The clubs willingness to write off seasons

[McGrathsipan]

It's absolutely baffling for a board that care so much about finances that they're allowing managers to lead us to midtable finishes. Finishing outside top 4 sets us back years each time it happens.

It's doesn't set the finances back. The business is growing. Feck the football. The money is still coming in.

 

[MrBest]

And that's one of the most ridiculed thing in Football which has led to the idea that when a club gives you public support you are a dead man walking. Your point is essentially that you want the club to purposely fool the fanbase for no obvious reason.

My point is not that, you are being cynical. Like i said, i believe that if a club has as much pressure as United has faced this week, someone needs to come out and reassure. The season is still ripe, Ole most likely will not get sacked on Saturday despite the result and we stl have a game to win. It's cled a vote of confidence, every company does it when there is intense pressure. If you don't agree with my opinion then fine, but don't out right just dismiss me because you are argumentative.

 

[PieCrust]

It's why I'm not convinced the next manager even really matters. The rot is at the top.

 

[Flytan]

It's why I'm not convinced the next manager even really matters. The rot is at the top.

Yup if the club is worried about hiring successful managers then it's from the very top. They'd all rather just get along and make millions together than do anything successful. This is from our puppet manager all the way to the glazers.

 

[JPRouve]

My point is not that, you are being cynical. Like i said, i believe that if a club has as much pressure as United has faced this week, someone needs to come out and reassure. The season is still ripe, Ole most likely will not get sacked on Saturday despite the result and we stl have a game to win. It's cled a vote of confidence, every company does it when there is intense pressure. If you don't agree with my opinion then fine, but don't out right just dismiss me because you are argumentative.

I'm not being cynical I really don't understand how sending a message to the fans, a message is most likely untrue is supposed to help anyone, particularly when we all know how professional sport works. It doesn't even make sense from the POV of players because if you have a message for players, if you want to galvanize them you shouldn't do it through the press but in person at the training ground during the week behind closed doors. What you are suggesting is tacky and one of the things that would be used against Woodward like his fabled breafings about a DOF after every bad loses until the appointment of Murtough.

And I'm not dismissing personally, I simply don't understand why you want to see the club use PR tactics that don't work and only demonstrate that the manager is in trouble.

 

[Lee565]

Yup if the club is worried about hiring successful managers then it's from the very top. They'd all rather just get along and make millions together than do anything successful. This is from our puppet manager all the way to the glazers.

But the fans have let the glazers of the hook once again this because all fans care about these days is purchasing shiny new expensive toys every summer and all will be forgotten despite it not doing us any great deal of good, this is the same fanbase that at one stage were all worshipping "agent" woodward on social media when we signed schweinsteiger and Schneiderlin within a short period of one another.

 

[Flytan]

But the fans have let the glazers of the hook once again this because all fans care about these days is purchasing shiny new expensive toys every summer and all will be forgotten despite it not doing us any great deal of good, this is the same fanbase that at one stage were all worshipping "agent" woodward on social media when we signed schweinsteiger and Schneiderlin within a short period of one another.

Oh I for sure agree the fan base causes issues. We still have members in this board supporting ole and match going fans singing his name.

 

[Devil may care]

The title was never on no matter who was manager, that midfield is crap, but if we lose the next 2 games we're potentially 9 points off top 4, that'll be a big enough task.

 

[AneRu]

I fully agree with that and I like 2023 because I have high hopes for the likes of Rose, Marsch and maybe Seoane. We also have a team that is split between very young players that hopefully will be superstars such as Sancho, Greenwood, Mejbri, even Rashford and older players like Maguire, Varane, Ronaldo and a bridge player like Fernandes. In my opinion we are in a great position to get someone like Conte today and if needed move to the progressive managers in 2023 with a core of young players that hopefully tasted success under Conte and can support a young progressive manager that most likely will need to get used to elite football and star players.

Right, there are a lot of promising young managers that will, hopefully, have fulfilled their potential or established themselves as very good/top managers. The problem at United is that we don't have anyone to monitor them or who is remotely aware of them to be in a position to plan for their arrival.

In 2023 we'd have seen more of Ten Hag (I don't think we need to see more), Potter or Rose but the challenge is that our board is not in touch with current trends.

What has been particularly dismaying has been the absence of Murtough and Fletcher in the discussions determining Ole's fate. Arnold, Woodward and Sir Alex have featured prominently but this situation is exactly why we were saying we needed a DOF because accountants see the obvious potential loss like a big pay off but don't possess the skill to see beyond that, for example the financial benefits of having a damn good coach who can improve players or take chances on a kid e.g LVG was a certified failure but he did unearth an £80m gem for us in Rashford. Mourinho or Ole would never.

 

[Member 117152]

Right, there are a lot of promising young managers that will, hopefully, have fulfilled their potential or established themselves as very good/top managers. The problem at United is that we don't have anyone to monitor them or who is remotely aware of them to be in a position to plan for their arrival.

In 2023 we'd have seen more of Ten Hag (I don't think we need to see more), Potter or Rose but the challenge is that our board is not in touch with current trends.

What has been particularly dismaying has been the absence of Murtough and Fletcher in the discussions determining Ole's fate. Arnold, Woodward and Sir Alex have featured prominently but this situation is exactly why we were saying we needed a DOF because accountants see the obvious potential loss like a big pay off but don't possess the skill to see beyond that, for example the financial benefits of having a damn good coach who can improve players or take chances on a kid e.g LVG was a certified failure but he did unearth an £80m gem for us in Rashford. Mourinho or Ole would never.

What are Murtough and Fletcher even doing at our club then?

Honestly this hire the guy Sir Alex is friends with thing HAS to stop. It’s ridiculous at this point. Football moved on from Sir Alex even in 2009 when Barcelona played us off the park.

He never had an answer for that.

Sir Alex wants us to be like Bayern with legends in the back but truth be told those Bayern legends have far bigger personalities and profiles than our hired ‘legends’. The drive to win is not there at our club.

Relying on the advice of a guy super past his best years is just not sufficient when young and hungry forward thinking managers / people are left to collect a pay cheque somewhere else because they don’t have the “United DNA”. It’s farcical.

The truth is there are some great men like Conte. Born winners who are demanding but our club doesn’t want that. Despite the fact all our success was built on that thing with Sir Alex back in the day.

We are a poor tribute act without anything really on the line each season. If we qualify for the CL great hopefully we play a few knockout games etc. That is literally it.

 

[Giggsyking]

Are you criticizing the board that appointed a manager from the Norwegian league with his best English football achievement being the relegation of a Premier league club? We are beyond that level now, we know our board are not that smart footballing wise.

 

[AneRu]

What are Murtough and Fletcher even doing at our club then?

Honestly this hire the guy Sir Alex is friends with thing HAS to stop. It’s ridiculous at this point. Football moved on from Sir Alex even in 2009 when Barcelona played us off the park.

He never had an answer for that.

Sir Alex wants us to be like Bayern with legends in the back but truth be told those Bayern legends have far bigger personalities and profiles than our hired ‘legends’. The drive to win is not there at our club.

Relying on the advice of a guy super past his best years is just not sufficient when young and hungry forward thinking managers / people are left to collect a pay cheque somewhere else because they don’t have the “United DNA”. It’s farcical.

The truth is there are some great men like Conte. Born winners who are demanding but our club doesn’t want that. Despite the fact all our success was built on that thing with Sir Alex back in the day.

We are a poor tribute act without anything really on the line each season. If we qualify for the CL great hopefully we play a few knockout games etc. That is literally it.

I think Sir Alex is conflicted to an extent, Ole is the guy who scored the goal that won him a career defining trophy but to heap it all on Sir Alex is a bit of a stretch. The only reason Woodward and Arnold are listening to him now, that is if they are, is because he is saying something they want to hear as they themselves don't want to make the decision because it makes them look stupid.

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

Yeah it’s baffling. Seems to be just so that we can be the club that’s different and always backs their manager. Some aspects of this club are still stuck in the past.

Strangely it does make sense from the club's perspective. We aren't a special club, we just have had two very special managers in our history.

While Liverpool, Real, Barcelona, Bayern, Juventus, etc. have been successful with a host of different managers and the club is bigger than any one manager. While I can't really say for sure that Manchester United are bigger than Ferguson considering he got us to where we are. Please note I have seen United win only under Fergie.

 

[Member 117152]

Strangely it does make sense from the club's perspective. We aren't a special club, we just have had two very special managers in our history.

While Liverpool, Real, Barcelona, Bayern, Juventus, etc. have been successful with a host of different managers and the club is bigger than any one manager. While I can't really say for sure that Manchester United are bigger than Ferguson considering he got us to where we are. Please note I have seen United win only under Fergie.

You may have hit onto something here.

Let’s be real also that our European record is patchy at best compared to some of our peers in the game.

Then again you could say the same about Juventus arguably the biggest club in Italy so club size doesn’t always amount to major trophies on some fronts.

 

[Abraxas]

Strangely it does make sense from the club's perspective. We aren't a special club, we just have had two very special managers in our history.

While Liverpool, Real, Barcelona, Bayern, Juventus, etc. have been successful with a host of different managers and the club is bigger than any one manager. While I can't really say for sure that Manchester United are bigger than Ferguson considering he got us to where we are. Please note I have seen United win only under Fergie.

But what does it mean to say you aren't sure we are bigger than Ferguson?

I think that might be the wrong phrasing. We'll never be bigger than Ferguson if this equates to the same consistent success as it's not clear how possible that is within the current landscape of football.

But my understanding of size has little to do with the types of management and their reigns. It's much more about revenues, audience, being in a position to succeed on that basis with some historical legacy thrown in. Most managers are transitory figures, I don't think stumbling across a few that bring success will have any wider implications for our size beyond some extra revenue and credit for doing so, it would just be a nice thing.

 

[RazorOz]

I more think this is just mismanagement from the top than them actually writing off seasons. I don't think the board actually sit there in October giving up on the season, they just don't see the bigger picture until too late as there aren't enough football people actually making the decisions.

A lot seems dictated by money, ie. the board don't seem to panic until top 4 is at risk, ie. CL football next season is at risk, when they know it will hit revenues, but by the time you reach that point it's already too late.

The title was never on no matter who was manager, that midfield is crap, but if we lose the next 2 games we're potentially 9 points off top 4, that'll be a big enough task.

A better manager likely wouldn't have let us come into the season with this midfield. Besides the midfield does have a lot of talent, it's just not utilised well.

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

But what does it mean to say you aren't sure we are bigger than Ferguson?

I think that might be the wrong phrasing. We'll never be bigger than Ferguson if this equates to the same consistent success as it's not clear how possible that is within the current landscape of football.

But my understanding of size has little to do with the types of management and their reigns. It's much more about revenues, audience, being in a position to succeed on that basis with some historical legacy thrown in. Most managers are transitory figures, I don't think stumbling across a few that bring success will have any wider implications for our size beyond some extra revenue and credit for doing so, it would just be a nice thing.

Phrasing not great from my end. But essentially our success was due to Ferguson not the club culture or ambition. It was Ferguson who had the winning mentality not the club. While in case of Real, Bayern, Barcelona, etc. it is the club who have the winning culture and the managers are just transitionary figures.

 

[Yagami]

So, with Ole back at training, we've effectively wrote this season off then.

Another trophyless year fighting for top 4 at best.

 

[croadyman]

So, with Ole back at training, we've effectively wrote this season off then.

Another trophyless year fighting for top 4 at best.

The thing that really disappoints me is some of our top players seemingly happy to accept this situation, surely they want a manager in place who can actually coach them properly.

 

[laughtersassassin]

If I was a footballer or a manager and had other options with comparable but worse salarys there is not a chance in the world I'd Join United.

Its been career Suicide since 2013.

Surley at some point it will catch up to us as a club

 

[Skills]

It's obvious the board wrote off this season. At the end of October they decided it was best to just see out the entirety of the season after just 9 games.

 

[arthurka]

It's obvious the board wrote off this season. At the end of October they decided it was best to just see out the entirety of the season after just 9 games.

I agree. At least the wheels are well and truly off and there is nowhere to hide for these posers.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

It's obvious the board wrote off this season. At the end of October they decided it was best to just see out the entirety of the season after just 9 games.

Chelsea got in a world class manager in Tuchel after a similar run to Ole at United, we went for a man that doesn’t even manage anymore. I suppose in the end if we get Ten Hag and he’s great it might be worth it long term but why not Valverde or another actual functional manager.

 

[Dominos]

It's obvious the board wrote off this season. At the end of October they decided it was best to just see out the entirety of the season after just 9 games.

Were we not 2 points off 4th when Ralf was appointed? You think the board didn't think they could get top 4 from this position, with so many games left? The season was obviously still retrievable if the players could be arsed, and we appointed the right manager. Unfortunately it looks like the wrong manager was appointed, and the players are a bunch of sulking whingebags.

I think ultimately the club overestimated the quality of the squad, and overestimated the quality of Ralf's coaching. We should have shown more urgency in the January transfer window, though I suppose it's possible there was just no realistic quality available. And the choice of interim manager was always going to be a bit of a lottery as you don't know who's going to get the best out of the team until you've seen them work with the team. Of the 5 possible interims we reportedly interviewed at the time, it's hard to imagine any of them could have done worse in terms of results and performances. But as I said, benefit of hindsight.

I've read people suggest we appointed Ralf knowing he'd fail miserably as manager but we'd benefit down the road from his behind the scenes work, which is just absurd. We brought him in to rescue top 4 and thought he had as much chance as achieving that as anyone else, and he had the added bonus of working behind the scenes after.