Tbf the author has written extensively on Khabib, Kadyrov and Dagestan in the past (more so than any other journalist I'm aware of), so I'm sure he's at least somewhat aware of the context.
You can see a list of his articles covering Kadyrov here.
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Tbf the author has written extensively on Khabib, Kadyrov and Dagestan in the past (more so than any other journalist I'm aware of), so I'm sure he's at least somewhat aware of the context.
You can see a list of his articles covering Kadyrov here.
So why does he then not take into consideration the potential repercussions Khabib could face by snubbing Kadyrov. It could cause tension between Chechens and Avars too.
Fair point.
I think most in Russia, regardless of their political beliefs would let someone very very powerful into their homes out of fear. Being rich and famous doesn't change that.
I just don't see it with GSP. I mean how old is GSP? What would Khabib gain by beating past it, retired fighter?
@sullydnl I looked through that journalists articles and one thing is clear to me, is how powerful Kadyrov is, how much he uses sport to sportsmanship his image. Nothing i didn't know but Khabib snubbing him would be a major issue for Kadyrov. I don't blame Khabib not wanting to look over his shoulder for an absolute psycho for a president.
Regarding homophobia, if Khabib has nothing good to say than he should keep his mouth closed at the very least. Though, like I said, he is a byproduct of social conditioning to hate gays. I don't mean name calling. I mean execution. So do you blame the society that he grew up in or the individual. Again, I'm not condoning homophobia or Khabib but he's been brought up in hate. I'm lucky I moved from Russia when I was 10 and I'm very tolerant and Liberal id say but if I haven't, the chances are I'd be the same.
Regarding homophobia, if Khabib has nothing good to say than he should keep his mouth closed at the very least. Though, like I said, he is a byproduct of social conditioning to hate gays. I don't mean name calling. I mean execution. So do you blame the society that he grew up in or the individual. Again, I'm not condoning homophobia or Khabib but he's been brought up in hate. I'm lucky I moved from Russia when I was 10 and I'm very tolerant and Liberal id say but if I haven't, the chances are I'd be the same.
I agree with you which is why I said Khabib may think this as he's mentioned GSP many times.
What’s coming back on me? I don’t care a jot what you think or say in the matter so all this is a waste of time on your part
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What’s coming back on me? I don’t care a jot what you think or say in the matter so all this is a waste of time on your part
What? Nothing is coming back on you, I meant Khabib, unless you share the same mum which would explain your odd love for him.
It wasn't really a waste of time, took about 15 seconds.
Judging by your short reply and lack of replying to anyone who made valid points re Khabib's views you've not really got a valid response to any of it and will just pretend none of it exists or dismiss it all as his cultural views again.
What’s new about any of it? I know about the incidents and I’d expect most people on his situation to act the same.
Is everyone who voted for Blair or took a photo with him a war criminal too?
I don't know about the Kadyrov wouldn't harm him bit when he only recently went after Fedor's teenage daughter.
Jesus, talk about scraping a barrel.
You literally would defend Khabib on anything
I don't think anyone called Khabib a war criminal....just criticised him for being pally with one which seems a fair enough criticism.It's only fair that after the praise he's got people can also say he's a dodgy character, there's balance to everything.
And I’ve already written a response to that. The article is flawed and extremely biased as it looks at Khabibs decisions from a solely a western view. Not sure what else I can add if this is what I believe?Jesus, talk about scraping a barrel.
You literally would defend Khabib on anything
It's only fair that after the praise he's got people can also say he's a dodgy character, there's balance to everything.
Surely you can concede it's fair people will judge him on his sketchy background and the stuff he does? Can't just dismiss everything as a view from the western world.
You spent all weekend telling us how great he is as a person, a fighter, slating other fighters for their traits and yet when people criticise Khabib it's the western worlds problem.
People can look at it from the Western view, then use your argument that maybe he thinks differently and still come to the same argument that "actually the guy is clearly a bit of a cnut"
feck sake. The decision between keeping Maupay Vs getting Antonio in is doing my nut!
Antonio has a better ground game but Maupay is a good all round fighter. Although he has got history of being a choker ala Cerrone on the big stage (see the 98th minute penalty vs. United.)
When did I say others couldn't draw their own conclusions. You can do as you like.
Each to their own. I just find it really weird when people get ultra defensive about people they don't even know getting criticised. Especially to just brush off someone's ridiculous views as people from the western world being ignorant to it...at the same time you criticise other fighters at any give opportunity
I have grown up and live in the same western world that McGregor did. So there is no bias or lack of empathy when I criticise him or hold him accountable against the standards of his culture. Not sure what is so hard to understand on this front.
Surely people can criticise others if they're not from the same culture though? If there's valid criticisms about Khabib surely he can he criticised. By your logic do you disagree with Khabib criticisng McGregor? Different cultures after all.
There seem to be two conversations going on here.
1. The Report
Sure you can, but be empathetic to the person you are criticising. A journalists personal views are worthless. It's their job to live in the views of their subject and tell the story from this perspective. They may then objectively apply other judgment criteria. Its called a 'report' for this reason. But the report posted which initiated this conversation was absurdly biased, and was basically an OpEd.
2. Our personal views
Khabib has no right to criticise McGregor for adhering to western cultural norms, but then I don't think he ever has? Any allegation Khabib has made against McGregor has support across the western world. As for criticising people from other cultures, it's Khabib's risk not to conform if he wants to pocket all the $$$ from another culture, but that's about it.
I don't think that Western culture is superior than others. It's simply an opinion on how life should be lived, and there are many such opinions around the world. As a Westerner, you are most welcome to criticise him, but why are you so surprised that others will find your criticism naive or unsophisticated?
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Yeah, you're not one of the most popular athletes on the planet forever.
It's not particularly his personal views though in fairness. I'd say by definition of journalism it hits the criteria pretty well, especially for MMA standards. I think it's perfectly fair for people to hear both sides of the story. We've heard all week what a great athlete Khabib is (and he is.) But then with anyone it's only fair to hear the flaws of the person as well, especially after some of the stuff with Khabib was putting him as this angel outside of the sport when the reality is far more complex than that. Course we've not lived under that lifestyle Khabib has but for me that doesn't mean we can't criticise him for certain things.
I don't think Khabib is adhering to "norms" though particularly. I don't think the "norm" is hanging around with dictators for example and some of the stuff he says leaves a lot to be desired. Equally with Khabib it's not like he's lived stuck in Dagestan forever, he trains out of AKA with plenty of people who are not from that culture and therefore he should be slightly more educated than the stuff he says. I think even being generous with him and saying some stuff is out of his hands in regards of what he has to say in front of dictators, he's said plenty of stuff on his own free will which can be described as ignorant at best (homophobic and sexist is probably more appropriate.)
Regarding McGregor he did criticise certain western norms, he criticised him for lifestyle choices regarding acohol/drugs which are a culturual thing and are impacted by the society you are brought up in. He accused him of being a rapist which obviously isn't normal but equally there's no charges of it and it's a pretty strong alegation to throw at someone.
I don't particularly think it's unsophisticated to criticise it and I'm intrigued as to why you think that is the case? If you read up on something and form an opinion that's the complete opposite of being unsophisticated. If anything I'd say if people can't see the other side of the debate or argument and are blinded by their views and beliefs then they are ignorant themselves (not talking about you there by the way more of a general comment.)
Nothing wrong in this post from my POV but all we have established is there are several ways to view things. But then we all know this.
IMO, the journalist should have established this and failed in that regard.
My thanks for a good and robust discussion.
Good HBO piece on the intersection of MMA and the Chechen dictatorship. Also interviews Karim Zidan at one point.
Same to you!
Always good to see and hear different views.Region blocked unfortunately, does anyone know if it's available elsewhere? Wouldn't mind watching that later.
Same to you!
Region blocked unfortunately, does anyone know if it's available elsewhere? Wouldn't mind watching that later.
There may be a third party version floating around on Youtube. Just type in kadyrov hbo interview.
Great video showing GSP training at Tiger Muay Thai, where I have also trained MMA for 10 weeks! Covid has temporarily destroyed what was becoming the fight training mecca in the world, a road called Soi TaiEd in Phuket.
Once its up and running again, I'd seriously recommend any of you who want to get better at MMA, or fancy a fitness, beach and healthy eating holiday, you must go to Soi TaiEd in Phuket! Many other top MMA fighters have also trained in this area, especially just before they hit the big time, so it's highly likely you will see people while you are there that became famous within a year to two later.
This guy gives great and fair reviews for all gyms on the street (go back to Feb 2020, as he cant review since covid19 lockdown)
Once its up and running again, I'd seriously recommend any of you who want to get better at MMA, or fancy a fitness, beach and healthy eating holiday, you must go to Soi TaiEd in Phuket! Many other top MMA fighters have also trained in this area, especially just before they hit the big time, so it's highly likely you will see people while you are there that became famous within a year to two later.
This guy gives great and fair reviews for all gyms on the street (go back to Feb 2020, as he cant review since covid19 lockdown)
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Where do Matt Hughes and BJ Penn enter the GOAT discussion? Hughes especially I never see mentioned, but looking at his record, he has some very impressive wins and runs.
Hughes lost quite a few fights later in his career. Penn barely has a winning record.
So predictable
He absolutely will...
Jon Jones is insufferable.
Just let the man have his moment. Let your own career speak for itself and have some class. When you do that, people will speak up for you and put your name forward.
Khabib just put on a flawless performance against a fighter on an absolute tear. He is 29-0 and has won almost every round in his career.
Let him have his deserved moment and praise and wait for the next of the many, many moments you have already been allowed to savor.
Completely classless, insecure and egotistical, and that’s before you even mention USADA and his self-sabotage.
Just let the man have his moment. Let your own career speak for itself and have some class. When you do that, people will speak up for you and put your name forward.
Khabib just put on a flawless performance against a fighter on an absolute tear. He is 29-0 and has won almost every round in his career.
Let him have his deserved moment and praise and wait for the next of the many, many moments you have already been allowed to savor.
Completely classless, insecure and egotistical, and that’s before you even mention USADA and his self-sabotage.
what?!? What about his mother's promise? He would never go back on that he's a man of great honour!!!!!! This must be some kind of mistake.
Mother’s promise vs father’s wish... hmm, it’s a tough one
Hope not. He’d absolutely smash a 39-yr old GSP who’s only fought once in the last 7 years. Last time he stepped into the cage was 3 years ago.
Its not like Khabib would be fighting an over the hill version of Cowboy Cerrone, Dan Henderson, Bisping, or BJ Penn. This is GSP and he's in great shape still.
Umm, what did you expect when P4P goat talk comes up? These guys are fighters and self-promoters ffs. And there’s not much wrong with what Jones has said. It’s not like Khabib’s died.