Tanguy Ndombele | Signed For Spurs

[RooneyLegend]

I don't know if it is my problem but I was reviewing the first half vs Barcelona and looking into the particular context of that game imo from the 11 Lyon players during the match maybe only Lopes had a better game than him.

I mean even looking into some individual stats he had like dribbles, only Messi had a better share of dribble success.

Not saying he should be signed here, just refuting some mind boggling things I read on this topic like he wasn't impressive at all when they were playing against a better team.

It's crazy talk especially with some claiming Aouar was better. A player who went into hiding the moment he lost the ball once. Ndombele was the sole reason the could even move up the pitch the whole first half. His ball retention under pressure was nothing short of amazing. In the second Lyon were basically holding on for dear life and no one did much.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Clearly that isn't enough. He's clearly a better passer than Kante

That isn't high praise though. We need someone with 5 times the passing quality of Kante.

 

[SCP]

It's crazy talk especially with some claiming Aouar was better. A player who went into hiding the moment he lost the ball once. Ndombele was the sole reason the could even move up the pitch the whole first half. His ball retention under pressure was nothing short of amazing. In the second Lyon were basically holding on for dear life and no one did much.

Only mentioned this because someone said he was far from being impressive without looking at the context of the game.

 

[kouroux]

That isn't high praise though. We need someone with 5 times the passing quality of Kante.

I'd honestly even be fine with someone who can pass it like Kante, he doesn't lose many balls anyway.

 

[roonster09]

I'd honestly even be fine with someone who can pass it like Kante, he doesn't lose many balls anyway.

From the performance video vs Barca and one more team (I think City), it looks like he is good enough passer. Keeps it on ground and tries to pass between the lines. Looks very interesting player, no wonder he is linked with so many big clubs

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I'd honestly even be fine with someone who can pass it like Kante, he doesn't lose many balls anyway.

So you don't think a proper playmaking CM should be a priority?

 

[MikeKing]

So you don't think a proper playmaking CM should be a priority?

Longterm yes. Aren't we fine in that regard currently with Matic still a couple of years in him and Garner coming through? Our best attackers seems to benefit most from having this style we're having of pressing, then counter-attacking. Notice how Liverpool are focusing on having dynamic midfielders that are press resilient, it works for them. They struggle a bit against a parked bus like most teams, but we have Pogba for that. Maybe a proper playmaking CM could be beneficial for next season, but I'm not sure about priority. How many dynamic playmakers are there with a bit of bite defensively? We do have time now to go find the right player, but not a reason to not go and replace Fred/Fellaini while waiting.

 

[NoPace]

Watched him closely against Barca. Very press resistant, hit a lot of nice, hard low passes forward and he can dribble well in a ball retentive way, has that Scott Parker spin thing down. Closer to Matic than Herrera in terms of quality on the ball and I would guess he'll exceed Matic by his mid20s, so that's a fine midfield player right there.

But defensively, he looked below average to me. Didn't sniff out danger well or fly to the ball when he could have, didn't seem to understand that Messi on the ball in the D can't happen.

Busquets was fantastic, best midfielder on the pitch by a mile overall.

 

[JPRouve]

Watched him closely against Barca. Very press resistant, hit a lot of nice, hard low passes forward and he can dribble well in a ball retentive way, has that Scott Parker spin thing down. Closer to Matic than Herrera in terms of quality on the ball and I would guess he'll exceed Matic by his mid20s, so that's a fine midfield player right there.

But defensively, he looked below average to me. Didn't sniff out danger well or fly to the ball when he could have, didn't seem to understand that Messi on the ball in the D can't happen.

Busquets was fantastic, best midfielder on the pitch by a mile overall.

Bear in mind that while he is playing deeper at the moment, he isn't/wasn't a defensive player. The comparisons with Busquets and Matic are in my opinion misguided. This video is closer to what he is as a player when in form:

 

[kouroux]

So you don't think a proper playmaking CM should be a priority?

I'd see it as a bonus, don't get me wrong I would love it as if we can find a midfielder likd that but since they are so rare and expensive, a competent midfielder to participate in the rotation or challenge the starters would be great. We are very thin in quality in the middle.

 

[roonster09]

I'd see it as a bonus, don't get me wrong I would love it as if we can find a midfielder likd that but since they are so rare and expensive, a competent midfielder to participate in the rotation or challenge the starters would be great. We are very thin in quality in the middle.

Do you think he can play alongside Pogba and Herrera/Matic? I mean what is the role he is more suited to if he plays alongside Pogba?

Edit: @JPRouve same question, interested to see your answer to this.

 

[kouroux]

Do you think he can play alongside Pogba and Herrera/Matic? I mean what is the role he is more suited to if he plays alongside Pogba?

Edit: @JPRouve same question, interested to see your answer to this.

He could replace Herrera, he could replace Matic which would make Herrera go in Matic's role or he could play the Matic role even in "easier" games.
It would make resting Matic or Herrera a real possibility which is a luxury that we cannot afford right afford right one.
Yaya started as a 10 earlier in his career then became a DM for Barca and then he changed his role again at City.
Midfielders can adapt IMHO, as long as they have important elements to their game (technique, passing, strength etc etc)

 

[roonster09]

He could replace Herrera, he could replace Matic which would make Herrera go in Matic's role or he could play the Matic role even in "easier" games.
It would make resting Matic or Herrera a real possibility which is a luxury that we cannot afford right afford right one.

Thanks, that sounds interesting. This is something I want us to address, sign one more quality midfielder so that Herrera can move to Matic's position and we will have more options.

 

[JPRouve]

Do you think he can play alongside Pogba and Herrera/Matic? I mean what is the role he is more suited to if he plays alongside Pogba?

Edit: @JPRouve same question, interested to see your answer to this.

I share Kouroux's opinion, today ideally he plays the role played by Herrera but brings more percussion and probably less defensive nous, Herrera can play behind them which in theory gives us a dynamic midfield. The thing about Ndombélé is that I believe that he has the tools to be closer to Verratti in terms of style, there is no guarantee that he will do it but he has the tools, he needs to be more aggressive in defense and sometimes pass the ball faster.
Also I think that we need two midfielders, so to me it doesn't matter all that much which type we get first(b2b or DLP), we need to anticipate the potential decline of players entering their 30s from that point you don't really know when a player falls off the cliff and we need numbers anyway.

 

[roonster09]

I share Kouroux's opinion, today ideally he plays the role played by Herrera but brings more percussion and probably less defensive nous, Herrera can play behind them which in theory gives us a dynamic midfield. The thing about Ndombélé is that I believe that he has the tools to be closer to Verratti in terms of style, there is no guarantee that he will do it but he has the tools, he needs to be more aggressive in defense and sometimes pass the ball faster.
Also I think that we need two midfielders, so to me it doesn't matter all that much which type we get first(b2b or DLP), we need to anticipate the potential decline of players entering their 30s from that point you don't really know when a player falls off the cliff and we need numbers anyway.

Agree with the bold part. Transition should be smooth, we have Matic and Herrera who will be 30 or older, so we should sign young players who can take time to adapt.

Btw I like what I read about this player. Hopefully we go for him and Rabiot. Should settle our midfielder for few years. Enough quality and depth.

 

[kouroux]

I share Kouroux's opinion, today ideally he plays the role played by Herrera but brings more percussion and probably less defensive nous, Herrera can play behind them which in theory gives us a dynamic midfield. The thing about Ndombélé is that I believe that he has the tools to be closer to Verratti in terms of style, there is no guarantee that he will do it but he has the tools, he needs to be more aggressive in defense and sometimes pass the ball faster.
Also I think that we need two midfielders, so to me it doesn't matter all that much which type we get first(b2b or DLP), we need to anticipate the potential decline of players entering their 30s from that point you don't really know when a player falls off the cliff and we need numbers anyway.

Hopefully one of those CMs is Fred but I'm not too hopeful.

 

[JPRouve]

Hopefully one of those CMs is Fred but I'm not too hopeful.

Today I see him as the sixth man, Pogba's deputy. I don't expect Pogba to miss a lot of games but when he does Fred should probably be the one playing his role.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I'd see it as a bonus, don't get me wrong I would love it as if we can find a midfielder likd that but since they are so rare and expensive, a competent midfielder to participate in the rotation or challenge the starters would be great. We are very thin in quality in the middle.

I really feel we need one. We've got somebody to breaks play up in Matic and a terrier in Herrera. Pogba is our creative force. But there's nobody in that squad who can dictate a football match. They are rare I suppose but we need to catch them early IMO. Neves would be expensive but available. Others like Aouar, Barella, that Pirlo lookalike etc I don't know enough about whoever catches them early will reap the rewards for years

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I'd see it as a bonus, don't get me wrong I would love it as if we can find a midfielder likd that but since they are so rare and expensive, a competent midfielder to participate in the rotation or challenge the starters would be great. We are very thin in quality in the middle.

I really feel we need one. We've got somebody to breaks play up in Matic and a terrier in Herrera. Pogba is our creative force. But there's nobody in that squad who can dictate a football match. They are rare I suppose but we need to catch them early IMO. Neves would be expensive but available. Others like Aouar, Barella, that Pirlo lookalike etc I don't know enough about whoever catches them early will reap the rewards for years

 

[JPRouve]

I really feel we need one. We've got somebody to breaks play up in Matic and a terrier in Herrera. Pogba is our creative force. But there's nobody in that squad who can dictate a football match. They are rare I suppose but we need to catch them early IMO. Neves would be expensive but available. Others like Aouar, Barella, that Pirlo lookalike etc I don't know enough about whoever catches them early will reap the rewards for years

Aouar doesn't control games though, there is little difference between him and Ndombélé and currently he is probably better higher up the pitch. In general young players aren't good at it and people try to force that trait on them.

 

[Cassidy]

I really feel we need one. We've got somebody to breaks play up in Matic and a terrier in Herrera. Pogba is our creative force. But there's nobody in that squad who can dictate a football match. They are rare I suppose but we need to catch them early IMO. Neves would be expensive but available. Others like Aouar, Barella, that Pirlo lookalike etc I don't know enough about whoever catches them early will reap the rewards for years

Was evident vs PSG that we need someone to control the tempo at times and manage the game

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Was evident vs PSG that we need someone to control the tempo at times and manage the game

Absolutely.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Aouar doesn't control games though, there is little difference between him and Ndombélé and currently he is probably better higher up the pitch. In general young players aren't good at it and people try to force that trait on them.

Then not Aour either.

You're correct that young players tend not be great at it although with the likes of Fabregas and Xavi it was clear that they could. But not more importantly if we're buying young they should have the potential for it. I think a gifted passer tends to be a very good passer even at a young age, albiet maybe a more inconsistent/impatient/ rash version at a younger age.

 

[kouroux]

Aouar doesn't control games though, there is little difference between him and Ndombélé and currently he is probably better higher up the pitch. In general young players aren't good at it and people try to force that trait on them.

This cannot be stressed enough. Unless you're a special talent, this aspect of the game often requires years of experience.

 

[JPRouve]

Then not Aour either.

You're correct that young players tend not be great at it although with the likes of Fabregas and Xavi it was clear that they could. But not more importantly if we're buying young they should have the potential for it. I think a gifted passer tends to be a very good passer even at a young age, albiet maybe a more inconsistent/impatient/ rash version at a younger age.

And the player that you describe fits with both Ndombélé and Aouar, that's the reason their partnership isn't actually bad despite their lack of control. From a technical standpoint they are generally better or as good as the opposition which means that you always have to respect the fact that they are one dribble or one pass away from eliminating your entire midfield and Ndombélé can physically wreck your midfield when he is in the mood.

But about your point, I don't disagree with the idea that we need a game manager, in fact I totally agree where I disagree is with the idea of forcing a profile when we need more than one and that we don't have the ideal player in sight. If someone like Verratti is available than I would sacrifice the transfer budget for him but we shouldn't do it if we don't have that type of player in exchange, we need to be methodical, our star players are young, they are going nowhere and we need to build an actual great team around them.

And I forgot to mention that the way we currently play doesn't require a game manager, it requires mobile players with great technique, adding a game manager would require an alteration of our game which isn't a bad thing but also means that it's not actually a priority when you badly need numbers.

 

[Rocknrolla69er]

Looks a more dynamic , more physical , quicker option than Herrera. I definatly think he’d be an upgrade, taking nothing away from Herrera. He looks quite a handful and very energetic, any idea how much he’s valued at or if he has a release clause?

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Was evident vs PSG that we need someone to control the tempo at times and manage the game

What actually killed us vs PSG was Pogba, our only center midfielder with attacking creativity was marked out of the game

 

[luke511]

Pogba Ndombele
Herrera
​

Would this work? I reckon it would.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

And the player that you describe fits with both Ndombélé and Aouar, that's the reason their partnership isn't actually bad despite their lack of control. From a technical standpoint they are generally better or as good as the opposition which means that you always have to respect the fact that they are one dribble or one pass away from eliminating your entire midfield and Ndombélé can physically wreck your midfield when he is in the mood.

But about your point, I don't disagree with the idea that we need a game manager, in fact I totally agree where I disagree is with the idea of forcing a profile when we need more than one and that we don't have the ideal player in sight. If someone like Verratti is available than I would sacrifice the transfer budget for him but we shouldn't do it if we don't have that type of player in exchange, we need to be methodical, our star players are young, they are going nowhere and we need to build an actual great team around them.

And I forgot to mention that the way we currently play doesn't require a game manager, it requires mobile players with great technique, adding a game manager would require an alteration of our game which isn't a bad thing but also means that it's not actually a priority when you badly need numbers.

The question to be asked is, dont mobile, quick game managers exist out there. In the mould of a KDB for example.....

 

[JJ12]

He looks strong and powerful but I don't think his dribbling would work so much in the prem. It's hardly close control and almost kick and run for lack of a better phrase. Not sure he'd get away with that in the middle of the park in this league.

I must add that's going off the above YouTube video.

 

[JPRouve]

The question to be asked is, dont mobile, quick game managers exist out there. In the mould of a KDB for example.....

Outside of Verratti I struggle to find anyone. Someone like Arthur seems to have the tools but he isn't doing it yet.

 

[Patrick08]

Outside of Verratti I struggle to find anyone. Someone like Arthur seems to have the tools but he isn't doing it yet.

How's that kid Tilemans doing?

 

[JPRouve]

How's that kid Tilemans doing?

At Leicester? I don't know. In France, he wasn't good.

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

The question to be asked is, dont mobile, quick game managers exist out there. In the mould of a KDB for example.....

Can neves not be one - the guy looks like he is 30 but still young & can develop in to that can't he?

 

[Inigo Montoya]

At Leicester? I don't know. In France, he wasn't good.

He looked ok in the recent game but hasn't had enough time to show the promise he had at Anderlecht

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Can neves not be one - the guy looks like he is 30 but still young & can develop in to that can't he?

I think so too. He always reminds me of Carrick with some extra pace

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Personally, I agree with JPRouve that our new style doesn't really need a game controller. Right now we lack a second player who can do what Pogba does. We suffered vs PSG because we had only one. I know no team that would be able to mark 2 in midfield. That is why I like the idea of targeting an Ndombele type. He has better defensive balance and a bit more defensive orientation than a Pogba but he still has sufficient creative skill going forward. With the size, pace and skill to back it up

I also think its essential we replace a Mata with a Joao Felix/Bernardo Silva type of player. A quick mobile, hard working 10 who can also comfortably operate out wide. To make the options for the diamond we employ from time to time more potent

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Pogba Ndombele
Herrera
​

Would this work? I reckon it would.

Hell yes it would

 

[andersj]

Personally, I agree with JPRouve that our new style doesn't really need a game controller. Right now we lack a second player who can do what Pogba does. We suffered vs PSG because we had only one. I know no team that would be able to mark 2 in midfield. That is why I like the idea of targeting an Ndombele type. He has better defensive balance and a bit more defensive orientation than a Pogba but he still has sufficient creative skill going forward. With the size, pace and skill to back it up

I also think its essential we replace a Mata with a Joao Felix/Bernardo Silva type of player. A quick mobile, hard working 10 who can also comfortably operate out wide. To make the options for the diamond we employ from time to time more potent

I agree that we could need one more Pogba. But I think I would prefer that player to be Kai Havertz.

 

[kouroux]

He looks strong and powerful but I don't think his dribbling would work so much in the prem. It's hardly close control and almost kick and run for lack of a better phrase. Not sure he'd get away with that in the middle of the park in this league.

I must add that's going off the above YouTube video.

Yaya worked well in the PL, NDombele is a little similar to him.