Virgil van Dijk | Performances

RobinLFC said:
That’s irrelevant as to how good a player is though.
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It helps when rating players of a sjmilar quality imo. That's why people play football professionally, after all.

If Stam and Van Dijk were being compared, and you found it really hard to separate them on attributes, wouldn't it be fair to point to Stam's treble and 3 titles?
 
Bubz27 said:
It helps when rating players of a sjmilar quality imo. That's why people play football professionally, after all.

If Stam and Van Dijk were being compared, and you found it really hard to separate them on attributes, wouldn't it be fair to point to Stam's treble and 3 titles?
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No, because football is a team sport and you can only do so much as a defender.

It's like people bringing up rings in a debate between two similar basketbal players.
 
So we have players who have played at the top of their game year after year being part of winning teams but some think he's the best dutch player to play in the Prem. :lol::lol: Got to love the overrating of pool players.
 
RobinLFC said:
No, because football is a team sport and you can only do so much as a defender.

It's like people bringing up rings in a debate between two similar basketbal players.
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If one plays for United and one plays for Everton, then yes. (Then I'd argue they werent a top top player.) But in this case, both players are playing for top teams, then trophies come into it.
 
Bubz27 said:
If one plays for United and one plays for Everton, then yes. (Then I'd argue they werent a top top player.) But in this case, both players are playing for top teams, then trophies come into it.
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First season where Liverpool can be considered a top team, and even then they were underdogs going into this season due to the insane squad of City. The other Dutch players were playing for the best team in the league at that time. Same reason why De Gea is rated way higher than someone like Ederson for instance, even though the latter could probably win more league titles during his stay.

I do agree that he'll need to prove himself for more than 1 year though.
 


Video not available for me but apparently he's blaming the ref. Embarrassing lot.
 
Should be a ban that. If a manager isn't allowed to comment on a refs decision, the players shouldn't be allowed too.
 
According to Klopp, VVD has lost 3-4kg due to an illness and that's part of why they lost. :confused:
 
Reading this thread is hilarious. Van Dijk is a good defender in an era of shite center halves. Comparing him with Stam, Ferdinand, Terry etc is laughable. He’s done it for all of what? 6 months. Tops. Prior to that he was seen as good but with load of question marks. Go away and put it together consistently for about 5-7 seasons, then we can have this conversation. It’s not helped by that fact that once the chips are down, against either top opposition, or in pressure situations, he looks like he has at least one mistake in him. His positional awareness is miles off elite status.
 
AJ10 said:
So we have players who have played at the top of their game year after year being part of winning teams but some think he's the best dutch player to play in the Prem. :lol::lol: Got to love the overrating of pool players.
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Seriously, it’s one of the stupidest things I’ve read on the caf. Now just pause for a second and put that into context.
 
AJ10 said:
So we have players who have played at the top of their game year after year being part of winning teams but some think he's the best dutch player to play in the Prem. :lol::lol: Got to love the overrating of pool players.
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Look, just a few weeks back Fabinho was being hailed as some top class footballer by them. Keita was everything Pogba should have been. It's all par for course.
 
RobinLFC said:
No, because football is a team sport and you can only do so much as a defender.

It's like people bringing up rings in a debate between two similar basketbal players.
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It's a team sport but even judging him purely as an individual, he's spent much of his career until the age of 27 at a pretty low level. He's a baby at the real big stage. Not really a case of a defender whose been top class for years but only held back in terms of trophies by his teams.
 
simonhch said:
Reading this thread is hilarious. Van Dijk is a good defender in an era of shite center halves. Comparing him with Stam, Ferdinand, Terry etc is laughable. He’s done it for all of what? 6 months. Tops. Prior to that he was seen as good but with load of question marks. Go away and put it together consistently for about 5-7 seasons, then we can have this conversation. It’s not helped by that fact that once the chips are down, against either top opposition, or in pressure situations, he looks like he has at least one mistake in him. His positional awareness is miles off elite status.
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This
 
Can't wait for VAR. The linesman can't look at two different places at the same time. He needed help.
 
Bubz27 said:
It helps when rating players of a sjmilar quality imo. That's why people play football professionally, after all.

If Stam and Van Dijk were being compared, and you found it really hard to separate them on attributes, wouldn't it be fair to point to Stam's treble and 3 titles?
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It really doesn't though - you are using a team achievement to judge an individual. Many very average players have won things, doesn't make them great players.
 
simonhch said:
Reading this thread is hilarious. Van Dijk is a good defender in an era of shite center halves. Comparing him with Stam, Ferdinand, Terry etc is laughable. He’s done it for all of what? 6 months. Tops. Prior to that he was seen as good but with load of question marks. Go away and put it together consistently for about 5-7 seasons, then we can have this conversation. It’s not helped by that fact that once the chips are down, against either top opposition, or in pressure situations, he looks like he has at least one mistake in him. His positional awareness is miles off elite status.
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That's not true.

I have watched every game. His positional play has been superb. He will make mistakes but so does every player.

I don't care about comparisons.
 
He's brilliant at the back, in the air, across the grass and his passing.

But those comparisons and putting him above Rio/Terry/Carvalho or even up there, were absurd.
 
balaks said:
It really doesn't though - you are using a team achievement to judge an individual. Many very average players have won things, doesn't make them great players.
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How many average players have made significant contributions towards a teams success?

For instance, Thomas Vermaelen - won many trophies for Barcelona but barely featured (50 games in 4 years).
 
Di Maria's angel said:
How many average players have made significant contributions towards a teams success?

For instance, Thomas Vermaelen - won many trophies for Barcelona but barely featured (50 games in 4 years).
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That is subjective though and looking at the individual - which is fine - the issue I have is with people making broad statements that so and so is a better player than another guy because he won more medals. As you have pointed out it is much more complicated than simply looking at a trophy cabinet or medal drawer.
 
To me the best Dutch defender ever is Jaap Stam. The guy was unbelievable good in defence and had many superb match vs big team.

Best Dutch striker in the league is RVP and RVN close second.

Van Dink still has lots to do before compared to the Dutch legends.
 
balaks said:
It really doesn't though - you are using a team achievement to judge an individual. Many very average players have won things, doesn't make them great players.
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I think it does when the players are playing for teams that should be winning/competing for the highest honours. We're not talking about Djimi Traore here.


You could argue, in the original context of my post, that a top player (best Dutchman to ever play in this league) would be playing for a top team.
 
Best Dutch player in the PL - a player who has never even been to an International tournament or win a trophy in England!

He’s a player in great form, but for goodness sake, players like Bergkamp, RVP, RVN, Dtam, Robben, VDS are legends of the game. VVD is a top class defender, in this era - which is an era where there are few few decent CB’s in the world.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
It's a team sport but even judging him purely as an individual, he's spent much of his career until the age of 27 at a pretty low level. He's a baby at the real big stage. Not really a case of a defender whose been top class for years but only held back in terms of trophies by his teams.
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Stam played in the Dutch league untill he was 26. Not the best example of An early bloomer.

I think judging these different era people is nigh impossible. Personally was a big fan of Stam. Virgil, meh, I do rate him, but he doesnt really do anything for me.

If he captains the Dutch to silverware I will hapilly tattoo his mug on my bum though.

Best Dutch player in the premier league is Robben for me. Though he didn't peak there. Yet Chelsea's Robben was already the star of our National team.
 
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ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
Best Dutch player in the PL - a player who has never even been to an International tournament or win a trophy in England!

He’s a player in great form, but for goodness sake, players like Bergkamp, RVP, RVN, Dtam, Robben, VDS are legends of the game. VVD is a top class defender, in this era - which is an era where there are few few decent CB’s in the world.
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Think the last point is very relevant. PL once had Vidic,Rio,Terry, Kompany playing at the same time. Compare with the duds we have in PL now and we will get the difference .
Again not saying he is a bad defender. He is brilliant but bit overrated here.
 
He's a very good player but he's been overrated, in typical fashion, by Liverpool fans. That's what they do.

They used to say Hyypia was the best defender the league had seen as well. We're talking about a fanbase that thought Keita was better than Pogba here.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
It's a team sport but even judging him purely as an individual, he's spent much of his career until the age of 27 at a pretty low level. He's a baby at the real big stage. Not really a case of a defender whose been top class for years but only held back in terms of trophies by his teams.
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That's not what I commented on. He's not even close to being the best Dutch player in the PL nor will he ever be. You have great players and you have legends - Van Dijk currently belongs in the former category and it's highly unlikely he'll end up in the latter one.

Taking trophies into account to compare individual players is useless a lot of times, and I'll stand by it. If you're comparing Del Piero with Totti and you're giving the edge to Del Piero based on trophies, I'll quote Capello: one Scudetto in Rome is worth 10 in Turin.
 
As we are in need of humour today, here’s Tanc having a go at a Liverpool fan.

Tanc had a top 10 footballer list, which led to Liverpool fans saying VvD should be in it.


Here’s the list...and yes he has two people both as number 5 giving him 11 people in his top 10 list :rolleyes:

1 Messi
2 Cristiano
3 Mbappé
4 Neymar
5 Hazard
5 Kane
6 Suarez
7 Salah
8 De Bruyne
9 Griezmann
10 Icardi
 
Chelsea fans will be heartened to see their player is the fifth best in the world currently. Mulling over that while waving goodbye to CL football for another season. :)
 
48 hours said:
As we are in need of humour today, here’s Tanc having a go at a Liverpool fan.

Tanc had a top 10 footballer list, which led to Liverpool fans saying VvD should be in it.


Here’s the list...and yes he has two people both as number 5 giving him 11 people in his top 10 list :rolleyes:

1 Messi
2 Cristiano
3 Mbappé
4 Neymar
5 Hazard
5 Kane
6 Suarez
7 Salah
8 De Bruyne
9 Griezmann
10 Icardi
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Hazard Icardi Griezzman El oh el
 
Liverpool fans are well and truly infatuated with van Dijk. He's an incredible defender for sure, one of the best in the world, but the overstatement of his abilities is painful. Getting upset because he is not in a top ten list (compiled by one of the worst journalists in football at that) of the world's greatest players is a bit silly.
 
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