US Army helicopter / American Airlines Crash in DC | Medical plane crash in Philly

Between all the other bile coming from Donnie's mouth it's once again very obvious people have already gotten in his ear who are looking to profit from it. Watch a certain company or companies with direct or indirect ties to him get a contract to "upgrade" or replace ATC systems.
 
gaffs said:
Trump saying he signed a bill to hire people of "superior intelligence" to work as Air Traffic Controllers.

Median annual wage for air traffic controllers is $137k.

Sorry, I think I will take my "superior intelligence" and work elsewhere.
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Too bad they don't have the same requirements for POTUS.
 
Carolina Red said:
I mean… were guys in the Blackhawk just looking at the wrong plane?

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That has to be a distinct possibility, most landings and takeoffs at DCA are on runway 1/19, this one was on 33 which is a shorter cross runway, it's normally used a lot less and is typically used by CRJ-200/700s and Dash-8 props
 
4bars said:
Trump is right, should be one or the other, you can't be both at the same time. Good that they are scrapping the DEI
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Nope, it says typically, not always, it's not unusual, es[pecially at break times and/or shift change over
 
Redplane said:
Between all the other bile coming from Donnie's mouth it's once again very obvious people have already gotten in his ear who are looking to profit from it. Watch a certain company or companies with direct or indirect ties to him get a contract to "upgrade" or replace ATC systems.
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MAGAts and RWNJs fueled by hate talk radio, right wing media, and online vile would be shouting "conspiracy!" from the rooftoops if the Dems were doing this stuff.
 
Red in STL said:
Nope, it says typically, not always, it's not unusual, es[pecially at break times and/or shift change over
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Rams said:
No he’s not. The reason is lack of investment of course.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GAOREPORTS-GAO-04-770T/html/GAOREPORTS-GAO-04-770T.htm

But guess what Trump wants to do because poor Elon is paying too much taxes?
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@Redplane understood what i meant with the message that you quoted. I am just a genius of comedy
 
4bars said:
OK you got me there but it's not the sort of thing I find humor in TBH

DCA is an airport I've spent a lot of time at over the years, both as a passenger and as an aviation photographer[/USER]
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This guy goes a pretty good job walking through the buildup and aftermath just using comms recordings and the map:



Though he mostly stays away from pointing fingers he seems to make it pretty clear imho that the the failure may have been systemic as they so often are: the CRJ appears to have done exactly what it should have, tower told the Blackhawk to maintain visual separation, they erroneously accept that thinking they have the plane in sight when they clearly don't, and tower realizes when it's pretty much too late they clearly are not seeing it. Seems like the fault can be put with both the BH and ATC to a degree. Even if the BH though didn't see the CRJ, why would they fly directly into the approach path of an active runway? And why did ATC trust them to maintain visual separation at night in such a crowded corridor? I really hope this will lead to some serious regulatory changes.

Btw heart goes out as well to the poor controller who had the lead on this communication and then after realizing what happened had to vector remaining in and outbounds away from the airfield as quickly as possible. Was impressed though with how quickly ground control seemed to put a complete hold on any other movements so rescue could cross unimpeded.
 
Redplane said:
tower told the Blackhawk to maintain visual separation
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Other way around: the helicopter requested visual separation, the tower then approved it. It's in the video correctly.
 
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berbatrick said:
I follow those ATC youtube channels and there's been a separation incident in the US every few months, for almost 2-3 years now. Many at SF and DC.
But unlike this one, none involved a helicopter, most involved an aircraft on the runway in conflict with one in the air or on a taxiway, in many, the ATC seemed to be at fault, and of course, for the ones in the air, TCAS got involved.
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What are the worst airports in the US in terms of separation incidents?
 
berbatrick said:
I follow those ATC youtube channels and there's been a separation incident in the US every few months, for almost 2-3 years now. Many at SF and DC.
But unlike this one, none involved a helicopter, most involved an aircraft on the runway in conflict with one in the air or on a taxiway, in many, the ATC seemed to be at fault, and of course, for the ones in the air, TCAS got involved.
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I think you're referencing Runway Incursions?
 
Helicopter presumably to have deviated from approved path.

NYT:
An Army helicopter may have deviated from its approved flight path before its deadly collision with an American Airlines jet over the Potomac River, the latest details to emerge as investigators combed the crash site for clues.
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Blaming this on DEI initiatives is utterly pathetic but what else can you expect from the rapist and his rabid supporters?
 
Redplane said:
This guy goes a pretty good job walking through the buildup and aftermath just using comms recordings and the map:



Though he mostly stays away from pointing fingers he seems to make it pretty clear imho that the the failure may have been systemic as they so often are: the CRJ appears to have done exactly what it should have, tower told the Blackhawk to maintain visual separation, they erroneously accept that thinking they have the plane in sight when they clearly don't, and tower realizes when it's pretty much too late they clearly are not seeing it. Seems like the fault can be put with both the BH and ATC to a degree. Even if the BH though didn't see the CRJ, why would they fly directly into the approach path of an active runway? And why did ATC trust them to maintain visual separation at night in such a crowded corridor? I really hope this will lead to some serious regulatory changes.

Btw heart goes out as well to the poor controller who had the lead on this communication and then after realizing what happened had to vector remaining in and outbounds away from the airfield as quickly as possible. Was impressed though with how quickly ground control seemed to put a complete hold on any other movements so rescue could cross unimpeded.
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This guy's video is pretty good - However the issue with this idea of the Helicopter seeing the plane further behind the one they hit is they are given an express command to turn "behind" the CRJ plane. This would mean they should wait and hover or maneuver away from the other plane also on an inbound flightpath.

The pilot of the Helicopter could have queried this command from ATC - but he didn't - he went directly against it and turned in AHEAD of the plane HE thought was the CRJ, right into the path of the nearer plane. This seems a weird move to be making so close to an active runway.

I'm not trying to do a Trump here and say for definite one person is at fault...it could be a malfunction of the pilot's night vision equipment or an incorrect mission briefing.
 
buchansleftleg said:
Remember he released confidential FBI report info about the Manchester Bombing on Twitter in the immediate aftermath - that caused absolute mayhem among the families of victims and Emergency service personnel.
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I knew there would be competition to that claim :lol: Its just so difficult to remember it all. So many times he's proven to the world he should be nowhere near any position of responsibility of anything, ever.
 
Redplane said:
This guy goes a pretty good job walking through the buildup and aftermath just using comms recordings and the map:



Though he mostly stays away from pointing fingers he seems to make it pretty clear imho that the the failure may have been systemic as they so often are: the CRJ appears to have done exactly what it should have, tower told the Blackhawk to maintain visual separation, they erroneously accept that thinking they have the plane in sight when they clearly don't, and tower realizes when it's pretty much too late they clearly are not seeing it. Seems like the fault can be put with both the BH and ATC to a degree. Even if the BH though didn't see the CRJ, why would they fly directly into the approach path of an active runway? And why did ATC trust them to maintain visual separation at night in such a crowded corridor? I really hope this will lead to some serious regulatory changes.

Btw heart goes out as well to the poor controller who had the lead on this communication and then after realizing what happened had to vector remaining in and outbounds away from the airfield as quickly as possible. Was impressed though with how quickly ground control seemed to put a complete hold on any other movements so rescue could cross unimpeded.
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I think he's got it spot on. The helicopter pilot was aiming to go behind the next aircraft and looks like the angle meant aside from a strobe and a tailfin illuminated against a sea of lights he had little chance of seeing the CRJ.


Something else that stands out is the response. ATC announcing a crash shouldn't have to be asked where it is. Hints to some of the question marks over US ATC.
 
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