I hope so because the man should not be above the law (he had been for decades). Would have thought we could all agree on that....
The Mueller Report
- Thread starter Raoul
- Start date
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/27/mueller-grand-jury-1238861
The special counsel’s grand jury investigating Russian collusion into the 2016 presidential election is “continuing robustly” despite the end of Robert Mueller’s probe, a federal prosecutor said in court Wednesday.
Mueller’s office in recent days has been handing off a series of its cases to federal prosecutors across the government as it closes up shop, including the mystery subpoena fight that’s been ongoing since last year.
The U.S. attorney’s office in Washington, D.C., where Goodhand works is now leading the subpoena fight, as well as Mueller’s upcoming trial in November against longtime Trump associate Roger Stone.
Someone should tell Muellers grand jury that there is no colusion because Bill Barr told us so.
The special counsel’s grand jury investigating Russian collusion into the 2016 presidential election is “continuing robustly” despite the end of Robert Mueller’s probe, a federal prosecutor said in court Wednesday.
Mueller’s office in recent days has been handing off a series of its cases to federal prosecutors across the government as it closes up shop, including the mystery subpoena fight that’s been ongoing since last year.
The U.S. attorney’s office in Washington, D.C., where Goodhand works is now leading the subpoena fight, as well as Mueller’s upcoming trial in November against longtime Trump associate Roger Stone.
Someone should tell Muellers grand jury that there is no colusion because Bill Barr told us so.
After 8 years of the smart black guy and people hating his guts for no other reason than the colour of his skin; then, an ignorant, loud mouth guy comes along who doesn't give a shit about anyone or anything but himself then says for over 4 years that the then President wasn't American because he's black. Stop me when I'm not making sense. The right wing nut jobs, xenophobes and racists needed a mouthpiece and a saviour...they got one.
Maybe in the end this will let Trump focus on things like taking healthcare coverage away from people or ending the Special Olympics and the rest of the investigation can continue onhttps://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/27/mueller-grand-jury-1238861
The special counsel’s grand jury investigating Russian collusion into the 2016 presidential election is “continuing robustly” despite the end of Robert Mueller’s probe, a federal prosecutor said in court Wednesday.
Mueller’s office in recent days has been handing off a series of its cases to federal prosecutors across the government as it closes up shop, including the mystery subpoena fight that’s been ongoing since last year.
The U.S. attorney’s office in Washington, D.C., where Goodhand works is now leading the subpoena fight, as well as Mueller’s upcoming trial in November against longtime Trump associate Roger Stone.
Someone should tell Muellers grand jury that there is no colusion because Bill Barr told us so.
Fox News legal analyst: Barr’s summary indicates that Mueller did find evidence of a conspiracy
https://www.rawstory.com/2019/03/fo...y-indicates-mueller-find-evidence-conspiracy/
https://www.rawstory.com/2019/03/fo...y-indicates-mueller-find-evidence-conspiracy/
Judge Napolitano seems to think the Mueller report is 700 pages long.
Oh, plus evidence of conspiracy, nearly forgot that bit.
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No mention of Graham and Gaetz, disappointing. He’s right though.
According to popular opinion Mueller Report was supposed to be the end of Trump in the White House leading to his impeachment and possible indictment . But how have the tables have changed it's crazy to think that in the end Mueller Report might end up helping Trump win his re-election in 2020 as now he has more or less been given a clean chit . Not to forget he will milk this for sympathy along with showing financial progress which was started by Obama .
Mueller now needs an extra extension to the Manafort redactions. For someone who had come to the end of his investigation he and his prosecutors do seem to be under intense pressure of work. ? Was he shutdown by Barr.
Hope Hicks lied to Mueller about the Trump Tower meeting: ex-Trump legal spokesman
Its inevitable that someone will leak it. The GOP can only lose if they fail to release it before that happens and news reporters, twitterati start sensationalising findings in and out of context.
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There is no quote there from mueller. Barr says and Mueller says are two different things, there are no quotes from mueller pertaining to indictments in the 3 1/2 page BS summary that he wrote. Maybe you should go read that. Also, here is a bit of reading for you
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/27/rob...ry-still-working-even-after-final-report.html
The federal grand jury that Robert Mueller was using is still working "robustly" even after the special counsel submitted his final report to the Justice Department, a prosecutor said at a court hearing Wednesday.
The revelation means the panel could issue further indictments even as the special counsel's shop closes after two years of work.
If there are no more indictments why on earth is there still a grand jury. The only point of a grand jury is to issue indictments.
A Justice Department official confirmed that Mueller was not recommending any further indictments.
That person, who described the document as “comprehensive,” was not authorized to discuss the probe and asked for anonymity.
That person, who described the document as “comprehensive,” was not authorized to discuss the probe and asked for anonymity.
To unseal and hear the sealed indictments that are already registered?If there are no more indictments why on earth is there still a grand jury. The only point of a grand jury is to issue indictments.
No, the grand jury doesnt unseal indictments. It decides whether to bring an indictment, with consoltation with the procecutors, against a potential defendant. Now we can either listen to the spin of a "justice department official" or we can look at the facts in plain fecking sight that are to the contrary.
Could these be “pending” indictments ie not new or further indictments?
anyway you slice it Barr's statement saying "the report does not recomend any further indictments , nor did the Special Counsel obtain any sealed indictments that have yet to be made public" IS PURPOSELY MISSLEADING!!!
Yes I do agree, in fact the whole letter is purposely misleading. Something is still going on at the SC though because they are still very busy it seems. Either they have a specific deadline to tie up loose ends or they are still working on the investigation.
As I have said from about page 4 , something is very odd about all of this. I dont think the investigation was shut down but you can never tell with republicans especially when they say shit like this.
As I have said from about page 4 , something is very odd about all of this. I dont think the investigation was shut down but you can never tell with republicans especially when they say shit like this.
Schlapp's tweet is also particularly suspect when you consider that Mueller apparently told Barr that he couldn't come to a conclusion around that time.
Could be that Barr suggested that Mueller wrap it up within the month or Trump would close it. Along the lines of “ I can hold him off for a month maybe but not any longer” so Mueller did as much as he could within the time frame. Whatever happened I don’t think Mueller had any intention of closing the investigation in the immediate/ near future. How can any investigator say that they’ve investigated fully when they haven’t spoken to the the prime suspects, and I get the impression Mueller is thorough.
Mueller knows Barr, and knew his opinion on the charge. Probably the reason he literally wrote that the President was not exonerated in his view.
I don't think this is over anymore, and wonder who will end looking worse if it comes out that Trump clearly obstructed justice in any common persons view , just not in Barrs - for whom it was impossible to start with.
Barrs opinion is most worrying if you think Trump fired Comey, say, to end the investigation so the world wouldn't learn about his crime of paying of Stormy Daniels. That would be clear obstruction, but according to Barr it can't be, because once there was no collusion, everything goes away.
I don't think this is over anymore, and wonder who will end looking worse if it comes out that Trump clearly obstructed justice in any common persons view , just not in Barrs - for whom it was impossible to start with.
Barrs opinion is most worrying if you think Trump fired Comey, say, to end the investigation so the world wouldn't learn about his crime of paying of Stormy Daniels. That would be clear obstruction, but according to Barr it can't be, because once there was no collusion, everything goes away.
This could be a theory. Mueller has farmed out most of his cases to other procecutors so the investigation will continue.
Look at this timeline
3 weeks ago Mueller briefs Barr on his findings on obstruction.
2 weeks ago Trump goes on a twitter tirade and goes crazy on mueller, witch hunts and John Mccane
1 week ago he starts welcoming the release of the mueller report and the white house starts getting cocky as feck .
then friday mueller report drops.
Something definately happened
.This could be a theory. Mueller has farmed out most of his cases to other procecutors so the investigation will continue.
Look at this timeline
3 weeks ago Mueller briefs Barr on his findings on obstruction.
2 weeks ago Trump goes on a twitter tirade and goes crazy on mueller, witch hunts and John Mccane
1 week ago he starts welcoming the release of the mueller report and the white house starts getting cocky as feck .
then friday mueller report drops.
Something definately happened
Barr said Mueller found the witch but its not Trump.
Kirschner is usually very good. If Mueller was in any way muzzled it will come out at some point.
Would probably save everyone a lot of time and hassle if they just bring Mueller in straight away
Do you folks just like living in an echo chamber?
Most people do just that.
I'm all for intelligent, well reasoned argument against what I've been reading on the matter...but no idea of a good source.
Here’s something I only came across this week, a fairly convincing case that the Roger Stone indictment isn’t really all that - https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/02/roger-stone-indictment-proves-no-evidence-of-collusion/
See that makes sense, cheers. And looks right - no collusion, which genuinely feels like what we all agree on now.
Would be curious to see as vigorous a defence of Barrs obstruction conclusion
More balance, I braved a visit to fox news: https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/les...mp-still-has-big-problems-heres-what-they-are
This isnt a very good article and its full of ommisions and just false information. Andrew Mccarthy isnt exactly a non partisan political comentator.
I dont even know where to begin with where he is inaccurate.
I could probably start here.
"This inflated portrait of Stone as a major criminal was further bloated by the scene of his arrest: a well-armed battalion of FBI agents sent to apprehend him as the media, conveniently on hand at 6 a.m., took it all in." This is a popular Trump world talking point which has been used to make it seem that Mueller and or his team went at length to rough up scare and embarass Stone with men with guns and CNN cameras. They make it seem like CNN was somehow tipped off by the SCO. If any one was tipping them off about an impending indictment it would be Roger himself
. But those who follow this case closely and have a little common sense would have known that Stone was likely being indicted Friday. I knew it was a high chance due to reported grand jury activity. CNN has a team that literally watches the mueller office and the Court house 24/7. Mueller only convenes grand jury on Friday.When he does it on thursday he is getiing an indictmet ready for friday. Which is exactly what happened on thursday under seal. Roger Stone was most likely that man and with CNN's resorces it doesnt take much to steak out at Rogers house for 1 night.Anyway moving on to other things. There are many reasons Robert Mueller may not have chose to indict Roger with Conspiracy with the russian Government. First of all wikileaks isnt the Russian Govt. Wikileaks has a very big case for itself that it is simply a news organisation that gets information and reports on it and therefore are protected by 1A rights like fox , breitbart cnn and nyt are. Wikileaks getting classified and stolen information hasnt yet been seen as criminal, or rather has not been tested.
One main missconception is this line in the Barr summary. [T]he investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities.”
Couple things about that. First why does this quote start like this [T] ? That is because this is not the start of the sentence. Its actually the middle of the sentence . The [T] signifies that its actually a common t and not a captital one. That means there is information in the report that comees before this.
Secondly what does this statement even mean. Well Barr helps us out there by including this:
The Special Counsel defined “coordinated” as an “agreement–tacit or express–between the Trump Campaign and the Russian government on election interference.”
Roger Stone , Randy Credico , Jerome Corsi and all these bumbling fools arent part of the trump campaign. Roger Stone was fired very early and its why Mueller has asked others repeatedly the precise date that he stoppedd working as a Campaign Advisor. Roger Stone wasnt officially part of the Campaign from summer 2015. Well before any Russia stuff. Oligarchs and wikileakes are not Russian Govt. Konstantin Kilimnik who manafort GAVE POLLING DATA TO ( and this isnt a guess or a hunch this is actual fact ) is not Russian government. All of this is probably layed out in the Mueller report but of course uncle Bill doesnt want to show anyone that information just yet.
Here is THE BEST PART . Barr even says that in the Mueller report:
The Special Counsel found that Russian government actors successfully hacked into computers and obtained emails from persons affiliated with the Clinton campaign and Democratic Party organizations, and publicly disseminated those materials through various intermediaries, including WikiLeaks
This is a huge statement. The Russian government didnt cordinate with trump to steal the emails they did that by themself. What the Stone did was work with wikileaks ,WHO GOT THE EMAILS FROM RUSSIA, on when and what they were releasing the emails to benefit Big DJT. How do i know that last part? because its in the stone indictement that this article scoffs at
. Now would you say that if Hillary and her cronies went to CNN and said "hey we heard you got a trump tape on sexual abuse, we wanna work with yah to time this all to our benefit" that is was a consipracy to hack ABC of their files ? No it isnt . Its just a shady fecking thing that could possibly lead to her being called to resign .If you look at the stone indictment it says in plain english what Stone was doing.
“within a couple of days, there would be a massive dump of emails that would damage Hillary Clinton’s campaign,” to which Trump responds, “wouldn’t that be great.”
Stone emails Jerome Corsi and asks him to “get the pending WikiLeaks emails”
After Assange has a press conference but doesn’t release any emails, Steve Bannon emails Stone and asks what happened, and Stone replies that WikiLeaks will release “a load every week going forward”
Now none of this is actually illegal because as of this post , the USA DOJ has never presented arguments that wikileaks is a Russian entity. So there is no way to actually charge stone with anything ilegal for this.
Another tid bit. The article you posted asks:
"
If not from Credico, from whom, pray tell, did Stone learn what WikiLeaks was up to? Who is the other intermediary?
In truth, he didn’t need one. He had two sources of information about WikiLeaks — neither of them Corsi, neither of them sensibly thought of as an “intermediary.” These sources go unmentioned in the indictment. Worse, while the prosecutors finger Corsi as Stone’s hidden “intermediary,” their evidence does not support this claim — and they know it, so they fudge it.
"
I can answer that right now. His name is Ted Malloch. This man is not known to the mainstream people. But anyone worth their salt investigating this whole sham will know him. Roger Stone certainly does. That is why stone emailed Corsi on 25 July 2016 asking “Get to Assange at the Ecuadorian Embassy in London and get the pending WikiLeaks emails,” Now how does little old me know this? Surely i am making this up? No this is from a leaked Mueller Draft by Jerome Corsi himself.
Six days later, Stone allegedly emailed Corsi again to say Malloch “should see Assange”. Then on 2 August, Corsi replied to Stone: “Word is friend in embassy plans 2 more dumps … Impact planned to be very damaging.”
Corsi and this is a fact tried to delete all these fecking emails and wipe his computer clean. He said he was giving it to his nephew or some shit and wanted to give it to him in the best possible shape
https://www.vox.com/2018/11/27/18115445/mueller-corsi-trump-russia-roger-stone
take a good hard look at this and you will realise that article you posted is garbage.
There is so much more i could type but i feel at this time my post is probably so long no one will read it.
EDIT: Mueller was ready to charge Corsi with false statements and destroying evidence but offered him a plee deal for his corporation, which he (Corsi) decided to blow up and leak. Mueller has not since indicted Mr Corsi. This case is probably with SDNY or any other US Attourneys Office.
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I've gone through it again, and the Vox piece. I still find McCarthy quite convincing, he seems to address your complaints. He answers the question on how Stone came to know what Wikileaks was doing quite convincingly IMO - most obviously, Wikileaks had very publicly announced it earlier, something which Thomas Massie pointed out to Michael Cohen at the recent hearing. And he addresses Ted Malloch's alleged role - for which there doesn't seem to be any actual evidence. The most damning piece of information in the Vox piece is that Corsi deleted all his emails, suggesting he was trying to hide something. But McCarthy shows that Corsi was completely wrong about the nature of the Wikileaks dump, which suggests he hadn't a clue what was coming. Of course there may be further damning information on this yet to be revealed, one way or another, but as things stand Mueller has decided not to indict either Stone or Corsi for collusion/conspiracy, and you seem to agree with him (and McCarthy) that there are in fact no charges along those lines worth bringing.
Just watching this from the beginning (before this starts). The onslaught by the Republicans against Schiff was embarrassing. Couldn’t be more obvious that their blatant attack was co-ordinated in an effort to remove Schiff from the chair of the committee and the only reason for that can be because he is such a threat to them. Watching it from the beginning and the Republicans disappear at some point so will carry on to see what causes them to leave.