ThierryHenry
wishes he could watch Arsenal games with KM
I’ve moved to yet another Labour safe seat (******* Harman’s in fact), so I’m again fairly limited in what I can do. Tempted to vote green as an environmental protest.
This is 100% going to be a Brexit election.I’m seeing so many people (myself included) say that the election isn’t going to be about Brexit, that JC will be able to bring the debate back to health and inequality, that I’m starting to wonder if we’re all wrong, and it actually will be a Brexit election.
Everyone thinks the next election will be like the previous one, but it never is. Given the huge number of unknowns in this election, I think it’s just impossible to say how it’s going to pan out. And yes, I appreciate how useless a statement that is.
Why campaign to respect the result of the referendum then campaign to have a second referendum?
I’m seeing so many people (myself included) say that the election isn’t going to be about Brexit, that JC will be able to bring the debate back to health and inequality, that I’m starting to wonder if we’re all wrong, and it actually will be a Brexit election.
Everyone thinks the next election will be like the previous one, but it never is. Given the huge number of unknowns in this election, I think it’s just impossible to say how it’s going to pan out. And yes, I appreciate how useless a statement that is.
Last time they lost and made it look like they’d won. Apparently Labour now just aspire to not lose horribly.
This is 100% going to be a Brexit election.
You don't understand why a confirmatory referendum is needed?
Farage is unusually quiet...
Probably someone voting for sdlp/uup in the north.Who voted ‘other’?
The Lib Dems are con artists. Flip flop to gain votes. They pushed for the referendum in the first place.
Im surprised people are falling for it again after what they did from 2010. I guess that is how long people remember for, 9-10 years.
So Labour can change their stance as events unfold but the Lib Dem’s can’t?
I'm confused, so you do understand the logic of a confirmation referendum but you're just trying to deflect from the Lib Dems stupidity?
Bit of a difference between saying we'll do Brexit and then ask you if you're sure when we have the details to "We demand a referendum but we won't enact your result". Or would Lib Dems have enacted the results when Swinson said it in that video?
Because leave is not a binary option. There are many different ways to "leave".Why campaign to respect the result of the referendum then campaign to have a second referendum?
I don't criticise those who want to vote selfishly or because of greed but its not a difficult choice is it?
If you're leave then Tory
If you're crackpot leave then Brexit Party
If you're remain, whichever party might defeat the Tories in your seat.
this isn’t a tough decision for you now or ever
Why so obtuse?Pretty clear that both parties changed their policies in the face of unfolding events.
I think anyone who isn't swivel eyed kipper needs to vote strategically. If the conservatives get a majority we're sunk. Ideally we need a centre left coalition government, which will ensure a safe approach to brexit, a re-focusing on the social issues crippling society at the moment and a boost to the environment and industry by launching the Green economy. A thin labour majority would simply mean the labour party at war between itself whilst in power; whereas a coalition with the SNP/Libdems (who are more likely to prop up the tories) would help reign in the radical left in Momentum.
People need to remember - non elected party members don't have a say over parliament, no matter how much they shout. If that were the case we'd have done no deal ages ago.
I'm just afraid that in most seats, if you vote Lib Dem, you're likely to get a Conservative.
I know it's not a popular opinion, but I think the lib dems get a hard deal over the coalition. The context at the time was global recession, the country going bust and trillions of pounds being pumped into the banks in an attempt to keep our economy viable on it's feet, whether that should have happened or not is a separate discussion.
David Laws said they would have preferred to go in to coalition with Labour, it was a much more natural fit, but the talks with Brown weren't taken seriously by Labour at all and together they still wouldn't have had the numbers to get a majority in the commons. The country desperately needed stable government, a minority government at that point would have been a disaster.
Yes their voting record in coalition was not perfect and yes they were forced to u turn on tuition fees, but they did good as well. Raising the income tax threshold, pupil premium, investment in green energy, the banking levy, even gay marriage was the result of massive pressure from the Lib Dems, despite Cameron's support, the majority of the Tory party and cabinet were dead against. The Tory government unleashed without them since 2015 has been disastrous.
Like I've stated I'm not a Lib Dem supporter, but the way so many people write them off as power grabbing whores is an easy argument in my opinion and ignores, the good they tried to do and the good they achieved.
I tend to agree. Strategic voting against the Tories is the way to go.I think anyone who isn't swivel eyed kipper needs to vote strategically. If the conservatives get a majority we're sunk. Ideally we need a centre left coalition government, which will ensure a safe approach to brexit, a re-focusing on the social issues crippling society at the moment and a boost to the environment and industry by launching the Green economy. A thin labour majority would simply mean the labour party at war between itself whilst in power; whereas a coalition with the SNP/Libdems (who are more likely to prop up the tories) would help reign in the radical left in Momentum.
People need to remember - non elected party members don't have a say over parliament, no matter how much they shout. If that were the case we'd have done no deal ages ago.
I'm just afraid that in most seats, if you vote Lib Dem, you're likely to get a Conservative.
Agree with all of this apart from the bolded
You can disagree with it but it's true. One of them said as much on Sky New this morning. They said they wouldn't form coalition with Corbyn and when asked Boris they said their preference isn't to do so. That's as outright as most politicians get.
They'll form a coalition with the Tories in a trade off for a second referendum. Some may be happy with that but people should be aware of what they're voting for.
Yep, I can't see it being any other way. Which puts Corbyn and Labour in a difficult position if they aren't strong enough to force as much of the narrative away from that as possible.
I think that is what they'll be doing but don't think it'll be enough with pretty much every other party making it all about Brexit plus the majority of the media doing the same.Labour need to go very hard on domestic policy... try as much as they can to steer debate away from Brexit. I would even go down the route of "the media and the Tories want this election just to be about Brexit... they want you to ignore the NHS, public services, workers rights, poverty etc".
3 votes for UKIP already. The Caf never ceases to amaze me
I assume he means the Lib Dems and not the SNP who would never support the Tories under any circumstances I can conceive of.Agree with all of this apart from the bolded
You believe that isn't just electioneering?"I'm not going to support Boris Johnson or Jeremy Corbyn. They are not up to the job." - Jo Swinson speaking to the BBC, that's pretty outright.
"I'm not going to support Boris Johnson or Jeremy Corbyn. They are not up to the job." - Jo Swinson speaking to the BBC, that's pretty outright.
Yeah possibly that's the caseIt's probably some posters not even able to vote in the election trolling.
That's not what she said in her leadership campaign or what her other MPs are implying. She's as trust worthy as Boris if not less.
You really think they won't support the Tories for a second ref?
I think that is what they'll be doing but don't think it'll be enough with pretty much every other party making it all about Brexit plus the majority of the media doing the same.
Is frustrating that in all likelihood, the voting will be mostly on a single issue when there's so much more to the country.
If there's a hung Parliament and the Lib Dems are king makers (they may not be) then they will work with someone. It may not be a formal coalition but they will work with someone. They can't say that now, of course, for the reasons that you cite.I don't like Jo Swinson and don't trust her, but the Lib Dems know how badly they were burnt last time they went into a Tory coalition, they're finally making a come back with the electorate they won't make the same mistake again, but they won't go into coalition with Labour either. At a grassroots level though I imagine there will be quite a lot of strategic 'keep the Tories out' going on between the two parties though
EDIT: I also think the the Tories would never offer a second ref, their support wouldn't stand for it
Agree with all of this apart from the bolded
I hope so too but there is now a culture war going that has coalesced around the stage managed depiction of Brexit as a binary issue.My hope is... and I am only talking personally here... is that talking about the other issues may resonate more with voters. I can't speak for everyone obviously, but I think a lot of people feel Brexit fatigue at the moment. I'm almost tired of hearing about it and when I do... I basically switch off. It's been dragging on and has just become tiresome. My hope is that the electorate might be more interested in the other stuff than people think... but time will tell.
If there's a hung Parliament and the Lib Dems are king makers (they may not be) then they will work with someone. It may not be a formal coalition but they will work with someone. They can't say that now, of course, for the reasons that you cite.