Surveillance Draft - R1- Physiocrat vs mazhar13/Enigma_87

Who would win?

  • Total voters
    33
  • Poll closed .

green_smiley

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Physiocrat

Tactics

4231 out of possession, 3232 in possession
Defensive Line Moderate/High
Moderate/High risk possession team (possession with a purpose) stretching the play both laterally and vertically.

Player Name - Player Position - Player Role

Oliver Kahn - Goalkeeper - Stop the opposition from scoring
Thiago Silva - Centre Back - Ball Playing CB/ Covering Defender
Sol Campbell - Centre Back - Stopper
Lilian Thuram - Right Back - Defensive
Serginho - Left Back - Attacking
Daniele De Rossi - Defensive Midfielder - Holding and Destroying Midfielder
Luka Modric - Central Midfielder – Creative CM
Juan Roman Riquelme - Attacking Midfielder – Classic No.10 Playmaker
Andrei Kanchelskis - Right Wing – Classic Winger
Beppe Signori - Left Wing – Inside Left
Ruud van Nistelrooy - Centre Forward – Cultured Target Man

NB. Since Sol Campbell is captain I'm guaranteed a monstrous performance and no accusations of racism.

Physio-67-87-formation-tactics.png
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Team Mazhar/Enigma:

GK: Stefan Klos - complete GK- won the CL in 97 with Dortmund, 2 Bundesligas, 4 Scottish titles and is probably the best Rangers keeper along with Goram. Not the flashiest goalkeeper but a reliable and strong one that gave everyone in front of him confidence and cool heads.

LB: 6. Gianluca Pessotto - balanced-attacking . One of the most under-rated defenders of his generation, Pessotto rarely made the headlines in the press but he was a fine full back, with the versatility to play on the right or left of defence and midfield. A very dogged marker, who held the defensive line, Pessotto may not have been the most gifted technically, but it is difficult to think of many occasions when the current Juve team manager was beaten by his man. Many world class wingers failed to go past Pessotto.

CB: 2. Marcel Desailly - Stopper - marker. "The rock" in his solid and dominant CB role. No need for introduction, one of the very best CB's in the draft.

CB: 12. Christian Worns: Sweeper/complete defender. Excellent defender and one of the notable ones that came from Germany in the last 20 years. Commanding, cool under pressure and of course solid defensively are some of his traits that he showed during his close to 20 years in Germany for both Dortmund and Leverkusen.

Right Back: 15. Javier Zanetti - Offensive. One of the most balanced right backs in the game - both offensively and defensively he has a case of being one of the very best at his position.

Holding Midfielder: 19. Phillip Cocu - very versatile player, that can play everywhere on the pitch - be a defensive midfielder, or run the play as a playmaker, a winger, a central defender, even as a forward. He was a midfield general who was integral part in Barcelona's La Liga winning campaign in 98/99.

Central Midfielder: 41. Arturo Vidal- Box to Box. One of the most complete midfielders in recent time. At his peak Vidal could do it all - pass, score important goals, and bring steel to any midfield.

Attacking RCM: 27. David Silva. One of the most influential players for City recently and the Spanish team. Creative, skillful, eye for the pass he'll be in his favorite free playmaker role with license to roam around.

Left Winger: 31. Ryan Giggs. Fast, skillful and capable of providing tons of assist setting up our forwards, but also able to finish chances by himself. Giggs will occupy his favorite left wing position supported by Pessotto.

Second Striker: 37. Raul - Real Madrid legend, one of the best Real and Spanish players of all time. He'll provide clinical finishing, linking up with Sheva in the attack and playing off him swapping positions.

Complete forward: 39. Andriy Shevchenko: Goalscorer. One of the best and versatile forwards in the past 20 years. He'll link up with Raul, stretch up the play when dropping into channels and of course score goals.

Tactical layout
4-3-3 to 4-2-3-1 - lopsided. Formation will change shape occasionally depending with/without the ball and Silva/Sheva roaming forward.
Normal defensive line, fast direct tempo, look for openings and set the stage for our attacking duo Sheva/Raul.
Solid and rugged defence, two complete midfielders, excellent flanks who can provide support to the attack.
Pace, interchangeability in attack - unpredictable on the flanks and through the middle

Defence - We have two solid defenders who match very well to RvN/Signori style. Zanetti/Pessotto are excellent defensively and will limit Physio opportunities wide that probably Signori or Kanchelskis can provide.
Midfield - Cocu and Vidal are complete as it gets. Our midfield doesn't lack steel, tactical flexibility or skill on the ball. Cocu would be a good fit to keep an eye on Riquelme with Vidal's energy being a good counter both Modric and the Argentinian playmaker strengths. We have also David Silva with his high work rate giving us boost in midfield in the defensive phase.
Attack - lot of variety - two proven goalscorers in Raul and Sheva, options on the flanks with Giggs/Pessotto on the left and Zanetti, Silva on the right.
 
Last edited:
Poll added. Let me know if you want any of the settings changed.
 
Won't be voting in this one for now, has a draw written all over it.
 
The way I see it I'll have more of the ball and I see my left flank as a way to goal. Silva doesn't help much defensively an with Serginho overlapping Signori that will cause problems even for Zanetti. Sure Desially can shift over but that gives Ruud more room- he was not a big lump, he had excellent movement and decent place at his peak. He will certainly cause Worns a problem. Remember Ruud scored 95 goals in 150 games for United despite lining up with Kleberson et al.

He will also get good service from Kanchelskis who will be a complete handful for Pessotto. Lest we forget Riquelme- Cocu is a decent DM but is hardly going to keep him quiet all game when he has options across the whole pitch. As you can see I have all five lateral spaces covered in attack giving Riquelme ample options to pick that pass and Ruud will score.

Not also I have by far the best goalkeeper on the pitch. Stefan Klos is decent but isn't going to pull of those spectacular saves he needs to keep me out
 
green_smiley said:
Could you please enable the option "Allow voters to change their votes" @jojojo
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Changed.

Physiocrat said:
@jojojo

Could you please make votes publically viewable?
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Hmmm. Looks like I can't now the poll is underway. I can delete the poll and have another go at it, but that will discard any existing votes.

What do you guys think?

Sorry about this chaps. I'll try and remember your preferred settings in case anyone's daft enough to ask me to set up a draft vote again :lol:
 
jojojo said:
Changed.



Hmmm. Looks like I can't now the poll is underway. I can delete the poll and have another go at it, but that will discard any existing votes.

What do you guys think?

Sorry about this chaps. I'll try and remember your preferred settings in case anyone's daft enough to ask me to set up a draft vote again :lol:
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Don't know how the votes are now, but it should be okay to delete and change since the game is still early
 
Physiocrat said:
The way I see it I'll have more of the ball and I see my left flank as a way to goal. Silva doesn't help much defensively an with Serginho overlapping Signori that will cause problems even for Zanetti. Sure Desially can shift over but that gives Ruud more room- he was not a big lump, he had excellent movement and decent place at his peak. He will certainly cause Worns a problem. Remember Ruud scored 95 goals in 150 games for United despite lining up with Kleberson et al.

He will also get good service from Kanchelskis who will be a complete handful for Pessotto. Lest we forget Riquelme- Cocu is a decent DM but is hardly going to keep him quiet all game when he has options across the whole pitch. As you can see I have all five lateral spaces covered in attack giving Riquelme ample options to pick that pass and Ruud will score.

Not also I have by far the best goalkeeper on the pitch. Stefan Klos is decent but isn't going to pull of those spectacular saves he needs to keep me out
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Couple of points first. Signori is more of a inside left and second striker than a proper winger. He didn't relish being one and that was the reason he was left out for the final in the 94 WC:

The incredible thing, however, was that Sacchi played him on the left-wing, after finishing as the top scorer in Italian football two seasons running. Despite being played out of position, Signori played very well during the tournament providing two crucial assists – including Roberto Baggio’s winner against Spain that saw Italy reach the semi-final. Unfortunately for Signori, a bust-up with Sacchi following Italy’s win over Bulgaria saw him dropped from the World Cup Final against Brazil. Annoyed at constantly being played out of position, his protests meant that he didn’t even make the bench, and had to watch as his side lost on penalties.
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Desailly is by far the best CB on the pitch and is a nice fit for RvN both in his movement and physically.

There's another point in relation to the midfield. Modric is obviously quality but David Silva running around and offering support we will have an extra man in the center as Riquelme will offer none of this as we know due to his lazy style.

This is imo important since Physio plan is based on possession and I can't see Riquelme harassing our midfield or defenders or pressing them to get the ball back.
 
jojojo said:
Changed.



Hmmm. Looks like I can't now the poll is underway. I can delete the poll and have another go at it, but that will discard any existing votes.

What do you guys think?

Sorry about this chaps. I'll try and remember your preferred settings in case anyone's daft enough to ask me to set up a draft vote again :lol:
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I'd keep the poll. We can work out how many manager votes there were later
 
Don't remember much of Wörns tbf, he always seemed injured on big international tournaments.

Vidal's energy is going to massively limit Riquelme, while I don't rate De Rossi to deal with Silva/Raul running between the lines.
 
harms said:
Don't remember much of Wörns tbf, he always seemed injured on big international tournaments.

Vidal's energy is going to massively limit Riquelme, while I don't rate De Rossi to deal with Silva/Raul running between the lines.
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Aye Cocu is pretty energetic as well and tactically and positionally very smart. I think both can limit Physio creativity options while Silva/Raul and Sheva will cause all sorts of problems with their movement up front.

Worns missed most of the big tournaments due to injury that's true, but IMO he was one of the best CB's (could play as a sweeper or stopper) at the time in Germany. He was excellent in the 98 WC but a red card in the QF against Croatia(?I think) was really unfortunate in terms of praise at that stage.

He's a good fit for Desailly - he's a commanding CB with very good reading of the game and positional sense. Despite the injuries missing some of the biggest tournaments he still won 66 caps for some excellent German sides during those years.
 
Enigma_87 said:
Couple of points first. Signori is more of a inside left and second striker than a proper winger. He didn't relish being one and that was the reason he was left out for the final in the 94 WC:
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He's only on the left wing out of possession- he's not playing as a left winger. In it he's an inside left/second-striker. With the ball I'll have a front five like this:

--------------Signori--------RVN-----------
Serginho-------Riquelme--------Kanchelskis

Enigma_87 said:
Desailly is by far the best CB on the pitch and is a nice fit for RvN both in his movement and physically.
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I think that's debatable. Desially was at his best really as a pure DM at Milan. Good defender no doubt but is he really by far better than Sol or Silva? That's an overstatement. Also Desially is on Signori's side where more pace than physicality would be helpful.

Enigma_87 said:
There's another point in relation to the midfield. Modric is obviously quality but David Silva running around and offering support we will have an extra man in the center as Riquelme will offer none of this as we know due to his lazy style.
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That's only important when I'm out of possession and I'm not that impressed with Silva's work rate.

Enigma_87 said:
This is imo important since Physio plan is based on possession and I can't see Riquelme harassing our midfield or defenders or pressing them to get the ball back.
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True, he won't but the whole cast around him will put a proper shift in. Also my back 5 is absolutely rock solid and Serginho has pace and stamina in abundance and will hare back to defend.

Also I'm a huge fan of Giggs but I don't see him getting much joy from Thuram. BTW which Giggs is this?
 
harms said:
Don't remember much of Wörns tbf, he always seemed injured on big international tournaments.

Vidal's energy is going to massively limit Riquelme, while I don't rate De Rossi to deal with Silva/Raul running between the lines.
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Don't forget Modric. If Enigma sits deeper which Vidal on Riquelme all game allows Modric to pull strings from deeper with a huge array of options further forward. Also I don't think Vidal can shut Riquelme out of the game- his close control and ball control can get him out of tight spaces to then release Beppe and RVN with a penetrating pass to finish. Also Vidal is one of the most overrated players I've seen for a long time- a poor man's Roy Keane. I think he's rated as he is because of the lack of genuine box-to-box players these days.

De Rossi is a terrier as well as having excellent positional sense (you have to when playing sweeper). With the help of Modric who is hardly poor defensively we can reduce the chances.

Note also that all my back four are pretty rapid, of particular importance are Sol and Silva when we consider Shevchenko's major asset was his pace- he was a pale imitation of himself when his pace went at Chelsea. As such we can limit his influence. As will Oliver Kahn who is clearly the best keeper on the pitch.
 
Physiocrat said:
He's only on the left wing out of possession- he's not playing as a left winger. In it he's an inside left/second-striker. With the ball I'll have a front five like this:

--------------Signori--------RVN-----------
Serginho-------Riquelme--------Kanchelskis
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I see. From the formation and tactics he's specified as a left wing, that's why I mentioned it. I'm not sure if he'll track back often and support the full back in a 4-2-3-1 on that left wing as well.

Physiocrat said:
I think that's debatable. Desially was at his best really as a pure DM at Milan. Good defender no doubt but is he really by far better than Sol or Silva? That's an overstatement. Also Desially is on Signori's side where more pace than physicality would be helpful.
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Desailly is a WC and EURO winner with France as a pure CB, I don't think either Sol or Silva come with those credentials. Personally to me he's at least a level above both of them.


Physiocrat said:
That's only important when I'm out of possession and I'm not that impressed with Silva's work rate.
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City play usually with one holding midfielder in Fernandinho, I think it's worth mentioning especially when Riquelme offers practically nothing in that respect on the other side. Vidal and Cocu energy will be tough to deal for Modric/ De Rossi who will have to control that midfield in order to play in accordance to the gameplan.

Physiocrat said:
True, he won't but the whole cast around him will put a proper shift in. Also my back 5 is absolutely rock solid and Serginho has pace and stamina in abundance and will hare back to defend.

Also I'm a huge fan of Giggs but I don't see him getting much joy from Thuram. BTW which Giggs is this?
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Kanchelskis is one that really impressed me at the time with his dribbling and shooting but at United I thought he was more of a free role winger(correct me if I'm wrong). I don't think Beppe would cover for the full back as well, it wasn't his game at his peak. When he drops wide he'll be up against Zanetti and he can shut him down as he's a good fit for his style.

Giggs will be playing at his peak left winger role if that's what you mean not the central player and occasional winger in his mid 30's.
 
Physiocrat said:
Don't forget Modric. If Enigma sits deeper which Vidal on Riquelme all game allows Modric to pull strings from deeper with a huge array of options further forward. Also I don't think Vidal can shut Riquelme out of the game- his close control and ball control can get him out of tight spaces to then release Beppe and RVN with a penetrating pass to finish. Also Vidal is one of the most overrated players I've seen for a long time- a poor man's Roy Keane. I think he's rated as he is because of the lack of genuine box-to-box players these days.

De Rossi is a terrier as well as having excellent positional sense (you have to when playing sweeper). With the help of Modric who is hardly poor defensively we can reduce the chances.

Note also that all my back four are pretty rapid, of particular importance are Sol and Silva when we consider Shevchenko's major asset was his pace- he was a pale imitation of himself when his pace went at Chelsea. As such we can limit his influence. As will Oliver Kahn who is clearly the best keeper on the pitch.
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Our gameplan is not sitting deep, we're playing a normal defensive line and we'll use Vidal, Cocu, Silva energy to get the ball back when out of possession.

I think you're being well harsh on Vidal. He's couple of levels above De Rossi to say at least, who I don't rate particularly high myself.

Sheva at Chelsea was a pale imitation alright but here's the peak Sheva who was Seria A top goalscorer twice in some of the best era in terms of defences and won Ballon D'or.

Both he and Raul are one of the most clinical finishers and best goalscorers in Europe as well.
 
I don't rate Desailly higher as a CB than Silva or Sol. I'd put Campbell as a better Premier League centre-half for sure. And Thiago Silva was the best centre-half around post-Rio / pre-Godin.

What's the thinking behind the left-footed Cocu on the right and the right-footed Vidal on the left?
 
Enigma_87 said:
I see. From the formation and tactics he's specified as a left wing, that's why I mentioned it. I'm not sure if he'll track back often and support the full back in a 4-2-3-1 on that left wing as well.
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He played left wing in a 442 for a hard working Sacchi team. He's more than capable of putting a shift in. The key difference here is he has the freedom to cut in and score goals. Also since I'll have more of the ball he'll be mostly central anyway where he will cause serious problems. He was regularly the top scorer, or thereabouts, in the mid 90s when the defending quality was better than when Shevchenko was playing.

Enigma_87 said:
City play usually with one holding midfielder in Fernandinho, I think it's worth mentioning especially when Riquelme offers practically nothing in that respect on the other side. Vidal and Cocu energy will be tough to deal for Modric/ De Rossi who will have to control that midfield in order to play in accordance to the gameplan.
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Silva works in a pressing cog machine of Pep's. I'm more dubious of how he'd work in your set up.

Sure Vidal and Cocu can harry but both Modric and De Rossi are excellent in possession.

Enigma_87 said:
Kanchelskis is one that really impressed me at the time with his dribbling and shooting but at United I thought he was more of a free role winger(correct me if I'm wrong).
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He wasn't Sir Stan but he stayed wider right than someone like Best would. I'll try and get some vids up later. He can certainly own the right flank on his own. Also Kanchelskis will get more joy out of Pessotto than Giggs will with Thuram.
 
Enigma_87 said:
I think you're being well harsh on Vidal. He's couple of levels above De Rossi to say at least, who I don't rate particularly high myself.
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The key difference is De Rossi isn't tasked with stifling a brilliant number 10.
 
One more thing before I head off to work. Shevchenko was best as a second-striker when he could pull deep and use his dribbling and pace. Playing him alongside Raul is sub-optimal as he'll have his back to goal quite a bit.
 
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