He actually needs a rest badly and the games he misses aren't too bad.
Tyrone Mings stamp on Zlatan | He’s at it again
- Thread starter Cutch
- Start date
feck me, there are some proper drama queens on here. Grow a pair.
Ok, Ibra has scored the lion share of our goals but he has been leading the line in almost all of our games. He has missed some sitters, too.
As long as it's not Rooney coming in to replace him, then I think we will be absolutely fine. Let's hope Martial gets the opportunity to lead the line.
We have been creating lots of chances in games when Ibra has been non existent. His ban could be a blessing in disguise.
Ok, Ibra has scored the lion share of our goals but he has been leading the line in almost all of our games. He has missed some sitters, too.
As long as it's not Rooney coming in to replace him, then I think we will be absolutely fine. Let's hope Martial gets the opportunity to lead the line.
We have been creating lots of chances in games when Ibra has been non existent. His ban could be a blessing in disguise.
Trying to calm the situation down?
The FA's statement on this specific case hoists them by their own petard:
This wasn't an "off-the-ball incident". I mean, obviously. Like I said, Ibra was literally touching the ball and Mings at the same instant. It's as "on the ball" as you can get!
This wasn't an "off-the-ball incident". I mean, obviously. Like I said, Ibra was literally touching the ball and Mings at the same instant. It's as "on the ball" as you can get!
If you think he saw the incident, why didn't he give a red card? And please don't say "because he's incompetent", literally everyone who knows half a thing about football thinks Zlatan should've seen red.
Not suggesting anything about Rio but a lot of recreational drugs stays in your urine for 3-4 days / 1-2 days in your blood so a delay of a couple of days due to missing the test could be the difference between passing and failing. By banning Rio they made it clear that missing the test would be as severe as failing it.
bbc: - Deliberate elbowing and stamping are both red card offences, so would result in three-match bans if found guilty.
Stamping on head and elbowing on face should never be in the same bracket though !
Stamping on head and elbowing on face should never be in the same bracket though !
If ref had seen and punished Mings for the stamp, there would be nobody for Zlatan to elbow. Shameful from FA to charge Zlatan for this. Another one of those incidents proving that refs in the modern game are obsolete.
Now wait for Mou to play either Roo or Fellaini up front leaving Martial and Rashford on the wings.
I know they don't take it into account but, the elbow from Ibra is far less likely if the head stomp doesn't happen, or Mings is tossed because of it. No excuses being made from me for Zlatan, he should be able to control his emotions better at 35. Seen at least 2-3 times he loses focus to revenge v playing the game.
The exact same reason players escape red cards for reckless challenges all the time. Referees are human and they make mistakes. He probably thought it was one of those where Zlatan uses his arms for elevation and accidentally catches Mings. Video evidence was never intended to retrospectively correct refereeing mistakes. Because that would create crazy precedents. Like correcting penalty decisions, or whatever. It's supposed to be a way to deal with stuff that the referee doesn't see but tv cameras do. If the ref sees something happen and makes a mistake in dealing with it, then his decisions stands. The alternative is madness.
Mings has a bad injury now anyway doesn't he? So his ban won't actually make him miss any games most likely
Perhaps he saw the elbow but not the lead up to the contact? If so, then it's possible he was unsure if the contact was incidental or intentional. If he missed the stamp, then there may have been some doubt about Ibra's intent.
That said, he failed to noticed he'd given out a second yellow, so someone's earlier comment about the referee's three day bender/team building session may also explain the Friend's confusion.
Also BBC (next line down even): However, Mings could face an increased ban for his offence. The FA statement added: "Furthermore, the FA has submitted a claim that the standard punishment that would otherwise apply for the misconduct committed by the Bournemouth defender is 'clearly insufficient'."
And if the ref had punished Ibra for throwing Mings to the ground ..........
It happened and they must be punished but I still think the FA will bottle punishing Ibra.
Just because the ref missed an incident doesn't mean the player is right to exact revenge by also being violent. There's no defending Ibra on this, he'll rightfully get banned. He's not 20, he's 35. He should have been mature enough to control his temper and consider that the club that pays his wages needs him for the end of season run-in. If they charge him for 2 separate incidents (stamp attempt and elbow) he could be out for 5 matches easily.
This is what I think happened as well, and the talk to Zlatan afterwards was probably to tell him to cut it out/that he'd be watching him closely from then on.
I agree with you that this is setting a very dangeros precedent because basically everything can lead to a retrospective ban right now, since the ball was where the incident happened. I think the FA just feels that they're kind of obliged to ban Zlatan since there would be a serious media outrage if they wouldn't, even if it means applying their own rules incorrectly (once again).
Zlatan should be banned and will be banned, but on the wrong grounds. Media and other fanbases won't care though, that's just the way it is.
I think that's exactly what's happening. And it's incredibly frustrating. Trial by the media.
I agree with this. Ibra let himself and the team down by getting wound up by a no-mark defender.
Bye top 4.
I really don't see how these are wrong grounds. He fecking elbowed a player on his face, or course he should be banned.
I also don't see how this will cause precedents. You cannot correct offsides and pens retroactively, but deliberate challenges that are either brutal or with clear intentions to injure someone, should definitely be 'corrected' retroactively. I always found the rule that if the ref saw it, it cannot be corrected a stupid rule, and pretty sure they changed it (though I cannot answer how much) in this summer.
In addition, if the ref saw Zlatan doing that, he would have sent him off, no doubt there. Likely, he saw 'something' and in his mind it wasn't intentional or as bad as it really was.
he offered to come back and take it the same day.
"Ibrahimovic was charged with elbowing an opponent and hitting the bottom of an opponents boot with his head"
He clearly headbutted Mings' studs. We've got it all backwards.
As long as Rashford's fit it would be unfair on him that Martial plays the #9. He's better as a "winger".
I don't know when Ibra "threw Mings on the ground" but even if he did, unless the "throw to the ground" was endangering the safety of his opponent, that would have been a yellow card had ref seen it.
Had the ref done his job right, Ibra would've had a yellow for whatever incident you're talking about and Mings would have had a red for stamping on Zlatan. Case over and the game goes on, no elbow from Zlatan and no second yellow for Surman. Bournemouth would've still played with 10 men but the wrong player got sent off.
He would not have had a chance to take his revenge if refs did their jobs properly. If you're going to charge Ibra for this, the ref should be charged for allowing Mings to be on the field.
Video refs can't come soon enough.
If we go on a winning run in the league now, the Ewing theory is in effect.
Correct decision.
Don't matter if the ref saw it or not, Ibra deserves a ban - it's foolish to argue differently just based off a technicality.
Mings deserves a bigger ban though.
Don't matter if the ref saw it or not, Ibra deserves a ban - it's foolish to argue differently just based off a technicality.
Mings deserves a bigger ban though.
I don't think it would be harsh or controversial if Ibra had gotten a red card for this incident 'you didn't see'!
Clever reply. Ignored my entire post. Good on you.
Yes I watch the game on TV and they didn't repeat any incident where Zlatan should have seen a red except for the elbow. But the way you framed the sentence it tells me that even you aren't sure if there would've been a red card. FA is not retroactively penalizing Zlatan for any other incident, so it's safe to say that this said "incident" wasn't as serious.
Both players will get 3-match bans.
He should be banned but they simply can't support the ban on a correct ground. Pogue quoted the applying article earlier on this page:
Retrospective bans are based on this article, BUT Zlatan's elbow is not an off-the-ball incident since it happend right where the ball was at that moment.
This will be a precedent which can be used in later incidents where a ref judges a 'red card tackle' as non-deliberate or non-violent and gives a yellow card. These kind of situations are not open to retrospective action right now because he saw the incident and it wasn't off-the-ball, but that's exactly like Zlatan's elbow - ref saw it and it wasn't off the ball. So if they're banning Zlatan right now, they can take retrospective action against anyone in the future even if the referee saw the incident, and that's not what the panel is for.
Don't get me wrong, I also think Zlatan should be banned. And I 100% agree with the bolded part of your post. But since that's not the way it is right now, they can't base this ban on a correctly applying rule.
the FA has suggested a longer ban for Mings.
The incident where Ibra threw Mings to the ground for obstructing him was a few minutes earlier and not really picked up by the cameras as it was during a throw in. They showed a replay of it once, from a distant angle.
You can complain the Mings shouldn't have been on the pitch after the stamp, but sporting officials have always been quick to punish retaliation. Look at Fellaini and Huth last season. Players are supposed to be better than that, especially thirty-five year olds. The elbow was childish and let the team down immensely.
Your post is barely worth a reply but here goes.
Using your logic if the referee had dealt with the feud that was running between Mings and Ibra all game, for example when Mings was thrown to the ground, then the head stamp and elbow may never have happened.
But the referee didn't and both offences occurred and both now fully deserve a ban.
Trying to excuse Ibra is laughable. The guy puts it about plenty, which you would know if you actually watched the games.
I feel sorry for Surman who got booked for a challenge similar to one made by Shaw who wasn't cautioned and then got a second yellow for what I would describe as a light push on Ibra who went down like he had been shot.
The referee was shockingly bad but it doesn't alter the facts that the 2 players are guilty of violent conduct.
We are toothless without him, it's the sad fact.Easy now