How did he undermine the manager in this instance? That conversation was private until the 'manager' leaked it to his friend Duncan. There is no suggestion that Pogba repeated that for public consumption - but everything points to the manager.
The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked
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Yeah and you said "he was protecting his players", where he was actually protecting himself for his cowardly approach .
So you're invoking the hierarchy rule when you're assuming Pogba is having a go at Mourinho, but you're walking over the same rule when Mourinho is having a go at his higher-ups?
He was trashing Scholes over Pogba comments, calling him jealous or frustrated, something like that. I'm surprised you don't remember that.
Again isn't the manager the one that's supposed to be the grown-up and behave accordingly, rather than acting like a petulant child?
After the very first game of the season, 2-1 to Leicester, when a strong solid start to the season was vital Pogba in his post match interview said in his own words he's not really been happy. He also told the press box after being warned for the attack attack attack interview, that he was not allowed to speak. If he didn't want to undermine the manager he'd have his head down and walk past the press interviews. But he decided to speak out knowing it would hit the reports.
He's done it multiple times this season.
We were very lucky to draw and our team is worth 3 times what arsenal fielded. Hoofball from 70 mins. Lukaku looks like he’s never seen a football before. All the negative stuff around the club. A change is needed. I don’t care if pogba stays or goes either.
Fully agree with you. We can chuck enough money at Bournemouth and give Howe a chance for example. What club keeps a shit manager on because they cant get anyone else?
@VP89 Mourinho failing to get the best out of Pogba is surely to look bad on Mourinho, considering Pogba was his star signing, right?
And the manager hasn't? The manager who couldn't keep his trap shut in pre-season but kept taking a swipe at everything and everyone? If you're going to use that argument against Pogba, then you can't use the same argument to defend Mourinho's actions.
Reading your post I can remember why I asked you to stop quoting me - you seem to really argue in circles with other players evidently because you either fail to see, or refuse to see their actual point.
I did some digging on Mourinho trashing Scholes. I found this from the Guardian in January, is this what you mean?
“Paul [Pogba] tries to do his best all the time. Sometimes he plays very well, sometimes he plays well, sometimes he doesn’t play so well. It’s not Paul’s fault that he has made much more money than Paul Scholes. It’s not Paul Scholes’ fault either, it’s just the way football is. I think Scholes will be in history as a phenomenal player, not as a pundit. I prefer to look at him as a phenomenal player that gave so much to the club that I am proud to represent.
“If Paul one day decides to be a manager, I wish that he can be 25% as successful as myself. 50% of that is 12.5 silverware, 25% is around 6. If he’s 25%, he’ll be quite happy. In my mind Paul Scholes is a phenomenal player, one of the best I’ve ever seen playing in midfield. He gave so much to my club that I can only thank him for that. The prestige of this club is based on people like him.”
^^ So he basically said Paul earns more than Scholes. It's not Scholes' fault, that's how football is. He used the word phenominal to describe Scholes 3 times and then said the club is built on players like him.
Woah you're right. He needs to stop trashing on legends, man.
Yes, I think Pogba was one of Jose's biggest mistakes.
I made a thread when/before Pogba signed to question whether the 90m could be better spent given we had so many holes in the squad. It was a big concentration risk and it's flopped.
I lost faith in Jose a while ago. To any remaining Jose fans please watch the highlights of the womans teams game tonight.
They played as a team, scored after 35 seconds but continued to dominate possession and create chance after chance against a very physically strong side who defended tenaciously.
The team worked as a cohesive unit, with some rehearsed plays and worked hard for each other for 95 minutes.
You might remember that sort of thing, it's called effective team management and Casey Stoney is currently showing Jose up.
Oh you will also remember that it's a game that's supposed to be an enjoyable experience to watch also!
They played as a team, scored after 35 seconds but continued to dominate possession and create chance after chance against a very physically strong side who defended tenaciously.
The team worked as a cohesive unit, with some rehearsed plays and worked hard for each other for 95 minutes.
You might remember that sort of thing, it's called effective team management and Casey Stoney is currently showing Jose up.
Oh you will also remember that it's a game that's supposed to be an enjoyable experience to watch also!
He expects 25 year old Pogba to be a bigger man and he seems OK with 55 year old Mourinho acting like a man child all the time. Talk about cult following…
We're going in circles. Players don't have the same freedom to speak to the press like Managers do. They can't talk out of line as much - and this is just how it is in the football industry and a general football view. It's not Mourinho related.
I'm not trying to say Jose is right in a lot of what he says, but when a manager criticizes his players openly, it's not the same as a player openly undermining the manager. The latter is a lot more damaging from a control perspective.
Some of the players acting like we won the game and some fans are happy with the draw. That's where we are as a club under Mourinho. 8th place, way behind the top 4 but somehow happy to be there. Just amazes me how Mourinho has lowered standards.
While I agree that top 4 is our level currently, I'd rather be a top 4 team playing progressive football than hoof ball to the lanky cnut uptop.
I've said it before & I'll say it again. I don't think there are many managers that would do worse with this team this season.
It's a mini melt down similar to his last at Chelsea it's just missing the Eva boom ( I was amazed this happened on the first day of the season)
Compare the stats between both teams 2nd/3rd seasons, awfully similar.
In terms of options, Mckenna/Carrick if anything just so we don't have to deal with the daily drama.
Jardim (Monaco final season isn't fair to blame on him, injury crisis +750mill of sales..)
Zidane.. hell even fecking Wenger as an interim would be a significant improvement.
So I agree with progressive football, but McKenna/Carrick present their own risks. They are both not proven enough to handle a top 4 race. Heck they've never managed a top league club.
Jardim looks to be off to another club.
Zidane doesn't want to join.
I said after Palace we may as well sack Jose and get Jardim in as caretaker with the chance to have the job full time beyond. But I think Jardim isn't available now.
What more would you expect from 'Pogba's biggest fan'?
It makes sense but since none of these things are new I have to say that you took your time to join us.
Why did Mou not make a change at right back before putting Pogba on?? Keeping Lingard on and using Valencia to sure up our defence would have allowed us to press in the last 10 minutes instead of hanging on at the end.
Surely it was obvious!
Surely it was obvious!
Where did I say that? I've said in multiple posts tonight itself that I'm not happy with Jose mouthing off.
Jesus read my posts or don't quote me. You've got issues.
Of course we gonna be going in circles, when you're unable to see the hypocrisy in your own wards and whenever someone points at it, you try ignore it and cut the discussion short by giving some generic bs responses the likes of which you already used to start this reply with.
Why was Mourinho mentioning money? Why is he questioning Scholes as a pundit just because Mourinho didn't agree with his opinion?
He should go no matter what. He could have got this attacking players to play a long time back and for playing Matic and Lukaku he should go.
Lindelof when he comes back should be put instead of Matic.
Who is the imbecile who made Matic the MOTM?
Lindelof when he comes back should be put instead of Matic.
Who is the imbecile who made Matic the MOTM?
And you think Pogba behaves like a “ grown up “ ?
He is nothing but a spoiled brat who has been indulged for too long
True.
Which part made you believe that I think so?
He's saying Scholes is a shit pundit. He's not trashing on Scholes as a player. He actually clarified how the club is literally built on players like Scholes and called him phenomenal 3 times.
How you think he's "trashing on legends" is beyond me. If he was trashing Scholes the player then I'm all on your side. But he's shitting on Scholes as a shit pundit, which he often is.
His posts generally revert to sensationalizing Mourinho's words to divert attention away from anything else. I Wouldn't bother. In fact he's on my ignore list now. Sorry @Fracture90 I don't want to indulge in any further debates with someone not bothered to read posts properly.
You don't need to say that, it's what everyone can conclude from the hypocrisy of in your words considering you're downplaying and straight-up defending Mourinho for the same things you're criticising Pogba for.
“Again isn't the manager the one that's supposed to be the grown-up and behave accordingly, rather than acting like a petulant child?”
I took this to mean that it was the manager acting like a petulant child not Pogba
Apologies if I misunderstood
In case you missed it, I didn't specify he was trashing Scholes as a player.
He's calling out a club legend for having a different opinion than him.
What's with the money part? Is he implying Scholes is jealous that Pogba is making more than he did and that's why he's criticising him?
How is it not obvious to anyone that after 400 million and in his 3rd season that this just won't work out. Nothing against him but we simply haven't made the progress that is expected for our investment.
Personally I think we should have given Mourinho enough time (which we did) to turn things around. Moyes, LVG had two very short spells. Expecting an immediate success after Fergie's tenure was too optimistic.
Mourinho been begging for players he wants signed and didn't get in last window. Things not going to improve with Mourinho at the helm, especially if Woody etc not giving him that HE wants to play HIS way. It's not the United way, and majority of fans want a change it feels.
It's been 2 and a half years, and Mourinho has never lasted more than 3 years at any club. Time's up, it feels like even he knows it.
I vote for a new manager and give successor freedom to sign the players he wants. And please no more panic buys like £500K a week Sanchez.
Mourinho been begging for players he wants signed and didn't get in last window. Things not going to improve with Mourinho at the helm, especially if Woody etc not giving him that HE wants to play HIS way. It's not the United way, and majority of fans want a change it feels.
It's been 2 and a half years, and Mourinho has never lasted more than 3 years at any club. Time's up, it feels like even he knows it.
I vote for a new manager and give successor freedom to sign the players he wants. And please no more panic buys like £500K a week Sanchez.
I don't think nor I'm implying that Pogba is behaving like a grown-up, in fact I don't think either of them is acting like a grown-up. But I'm pointing out considering the age difference, it's more expected from Mourinho to behave like a grown-up.
it's a big risk but I still feel it's a smaller risk than keeping Mourinho. This Pogba fiasco is a little more fiesty than before, which could very well lead to two camps in the dressing room and I imagine a few would side with Pogba.
And at the end of the day, they may actually try to win matches.
8th place, 3 points out of 9 with 2 of them home games and one of them against the second bottom team in the PL. He'd be sacked at Everton or Watford for form like that, nevermind any of the elite clubs, one of which we are supposed to be.
Don't forget - a whooping -1 GD as well.
There are no sure things in football, but here's one that I'm certian of: We're going nowhere with Mourinho. There's just no risk to letting him go.
Standards have slipped so fast it's beyond belief.
Old Trafford certainly let Pogba and Mourinho know what they felt about them tonight.
Very differing reactions.
Mourinho very positive, Pogba very mixed.
The fans have spoken.
Very differing reactions.
Mourinho very positive, Pogba very mixed.
The fans have spoken.
The same fans that were backing LVG?
This is tiresome. We are woeful and we're not improving. Before Jose joined the majority had reservations over his play style and his demeanour, but naturally hoped he'd at least be "our cnut" and win us trophies. Instead we're seeing him at his worst, causing divisions as always and serving up tripe on the pitch. His attitude is not befitting of Manchester United, nor any club that wishes to have a harmonious atmosphere to be honest. His style is horrific and we're slipping further and further away whilst he talks about the spending of bloody EVERTON!
His enjoyment of football does not match up with that of our great clubs traditions and he is not even offering the success to back it up. This guy is toxic and causes drama wherever he goes, we are best off rid of him.
His enjoyment of football does not match up with that of our great clubs traditions and he is not even offering the success to back it up. This guy is toxic and causes drama wherever he goes, we are best off rid of him.
No he should go. He has wasted enough at United. The fact a comedy of errors made this match entertaining to the neutrals does not mean he should stay. We cannot even beat Arsenal at OT.
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