I'm not sure "even as we were watching team after team target and exploit AWB with their press, I was still saying he's really good at not being pressed" is the winning argument you think it is.
Unpopular (AKA fickle) opinion time on AWB.....
- Thread starter Nou_Camp99
- Start date
I'm not sure "even as we were watching team after team target and exploit AWB with their press, I was still saying he's really good at not being pressed" is the winning argument you think it is.
That was more because he had Dan James or Lingard in front of him who never showed for the ball and Fred and Mctominay inside him who didn't want it either.
No surprise that with a bit of coaching from Ten Hag, Casemiro and Eriksen inside of him and Anthony in front of him that he looks much better when pressed.
This is a very good point. If your teammates aren’t showing, and leaving you isolated even when in possession, it’s going to make a player seem worse.
AWB has been picking his passes and dribbles out of trouble almost perfectly in recent matches, and having players to pass to certainly helps.
I also find him quite press resistant.
Under Ole our players positioning was all over the place - so pressing Wan Bissaka used to make him a quick incalculable pass to a player that wasn’t in possession.
Now we are much more about possesion and positioning - when Wan Bissaka gets pressed; the team’s positioning is usually quite safe or he can dribble out of the trouble himself.
Under Ole our players positioning was all over the place - so pressing Wan Bissaka used to make him a quick incalculable pass to a player that wasn’t in possession.
Now we are much more about possesion and positioning - when Wan Bissaka gets pressed; the team’s positioning is usually quite safe or he can dribble out of the trouble himself.
You would need stats since all you have is your opinion - which at the moment is most untrustworthy given how fickle it appears to be.
Being proven right by making a strong claim against the sea of public opinion and then having the tide of that sea turn around is infact, sir, a winning argument.
Professional managers have regularly targeted him as he often turns over possession when under pressure. I'm not even sure what arbitrary stat you'd want to prove that, it's visible to anyone who has watched him regularly.
You can argue he has improved in this regard, which he has, marginally. But to say he's always been press resistant is simply untrue.
He has a very unorthodox, but somewhat effective dribbling style; that is is not press resistance, nor does that make him press resistant.
We do not need to rewrite history because he's in a good vein of form. When everyone is fit he will not be starting, especially against any team that will press our defenders.
"Am I out of touch? No it's the children that are wrong."
Not hard. There must be some stat on turnovers per game out there.
Anyway, I'm happy to disagree on the points we've discussed so far, given that it suffices to say: I told you so.
Go and look them up then; I'm not the one asking for stats. Somethings don't need quantifying when you can see over multiple seasons how he is targeted due to his lack of composure and passing ability.
The sheer levels of arrogance and sanctimony you're displaying over this is hilarious, even more so when our manager had actively tried to offload him since his arrival. But apparently you've seen something everyone else with eyes has missed. The onus is on you to prove that, not the other way round.
Children shouldn't be anywhere near the internet, let alone argue with adults.
Much improved of late but he's still levels below Shaw on the opposite wing. Defensively solid, making some decent overlapping runs, but he lacks the technical ability to be a top, top full back.
Come on now, keep up with yourself.
You came in and made an assertion, being that AWB is targeted for turnovers by opposing managers. I asked if you had stats to prove it, and you asked what stats. I merely advised you on what to look for. You could have asked for stats from the beginning and I would have happily provided them - as I now have, below.
So what do these tell us?
Dribbles: He's a much better dribbler than other top right backs. Did your eye test tell you that?
Poor touches: He's just about average when compared with top right-backs.
So how can someone who's comparatively an excellent dribbler, who doesn't make an unusual amount of poor touches be simultaneously poor at press resistance? If he was poor at resisting the press it would obviously tell in a much lower dribble success rate, wouldn't it?
Edit:
And these are from what most would consider his worst season.
Edit +:
Thought you might enjoy an accompanying video - to refresh your eye test.
AWB Press Resistance Eye Test
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you haven't a clue. Carry on, kid.
You seem to think "kid" is an insult. I'd suggest, going by the eye test, of course, that you're merely projecting your insecurities over your own age perhaps.
Don't. You'll grow up and find that there's so much joy to being young. I promise.
Then again, you might just be a childish man who can't admit when he's wrong in an argument. That would be a shame.
All the best either ways!
The ironing is absolutely delicious. Please keep it up, this is cheering me right up.
I seem to remember AWB being given space under Ole because opponents knew he could do very little with the ball. Don't remember him being overly targeted by the opposition press.
What ironing? Did you mean irony?
Whatever the case, I am indeed pleased to see that something about my contributions here has cheered you up. I wouldn't have it any other way!
Cheers!
Edit:
On second thought, perhaps it's all that delicious ironing giving you such good cheer? How disappointing for me.
2/10; must do better.
.
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I remember him not being given space because they knew his passing was a bit ropy and he'd cough up possession semi often. He isn't / wasn't easy to get the ball off, he was liable to just give it away or put other players in difficult situations by poor choice or execution.
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Thought he was good and thought going forward he was hampered by Antony who was a tad unorthodox. Wasn’t sure if Antony wanted to hug the touchline and get crosses in or whether he was just aimlessly running - keeping possession. No cohesion between the two but if AWB can form a proper partnership on that side I don’t have an issue with him at all.
Actually thought Shaw was quite poor going forward last night.
Actually thought Shaw was quite poor going forward last night.
Come on now, keep up with yourself.
You came in and made an assertion, being that AWB is targeted for turnovers by opposing managers. I asked if you had stats to prove it, and you asked what stats. I merely advised you on what to look for. You could have asked for stats from the beginning and I would have happily provided them - as I now have, below.
So what do these tell us?
Dribbles: He's a much better dribbler than other top right backs. Did your eye test tell you that?
Poor touches: He's just about average when compared with top right-backs.
So how can someone who's comparatively an excellent dribbler, who doesn't make an unusual amount of poor touches be simultaneously poor at press resistance? If he was poor at resisting the press it would obviously tell in a much lower dribble success rate, wouldn't it?
Edit:
And these are from what most would consider his worst season.
Edit +:
Thought you might enjoy an accompanying video - to refresh your eye test.
AWB Press Resistance Eye Test
He has quite a specific "lanky" type of dribble (can't find a better word) in which he is pretty successful. However his passing/decision making/final ball are all quite questionable at times. That makes him relatively ineffective going forward (your stats confirm that).
What makes him good at this time is that he is a solid ball career, keeps it simple and has his side of the pitch locked. Don't think he will ever truly excell going forward, but these traits still make him pretty valuable to most EPL clubs. We could and should actually get solid money for him if we decide to sell because of his qualities.
Last season, both AWB and Rashford were so bad that we thought their career as professional footballer are done.
Their transformation this season are unbelievable. Rashford looks like 100M striker and AWB looks like 50M defender again.
Such a big difference coached by a proper manager
Their transformation this season are unbelievable. Rashford looks like 100M striker and AWB looks like 50M defender again.
Such a big difference coached by a proper manager
At the end of the match his tackle on Zaha was brilliant. It could have been 2-1.
He didn't yesterday tbf. Overplaying things a bit, nothing was really coming off for him.
The "dribbling" did it for me
AWB has improved but his one failing still needs improving, his defensive positioning isn't as good as it needs to be, his last ditch tackles are great but he shouldn't need to be doing as many as he does and that's partly down to his positional awareness. His passing in tight spaces has improved tremendously, a bit better on crossing and his positioning then Dalot's gonna have a hard time displacing him
I find a bit weird all the recent praise. I guess compared to last year he is a different player. But for me, this is the AWB of the first 1 and a half years. Some amazing tackles and some weirdly efficient dribbles. But overall, hopeless in attack with pointless runs, and useless overlaps. He can be useful in some specific games and can give a solid 7/10 performance. But put an inform Dalot in yesterday's match, and we probably win. With AWB the attacking right side is non-existent.
Quite agreed. He has a unique dribbling style that is effective for beating a press from a standing position, but not for taking on a man. So many conflate these. Ultimately I don't think he'll ever be a top full-back but he's far far better than most on here would have you believe. And press resistance has never been one of his issues.
I thought the issue was that he was targeted (to stop an outlet) and he would always play the ball back instead of forward. Don't recall him giving it away often but correct me if I'm wrong?
Yep, that's true. Obviously there were times when he'd lose the ball as well but a lot of the time the impact was simply that he'd keep having to make the safe pass backwards to Lindelof as he couldn't progress the ball forward, which helped shut down our right hand flank. We just ended up passing the ball along our back four a lot with nowhere to go.
In fairness to AWB, he didn't exactly get a lot of help from midfield inside of him or the RW in front of him either so it wasn't all on him.
This is why I think he should be given some time. Let's be fair if it turns out he's not up to it ETH will sell him. That's a fact...
Yep. At least he's now getting the gametime to try and win ETH over, unlike earlier in the season. If he does he does, if he doesn't he doesn't. Either way, his improved form is welcome.
Nobody saw Dalot having such a good season, perhaps ETH can get something out of AWB and save the blushes of those scouts and their 800+ excel doc. Assuming we're not bankrolled by some gay-bashing death cult and I'm still supporting United in the summer, it'd be nice to spend money on a sexier position than right back.
So your support for United is dependent on who owns them
This thread aged well
Give it time and the Casemiro one will end up the sameThis thread aged well
Well some of the comments in the matchday thread about Casemiro were fecking bonkers.
A lot of comments in all the threads are bonkers!