I always thought this was the stupedist thing ever. Over the last few years I've learnt to appreciate - and love - the event.
Absolutely phenominal.
Absolutely phenominal.
The Official Tour de France 2008 Thread
- Thread starter Dyslexic Untied
- Start date
Yeah he seems to have gotten over it alright, might really catch up to him near the end though.
Has Cadel Evans won yet, or leading at least?
Riccardo Ricco has become the third rider to test positive so far, he'd won two mountain stages so far. Again it was EPO. I just don't get it, evidently people are being caught, what's to gain from it?
Rams, this one wasn't the older generation. He was wearing the white jersey for best young rider
This is good news for me though. Some idiots still think they can get away with it despite the stringent testing already outlined in this thread, and they're getting caught. At some point, riders will realise it simply isn't worth it (or will at least try taking drugs that slip under the radar)
Rams, this one wasn't the older generation. He was wearing the white jersey for best young rider
This is good news for me though. Some idiots still think they can get away with it despite the stringent testing already outlined in this thread, and they're getting caught. At some point, riders will realise it simply isn't worth it (or will at least try taking drugs that slip under the radar)
it's been going on way too much. they need more than this random testing and the tests after a win. maybe they should test every one of them every day. It'd cost a bundle but I can't see any other way tbh.
the sport is going down the toilet and the only way to resurrect it is if the man in the street is convinced that everyone's clean.
the sport is going down the toilet and the only way to resurrect it is if the man in the street is convinced that everyone's clean.
Overall standings (after 12 stages):
1. Cadel Evans (Aus/Silence - Lotto) 50 hours, 23 minutes, 5 seconds
2. Frank Schleck (Lux/Team CSC) :01.
3. Christian Vandevelde (US/Garmin - Chipotle) :38.
4. Bernhard Kohl (Aus/Gerolsteiner) :46.
5. Denis Menchov (Rus/Rabobank) :57.
6. Carlos Sastre (Spa/Team CSC) :1:28.
7. Kim Kirchen (Lux/Col) :1:56.
8. Vladimir Efimkin (Rus/AG2R) :2:32.
9. Mikel Astarloza (Spa/Euskaltel) :3:51.
10. Vincenzo Nibali (Ita/Liquigas) :4:18.
BBC Sports Personality of the Year perhaps? Good chance for top 3 anyway.
I like his attitude, he has a huge amount of self-confidence. A winner.
I like his attitude, he has a huge amount of self-confidence. A winner.
The commentators were saying that the new testing regimes and the French introducing severe legal penalties has had a massive effect to the point where positive tests are rare outside the Tour. The Tour seems to temp people to cheat because it is such an important event.
I have no idea if this is correct mind.
I always had my suspicions about Ricco. He was struck off the Italian junior team as a youngster because of irregularities in his hemcrodite values. He came from nowhere a couple of seasons ago; there was no logic about his performances. This in contrast to an athlete of similar age like Frank Schleck, who has shown a gradual improvement. All the creds should go to the ASO and the French doping authorities. You've got to ask yourself the question why Ricco wasn't caught by the UCI and the Italian doping authorities before.
I think Evans has hurt his collar bone in that crash. I expect the CSC team to test him in the Alps. Keep an eye on Vandevelde. He looks very strong so far and he's a good time trialist.
the cockney wins again....
Evans lost today.
6 riders within a minute.
1. SCHLECK Frank 17 TEAM CSC SAXO BANK 63h 57' 21"
2. KOHL Bernhard 115 GEROLSTEINER 63h 57' 28" + 00' 07"
3. EVANS Cadel 1 SILENCE - LOTTO 63h 57' 29" + 00' 08"
4. MENCHOV Denis 131 RABOBANK 63h 57' 59" + 00' 38"
5. VANDEVELDE Christian 191 GARMIN CHIPOTLE 63h 58' 00" + 00' 39"
6. SASTRE Carlos 11 TEAM CSC SAXO BANK 63h 58' 10" + 00' 49"
6 riders within a minute.
1. SCHLECK Frank 17 TEAM CSC SAXO BANK 63h 57' 21"
2. KOHL Bernhard 115 GEROLSTEINER 63h 57' 28" + 00' 07"
3. EVANS Cadel 1 SILENCE - LOTTO 63h 57' 29" + 00' 08"
4. MENCHOV Denis 131 RABOBANK 63h 57' 59" + 00' 38"
5. VANDEVELDE Christian 191 GARMIN CHIPOTLE 63h 58' 00" + 00' 39"
6. SASTRE Carlos 11 TEAM CSC SAXO BANK 63h 58' 10" + 00' 49"
How much is he expected to beat the closest riders by in the time trial RAMS?
The Aussie press seem to think he still has it in the bag. Which means feck all since they already have Heath Ledger as a shoo in for an Oscar when he will be lucky to be even nominated.
The Aussie press seem to think he still has it in the bag. Which means feck all since they already have Heath Ledger as a shoo in for an Oscar when he will be lucky to be even nominated.
Who's this cockney you speak of?
A minute, a minute and a half I think.
Although you never know with Menchov. He only lost 7 seconds in the first time trail, but the one on Saterday is double the distance of the first one...
But still some heavy mountains (the heaviest on Wednesday) to climb so we'll have to wait and see.
Menchov is still the biggest threat to Evans even though he's further behind than the other contenders. I predict Menchov to take about half a minute out of Evans in the next two mountain stages but feel Evans will be too strong in the time trial and will be wearing yellow in Paris.
It will be interesting to see if Evans has recovered because he looked really bad yesterday and the Prato Nevoso climb is nothing compared to Alpe Duez.
Fact of the matter is Evans doesn't have a good enough team to protect him so it will be interesting to see what happens tomorrow and Wednesday. But it could just have been a bad day yesterday...
But does he really need protection in this instance? He can use other riders, still in with a chance of winning, to help protect himself. The likes of Kohl, Vandevelde and Menchov also have to respond to CSC attacks. Likewise if Kohl, Menchov or Vandevelde attack, CSC will have to respond and Evans can hitch a ride.
I think the rest day has come at the ideal time for Evans and could end up being the crucial factor which helps him to win the yellow jersey.
Nobody mentiones Vandevelde. He's as good a time trialist as Evans.
I would say Menchov is now slight favourite, but we'll see how it stands after L'Alpe d'Huez on Wednesday.
I would say Menchov is now slight favourite, but we'll see how it stands after L'Alpe d'Huez on Wednesday.
It's always better to have one teammate with you imo, make the rider more relaxed.
But you are right, the other favourites are on their own too so. Lotto bought Popovych to help Evans on the last climb but he isn't good enough.
The rest day has come at an ideal time indeed. But still you have that mental problem because you had that crisis in the last stage.
Remember that Giro of 2002? Evans just fell apart, while in the pink jersey on the last climb of the Giro and lost it. He will be thinking about that I'm sure.
Well this lad shares my attitude to drugs cheats, seem bizarre to me it hasn't always been considered a criminal offence...
Thomas wants Nevado to be jailed
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/7520400.stm
Wales' Geraint Thomas says his Barloword team-mate Moises Duenas Nevado should go to prison after the Spanish rider failed a drug test.
Duenas Nevado tested positive for the banned blood booster EPO on 8 July.
"I never expected him to do this, and because of his selfish act our sponsor has now pulled out," said Thomas, a world track cycling champion.
"The last I heard he was facing a five-year prison sentence in France, and I hope he gets it."
Thomas, part of Great Britain's pursuit team at the Olympics, said the time had come for drug cheats to feel the full weight of the law.
"It’s about time people realised it can't happen anymore," he added.
"I guess you will always get people who will try to cheat the system, not just in sport but in everyday life.
"Saying that, if someone is fraudulent in a business, wouldn’t they be facing a prison term?
"I don’t see how riders taking drugs to win races and lying to their teams is any different. Bang them up and throw away the key.
Duenas Nevado was immediately suspended by Barloword and withdrawn from the 11th stage of the Tour following an apparent raid by French police at his team's base in Tarbes.
Barloworld, a massive multinational company associated with major brands such as Caterpillar and Avis, decided to end its sponsorship in the wake of the scandal.
Thomas wants Nevado to be jailed
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/7520400.stm
Wales' Geraint Thomas says his Barloword team-mate Moises Duenas Nevado should go to prison after the Spanish rider failed a drug test.
Duenas Nevado tested positive for the banned blood booster EPO on 8 July.
"I never expected him to do this, and because of his selfish act our sponsor has now pulled out," said Thomas, a world track cycling champion.
"The last I heard he was facing a five-year prison sentence in France, and I hope he gets it."
Thomas, part of Great Britain's pursuit team at the Olympics, said the time had come for drug cheats to feel the full weight of the law.
"It’s about time people realised it can't happen anymore," he added.
"I guess you will always get people who will try to cheat the system, not just in sport but in everyday life.
"Saying that, if someone is fraudulent in a business, wouldn’t they be facing a prison term?
"I don’t see how riders taking drugs to win races and lying to their teams is any different. Bang them up and throw away the key.
Duenas Nevado was immediately suspended by Barloword and withdrawn from the 11th stage of the Tour following an apparent raid by French police at his team's base in Tarbes.
Barloworld, a massive multinational company associated with major brands such as Caterpillar and Avis, decided to end its sponsorship in the wake of the scandal.
Good day for Evans, Menchov managed to lose time going downhill... the plonker.
That SA ride falling down the mountain was mad. I wonder if one of the spectators managed to salvage his bike? Nice feckin souvenir..
Tomorrow is the big day!
That SA ride falling down the mountain was mad. I wonder if one of the spectators managed to salvage his bike? Nice feckin souvenir..
Tomorrow is the big day!
I understand what Thomas is saying, but he is not a criminal and should not be locked up.
Anyway Brad, this is a thread about the race. I suppose you've been following the race? What do you think of it?
If he's guilty of doping then he's seen as a criminal in the eyes of the French legal system. Don't you think it's about time stronger action was taken against the drug cheats?
I've watched the highlights throughout, though not since the last stage Cavendish took
I'll try and catch tomorrow live though, could very well be deciding day bar any accidents being the last day in the Alps. Surely someone will try and drop Evans tomorrow
Disagree with you not saying a drug cheat is a criminal. It's fraud, they are obtaining potentially millions of pounds in prize money and the resultant marketability of their brand, by deceitful means. It's also theft, they are stealing something that should belond to someone else. I'm absolutely for making it wholesale illegal
Firstly, cyclists do not lead normal lives and do not have normal medical conditions. You should compare the body of a professional cyclist to a formula 1 car. They’re bodies are highly strung and they live on the edge all the time. Can you imagine what riding 200km every day at full blast in all kinds of terrain and weather conditions does to a human body? The amount of medical conditions they have to suffer is terrifying. And they can’t treat those medical conditions as you and me would if we went to see a doctor, because most medication nowadays is on the banned list.
Secondly, to start locking up athletes for the use of doping would open a can of worms, especially considering my first point. Caught riders are now heavily fined, they have to pay back all their prise money and salary over the season AND their careers are in ruins… and I haven’t even mentioned the effect it has on their private lives… (the amount of caught cheats who have committed/attempted suicide is shocking). You should read up on the subject.
Would it have been reasonable to imprison i.e. Dwaine Chambers? Of course not.
Secondly, to start locking up athletes for the use of doping would open a can of worms, especially considering my first point. Caught riders are now heavily fined, they have to pay back all their prise money and salary over the season AND their careers are in ruins… and I haven’t even mentioned the effect it has on their private lives… (the amount of caught cheats who have committed/attempted suicide is shocking). You should read up on the subject.
Would it have been reasonable to imprison i.e. Dwaine Chambers? Of course not.
Pff that kind of sucked. Evans will win it now, too bad, he's anything but a great rider and imo doesn't deserve to win.
Thought that was good entertainment myself Crazy, I wouldn't be so certain that Evans wins it from here either
Rams, of course someone who thinks doping should be a criminal offence thinks Chambers should have to serve a jail sentence! I'm sorry but your 'tough life for an athlete' speech is utterly redundant. Yes it is tough for them, so why should the ones who put their bodies on the line legally be punished because they DON'T cheat? Paying back the prize money and career earnings doesn't cut it. Does a business man who's committed fraud just get to give back the cash? No, he serves time for the illegality of the action committed. And athletes should be treated the same way
Rams, of course someone who thinks doping should be a criminal offence thinks Chambers should have to serve a jail sentence! I'm sorry but your 'tough life for an athlete' speech is utterly redundant. Yes it is tough for them, so why should the ones who put their bodies on the line legally be punished because they DON'T cheat? Paying back the prize money and career earnings doesn't cut it. Does a business man who's committed fraud just get to give back the cash? No, he serves time for the illegality of the action committed. And athletes should be treated the same way
Meh can't see anyone who can beat him now.
Sastre has 1 minute and 34 seconds at the moment. For Sastre it should have been maybe 2 and a half or even 3 minutes to win the yellow jersey in the end. Sastre might be the worst one in the time trail of the top 5 riders.
I enjoyed Andy Schleck but I didn't enjoy the stage. Too many riders who are just not good enough. Contador would have blown them away if he was here. Andy Schleck will do it in the future, too bad he had that food crisis on Hautacam and had to wait today.
Evans will win the tour without a stage win, without any attacking move even, which is fairly sad.
Dope cheats are not criminals and are not robbing other people. The French are prisoning atletes not for fraud, but because of taking 'illegal' substances. The same 'illegal' which are used, in the case of EPO, for kidney patients.
Great race today. I think Evans should make the time up, but I wouldnt bet on it.
In the eyes of the current law, they are not robbing other people. But the law is an ass. They are robbing their fellow competitors, and they are robbing the sponsers whose brand can be tarnished by association with a drugs cheat. They are robbing the event, taking the prize money and benefiting personally with follow up self promotion and merchandising deals
The sooner the law recognises this, the better
The sponsors & race organisers get far more from their advertising than they do from their expenses. The sponsors know exactly what they get in to. In fact, sponsors put pressure on teams and riders to perform, which only encourages cheating.
I remain with my stance that athletes who take banned substances should not be treated like criminals. I’m all for life bans and fining, but imprisonment is a draconian measure IMO. Most dope cheats are for the rest perfectly law-abiding citizens. Most of them are not wicked people. They are human beings who do things which actually only harms themselves, rightly or wrong.
And the fact is that most doping products are, like it or not, not illegal in most countries. EPO or THG are not illegal in the UK as far as I know.
The thing is Brad, Im afraid you don’t (want to) understand the difficulties in determining what is a dope cheat and what is an innocent mistake which I have tried to explain to you. For example, most cough medicine contains substances, which are banned in cycling. This means that as a cyclist not only can you not treat medical conditions properly (which to be fair cycling has it’s self to blame for), there is a much greater chance for a cyclist of unknowingly breaking the rules than with other sports.
Why don’t you read up on the case of the Italian sprinter Pettachi. He accidentally took the wrong medicine for his asthma and his now banned for 2 years. By your opinion he should also be jailed.
Things are never black and white.
CMON CADEL!
If he picks up the yellow tonight I dont know how anyone can say he doesnt deserve it. I may be rather biased but the bloke has had CSC try to rip him to pieces yet he held on each time with absolutely no support from his shit team. That climb the other night when he went to front and basically did it all himself trying to minimise the damage was fecking awesome. CSC did everything they could to break him and then he did it all himself as not 1 other fecker even made an attempt to reel in some time on Sastre.
I dont know how is legs are after the fall/alps but tonight should be awesome. Cant wait.
If he picks up the yellow tonight I dont know how anyone can say he doesnt deserve it. I may be rather biased but the bloke has had CSC try to rip him to pieces yet he held on each time with absolutely no support from his shit team. That climb the other night when he went to front and basically did it all himself trying to minimise the damage was fecking awesome. CSC did everything they could to break him and then he did it all himself as not 1 other fecker even made an attempt to reel in some time on Sastre.
I dont know how is legs are after the fall/alps but tonight should be awesome. Cant wait.
Well I have to disagree with you Mjdj, we have the romantic victory most us us craved after all. Sastre attacked on the toughest moutain of all, and held it together today to fully deserve his victory, assuming all goes well tomorrow. I had a little bet on Menchov to sneak todays stage, bit of cash wasted there!
So true.
Can't remember when I last time enjoyed the tour as much as I have this summer. It's been like re-writing cycling for me, with lots of young riders coming through. Looks very promising for the future
He has lost it
I'm glad I was wrong about the time trail. Evans wasn't up for it, maybe due to stress or something.
Yep all credit to Sastre. Superb ride. In no way did I mean to suggest he didnt deserve it. Just saying if Cadel did the job last night he would have been equally as deserving.
Unfortunately for Cadel the mountains looked like they finally caught up with him. CSC were just relentless and it took an unbelievable effort to stay this close.
Fingers crossed we dont get any positive tests this week...
I think the last 3 weeks had taken their toll on Evans.
Anyway, Im glad for one that Sastre won. At least he managed to attack and ride away from the other riders in the mountains.
Anyway, Im glad for one that Sastre won. At least he managed to attack and ride away from the other riders in the mountains.