Van Dijk revisited

cyberman said:
It’s a shame but it looks as if the injury has done a number on him. He isn’t even the best CB at Liverpool anymore
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Matip looked a better player for sure tonight.

For the goal VVD should have engaged tighter and not allowed the shot, also got lucky with one or two touches which could have left him looking red faced.

It's interesting to note that they rarely leave him as the last man back as well, not sure if he has maybe lost a yard of pace post injury?
 
Strange bump. He didn’t give Vardy a sniff and shut him out at basically every opportunity. To the point Vardy was too scared to even try anything.
 
Klopper76 said:
Who is? Van Dijk has been excellent this season.
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Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
 
Top player. World class. Arguably the most overrated player in Premier League history.
 
He dropped many levels now. Still better than our defenders. But dropped levels.
 
I love to mock him but thought he was good today. Maybe because I just saw our defenders crap show yesterday.
 
cyberman said:
Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
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I think that's too short-termism, Rudigers playing well but Van Djik back from injury is still a level or two above that. He's playing a little more reservedly and understanbley so, but he still looks good
 
cyberman said:
Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
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He doesn't even play on Trent's side though? He plays as a left sided CB.
 
Imagine the dogs abuse Maguire would have got for not blocking that shot for the goal.
 
AshRK said:
I love to mock him but thought he was good today. Maybe because I just saw our defenders crap show yesterday.
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This is like praising Lindelof for doing his job. He was ok, but could have done better for the goal, and thats what he'll be judged for
 
He's lost couple of steps after knee injury, which is understandable.

But, folks are deluding themselves with takes in here. He's still a world class player and absolutely crucial for them, few games when he was out showed how open Liverpool were at the back.
 
Klopper76 said:
He'll be in the PL team of the season.

No, Matip or Konate covers Trent's side. Van Dijk cover's the LB area.
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Not back in the day? I swear I’ve seen him go out and man handle Rashford etc on the left. He seemed to sweep up everything back there
 
cyberman said:
Not back in the day? I swear I’ve seen him go out and man handle Rashford etc on the left. He seemed to sweep up everything back there
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That's rare. You'll usually see someone else on that side depending on who he's playing with. It's why teams target that side. Alexander-Arnold is easier to get at and the CB covering isn't Van Dijk so teams tend to go that way.
 
Van Dijk is the best defender in the league. It’s not even a question.
 
Ludens the Red said:
Strange bump. He didn’t give Vardy a sniff and shut him out at basically every opportunity. To the point Vardy was too scared to even try anything.
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This.

And of all the players involved he’s the least at fault for the goal. Firstly Henderson doesn’t track his runner, then Trent lets his runner jog off him, then Matip lets the striker cut inside and get a clear shot away. At least Van Dijk closes the most dangerous half of the goal but by that point the errors had accumulated and the damage was just about all done.
 
Klopper76 said:
That's rare. You'll usually see someone else on that side depending on who he's playing with. It's why teams target that side. Alexander-Arnold is easier to get at and the CB covering isn't Van Dijk so teams tend to go that way.
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Tosh; they target the left because TAA cannot defend, whereas Robertson, relatively, can, although at times he screams.
 
Figgins said:
Tosh; they target the left because TAA cannot defend, whereas Robertson, relatively, can, although at times he screams.
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Yeah but Van Dijk is a very difficult defender to beat as well. Robertson leaves some space behind him as well at times. He is better at defending one on ones though.
 
Klopper76 said:
Yeah but Van Dijk is a very difficult defender to beat as well. Robertson leaves some space behind him as well at times. He is better at defending one on ones though.
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was; he’s good With the ball in front, he’s lost the twist. He’s just not as good as he was
 
Very strange bump. Although I feel that he lost that explosiveness/acceleration that helped him be incontestable the best CB in the world before his injury, he is still very solid and among the best defenders out there (probably in top 3).
The season when some people were touting him for Ballon D'or, I actually felt he was invincible in 1vs1 .. a feeling only Nesta 2000-2003 and Neuer 2013-2015 gave me all these years of watching football.
 
Klopper76 said:
Yeah but Van Dijk is a very difficult defender to beat as well. Robertson leaves some space behind him as well at times. He is better at defending one on ones though.
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There isn’t a hole in hell that goal happens on the other side if Robertson was playing.

Robertson would not be caught jogging back half-heartedly allowing an attacker to run off him and end up scoring. Trent is an awful defender who doesn’t read the defensive game well and lacks the drive to cover positions and track runs.
 
Kush said:
He's lost couple of steps after knee injury, which is understandable.

But, folks are deluding themselves with takes in here. He's still a world class player and absolutely crucial for them, few games when he was out showed how open Liverpool were at the back.
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This is true, they were horrid at the back for the couple games he missed. If he gets injured again for any period of time where he has to miss 6 games plus, they’re fecked.
 
cyberman said:
Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
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Thinking the left centre back is going to cover for the right back is wishful thinking.
 
cyberman said:
It’s a shame but it looks as if the injury has done a number on him. He isn’t even the best CB at Liverpool anymore
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These kind of posts are cringe. You surely can’t have watched VVD barely at all this season. He’s still world class and arguably the best defender in the league.
 
cyberman said:
Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
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This confirms you clearly don’t watch him. You don’t even know what side of the defence he plays on.
 
cyberman said:
Not from what I’m seeing. The majestic defender taking attackers souls is gone. He can’t dominate strikers and cover for Trent at the same time anymore.
im not saying he’s a bad defender but he isn’t the best in the world anymore, he isn’t even Rudiger level just below that
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VVD is level above Rudiger, by far the best CB in the league.
 
Pep Guardiola thinks Van Dijk is overhyped by football pundits especially Jamie Carragher.
In a Christmas special interview with Amazon Prime he said :

" A lot of pundits especially Jamie Carragher compares Virgil with the likes of Vidic, Terry and Ferdinand but the reality is he's a good defender but nowhere near them. We've beat Liverpool by four-five goals twice in last few seasons and the players don't really find him that intimidating. Nemanja Vidic in my opinion should go down as the best defender to ever play in England as he's faced my prime Barcelona team a number of times and he was that one player who impressed me the most, I tried to sign him in 2010 but he was loyal to Sir Alex. Players like Van Dijk, Maguire and Silva never faced my Barcelona team of 2009-12, that was the toughest thing they could defend against."
 
roonster09 said:
VVD is level above Rudiger, by far the best CB in the league.
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Not this season. Where’s the performances?
Rudiger may be protected by the system somewhat but I’m struggling to see where Liverpools defensive examples come from.
Not only do they concede silly goals but feck me the chances they give up and the misses from the opposition is extraordinary, and that’s with a defensive midfield 3 in front of them as well.
it’s not just defensively but Rudiger has leapt in front of him with the ball at his feet as well.
Arsenal are the only side in the top 6 who didn’t swamp their defence this season, that never used to happen and you have seen more mistakes, more failure to track runs like last night than you ever had with him before in a Liverpool shirt
 
roonster09 said:
VVD is level above Rudiger, by far the best CB in the league.
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Not anymore, I noticed it after Atletico away and I’m gonna dig back and see the goals they have conceded to see where VVD could have done better.
Griezmann missed a 1v1 when VVD let him go and it was like he was stuck in quick sand trying to catch back up. His actual goal is VVD getting his positioning all wrong and being turned inside his own box
That never used to happen. You know what’s an easier way to gauge this? The lack of OMG! What a performance!!! Posts on here anymore. Im not going to look at all the goals this morning but I’ll skim through a few and give an honest assessment because this Liverpool team is due that this season instead of being the subject of empty praise like this.
Honestly, where are these VVD performances? These defensive master classes must be easy to reference?
 
cyberman said:
but I’ll skim through a few and give an honest assessment
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I'm not looking forward for this "honest" assessment, so is you are replying to me you can save the time.

If it's for other posters, please go ahead
 
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The standards defenders are held to nowadays are impossibly high. I blame the fact that we now get 20 replays and 15mins of analysis for every goal conceded. Of course the CBs can be highlighted for virtually every goal that goes in due to the nature of their position. Of course there is always a different action they COULD have taken.

Take van Dijk last night. Yeah, he could have stepped out and engaged Lookman, but Lookman was travelling at pace and from his body shape, had set himself to shoot across the goal. In that split micro-second, you see van Dijk decides to plant his body and make a barrier, blocking the shot into the far corner. At the last minute, Lookman whips the ball nearpost and scores.

So yeah, you can say vVD could have engaged...but if he had given a penalty away the same pundits would have said "no need to dive in/going nowhere". Yeah he could have set-up to block a nearpost shot, but the percentage call based on Lookman's body shape in that split moment was the shot was going far post. Sky rarely go back and analyse all the mundane tackles, blocks and headers defenders make, because they are so outcome-orientated it'a untrue.

Another example...the most hated player on this forum...our captain, Harry Maguire. Against Newcastle, ASM shapes to shoot and Maguire covers, again, all at high-speed (and whilst instructing Dalot to cover the outside run). ASM doesn't shoot and takes another step. 99/100 this would leave him unable to get a shot off as you can see, ASM is now off-balance and is starting to fall away from the ball. Maguire would have known this was the low-percentage option, just like vVD knew the near-post shot was the low percentage option. Somehow, ASM managed to generate enough power and accuracy to get a shot on target and for it to nestle right into the corner of the net. I actually think if ASM tried that again 100 times, he wouldn't manage it again. So yes, Maguire ends up looking bad, because he goes with the first dummy and over-covers...but that is the percentage play. If ASM hits that early and scores, Maguire gets pelters again.

I'd love to see attackers held to these standards. CBs are measured in freeze-frames and micro-seconds. The likes of Rashford and Bruno (and even players like KdB) run about making mistake after mistake, giving the ball away in bad areas, overhitting passes, taking wild-shots, making poor decisions etc...yet eventually something comes off and they score/assist and they are a "genius" again.

Who would be a CB in modern football? Forced to defend halfway up the pitch, absolutely must be fantastic on the ball and be able to pass out against a press AND any slight mistake is pounced on. It's ridiculous.
 
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