The John Murtough Era

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DarkXaero said:
I did say that, the club mindset has been different (they've backed the manager heavily this time), but the competence is still in question (overpaying, late transfer window deals, dragged out transfer sagas).
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Yep. I said before the window that I'll give them a pass considering people were leaving and things aren't fully in place.

We were run similar to how Chelsea has also been run this summer. Letting the manager guide the targets and being in for loads of players.

I want us to hire a recruitment specialist and revamp that whole department in time for January/next summer. We can't be letting the manager wholly dictate our transfer policy. He should be involved but Murtough should be bringing in people to help him confidently overrule/suggest alternatives.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
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Feels like without Antony's intervention this would drown faster than De Jong. I guess Murty had no chance vs Van der Sar who's knowledge about football is twice of that.

Let's just say in terms of delivery desired player to his manager, he did just that. :lol:
 
We've got ETH a number of the targets he wanted but it doesn't mask the sheet ineptitude on display this summer in A) the inability to conclude deals in time for the season and B) the lack of any expertise from the club's own part in part in ensuring smart and efficient transfers (more of a who da ya wan Erik? strategy)
 
TheReligion said:
So…. How are people feeling about this now?

Malacia
Eriksen
Martinez
Casemiro
Antony

Still strong rumours we will do more before deadline day too.

Given the new recruitment team is only just up and running, and to my knowledge we still have key scouting roles to fill, this window was always going to be tricky.

Thoughts for a first window?
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More than I expected, despite our obvious needs.

Would expect more co-ordination between scouts/Murtough/ETH in January window or the summer window.
 
Frank Grimes said:
Let's praise Murtough for paying 100m euro on a player who managed 12 goal involvements in Eredivisie last season. No thanks.
Should have got Martinez and Antony for that at the start of June with maybe add ons involved.
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Shame Ajax wouldn't sell at that point.
 
TheReligion said:
So…. How are people feeling about this now?

Malacia
Eriksen
Martinez
Casemiro
Antony

Still strong rumours we will do more before deadline day too.

Given the new recruitment team is only just up and running, and to my knowledge we still have key scouting roles to fill, this window was always going to be tricky.

Thoughts for a first window?
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To add to that, had the De Jong deal agreed with Barcelona back in June at a fair price (atleast according to today’s market).

We may have left it late, but he has so far delivered on the manager’s targets it seems.

Will be interesting to see how the last few days shape up - backup GK + Ronaldo replacement (or temporary striking backup) if he goes. RB + another CM will be make it the perfect window but I suppose we’ve only got so much to spend.
 
No faith in Murtough or the so-called football operation at United. There is no evidence of any kind of structure supporting the coach's needs/philosophy.

Our signings this summer have mostly been manager targets, agent led and secured by paying over the odds. Ten Hag may be a great enough coach to make it work. However, it's unsustainable and doesn't reflect any kind of long term strategy. The exact thing you want your Football Director driving.
 
#07 said:
No faith in Murtough or the so-called football operation at United. There is no evidence of any kind of structure supporting the coach's needs/philosophy.

Our signings this summer have mostly been manager targets, agent led and secured by paying over the odds. Ten Hag may be a great enough coach to make it work. However, it's unsustainable and doesn't reflect any kind of long term strategy. The exact thing you want your Football Director driving.
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Exactly, every player in the world is available if you throw enough money at their club. United continually make a balls of transfer windows, then comes the panic and a couple of hundred million is found behind the club couch to make up for the clubs non existent football infrastructure.

A 10 year old could of gotten the players in that Murtagh got this summer. All you do is key in the cash cheat code and you Can recruit anybody.
 
#07 said:
No faith in Murtough or the so-called football operation at United. There is no evidence of any kind of structure supporting the coach's needs/philosophy.

Our signings this summer have mostly been manager targets, agent led and secured by paying over the odds. Ten Hag may be a great enough coach to make it work. However, it's unsustainable and doesn't reflect any kind of long term strategy. The exact thing you want your Football Director driving.
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Good job that structure is changing then isn’t it!
 
It would seem from my point of view ten Hag was in accord with Rangnick that a whole new team was needed and they’ve seemingly worked off the list of players ten Hag brought to that initial meeting.

Some transfer failures to acquire from that list are to be expected, I guess.

Shipping the unwanted players out for decent returns is the next step Murtough needs to learn.

ten Hag needs to show he can get this team gelled and working together. Fast.

In the meantime it buys time to establish a more regimented structure going forward.

This reminds me of Big Ron’s “emergency surgery“ when he took over.
 
There is no point in a DOF then. It's all driven by The Manager. All he has done is throw money at some players wanted by the manager and sign some players. ETH is not his boss but the other way around. But it looks like ETH is his boss.
 
Foxbatt said:
There is no point in a DOF then. It's all driven by The Manager. All he has done is throw money at some players wanted by the manager and sign some players. ETH is not his boss but the other way around. But it looks like ETH is his boss.
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Next summer when we have signed some headscouts - we have been missing 2 of them after we sacked them at the start of the window. It’ll be different and much more streamlined
 
Why is he being quoted on Dubravka rather than ETH?
 
If he pulls off FDJ in the next 5 hours he's alright in my book.
 
He's been abysmal this summer. lack of direction, lack of dilligence and the mumourings about the manager having total influence over recruitment has been an approach that has failed with every manager since SAF retired.

I'm not against the club moving Murtough into a more redundant role and bringing in a proper DOF. Can't see any improvement from here on out. All Murtough had to do was look at Woodward, draw a framework of execution around what Woodward didn't do to have a chance at success. It's been a comical summer especially around planning. No excuses.
 
SmallCaine said:
We have appointed the marcus rashford of Dof's. Seems like the only lesson he learnt from woody's incompetence is how to cozy up to journos and get them to write fictional puff pieces about yourself.
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How do you know it's fictional? Where in the United hierarchy do you work?
 
Now that it’s officially over I can safely say I can’t believe we spent all summer chasing a player who didn’t want to leave his club. I still think it’s dumb that we had fans saying “there’s no way the club would spend all summer chasing him if they didn’t think it could happen. There’s no way the club can be that incompetent” when there was never any indication the player wanted to leave Barcelona.

FDJ aside, I like Martinez, Malacia, Casemiro and Anthony.
 
We can sack Murtough and dissolve our scouting department. ETH is our DOF, Head Scout and Manager.
 
Murtough is as useful as a screen door on a submarine. Given that everything has to be signed off by Jack-off Joel, and Murtough doesn’t seem to have any useful contacts or negotiation skills, he’s really just an overpaid errand boy.
 
Ema_datsi said:
Murtough is as useful as a screen door on a submarine. Given that everything has to be signed off by Jack-off Joel, and Murtough doesn’t seem to have any useful contacts or negotiation skills, he’s really just an overpaid errand boy.
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He needs to make like a tree, and get out of here
 
alexthelion said:
How do you know it's fictional? Where in the United hierarchy do you work?
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So paying 100mn for a player we could have gotten for 80mn if we had agreed to a deal earlier is brilliant negotiating? When was the last time you heard people in football being impressed by manager interviewing skills of a DOF?
 
The actual work for Jan and next summer window should start now, that's what DoF should doing. We have a basic idea on what we need in the next window, we also have a manager who wants certain profile of players. Identify the players, lay the ground work for the future transfer.

First summer window can be excused with some reasons like head scouts were fired, we hired new manager who wanted specific players rather than specific profile of players. From now on there shouldn't be any excuse.
 
Absolute shit show of a window for him, I’d give him praise for the players we got in but I have a feeling they were probably identified by ETH anyway. FDJ saga was a farce. We overpaid on the Ajax boys when we could have got them both in early on in the window. The only way he vindicates himself now is if he manages to hire some quality scouts and makes some shrewd signings in Jan and next summer. We need to see evidence of a plan because this scattergun approach looks and sounds all too familiar.
 
Got there in the end, be interesting to see next years window as the new recruitment structure will have been in place long enough to identify targets rather than just go for ex Ten Hag players.
 
ETH was officially appointed 21 April, but the interview process was well underway in March.
The two scouts departing were announced 20 April, so Murtough should have known atleast a few weeks ahead - unless Arnold is one of those shitty bosses that drops sudden surprises last minute.
ETH actually stated working for United in mid-May.
The transfer window officially opened on 10 June.

Murtough had atleast all of May to prepare but it appears that he had no idea about what ETH wanted and the type of football ETH wanted to play despite interviewing the man multiple times in March and working with him from mid-May. Infact, ETH is supposed to have given him a list before going on vacation. What was Murtough doing that entire time? Waiting for Jack-off Joel to sign off on a subscription to wyscout and opta? Dick Arnold proudly declared that Murtough was working long hours on these deals - either Dick is a liar, Murtough is slower than molasses, or both are way in over their heads and lying to save their skins.

But more than the sheer incompetence of these clowns is that the Glazers are cheap basterds that try to run this club as cheaply as possible. No amount of preparation and ground work can overcome this fact. It’s only because of the fan unrest and SJR’s public interest, that these scumbags opened up the purse strings. FFS how do you go from haggling over Arnautovic and Rabiot (a player the club stressed was always the “plan”) to splashing 60 mil on a 30yr old Casemiro and 86 mil on Antony (when they could have gotten him for 68 mil before pre-season tour).

Some big signings and hairy wins later, and most of our fanbase have forgotten the root of all our problems. The only reason why we have to put up with clowns like Murtough, Arnold, Judge, and Woodward is because the Glazers deemed these ass-kissing amateurs fit to run this club. And sadly, unless our fans get serious about ousting these Glazers, we will be here again next year lamenting how bad Murtough is at his job. I’m fed up of going from Fergie’s “value in the market” to ETH’s “sign the right player”, and then watching all these panic buys (that mostly didn’t pan out). Dick Arnold sat in that pub and said something to the effect of “I look at that pitch and wonder where it (1bil) went”, well he’s defo gotten a strong start to wasting the club’s money by overpaying.
 
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Murtough had a verbal agreement with Frenkie de Jong's agent and FDJ about joining United.
(From Samuel Luckhurst. This is consistent with that reliable Dutch chap).

The insurmountable block was Barcelona's refusal to negotiate on the deferred wages. Murtough described Barcelona's behavior as "disgraceful"
(From Samuel Luckhurst)

Seems like the self deprecating United fans were wrong. FDJ was willing to join and as evidenced by Antony and Casemiro we are still desirable.

Also quite shocking that the game of chicken with FDJ has ended with Barca not budging. I sincerely hope they face some sort of consequence for it. Made worse by the inundation of hateful and atrocious messaged online from their fans being hurled at the likes of FDJ for not taking a pay cut or leaving. Cesspit.

Overall can't seem to fault Murtough. Deals were done when we wanted. The biggest gripe has to be against the Glazers for not loosening the purse strings until two games into the season. Yet again they show their true intentions with this club are to leech us for all we're worth.

Edit: reformatted
 
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RyRy11 said:
Absolute shit show of a window for him, I’d give him praise for the players we got in but I have a feeling they were probably identified by ETH anyway. FDJ saga was a farce. We overpaid on the Ajax boys when we could have got them both in early on in the window. The only way he vindicates himself now is if he manages to hire some quality scouts and makes some shrewd signings in Jan and next summer. We need to see evidence of a plan because this scattergun approach looks and sounds all too familiar.
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This wasn’t a scatter gun approach (see Chelsea)
 
Ted Lasso said:
From Samuel Luckhurst:
Murtough had a verbal agreement with Frenkie de Jong's agent and FDJ about joining United (this is consistent with that reliable Dutch chap).

The insurmountable block was Barcelona's refusal to negotiate on the deferred wages. Murtough described Barcelona's behavior as "disgraceful"

Seems like the self deprecating United fans were wrong. FDJ was willing to join and as evidenced by Antony and Casemiro we are still desirable.

Also quite shocking that the game of chicken with FDJ has ended with Barca not budging. I sincerely hope they face some sort of consequence for it. Made worse by the inundation of hateful and atrocious messaged online from their fans being hurled at the likes of FDJ for not taking a pay cut or leaving. Cesspit.

Overall can't seem to fault Murtough. Deals were done when we wanted. The biggest gripe has to be against the Glazers for not loosening the purse strings until two games into the season. Yet again they show their true intentions with this club are to leech us for all we're worth.
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Where have you read this?
 
roonster09 said:
The actual work for Jan and next summer window should start now, that's what DoF should doing. We have a basic idea on what we need in the next window, we also have a manager who wants certain profile of players. Identify the players, lay the ground work for the future transfer.

First summer window can be excused with some reasons like head scouts were fired, we hired new manager who wanted specific players rather than specific profile of players. From now on there shouldn't be any excuse.
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This is pretty much exactly where we stand. Replace the scouts ASAP and start generating reports and lists of players hopefully in time for January, possible it’ll be next summer when there’s no excuse at all.

Really the scouts should have been gone back in February and replaced in time for the summer so we could see the positive effects sooner but it is what it is. They probably wouldn’t have been able to have much meaningful for this summer anyway at that stage but I’d be feeling a lot more confident going forward.

As it happens so far I’m very impressed with Ten Hag’s picks so it’s far from the end of the world and an awful summer, but yeah, next year should/must be a lot better.
 
Ted Lasso said:
Just beginning to make it's rounds on Twitter. And looking at how my post formatted, need to clarify it's the first two statements coming from SL. The rest are my thoughts
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Can you post the tweets?

Should be in the De Jong thread really as if true I’ve no doubt we will revisit this.
 


United agreed an €85m fee with Barcelona forFrenkie de Jong in July. Murtough had a verbal agreement with the player’s agent, Ali Dursun, on a salary, an encouraging development that suggested De Jong was more receptive to joining United than his public proclamations suggested.

De Jong’s wage deferral was the insurmountable stumbling block and Murtough privately described Barcelona’s behaviour as “disgraceful”.

Murtough was filmed smiling in response to an enthusiastic Norwegian fan’s cry of “get Frenkie” in Oslo after United's friendly with Atletico Madrid. Not filmed was a fan enquiring about his July trip to Barcelona.

“It’s lovely this time of year,” Murtough cheerfully replied. Murtough is an affable figure whose enthusiasm to reinvent United could do with being shared by the owners.
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Still a bit fuzzy on his actual state of mind "suggested" "receptive".
 
phelans shorts said:
This is pretty much exactly where we stand. Replace the scouts ASAP and start generating reports and lists of players hopefully in time for January, possible it’ll be next summer when there’s no excuse at all.

Really the scouts should have been gone back in February and replaced in time for the summer so we could see the positive effects sooner but it is what it is. They probably wouldn’t have been able to have much meaningful for this summer anyway at that stage but I’d be feeling a lot more confident going forward.

As it happens so far I’m very impressed with Ten Hag’s picks so it’s far from the end of the world and an awful summer, but yeah, next year should/must be a lot better.
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Yeah, as of now all our signings look good choice. Hopefully this window will be considered as a successful one.

Casemiro adds lot of the midfield, both defensively and to move the ball quickly. Very excited to see how Antony plays for us. First time in years we have proper left footed winger who is full of tricks and flair.
 
Bastian said:




Still a bit fuzzy on his actual state of mind "suggested" "receptive".
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Its quite obvious that the deal would have happened if Barca didn’t threaten legal action they day after a fee was agreed in my opinion.
This one isn’t over yet
De Jong hasn’t said much and his agent has kept in touch with United. Whilst the club has maintained his is still a priority target
 
Rightnr said:
You've made that up. We just didn't want to pay the going rate quoted, especially for Antony which was still steep but cheeper than now.
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You don't just go in and say: 'here, have a €100m" - you negotiate and this takes times. If we said, the former, we likely would have ended up paying even more than what we did. That is how negotiations work.
 
roseguy64 said:
We've been negotiating all summer. That's why some are upset. If we were gonna pay up eventually we should have done so when the price was 80 weeks ago.
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Who said it was ever actually 80, though? The thing is if you start high in negotiations, the price will only go up. There is no way they would have accepted 80 if it was our starting bid. They would have wanted, and pushed, for more.

I think they always wanted €100m, but we couldn't just go straight in and bid that amount, otherwise they would want €110m.
 
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