Too Many Games

[bosnian_red]

This is a risky plan. What if Tottenham get going, what if Newcastle get back on track after the disappointment of the Carabou Cup (and they have games in hand) top-4 could easily become: Arsenal/City/Spurs/Newcastle. That would probably lead to your manager being sacked (its in the contract) with just his league cup win and 7:0 to Liverpool as his legacy.

Oh my 400th post - yeh!

It's not in the contract, and Spurs and Newcastle won't get going suddenly to a pace where they get high 70s in points that it would require to likely surpass United. I'm not saying throw away the league. But we have plenty of easy enough games that even if we don't keep up our points pace from the whole season til now (no reason to think as we don't have a tough fixture list left), we should still be fine.

 

[Wrecking ralf]

The squad just needs to be utilised better. At 2-0 I would have brought Sabitzer on for Weghorst and brought Sancho on for Antony. We would have controlled the middle of the park better and limited their attacks. If we get a goal back at 2-0 then the game could have swung.

Instead we went 3-0 down and waited another 10 mins to bring Mctominay on who let’s face it. Doesn’t help us in games.

The teams tired though playing every 3 days. Players need to be rested sparingly for games we don’t need them to start in. Cup games are great for giving players like pellistri, Sancho and Iqbal games to rest other players. If Casemiro needs resting then drop the no10 role and play a midfield 3 to provide the necessary protection for the defence.

 

[elmo]

I think England needs to get rid of one of their cups. I think that additional cup could be responsible for English team not performing better at European competitions. Maybe a terrible take from me, but can someone explain to me the purpose of EFL? I think we won it at expense of our team getting totally mentally and physically depleted.

Make the EFL under 23s for teams in the top division.

Championship teams can continue playing their first team.

 

[Himannv]

Yeah, I think this is the main problem and it's really epitomized by Casemiro's performance the other night. We have such a hectic schedule and ETH seems to prefer a smaller squad so rotation is minimal. In a way it's worked well as we've won a lot, but it also opens us up to a result like what we had the other night when we're up against a team in ascendency who are clearly up for it and are far better rested.

 

[Vapor trail]

League is bottom priority because we are 7 clear of 5th and 4 clear of 4th with a game in hand. We also have 7 home games remaining, many games against bottom half sides, no City, Liverpool or Arsenal to play. And can take our eyes off the league and still qualify comfortably pretty much.

The focus is Europa League and FA Cup, and then grind through the league games to stay in 3rd but no big deal if we finish 4th.

Disagree the league should be a priority number 1. It's difficult to put knockout competitions as a focus because form doesn't really warrant winning it's on the day and players like we saw against Liverpool can just decide not to turn up for 45 mins.

Top 4 in the league qualifies the UCL which effects next seasons budget with plausibility to FFP and player acquisitions. The FA cup is of least importance but would be good for the credibility of the manager but the clubs priorities are more important.

 

[PieCrust]

The issue isn't too many games, it's lack of squad quality due to the mismanagement over the years. There's no excuse for a top club not being able to effectively compete on multiple fronts. This then gets coupled with lack of trophies, in some ways forcing ETH to play strong lineups for things like the league cup to start breeding the winning mentality again. Kind of a tough spot, considering what ETH has to work with. This will improve if we can start getting the transfers right again.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

WTF is wrong with some of you in here.
Football is about winning and to win you need to play game, OK I maybe teaching you how to suck eggs, but FFS some of the comments are shocking, bin this cup , bin that WHY ?
What the point of being in if not to win.
Moaning about the EL , OK its a few more games. none would be moaning if it was the CL , none would calling to rest everybody.
Winning the EL is CL football, getting top 4 is CL football so why priorities either , both have the same out come, winning the EL is a trophy, best available team IN BOTH

 

[bosnian_red]

Disagree the league should be a priority number 1. It's difficult to put knockout competitions as a focus because form doesn't really warrant winning it's on the day and players like we saw against Liverpool can just decide not to turn up for 45 mins.

Top 4 in the league qualifies the UCL which effects next seasons budget with plausibility to FFP and player acquisitions. The FA cup is of least importance but would be good for the credibility of the manager but the clubs priorities are more important.

We are pretty comfortable in 3rd. Yes if that comfort starts to slip then it becomes priority again. But as it is, we have a lot of room to breath.

 

[quadrant]

WTF is wrong with some of you in here.
Football is about winning and to win you need to play game, OK I maybe teaching you how to suck eggs, but FFS some of the comments are shocking, bin this cup , bin that WHY ?
What the point of being in if not to win.
Moaning about the EL , OK its a few more games. none would be moaning if it was the CL , none would calling to rest everybody.
Winning the EL is CL football, getting top 4 is CL football so why priorities either , both have the same out come, winning the EL is a trophy, best available team IN BOTH

Best available team in both makes you less likely to achieve either. Hence the discussion.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

The issue isn't too many games, it's lack of squad quality due to the mismanagement over the years. There's no excuse for a top club not being able to effectively compete on multiple fronts. This then gets coupled with lack of trophies, in some ways forcing ETH to play strong lineups for things like the league cup to start breeding the winning mentality again. Kind of a tough spot, considering what ETH has to work with. This will improve if we can start getting the transfers right again.

Correct. Strength in depth is just as important as signing starters, which is why it does my head in when people say McTominay or Weghorst are good squad players, or that a certain AM shouldn't be bought because "we already have Bruno" when he plays every fecking game and fades in the spring time year after year because of that.

I'll also reiterate that it can't be quantified how much the Greenwood situation fecked us. It left us a without a 100m striker prospect that was in line to be the starter this year, and with Martial's injury troubles we've basically missed 3 strikers after Ronaldo left. Thus Rashford has had to constantly play through knocks without much rest as well.

 

[red woppit]

But there must be some logical middle ground.
For example there was absolutely no reason to start Varane, Martinez, Shaw, Case and Bruno in the league cup 2nd leg against bloody Forest after already having won the 1st leg 3-0.

I remember a poster on here saying that Ten Hag very often played more or less his strongest team in virtually all Ajax's matches, so really he is just carrying on that 'tradition'.
Let's not forget that Ten Hag is also learning, and how to manoeuvre in and around the Premier League, where virtually every game is like a cup final for some teams. He will have taken stock of yesterday's result and performance, and will know how much more Is required to actually become a force again in English football.
The squad has performed beyond what I thought they were capable of, and yesterday's result was going to happen at some stage during the latter end of the season.
Perhaps we can play some part in this by not deriding players like Maguire, Lindelof, McTominay, Elanga, Weghorst etc, and actually supporting those players, even if they are not of the standard of the players they are replacing, and some of those will in all likelihood, not be here next season. If they pull on a Manchester United shirt, then I will support them to do their best.

 

[glasgow 21]

Calm down folks its over. Rashford look below par from minute one. Klopp decided to go down our wings and both r and l backs didnt cope with it. When Caseimro was of it, It was a perfect storm yesterday on a side that was throwing everything at games every 3 days. Let the storm pass and reset.

 

[Smores]

Best available team in both makes you less likely to achieve either. Hence the discussion.

Very concisely put and it's the truth of the matter.

I don't buy that our squad is so poor that we couldn't have rotated more in some of our prior games. Its not a stinging criticism of ETH either, managing man utd is very different to Ajax when it comes to rotation needs. He's having to learn that lesson as Klopp and many before him did as well.

If there's an opportunity to rotate, we have to take it. That doesn't mean sacrificing a competition, just seeking a balance of rotation/risk.

 

[Tigersam]

If we are bad enough to lose against Fulham in the FA Cup at home and against Betis in the EL, i'm sure we can also bottle 4th. Not the other way around though.
Also where did you get the information that ETH is getting sacked if he finishes outside top 4? You read the contract?

I have not, but I believe it has been a standard non-negotiable in the contracts of all the post-SAF managers: for example wasn't LvG sacked half-an-hour after winning the FA Cup because he had failed to get CL. The fact is you have two chances now: top-4 or via winning the EL so I would expect it to happen. Newcastle have run out of steam and Spurs are well Spursy.