the English refs are the ones operating the VAR
VAR Decisions - PL 19/20 Season
- Thread starter edcunited1878
- Start date
Glad we agree then.
I'm not even sure it's the refs themselves so much as the officials above them. Everything about the way VAR has been implemented in England suggests an extreme reluctance to have on-pitch decisions corrected, overturned or officially deemed as having been incorrect in any way unless it is absolutely unavoidable. It's built into the principles of how they want VAR to operate.
Shite though the on-pitch or video assisted referees may themselves be, they're not the ones who created the system that actively discourages them from overturning decisions.
Shite though the on-pitch or video assisted referees may themselves be, they're not the ones who created the system that actively discourages them from overturning decisions.
Has VAR done anything useful this season? It might as well not be in effect, absolutely fecking pointless
Years and years of talk about their incompetents. VAR could highlight that level of incompetents, in more or less black and white situation they dont have a choice but to correct mistakes but give them a bit of space on a bit of subjective side and they going full brothers in black/pink mode, what ever they wear during a game.
I mean offside call vs Arsenal, holy shit, thats something alright. If you give them option to cover their m8s, they will take it, otherwise they would have to remove some of those refs or force improvement on them.
I mean offside call vs Arsenal, holy shit, thats something alright. If you give them option to cover their m8s, they will take it, otherwise they would have to remove some of those refs or force improvement on them.
Yeah, the PL fecked up version is wank.
I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure a dive is the simulation of contact, meaning there was no contact. Embellishing contact can't be considered a dive. Albrighton made a wreckless, unneeded challenge, then Mane made a meal of it causing the ref to award a pen. VAR can't overturn that and frankly shouldn't.
Honestly think VAR could disappear from the PL tomorrow and no one would notice or care, it's been so badly handled, and only managed to make the officials in this country look even more useless.
Agree, I've hated it from the start, pointless they way it's being used.
Fair comment but where that falls is the players who have been booked for simulation, and on replay have clearly been caught, it's a double standard. There VAR is not being used as it was supposedly brought in to do, guarantee fair play ! Those yellows mount up to a suspension, where they should be recinded but under the stupid rules it cannot! Bin VAR now, more mistakes now than ever.
the problem is in the consistency. With just the referee you can put it down to human mistakes. But with technology, you have to get more consistency. If the VAR didn’t overturn this one, then they should have intervened in martial vs palace or rodeo vs city, where the contact was way more clear than this instant.
the latter instances were not even accepted as mistakes by the ref in their report.
If a player is booked for simulation and there is contact, that is a terrible call. You can't police embellishing contact in any sport. The best thing you can do is not make a call. Your definition of fair play seems subjective.
I agree it should be consistent but the point is VAR was never designed to redo subjective decisions (fouls, yellows, embellishing contact). It was designed to fix obvious errors (offsides, violent conduct not seen by ref, handballs, etc). VAR is not perfect but I think expectations of it change based on who is playing. In this case, if the decision went against Liverpool nobody would be this upset.
Wouldn't it be funny if Rashford or Air Marshall Young get a slight contact in the area at 0-0. Fall down like a ton of bricks and ref doesn't award the penalty. VAR then views it and says no clear and obvious error. Only for Utd fans to scream blue murder?
Current implementation of VAR lets them get away with it.
Hilarious. In fecking stitches here.Wouldn't it be funny if Rashford or Air Marshall Young get a slight contact in the area at 0-0. Fall down like a ton of bricks and ref doesn't award the penalty. VAR then views it and says no clear and obvious error. Only for Utd fans to scream blue murder?
We should encourage all United players to go down in the box under the slightest touch. Sure, the ref will disregard those plenty of times but if we just continue to do it, like say 10 times in a game then it will increase the chances of the ref blowing his whistle, and by then VAR has no other option than to review it and as long as there was a slight contact a penalty will be given. It is a loophole in the system right now and we should take advantage of it to get the 3 points.
Don't quit your day job.Wouldn't it be funny if Rashford or Air Marshall Young get a slight contact in the area at 0-0. Fall down like a ton of bricks and ref doesn't award the penalty. VAR then views it and says no clear and obvious error. Only for Utd fans to scream blue murder?
VAR for offside is great, however VAR only checking for red card incidents is stupid. It should also look at yellow cards moments
Simulation is the attempt to deceive the referee. This includes feigning injury or pretending to have been fouled. There is no mention anywhere in the laws that simulation is only for instance with no contact. Embellishing contact is still simulation.
Of course VAR can overturn it. If they think it isn't a penalty then it'll be overruled. Slight contact isn't a foul, so slight contact doesn't mean VAR can't overrule it. How would that make any sense? VAR weren't going to overrule it because the PL VAR never overrule anything other than for offside and because it arguably was a penalty, even though Mane went down like an idiot. Of course they could have though.
But he was fouled and the contact wasn't slight, he just made a meal of it. Now if Mane drags purposely drags his legs over a defender not making a challenge that is a different scenario. When I say embellishing contact, I mean embellishing contact initiated by the defender and that can never be simulation in any sport (the NBA has good examples of this).
Just been on MOTD. Blatant dive by Mane. Not sure how anyone can see it another way? He actually takes another deliberate touch on the ball after the contact to move it away from Allbrighton, stops to think about it and then throws himself down.
You have to have one to be able to do that.
I honestly dont know what to say anymore. People trying to say it's a pen today yet when Martial was fouled by crystal palace defender who was basically playing american football nothing was said.
Wouldn't it be funny if Rashford or Air Marshall Young get a slight contact in the area at 0-0. Fall down like a ton of bricks and ref doesn't award the penalty. VAR then views it and says no clear and obvious error. Only for Utd fans to scream blue murder?
Yeah but, what if, what if, that thing that happened in Uniteds favour years ago was still brought up scousers in a ridiculous attempt at justifying 2 seasons of blatantly crap decisions in Liverpool's favour?
Let's not forget Valencia being half an inch offside 5 minutes before Zlatan scored.
MONUMENTAL!
Wouldn't it be funny if you lot spent 30 years claiming the FA are corrupt only to finally win the league through absolute Bollox.
Imagine that....
Fair enough.I'd snap your hand off.
VAR is a complete waste of time . Well the English version is anyhow . The clear and obvious rule is ruining the game imo. VAR hardly ever over turns a refs decision because like 99.9% of them you could probably argue a slight chance the original decision is right or wrong .
Nope. Only the ref can overturn it
The leagues in which VAR basically re-refs the games are absolutely worse.
In South America, where this is the case, you see VAR intervening at all times, with the last Libertadores game having 20 minutes of it being stopped by VAR.
I understand though, its a lost cause for me. 95% of fans want more VAR, I really really don't understand it.
I think EPL knows they have a gem in their hands, they don't want the crazy frenetic pace of the games to be interrupted by VAR all the time. They are spot on.
But again, I understand I am against the grain here. Most people disagree with me. If EPL turns into the shit show that is in Serie A, south america etc I honestly consider stop watching football. Its that bad.
The premier league has always mainly been about £, that's why they're not using the screens to let the referees review decisions, worried fans might lose interest due to the delay..
VAR in the premier league is just an extension of the "entertainment machine", to try and make the most money from TV rights as possible. Correct or not decisions, don't come in to it. That is why it seems so terrible compared to all the other leagues.
I've pretty much given up watching premier league games this season other than Chelsea, just too frustrating. The Utd Palace game was the final straw for me, probably the worst refereed game I've ever seen.
There just aren't these refereeing and VAR issues in Spain & Italy, can enjoy the actual games and they're trying to make them a fair contest.
Obviously enjoying football is subjective...
Personally I can't see how anyone who watches football in the other European leagues, the CL or EL and the premier league could think what the premier league is doing is "better".
It's unwatchable, I'll be interest to see the TV ratings come end of the season and the next one...
Go on twitter, it's obvious even the most casual of fans can see what the EPL is doing...
https://twitter.com/search?q=premier league var&src=typed_query&f=live
If they were to do VAR properly, they should have 3 officials who are not watching the game at all and are not in communication with each other and then provide them each incidents with absolutely no knowledge of any decision the referee has already made. Majority decision.
Completely remove the confirmation bias that clearly exists.
Completely remove the confirmation bias that clearly exists.
What is the point of VAR. I haven't wanted it from the start, but if you are going to have it, then use it properly. The decision yesterday with Liverpool's last minute penalty says it all. This was in the dying seconds of the match, & had a massive effect on the league. Was it a penalty, no. Mane either fell or dived, & the only decision should have been a yellow card for him. The referee obviously did a homer & went with the crowd, so it was an ideal situation for VAR to show what it was supposed to do. In other words, overturn a clearly wrong decision. So what does it do. Absolutely nothing. What is the point of it. Then to cap it all the sanctimonious humbug known as Klopp, then comes out with a straight face saying it was an obvious penalty. Can you imagine if it had been a Leicester penalty, the hypercritical twerp would have been jumping up & down with rage.
Referees aka "fecking clowns" are given way too much power IMHO.
The minute they came up with the clear and obvious it went to shit. Also that they gave quotas for refs to check the screens for the whole season. I watch a lot of Bundesliga and must say even though sometimes it's really strange to have refs run there and check it works much better. This was so bad and I even got my Liverpool mate to agree on that if it had been the other way around the ref would never have given it and it would have been denied by VAR due to it not being a pen .
There’s two things the game is absolutely desperate for, even more so with VAR, and that’s transparency and accountability.
Firstly, decisions need clear explanation from the officials that made them. In a lot of cases it could educate the layman to the nuances of the rules, in other cases it could establish a consensus on when decisions are right or wrong and if the rules maybe need changing.
With transparency comes accountability. If you’ve got referees constantly making decisions that they have no good explanation for then they need to be held accountable for them. It’s currently a closed society of professionals who look after their own. It’s no surprise the standard is getting so fecking bad, they have the written rules and then they have their own code that they apply to the game and it’s completely wrong.
Firstly, decisions need clear explanation from the officials that made them. In a lot of cases it could educate the layman to the nuances of the rules, in other cases it could establish a consensus on when decisions are right or wrong and if the rules maybe need changing.
With transparency comes accountability. If you’ve got referees constantly making decisions that they have no good explanation for then they need to be held accountable for them. It’s currently a closed society of professionals who look after their own. It’s no surprise the standard is getting so fecking bad, they have the written rules and then they have their own code that they apply to the game and it’s completely wrong.
Just look at some of the penalties both Manchester clubs have been denied this season, and then look at that Mane one yesterday... VAR is working entirely as it's meant to.
The decision against anybody is the issues no matter who it is, it's not being used correctly if it's still open to suggestions or differing opinions from different VAR officials it's not working! There were so called grey areas before there are more now. Grealish for Villa perfect goal, VAR disallowed it through poor Refereenig wrong, hand balls in boxes it's different when goal is scored to not , wrong all these are grey areas , if so just bin it and go back to the human mistakes everyone is used to.
If you want to use VAR only use it for tight offsides nothing else. Then that has been hopeless as well because if a lino raises his flag and ref blows whistle game has to be stopped, no matter on or off side, well that's what's supposed to happen!
Get rid of it now It does not work pointless having it.
Isn't the whole idea of VAR getting the correct decision. Look at the Palace goal onside by a finger nail. Mane dives yes dives but can't overturn as no obvious error. Soft penalty no he dived end of. Either you want correct decisions or not. Simulation as it was in the penalty box = 5 match automatic ban to get this crap out of the game, Its the worst form of cheating & Scouserpool have been excellent at it in the last 12 months (look at the earlier post in this thread). I thought VAR was going to rid of this but hey but as others said the PL have implemented their flawed version of Brexit. Absolute joke.
Agree, and it's got progressively worse since they all become Proffesional officials, these guys make a very very good living at this, they haven't got day jobs like before, there is a serious need to look at this, and they need to look at other sports to find the answer.