Trump and Brexit: What has happened to the world?

People need someone to blame and Trump took advantage of that. Clinton was too focussed on why she's better than Trump. Trump was focussed on why it's everybody else's fault America "isn't great", and clearly this is what a great deal of Americans wanted to hear
 
Full Member said:
You dont have any idea of who vote for what. As far as I remember, the ballot paper doesnt include a name - just a tick in a box. Any numbers that you see are not accurate - theyre based on exit polls of a small subset of people that is then multiplied to give a percntage of the population.

And also... how do you know the reasons behind how everybody who is "old" voted? Those people may have children and grandchildren they care about. Do you not think that their decision was made for whats best for their children, grandchildren and maybe great grandchildren - not to mention themselves... you know, because they are still alive and still have a right to vote for whatever agenda they want.
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No one old has ever done that. They vote for what's best for them, higher pensions nobody can pay for in a few years etc.
 
podurban2 said:
And the normal people forgot how to vote? Because the voter turnout was lower this year than last time. Can you show your math/facts?
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The white, uneducated people went voting while the rest had way lower turnout than in 2012. that's no rocket science, just do a bit of googling.
Basically, thanks to the retarded EV system, a few thousand dumb hillbillies in WI and PA were enough for Trump to win. It's sad.
 
The fact that many people aren't educated much at all on politics or what these candidates represent explains inconsistent voting patterns but we don't do anything to fix this. I know of people who have had no real valid reason at all for voting for a particular party.
 
Tyrion said:
Are you saying Facebook is left leaning?
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Of course it is. Discounting the allegation they neuter conservative press, it simply shows what is popular and what is shared. In the online world in 2016 that means left wing views and articles.
 
Full Member said:
I'll have to take your word for that - i dont have insight into how everyone votes.
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Have you ever followed an election? Ever looked up voting motivation and party preference by age? Here in Germany, people 60+ give shit all about the next generation. They vote for their personal gain, after them there might as well be another great flood, they don't care.
 
I think Jeremy Corbyn summed up my feelings perfectly:
"Trump’s election is an unmistakable rejection of a political establishment and an economic system that simply isn’t working for most people. It is one that has delivered escalating inequality and stagnating or falling living standards for the majority, both in the US and Britain.

“This is a rejection of a failed economic consensus and a governing elite that has been seen not to have listened. And the public anger that has propelled Donald Trump to office has been reflected in political upheavals across the world.

“But some of Trump’s answers to the big questions facing America, and the divisive rhetoric around them, are clearly wrong."
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Swaters16 said:
The fact that people like you automatically assume and label people that disagree with you are stupid or racist.
That's a huge part of your answer. People are sick of being told what to think and who they should be by people who believe they're better than them.
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People are sick of free speech and being called out when they do stupid shit? feck em then.

And there's nothing wrong with saying support for a racist sexist vile man is beneath you.
 
fcbforever said:
Have you ever followed an election? Ever looked up voting motivation and party preference by age? Here in Germany, people 60+ give shit all about the next generation. They vote for their personal gain, after them there might as well be another great flood, they don't care.
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I have indeed. And i know that what i vote for is not just about my own gain.
 
fcbforever said:
What happened? The dump, rascist deplorable shit discovered they can vote. Warned this could happen years ago and that we should be happy our election turnouts are so low.
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This is a very superficial analysis of why people voted for Trump and misses understanding why its happened in a same way the polls got it so wrong. Not asking the right questions and assuming the wrong answers.
 
I don't see why people are complaining about it? Yes it might not have been the decision you wanted but most of the UK voted to leave the EU, just like most of the people voted Trump in the USA. This is democracy and we do what the majority want. It's as simple as that.
 
Nytram Shakes said:
I think Jeremy Corbyn summed up my feelings perfectly:
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Jeremy is possibly the less influential head of opposition the UK had ever had. He makes Neville Chamberlain look like William the conqueror
 
fcbforever said:
The white, uneducated people went voting while the rest had way lower turnout than in 2012. that's no rocket science, just do a bit of googling.
Basically, thanks to the retarded EV system, a few thousand dumb hillbillies in WI and PA were enough for Trump to win. It's sad.
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I asked for your numbers but I guess I'll google it then. Anyway, you seem to have a lot of hate, relax. It's probably not going to be all that worse.
 
In the Primaries, one set of American voters very clearly told the Bush family they did not want another Bush in the White House, this family thing has got to stop. Move on to the general.....more of the same only this time the target was the Clintons.
 
Whatever the reason, it's clear there needs to be some serious introspection for the left. The working class chose a crooked, tax-evading billionaire over them FFS.

It'd be tragic, dangerous and stupid if we blame this on 'dumb white hillbillies' and carry on as usual.
 
Penna said:
Everyone's voice is of equal value, we need to move away from this "young people have more to lose/old people have more experience" line.

Baby Boomers like me (and there are a lot of us) hope to still have a good number of years left to live and therefore decisions made about the future of our country are very important. I can also understand why people just starting out in life feel aggrieved, but I'm afraid being young doesn't make your opinion more valuable than that of someone in their 50, 60s or whatever.

All I can say is that having been around and doorstep-campaigned for us to join the EEC when I was a teenager in the 1970s, my sense of loss is just as great as someone who's never known a Pre-Europe UK.
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Objectively the opinions aren't equal but everyone should be allowed to voice his opinion.
 
Matty7 said:
I don't see why people are complaining about it? Yes it might not have been the decision you wanted but most of the UK voted to leave the EU, just like most of the people voted Trump in the USA. This is democracy and we do what the majority want. It's as simple as that.
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Yeah, and the minority is allowed to complain about it...
 
devilish said:
Jeremy is possibly the less influential head of opposition the UK had ever had. He makes Neville Chamberlain look like William the conqueror
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i wasn't commenting on Jerney Corbyn as a person or a leader..... i was simply saying in this one case he sums up my feelings perfectly.
 
I dont get it... on one hand people are saying that everybody who voted Brexit and Trump is racist, but on the other hand there are some who are criticising the people who voted based on where they live and their intelligence levels. Is that not classed as discrimination?
 
11101 said:
Of course it is. Discounting the allegation they neuter conservative press, it simply shows what is popular and what is shared. In the online world in 2016 that means left wing views and articles.
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If left wing views are popular then why are people voting for right wing options like Trump and Brexit?
 
Matty7 said:
I don't see why people are complaining about it? Yes it might not have been the decision you wanted but most of the UK voted to leave the EU, just like most of the people voted Trump in the USA. This is democracy and we do what the majority want. It's as simple as that.
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More people voted for Clinton than Trump, simple - remove Trump immediately!
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Can we start another petition?
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Sure.



I do wonder if this result will cause some of the schemers in the Commons to think twice now. If May opts for an election in this climate, she could feasibly roll Labour up from Kent to Cumbria. Ironically, Corbyn had the right brand for these turbulent political times; only he lacks the courage required, and enough Eurosceptic Labour MPs.
 
Full Member said:
You dont have any idea of who vote for what. As far as I remember, the ballot paper doesnt include a name - just a tick in a box. Any numbers that you see are not accurate - theyre based on exit polls of a small subset of people that is then multiplied to give a percntage of the population.

And also... how do you know the reasons behind how everybody who is "old" voted? Those people may have children and grandchildren they care about. Do you not think that their decision was made for whats best for their children, grandchildren and maybe great grandchildren - not to mention themselves... you know, because they are still alive and still have a right to vote for whatever agenda they want.
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Now look at this : http://www.newstatesman.com/politic...fferent-demographic-groups-vote-eu-referendum and don´t do the reality denying Trump defence. While polls are not 100% accurate that dosn´t they are useless. The brexit campagn wasn´t exactly shy of people voicing their reasons were they ? and UKIP were mostly a party of older people and these were they strongest voice for Brexit with a fairly big amount Tories as well. This kinda shows that the Elderly most definately favoured an brexit generally speaking. So ignoring all experts advice on the economic challenges outside an EU membership and the Brexiters showing no plan how to deal with an Brexit, which means an chaotic situation at best. How in any way does voting for something like that under such circumstances, show any concerns for their children or grand children ? It showed blind faith otherwise they have been more cautious and waited for better arguments from the leave campaign to make sure not to rush into a stupid situation. The whole referendum was like an heart surgery debate and how to do it. Most people ignored the heart surgeons and went to the car salesmen for advice instead and now the result is slowing going to happen over the next few years. I never said they don´t have an right to vote but considering how the entire referendum it was done, it seems utterly reckless to vote Brexit. I´m still waiting to hear well argumented opinions from Brexiters to this day on the economic issue.

I have no problems with the British going their own way as it is their democratic right, however the whole circumstances of the referendum was an democratic embarrassment.
 
Pogue Mahone said:


This is true.
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The problem is that he's not a politician. All the horrible, awful shit he did could simply be dismissed by his supporters as having nothing to do with politics, whereas Hillary's email scandal which actually ended up damaging her far more than (I can't believe I'm saying this) the racism, disrespect to soldiers, and rape/sexism talk of women from Trump, because it was something that happened whilst she was in a political position.

Trump's biggest reason for winning (in my opinion at least) is that he's not a politician.
 
The real issue here is not the way the US voted. It's the choice that they had that is the really alarming concern. That many considered Hillary the lesser of two evils says it all really
 
Cina said:
The problem is that he's not a politician. All the horrible, awful shit he did could simply be dismissed by his supporters as having nothing to do with politics, whereas Hillary's email scandal which actually ended up damaging her far more than (I can't believe I'm saying this) the racism, disrespect to soldiers, and rape/sexism talk of women from Trump, because it was something that happened whilst she was in a political position.

Trump's biggest reason for winning (in my opinion at least) is that he's not a politician.
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Fair point. Although maybe don't get too hung up on the politician bit. When people are constantly being told that everyone in a position of power is a corrupt shyster (thank you, social media) who is only out for themselves you can see why someone who blatantly ticks all those boxes isn't as off-putting as he once might have been.
 
AXVnee7 said:
The real issue here is not the way the US voted. It's the choice that they had that is the really alarming concern. That many considered Hillary the lesser of two evils says it all really
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Yup. 'If' anything good comes from all of this I'd hope that we finally see a move away from 2 party politics. I think that puts a lot of the younger generation off voting too. They're told they're wasting their vote if it doesn't go to Party A or B (and it's true). That needs to change.
 
AXVnee7 said:
The real issue here is not the way the US voted. It's the choice that they had that is the really alarming concern. That many considered Hillary the lesser of two evils says it all really
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Which brings us back to the idea that honest, decent and caring people in general don't feel a need to get into politics which implies the current political scene is filled with ice-cold careerists and I think this phenomenon is becoming more and more true nowadays.
 
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