How about it? A minute at the end of each game is bollox, he's never gonna get a goal playing as a last minute sub. I'd be interested to know how many minutes on the pitch he's actually played in those 20 odd appearances he's had. Nothing against Ole here, in fact why not rotate him with Ruud too, but Diego needs some starts I feel.
Start Diego with Ruud and bring on Ole after 65 mins
- Thread starter Dans
- Start date
The fact that forlan never starts is because fergie doesn't trust him.
simple as that.
Which makes one wonder why we shelled out 7.5 million on a striker who play for a few minutes a game.
simple as that.
Which makes one wonder why we shelled out 7.5 million on a striker who play for a few minutes a game.
I think the difference between the playing style of United and of a SA team is too big. I don't know how can Forlan be called as a striker in SA as he didn't look like a striker by all means after watching the games he played for us so far. (May be they just have another completely different defintion for a "Striker" in America!) I afraid that it will take Forlan "serveral years" to learn to become a "true striker" in European's sense. We haven't bought any player directly from SA before (correct me if i'm wrong), so this is another lesson learnt by us: buy SA players ONLY for "future use". Don't expect they can be useful immediately.
Fergie has stated time and time again that he expects Forlan to come good at United. He's put a lot of faith in Deigo, I'm sure the chances will keep coming for him. I don't have a problem with that, as Frank Stapleton has rightly pointed out this morning, it's a whole new culture. Diego is probably still in awe of being at a club this size. Not scoring has dented his confidence, once that goal comes, I expect Diego to come good too.
I agree with Dans. Diego should be given more oppotunities from the start, especially against the 'lesser' teams.
I agree with Dans. Diego should be given more oppotunities from the start, especially against the 'lesser' teams.
SAF will stick by him, no doubt.
5 or 10 minutes at the end of a game is no good to anyone. Give him two games in the reserves then a full half. It would get him some match practice and hopefully confidence.
It would mean playing a couple of games with no striker on the bench, but we'd still have options with Giggs and Veron able to push forward to support RVN.
5 or 10 minutes at the end of a game is no good to anyone. Give him two games in the reserves then a full half. It would get him some match practice and hopefully confidence.
It would mean playing a couple of games with no striker on the bench, but we'd still have options with Giggs and Veron able to push forward to support RVN.
I was hoping to see Ruud and him upfront last weekend. 
Sooner or later, when Ole or Ruud is not fit to play, he has to start. Why not now?
Sooner or later, when Ole or Ruud is not fit to play, he has to start. Why not now?
Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>
As for Olle as a sub, i have to agree. Livvie will do her nut and point out how few goals he has scored as a sub etc but imo you cant beat Olle coming off the bench to change a game, hes the worlds best at it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I agree.
I've never said he isn't the best sub. we have - just that it isn't fair for him to be recognised as only a sub.
When Ole starts and we have problems, it's very demoralising that we haven't got him to bring on -he lifts the team.
Having said that, I don't know how he would react to such a role as it is demeaning to be called a super-sub. and can't do much for your confidence, especially as his record isn't actually that good. He'd be more of a psychological boost than anything else.
doesn't he need to play over 75% of matches when fit to retain a work permit at the end of the contract/year??????
what is the score with foreigners on a work permit, what's the % of games they need to play and when is the work permit reviewed???
if they get injured does it still count, or has forlan got an EU passport????? (if yes, how)????? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
what is the score with foreigners on a work permit, what's the % of games they need to play and when is the work permit reviewed???
if they get injured does it still count, or has forlan got an EU passport????? (if yes, how)????? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
I should think he's not far off the 75% mark if not surpassing it with all these one minute appearances he keeps making.
Forlan has an Italian passport:
Monday, January 21, 2002
Diego Forlan is having his medical with Manchester United today before completing his £6.9million move from Independiente.
United have completed the paper work of the deal and checked the details of the Uruguayan striker's Italian passport.
Forlan, 22, who watched United's 2-1 win over Blackburn at Old Trafford on Saturday, should become a United player inside the next 24 hours.
United manager Sir Alex Ferguson said on MUTV: 'Everything is agreed. His passport details have been checked and he should be registered by the end of the week.'
Monday, January 21, 2002
Diego Forlan is having his medical with Manchester United today before completing his £6.9million move from Independiente.
United have completed the paper work of the deal and checked the details of the Uruguayan striker's Italian passport.
Forlan, 22, who watched United's 2-1 win over Blackburn at Old Trafford on Saturday, should become a United player inside the next 24 hours.
United manager Sir Alex Ferguson said on MUTV: 'Everything is agreed. His passport details have been checked and he should be registered by the end of the week.'
Forgot that!
Of course Fergie trusts Forlan. Had he not he would've done anything to get another striker in. Simple as that.
Murt,
As for Olle as a sub, i have to agree. Livvie will do her nut and point out how few goals he has scored as a sub etc but imo you cant beat Olle coming off the bench to change a game, hes the worlds best at it.
<hr></blockquote>
Well, you now have to contend with me as well!
Have you considered the reason why Ole's been great whenever he comes off the bench, could be because we have one hell of a player who does equally well when he starts? Period .
Many of us only remember when Ole comes on to score when United is down, & that's OK because he's saved us yet again, but equally how many take into consideration that when he started regularly for United in his debut season, he top-scored with 19 goals?
We remember him scoring 4 against Forest when he came in as sub with 10 minutes to go, but how many remember him scoring 4 when he started against Everton when United was 0-1 down & Bosnich had to be substituted because of injury?
How many remembered him scoring 2 against Spurs & Fergie arrogantly subbed him at 1/2 time when Gary got sent off & instead of cruising, Spurs managed to claw back for a 2-2 draw?
And how he played as a lone striker for 7 games in Dec/Jan 2000/2001 & scored 6 to finish off the challenge of our nearest competitors in United's 7th EPL Title success?
We should be greatful that we have Ole & hope he starts as many games as possible for us! ( United lost only once & drew only thrice when Ole/Ruud started 19 times for United last season! )
Anyhow, my point wasn't to relegate Ole to the bench for any other reason than to give Diego a game. I also suggested Ruud sit a match or two out as well.
I have to agree with you on this one Dans - good post. It was only this weekend I was wondering how many minutes football Forlan has played. I'd love to know - so if anyone can find out it would be much appreciated. Get the number of minutes, divide it by 90 and you will see how many games he has really played.
Forlan's movement is excelent, he runs like a flippin maniac about the pitch. When he played against Shelbourn I was so impressed with his movement ahead of any other of the United players.
Forlan's movement is excelent, he runs like a flippin maniac about the pitch. When he played against Shelbourn I was so impressed with his movement ahead of any other of the United players.
Altho I feel sorry for Forlan - what can he ever do with only 2 minutes for the last 2 games - Ole knows this all too well - but is this the right time to experiment?
If we give Forlan a run & things don't work out, what will it do for his confidence & I wonder what those supporting his greater involvement will say then, with United 10 points behind?
If we give Forlan a run & things don't work out, what will it do for his confidence & I wonder what those supporting his greater involvement will say then, with United 10 points behind?
He has to get a run sometime - you can't keep wondering what this and that might do for his confidence and not play him at all. He's our third striker and needs games full stop.
I should point out that I mean this in a 4-4-2 formation.
kinell, striker, forward, attacker - what's the difference? They all play up front and generally are employed to score goals.
Originally posted by kkcbl:
<strong>Murt,
Many of us only remember when Ole comes on to score when United is down, & that's OK because he's saved us yet again, but equally how many take into consideration that when he started regularly for United in his debut season, he top-scored with 19 goals?
We remember him scoring 4 against Forest when he came in as sub with 10 minutes to go, but how many remember him scoring 4 when he started against Everton when United was 0-1 down & Bosnich had to be substituted because of injury?
How many remembered him scoring 2 against Spurs & Fergie arrogantly subbed him at 1/2 time when Gary got sent off & instead of cruising, Spurs managed to claw back for a 2-2 draw?
And how he played as a lone striker for 7 games in Dec/Jan 2000/2001 & scored 6 to finish off the challenge of our nearest competitors in United's 7th EPL Title success?
We should be greatful that we have Ole & hope he starts as many games as possible for us! ( United lost only once & drew only thrice when Ole/Ruud started 19 times for United last season! )</strong><hr></blockquote>
Losing battle I think.
Alan "Twat" Green said during the commentary on Saturday that the strange thing about Solskjaer is that he scores most of his goals when he comes off the bench.
And he's supposed to know about the game.
But it's a myth that won't go away.
I agree with the idea of playing Diego upfront with Ruud. It probably mean a return to 4-4-2, the formation with which we won trophies.
As for that commentator saying Ole only scores when he comes off the bench.
He has a 1 in 5 ratio as a sub and a 1 in 2 ratio as a starter.
Ruud is not the same player when upfront on his own and Diego needs the match time to get into his stride
As for that commentator saying Ole only scores when he comes off the bench.
He has a 1 in 5 ratio as a sub and a 1 in 2 ratio as a starter.
Ruud is not the same player when upfront on his own and Diego needs the match time to get into his stride
Personally, I'd start Forlan instead of Giggs.
Ruud and Ole aren't firing on all cylinders either, so if you're saying Diego needs games, that must also apply to them - that was Ole's first start at the weekend.
It might do Giggsy some good to know he isn't irreplaceable.
Ruud and Ole aren't firing on all cylinders either, so if you're saying Diego needs games, that must also apply to them - that was Ole's first start at the weekend.
It might do Giggsy some good to know he isn't irreplaceable.
Forlan doesn't strike me as a winger though.
could play behind Ruud or Ole... i think that role will suit him perfectly.
So 4-3-3 then giggzy?
4-5-1 or 4-4-1-1 then. I thought most didn't go ofr those formations. You weren't one of them then?
I don't see him starting any matches until Worthington Cup play begins.
nah..i like the 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1 formation...it helps us to control midfield..the only thing we miss is, a forward that can play in the hole... forlan would be perfect IMO.