you've made this point a few times. If you happily admit he owes United nothing then that's a 2 way street surely? Its a ruthless industry you say, but aren't happy there a question marks over a player who is clearly past his best, and could be easily replaced. The team doesn't need him

 

[Black Adder]

You are probably having a dig at those criticizing him. It's actually the other way around, we have been witnessing worse and declining performances for three years now. Yet some still find excuses for him year after year, with no correlation to performances.

This is his 2016/2017 performances thread, which means all criticism/praise should be in correlation to his actual perfomances on the field which haven't happend yet.

There are some excuses like poor managers (Moyes and LVG) who both made other players also look much worse than they really are, but that excuse aside Rooney's been in sharp decline which even blind man could see.

However that doesn't mean we should go over and over again about it since him being poor for last 3 years is something that's been done to death. Let's wait for him to kick the ball in Mourinho system before making judgement based on past perfomances.

Or should we go in every other thread bar Martial and De Gea and slate players for not being up to task?

 

[LeftyBlaster]

I hope to own a company one day.
My feelings towards an under-performer would be based on whether I can prove that they chose to be lazy and under-perform, or if (like Rooney) they just aren't up to it anymore (which isn't his fault, unless people here can prove otherwise.)

Fortunately for me (in that scenario) dealing with employees would be different to dealing with footballers who've signed four/five year contracts that can't be matched elsewhere.

It's difficult to really compare other industries to the football world, because people don't tend to lose their ability to cook, talk to customers, teach, make business decisions, stock-take or whatever. Whereas footballers can drop off at any time, without warning.

As for the bit about junk food - there's little evidence that he leads an unhealthy lifestyle and it's not really relevant.

I love that part in particular. When he isn't good enough and underperforms it isn't his fault Just when I thought the excuse making couldn't go any lower.

 

[dichinero]

I love that part in particular. When he isn't good enough and underperforms it isn't his fault Just when I thought the excuse making couldn't go any lower.

We could have a Rooney excuse thread and it would surpass Pogba's transfer thread. easy!!!

 

[M Bison]

This is his 2016/2017 performances thread, which means all criticism/praise should be in correlation to his actual perfomances on the field which haven't happend yet.

There are some excuses like poor managers (Moyes and LVG) who both made other players also look much worse than they really are, but that excuse aside Rooney's been in sharp decline which even blind man could see.

However that doesn't mean we should go over and over again about it since him being poor for last 3 years is something that's been done to death. Let's wait for him to kick the ball in Mourinho system before making judgement based on past perfomances.

Or should we go in every other thread bar Martial and De Gea and slate players for not being up to task?

Exactly, perfectly put. This thread is a joke of the highest order.

 

[Speak]

I love that part in particular. When he isn't good enough and underperforms it isn't his fault Just when I thought the excuse making couldn't go any lower.

If I asked somebody to climb a wall and they can't, I wouldn't class it as their fault. If I put a lot of money on them climbing that wall and they're incapable of doing it, I'd blame myself before them.
Unless I can prove that they're choosing to do a poor job, I wont blame them.

But then again, I'm in the 'It's not Moyes fault he wasn't good enough' camp, which you probably aren't.
Some people view footballers (and probably people in general) with a mentality of 'if you're not good enough for your job, I'm able to abuse you like you're purposely doing a bad job. How dare you play when chosen by your manager!'
Just a different way of viewing things, I guess.
Probably the same people who go on about Phil Jones as if he's choosing to pick up injuries for a laugh.

If Rooney were doing something detrimental to cause his decline, even he'd have been called out for it by now. Chances are that he isn't, and this is a natural (even if very strange) decline - the likes of which other players have had before their 30s.

Does any of this mean that anyone else is to blame? No.
So it's not an excuse in any way.

 

[Joga Bonito]

You're just a prick, mate. No wonder every English person I know has a bad opinion on Irish people.

 

[stevoc]

Why would you ask such a stupid question? Tell me. Who the feck would join a Manchester United forum and bother to post if he doesn't watch the games? You're just a prick, mate. No wonder every English person I know has a bad opinion on Irish people.

Learn to read as you clearly missed the part where I explained everything that you continue to ask me.

So wait you are telling me that every English and Irish person doesn't always say wonderful things about each other?

Mmm i wonder if there is some sort of historical animosity between the two countries.

 

[Sky1981]

If I asked somebody to climb a wall and they can't, I wouldn't class it as their fault. If I put a lot of money on them climbing that wall and they're incapable of doing it, I'd blame myself before them.
Unless I can prove that they're choosing to do a poor job, I wont blame them.

But then again, I'm in the 'It's not Moyes fault he wasn't good enough' camp, which you probably aren't.
Some people view footballers (and probably people in general) with a mentality of 'if you're not good enough for your job, I'm able to abuse you like you're purposely doing a bad job. How dare you play when chosen by your manager!'
Just a different way of viewing things, I guess.
Probably the same people who go on about Phil Jones as if he's choosing to pick up injuries for a laugh.

If Rooney were doing something detrimental to cause his decline, even he'd have been called out for it by now. Chances are that he isn't, and this is a natural (even if very strange) decline - the likes of which other players have had before their 30s.

Does any of this mean that anyone else is to blame? No.
So it's not an excuse in any way.

But if i pay a professional wall climber to climb the wall he better be able to climb that wall.

Footballers get paid to do just one thing. If he can't do that no more he's as good as useless

 

[Speak]

But if i pay a professional wall climber to climb the wall he better be able to climb that wall.

Footballers get paid to do just one thing. If he can't do that no more he's as good as useless

Totally agreed.
But him being useless is one thing. It being his fault that he's useless is a totally different thing.

 

[Art Vandelay]

So wait you are telling me that every English and Irish person doesn't always say wonderful things about each other?

Mmm i wonder if there is some sort of historical animosity between the two countries.

Nah that's all been forgiven. The English now talk quietly behind our backs because they think I hate Wayne Rooney and it hurts their feelings as he used to be a very good player.

 

[SteveJ]

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...TAC#v=onepage&q=wayne rooney 360 deal&f=false

 

[Jazz]

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=EqD0CAAAQBAJ&pg=PT88&lpg=PT88&dq=wayne+rooney+360+deal&source=bl&ots=JwaOifV13K&sig=VlHaGfuCqI4g6PqiR4WIszII8Ik&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjVxbD98JDOAhXlLMAKHfVCBLEQ6AEILTAC#v=onepage&q=wayne rooney 360 deal&f=false

That's depressing. So because of this stupid '360' whatever deal, he's always going to start for United and England and hold both teams back in the process? Maybe LVG wasn't playing him because he wanted to, but because he had no choice?

 

[Art Vandelay]

That's depressing. So because of this stupid '360' whatever deal, he's always going to start for United and England and hold both teams back in the process? Maybe LVG wasn't playing him because he wanted to, but because he had no choice?

Surely if that was the case then either LVG or Hodgson would have said something about it in order to defend themselves by now. If it is true then football is on a slippery slope.

 

[Jazz]

Surely if that was the case then either LVG or Hodgson would have said something about it in order to defend themselves by now. If it is true then football is on a slippery slope.

Depends on the nature of their contracts. There might be some clause on what you can, or cannot speak about. I doubt LVG could comment on United's business dealings - plus a manager who doesn't win anything can have no power.

This Rooney deal seems like a cold hard business deal, with football an afterthought. I wonder, does Ed realise that if Rooney's performances continue to be underwhelming, that will seriously 'affect' the brand? We won't be winning the league with an inconsistent player - especially now that it's even more competitive.

Quite frankly, Rooney needs United more for his brand than the club needs him for ours. I would cut our losses and pay off his contract. Nike can then suck on that, because no top team in the world would buy him.

In the meantime, we the fans will have to suffer if he doesn't improve his performances.

I've suddenly lost my enthusiasm for the upcoming season

 

[stevoc]

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=EqD0CAAAQBAJ&pg=PT88&lpg=PT88&dq=wayne+rooney+360+deal&source=bl&ots=JwaOifV13K&sig=VlHaGfuCqI4g6PqiR4WIszII8Ik&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjVxbD98JDOAhXlLMAKHfVCBLEQ6AEILTAC#v=onepage&q=wayne rooney 360 deal&f=false

So if i'm reading this right, this book claims the following.

So Rooney signed his contract in February 2014 (which he did) and by doing so the club for the first time in 25 years sided with a player over Ferguson and Ferguson retired at the end of the season?

Except thats not possible as SAF had already retired by that stage and Moyes was the manager when Rooney renewed his contract. If it gets an easily verified detail like that wrong then i wouldn't put too much stock into the likelihood of the rest of it being true. We are also sponsored by Adidas now so a contract with Nike isn't keeping Rooney in the side.

 

[stevoc]

Nah that's all been forgiven. The English now talk quietly behind our backs because they think I hate Wayne Rooney and it hurts their feelings as he used to be a very good player.

I was just being a bit sarcastic with that one mate i'm actually Irish myself. Just thought it was a strange comment, the English people he knows sound like really nice guys.

 

[dichinero]

Surely if that was the case then either LVG or Hodgson would have said something about it in order to defend themselves by now. If it is true then football is on a slippery slope.

You definitely can't speak about stuff like that in public!

 

[Art Vandelay]

I was just being a bit sarcastic with that one mate i'm actually Irish myself. Just thought it was a strange comment, the English people he knows sound like really nice guys.

I know, I was being sarcastic myself as it was bizarre to label the rest of us because I'm a prick.

You definitely can't speak about stuff like that in public!

Well I know they can't come right out and say it, but the pair of them backed him to the hilt. You'd think if it was true then the mask would have slipped at least once, especially with LVG's prickly and outspoken nature. Even with the amount Moyes has been defending himself over the last couple of years he's never hinted at it. It makes sense, but if it was true it would have leaked out in some way by now.

 

[stevoc]

it was bizarre to label the rest of us because I'm a prick.

Well people also tell me i'm a prick all the time so maybe he was onto something..lol

 

[LouisDanGaal]

Hoping for a good season, after this one it will be his last season contracted with the club I think? Would love him to rediscover his top form under mourinho which is entirely possible. After all, he was actually good after Christmas aside from the injury and one of englands best players at the world cup, it could quite simply be that not being involved in the game much just really didn't suit him which would make perfect sense for a player of his type. Regardless he can get the best out of the players around him and has been a key player in many teams, he will go in to the season fighting for the number ten spot and it is his job to keep it. Would love to have another two seasons of the Rooney of old before letting him sail off at 32.

 

[Womp]

Hoping for a good season, after this one it will be his last season contracted with the club I think? Would love him to rediscover his top form under mourinho which is entirely possible. After all, he was actually good after Christmas aside from the injury and one of englands best players at the world cup, it could quite simply be that not being involved in the game much just really didn't suit him which would make perfect sense for a player of his type. Regardless he can get the best out of the players around him and has been a key player in many teams, he will go in to the season fighting for the number ten spot and it is his job to keep it. Would love to have another two seasons of the Rooney of old before letting him sail off at 32.

He was decent playing as a midfielder, he will be a 10 under Jose. He was moved to midfield because he's lost his legs so I don't see how him looking ok playing in CM in the World Cup and towards the end of the season is any indicator he will be good as a 10 and revitalised all of a sudden? It's no secret I don't like him very much, but speaking from a strictly footballing perspective trying to shoe horn him into the team isn't beneficial for us at all. If we do sign Pogba, we would be handicapping our record signing and best midfielder to fit Rooney into the side.

We need to play 433, this season is going to be extremely competitive. Guardiola won't play underperforming players for the sake of it, I just hope Jose doesn't do the same. We can't slip up this season, every game is going to be extremely difficult with all the money everyone is receiving and we simply cannot afford to have any passengers.

I would love to be proven wrong, but I just don't see it. He's not getting any younger or quicker.

 

[stevoc]

Hoping for a good season, after this one it will be his last season contracted with the club I think? Would love him to rediscover his top form under mourinho which is entirely possible. After all, he was actually good after Christmas aside from the injury and one of englands best players at the world cup, it could quite simply be that not being involved in the game much just really didn't suit him which would make perfect sense for a player of his type. Regardless he can get the best out of the players around him and has been a key player in many teams, he will go in to the season fighting for the number ten spot and it is his job to keep it. Would love to have another two seasons of the Rooney of old before letting him sail off at 32.

He still has 3 years to run on his current contract, so two more years after this one. Unless something drastic happens and he wants to move somewhere else i imagine he will likely see out that contract. This season i think he will transition into a squad player.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

If I asked somebody to climb a wall and they can't, I wouldn't class it as their fault. If I put a lot of money on them climbing that wall and they're incapable of doing it, I'd blame myself before them.
Unless I can prove that they're choosing to do a poor job, I wont blame them.

But then again, I'm in the 'It's not Moyes fault he wasn't good enough' camp, which you probably aren't.
Some people view footballers (and probably people in general) with a mentality of 'if you're not good enough for your job, I'm able to abuse you like you're purposely doing a bad job. How dare you play when chosen by your manager!'
Just a different way of viewing things, I guess.
Probably the same people who go on about Phil Jones as if he's choosing to pick up injuries for a laugh.

If Rooney were doing something detrimental to cause his decline, even he'd have been called out for it by now. Chances are that he isn't, and this is a natural (even if very strange) decline - the likes of which other players have had before their 30s.

Does any of this mean that anyone else is to blame? No.
So it's not an excuse in any way.

First off. Let's not be retarded and pretend that Rooney's a poor victimised Britney Spears character.

Second, your wall analogy is flawed. Footballers are paid to play football. They are given wages and status in the team that should reflect the performances they are expected to turn in. It is not a statement of agenda or hate when people say that Rooney has simply underperformed for the past 2 seasons at least, and has not performed for his country in major tournaments. Rooney himself has shifted the goalposts for himself when telling the media 2 seasons ago that he is best employed as a striker and then changing his tune to "I am a midfielder". If I pay Wayne Rooney who has threatened to leave twice and accusing me of not showing enough ambition and demanding a pay rise (and don't you dare even think that he had nothing to do with this) as highly or higher than the top players in the world who perform better than him day in and day out, he'd better damn well climb that wall.

Third, "Moyes wasn't good enough, it's not his fault". Are you blind? Moyes came in without a plan and that is exactly his fault. "We got to the byline several times and thought we created enough chances to win", he said after that shiteous display against Fulham where there was zero creativity and no attempt to play football. That is as clear an indicator as any that Moyes came in without a plan and without looking to implement a system that maximised the strengths of his players. Not to mention he took a long ass break before the season started and came in like a drunk cowboy shooting his pistol at unrealistic transfer targets simply because they were big names before blundering a last minute Fellaini transfer.

Lastly, yes I agree that it isn't his fault that he is in decline as a player. But what is his fault is the shite he serves up on the pitch. The one dimensional passing, poor decision making, poor ball control, and lack of leadership has nothing to do with anyone else but him.

 

[Kag]

Rooney doesn't concern me this season. For the first time since Ferguson left the club, we're beginning to bring in some genuinely good attacking players. If he plays poorly, which is likely, he'll be out sooner rather than later.

It's all up to him.

 

[LouisDanGaal]

He was decent playing as a midfielder, he will be a 10 under Jose. He was moved to midfield because he's lost his legs so I don't see how him looking ok playing in CM in the World Cup and towards the end of the season is any indicator he will be good as a 10 and revitalised all of a sudden? It's no secret I don't like him very much, but speaking from a strictly footballing perspective trying to shoe horn him into the team isn't beneficial for us at all. If we do sign Pogba, we would be handicapping our record signing and best midfielder to fit Rooney into the side.

We need to play 433, this season is going to be extremely competitive. Guardiola won't play underperforming players for the sake of it, I just hope Jose doesn't do the same. We can't slip up this season, every game is going to be extremely difficult with all the money everyone is receiving and we simply cannot afford to have any passengers.

I would love to be proven wrong, but I just don't see it. He's not getting any younger or quicker.

He was playing much higher up the pitch at the start of the year when he was bagging for fun and that's all everyone was talking about in the real world but on the caf everyone was saying he was getting lucky as per when they have turned on a player. If anyone wouldn't play an underperforming player or one who wasn't in the best interests of the squad it is Mourinho so I have no idea what anyone is worried about. Either Rooney plays well and stays in the team or he doesn't and is out, None of this captain always plays nonsense. I'm rooting for our players rather than against though, I'm not sure why so many on here struggle to get behind a club legend and seem to have completely decided he is shite despite everyone outfield bar martial underperforming last season.

 

[Art Vandelay]

One of my concerns with playing him behind the striker is that the last time he played there consistently RVP complained about him getting in his way and trying to occupy the same space.

 

[Sky1981]

He was playing much higher up the pitch at the start of the year when he was bagging for fun and that's all everyone was talking about in the real world but on the caf everyone was saying he was getting lucky as per when they have turned on a player. If anyone wouldn't play an underperforming player or one who wasn't in the best interests of the squad it is Mourinho so I have no idea what anyone is worried about. Either Rooney plays well and stays in the team or he doesn't and is out, None of this captain always plays nonsense. I'm rooting for our players rather than against though, I'm not sure why so many on here struggle to get behind a club legend and seem to have completely decided he is shite despite everyone outfield bar martial underperforming last season.

He's had it easy with the fans, he's been underperforming for a good 3 years, any other player other than rooney will get his effigy burnt at Old trafford.

The fact that after the shite after shite he served there's still a Rooney can't do no wrong brigade defending him speaks volume about how much of a legend of him.

But there's always the tipping point, nobody shits on the pitchs so much and gets away with it

 

[LouisDanGaal]

He's had it easy with the fans, he's been underperforming for a good 3 years, any other player other than rooney will get his effigy burnt at Old trafford.

The fact that after the shite after shite he served there's still a Rooney can't do no wrong brigade defending him speaks volume about how much of a legend of him.

But there's always the tipping point, nobody shits on the pitchs so much and gets away with it

There is not a rooney can do no wrong brigade, nobody at all believes that, its entirely in the heads of the anti-rooney brigade. He will have a good game for instance his hatrick against brugge and people will still rush on here to point out how poor the opposition are and how he's still past it, they can't just enjoy a good moment. He's had it easy with the fans because of the whole him being a club legend thing I pointed out, remember when we were laughing at Madrid fans who in that poll suggested Ronaldo should be sold? that's what the fans on here are like, they can't stick with a player through a bad patch. The real fans, the ones at the match treat him well because they have seen what he has done for the club, how important he has been and how many good moments he has provided, rather than some knee-jerk drama queens on a forum venting after a match. I'm obviously not saying there aren't real fans on here but it tends to be a vacuum for many short-sighted fanatics as well who tend to be more vocal.

 

[Speak]

First off. Let's not be retarded and pretend that Rooney's a poor victimised Britney Spears character.

Second, your wall analogy is flawed. Footballers are paid to play football. They are given wages and status in the team that should reflect the performances they are expected to turn in. It is not a statement of agenda or hate when people say that Rooney has simply underperformed for the past 2 seasons at least, and has not performed for his country in major tournaments. Rooney himself has shifted the goalposts for himself when telling the media 2 seasons ago that he is best employed as a striker and then changing his tune to "I am a midfielder". If I pay Wayne Rooney who has threatened to leave twice and accusing me of not showing enough ambition and demanding a pay rise (and don't you dare even think that he had nothing to do with this) as highly or higher than the top players in the world who perform better than him day in and day out, he'd better damn well climb that wall.

Third, "Moyes wasn't good enough, it's not his fault". Are you blind? Moyes came in without a plan and that is exactly his fault. "We got to the byline several times and thought we created enough chances to win", he said after that shiteous display against Fulham where there was zero creativity and no attempt to play football. That is as clear an indicator as any that Moyes came in without a plan and without looking to implement a system that maximised the strengths of his players. Not to mention he took a long ass break before the season started and came in like a drunk cowboy shooting his pistol at unrealistic transfer targets simply because they were big names before blundering a last minute Fellaini transfer.

Lastly, yes I agree that it isn't his fault that he is in decline as a player. But what is his fault is the shite he serves up on the pitch. The one dimensional passing, poor decision making, poor ball control, and lack of leadership has nothing to do with anyone else but him.

We clearly view life differently. I don't blame people for not being capable of doing something. You obviously do. It's the football world where there aren't clear qualifications, so to speak. People choose jobs and are given job roles based on gut feeling and opinion. Not everyone is a top player/manager, and I don't blame them for that.

If people haven't done their research before hand or put money on someone who isn't guaranteed to do the job within the club, that's their problem. Unless it can be evidenced that a person isn't putting in effort or is sabotaging things on purpose, I wont blame them for not being good enough.

As an example - I don't blame Cleverley for having the nerve to play when being picked a few years ago (or pick up his wages when offered them.) I don't blame him for the fact that his football abilities aren't of the highest standard.
Was it Bebe's fault that he isn't Messi?

I'm still struggling to understand how it's a footballers fault if they decline (which maybe people forget, isn't something they desire or plan - just like Jones doesn't desire or plan to pick up injuries.)
Or are you suggesting that as soon as a player realises they aren't good enough, they should humbly demand a pay cut or transfer?

Your random 'footballers are paid to play football' point is quite dumb, if anything.
As far as I know, he does play football. Whether you think he does it well or not is irrelevant.
And *this is the bit you don't seem to grasp* football is an industry where there aren't clear qualifications needed for on-field (or to an extent, even manager) roles.
Everyone in football knows there is an element of risk attached to every player/manager, because you are signing a player/manager based on gut feeling and opinion.

This is different to paying a qualified roofer (for example) to do his job. Because a roofer will be properly qualified to do exactly what you ask him. You give money to the guy because he's 100% qualified without doubt. Not the guy who you simply think would do a good job and may have done some nice work before.