Sir Alex, David Gill and Bryan Robson have been brought in to advise Richard Arnold on a wide range of club matters

Trequarista10 said:
Fair. I don't think SAF would put himself in the firing line of supporters group meetings and I would hope the club wouldn't dare ask him to! The suits in charge get the big bucks, they're the ones who make the decisions, they need to face up and deal with things themselves.
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To be honest, I find that quite a bizarre statement. Sir Alex grew up in the ship yards of Glasgow and battled his way to the top of a mans game (no offence lionesses) & I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have any problems meeting with a bunch of prawn sandwich eating (no offence Roy) United fans keen to express some dissatisfaction with the way things currently are! They'd hand-pick the audience anyway, they wouldn't let me in, that's for sure!

P.S. You say: "The suits in charge get the big bucks, they're the ones who make the decisions, they need to face up...." well last I heard Sir Alex was on 4 million pounds a year, so what are the 'suits in charge' getting?
 
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Azhar88 said:
To be honest, I find that quite a bizarre statement. Sir Alex grew up in the ship yards of Glasgow and battled his way to the top of a mans game (no offence lionesses) & I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have any problems meeting with a bunch of prawn sandwich eating (no offence Roy) United fans keen to express some dissatisfaction with the way things currently are! They'd hand-pick the audience anyway, they wouldn't let me in, that's for sure!

P.S. You say: "The suits in charge get the big bucks, they're the ones who make the decisions, they need to face up...." well last I heard Sir Alex was on £4 million a year, so what are the 'suits in charge' getting?
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Please. He didn't get involved with confrontations with fans when he was the manager. He's now in a CONSULTANCY role, he's in his 80s, he's not in a position of power or responsibility - he's not going to suddenly decide to shield the MANAGEMENT from confrontations with fans about the MANAGEMENT.

Consultants consult, managers manage. This is exactly the sort of overdramatic, emotional insanity that SAF would have no interest in engaging with.
 
phelans shorts said:
Did he? I never saw any of that myself.

The idea of this think tank being actively involved with supporters is a bit daft. The idea with this kind of role is usually that they have an awareness due to the time they spent with said fan base of what they want, so are there to advise the current incumbent as to how things are likely to play out. Making sure the optics are in keeping with “Manchester United Values”, it’s largely a load of fluff, but having input of folk who were involved with a successful regime isn’t a bad thing unless their words hold too much power, as of right now we’ve no way of knowing.

Let’s be honest here as well, this sounds like exactly the kind of thing Ralf was to be doing. Chances are he was just another person that would be in this think tank, not that he’d have been on his own. Ralf however never managed to enamour himself to the fans, or the players, or well anyone so when he got a full time job elsewhere it made more sense to just let him go.
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I was referring to this sort of thing:

"Manchester United midfielder Scott McTominay has lifted the lid on Ralf Rangnick's demand to “cut out” negative body language..."

See - https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/man-utd-mctominay-rangnick-neville-25820962

I laughed out loud when I read this: "Ralf however never managed to enamour himself to the fans, or the players!!!" this is just so typical of the problems in the club today. New guy comes in, tells the players to take pride in wearing the United shirt and stop grumbling all the time (probably tightened things up in training too, to improve fitness) and the players were not very enamoured by that! I suppose Ryan Giggs and Lee Sharpe weren't very happy when Sir Alex called them out for going to a party in Stockport, back in the eighties, but did they throw their toys out, down tools? Of course they didn't, but in 2022 if King Ronaldo and Prince Fernandes and Sir Lord Rashford don't quite like to be told what to do (and to keep smiling whilst doing it) then you are fcked.
 
Whoever is against SAF being brought in, In any capacity, is a total and utter ingratiate.*

Like it or not, there are two people bigger than Manchester United: Matt Busby and Alex Ferguson. Those two virtually created Manchester United.

if they want to make Sir Alex Ferguson Manchester United Emporer. Giving him his own throne and golden leafy diadem. Giving him dominion over everything from matchday snacks to signings. I'm all for it.

I dare say, the people who are against this are the type of Manchester United fans are either the "Fergie, out!" brigade of the 80s, and never got over it, or they are kids who have no idea who SAF is.

*Don't even get me started on the "Sir Alex Ferguson's biggest mistakes" thread. Very respectful.
 
Azhar88 said:
I was referring to this sort of thing:

"Manchester United midfielder Scott McTominay has lifted the lid on Ralf Rangnick's demand to “cut out” negative body language..."

See - https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/man-utd-mctominay-rangnick-neville-25820962

I laughed out loud when I read this: "Ralf however never managed to enamour himself to the fans, or the players!!!" this is just so typical of the problems in the club today. New guy comes in, tells the players to take pride in wearing the United shirt and stop grumbling all the time (probably tightened things up in training too, to improve fitness) and the players were not very enamoured by that! I suppose Ryan Giggs and Lee Sharpe weren't very happy when Sir Alex called them out for going to a party in Stockport, back in the eighties, but did they throw their toys out, down tools? Of course they didn't, but in 2022 if King Ronaldo and Prince Fernandes and Sir Lord Rashford don't quite like to be told what to do (and to keep smiling whilst doing it) then you are fcked.
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So you think that throwing players under the bus is good management technique do you? Just generally acting like a dick to everyone? Believe it or not you need to give people something to buy into to up their performance, and being a dick to them is very rarely going to have that effect.

He was a fecking catastrophe and only has himself to blame that the club were more than happy to hold the door open for him and make sure it hit him on the way out.
 
I just finished reading The Promised Land by Daniel Harris - the story of the treble season.
There’s a lot in there that shows that whilst football has changed in some ways in many ways the same attitudes and principles bring success. There’s a great quote from David James that I thought I’d share as I think it shows that there are things that United stopped doing and which would be worth bringing back. The type of principles that the likes of SAF could advise on:

David James recalls his experience of the culture through time spent away with England, and how the United players would police themselves, supporting one another to the fullest extent.

"All those hours of sitting around.… and not once did any United player ever reveal anything to me about their team-mates, their dressing room or their manager. In an industry renowned for its gossip I find that
extraordinary... Even when the media reported chaos in the United dressing room... there were no comments from the United boys. There were plenty of questions, of course. But their answers were only ever
vague, or meaningless. It all contributed to that sense of separation:

there were United players, and then there was the rest of us."
 
alexanderplatz said:
I just finished reading The Promised Land by Daniel Harris - the story of the treble season.
There’s a lot in there that shows that whilst football has changed in some ways in many ways the same attitudes and principles bring success. There’s a great quote from David James that I thought I’d share as I think it shows that there are things that United stopped doing and which would be worth bringing back. The type of principles that the likes of SAF could advise on:

David James recalls his experience of the culture through time spent away with England, and how the United players would police themselves, supporting one another to the fullest extent.

"All those hours of sitting around.… and not once did any United player ever reveal anything to me about their team-mates, their dressing room or their manager. In an industry renowned for its gossip I find that
extraordinary... Even when the media reported chaos in the United dressing room... there were no comments from the United boys. There were plenty of questions, of course. But their answers were only ever
vague, or meaningless. It all contributed to that sense of separation:

there were United players, and then there was the rest of us."
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That was an excellent book. And we got to hear some details that we hadn't before about the 99 campaigns.
If you get a chance - and if you can get your hands on it - i recommend Daniel Taylor's "This is the One" 2007 book on Ferguson, which is by far the best United-related book I have ever read, detailing the dark days in the mid-2000's when Ferguson was castigated by the press and questions regarding his continuity were circling around, to him turning it all around, knocking Chelsea off their perch while spending a fraction of their budget as he developed the next great United team (possibly his best every United team).
 
Ladron de redcafe said:
That was an excellent book. And we got to hear some details that we hadn't before about the 99 campaigns.
If you get a chance - and if you can get your hands on it - i recommend Daniel Taylor's "This is the One" 2007 book on Ferguson, which is by far the best United-related book I have ever read, detailing the dark days in the mid-2000's when Ferguson was castigated by the press and questions regarding his continuity were circling around, to him turning it all around, knocking Chelsea off their perch while spending a fraction of their budget as he developed the next great United team (possibly his best every United team).
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awesome - hadn’t heard of that one. Will check it out! Thanks very much
 
So, I have read loads of threads on here in the last 24 hours, about how the players are still crap, but not the new ones, that we should have kept Ralf Rangnick or maybe we shouldn't have, that the manager messed up playing a false 9, but he will be OK really because he's a much better manager than RR. Ronaldo should definitely go, except when he came on he was good, so maybe he should stay (cos he's better than Arnautovic who's said 'No' to us anyway) and Rashford's a busted flush - he's basically the new Januzaj, but with an MBE.... and so on and so forth.

But I'm sorry to have to say this, nobody has mentioned the one constant in the post-Ferguson era and that is..... Sir Alex Ferguson.

There it was again today (if you saw the game on Sky) Gross goal goes in and the camera finds a) CR7 and then b) SAF. Nobody likes to have their first day at work scrutinised by the old Boss, but it always happens at United. Every bloody time. Now, unlike in the past, he is not just there in some ceremonial Ambassadors role or Associate Director. No, because from two weeks ago he was brought back to assist in some way.... in what way I'm not sure, can anyone tell me? But I can assure you of this, whatever it is, it didn't help today & I bet it never involves criticism of the Glazers or Ronaldo or David Moyes or The Rock of Gibraltar & a multitude of other things.

I'm sick of it. Finally, in December '21 we actually did something new and innovative (very new actually, probably the 1st 'interim manager' in footballing history) but it was the right idea; Ralf Rangnick was involved in the invention of 'gengenpress' afterall and he spotted that i) United needed many new players and ii) Ronaldo should go, but the board didn't like the sound of i) and the accountants probably didn't like the sound of ii). So he was 'let go' by mutual agreement (ha) and what is put in his place?

Bryan Robson, Alex Ferguson and David Gill. It's like 'Back to the Future' and we are back in 1986, will this club never learn? Things have moved on, football has moved on. United need to move on.
 
Heard their recommendation is to play McTominay more often
 
If you can't manage a football team because of one old man sitting in a crowd of 80 thousand watching you once a week, you shouldn't be managing Manchester United.
 
Azhar88 said:
So, I have read loads of threads on here in the last 24 hours, about how the players are still crap, but not the new ones, that we should have kept Ralf Rangnick or maybe we shouldn't have, that the manager messed up playing a false 9, but he will be OK really because he's a much better manager than RR. Ronaldo should definitely go, except when he came on he was good, so maybe he should stay (cos he's better than Arnautovic who's said 'No' to us anyway) and Rashford's a busted flush - he's basically the new Januzaj, but with an MBE.... and so on and so forth.

But I'm sorry to have to say this, nobody has mentioned the one constant in the post-Ferguson era and that is..... Sir Alex Ferguson.

There it was again today (if you saw the game on Sky) Gross goal goes in and the camera finds a) CR7 and then b) SAF. Nobody likes to have their first day at work scrutinised by the old Boss, but it always happens at United. Every bloody time. Now, unlike in the past, he is not just there in some ceremonial Ambassadors role or Associate Director. No, because from two weeks ago he was brought back to assist in some way.... in what way I'm not sure, can anyone tell me? But I can assure you of this, whatever it is, it didn't help today & I bet it never involves criticism of the Glazers or Ronaldo or David Moyes or The Rock of Gibraltar & a multitude of other things.

I'm sick of it. Finally, in December '21 we actually did something new and innovative (very new actually, probably the 1st 'interim manager' in footballing history) but it was the right idea; Ralf Rangnick was involved in the invention of 'gengenpress' afterall and he spotted that i) United needed many new players and ii) Ronaldo should go, but the board didn't like the sound of i) and the accountants probably didn't like the sound of ii). So he was 'let go' by mutual agreement (ha) and what is put in his place?

Bryan Robson, Alex Ferguson and David Gill. It's like 'Back to the Future' and we are back in 1986, will this club never learn? Things have moved on, football has moved on. United need to move on.
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I said years ago that the whole board should be sacked. I included the two knights of the realm in that but Sir Bobby's health situation should now save him (although I presume he's not well enough to do anything). the whole lot stink and have done for ages
 
Can we get Ed back?

Imagine saying that at the start of summer
 
Utd7 said:
The nepotism at this club is mind boggling. Run like a mom and pop shop.
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Wasn't there an issue some years ago to do with Football Agents, which SAF is apparently not a fan of, unless they are family of course.... a BBC Documentary was somewhat critical of Jason Ferguson and Elite (Jason's agency) and their dealings with Man Utd. fallout from which had 2 implications: 1) SAF refused to speak to Match of the Day or the BBC for many, many years and ii) Elite would never again be permitted to act on behalf of Manchester United. The club, however, cleared Ferguson and his son of any wrongdoings.

https://www.sportskeeda.com/football/why-did-sir-alex-ferguson-boycott-bbc-for-more-than-seven-years#:~:text=On 27th May 2004, BBC3,with Match of the Day.
 
alexanderplatz said:
I just finished reading The Promised Land by Daniel Harris - the story of the treble season.
There’s a lot in there that shows that whilst football has changed in some ways in many ways the same attitudes and principles bring success. There’s a great quote from David James that I thought I’d share as I think it shows that there are things that United stopped doing and which would be worth bringing back. The type of principles that the likes of SAF could advise on:

David James recalls his experience of the culture through time spent away with England, and how the United players would police themselves, supporting one another to the fullest extent.

"All those hours of sitting around.… and not once did any United player ever reveal anything to me about their team-mates, their dressing room or their manager. In an industry renowned for its gossip I find that
extraordinary... Even when the media reported chaos in the United dressing room... there were no comments from the United boys. There were plenty of questions, of course. But their answers were only ever
vague, or meaningless. It all contributed to that sense of separation:

there were United players, and then there was the rest of us."
Click to expand...
I've said it time and time again. We miss that siege mentality at the club.
 
Utd7 said:
The nepotism at this club is mind boggling. Run like a mom and pop shop.
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Darren Fletcher , Technical Director who is said to be learning at the job by sitting in the dugout during games. Probably the only TD to do so. This club is so obsessed with replicating the past that we’re falling behind in every department.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
I've said it time and time again. We miss that siege mentality at the club.
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I'm sorry to have to keep coming back to the same thing, but the siege mentality you talk about has to be built from top to bottom, without any dissension. One of the worst things to happen last season was when Liverpool thumped us 0:5 in October. The TV people just loved to seek out Sir Alex Ferguson and the United legend was spotted puffing out his cheeks, sporting a look of utter despair at the manner in which his former side had been turned over. But he was partly to blame due to his involvement last August in bringing Ronaldo back. Furthermore, to have the old Boss looking down from on high, looking grim, just gives those teams who suffered at his hands for all those years added impetus to get shock results like the one we saw on Sunday, Brighton's first ever league win at Old Trafford.

Can the old guard either stand up, accept their mistakes (the Glazers being the biggest one) & as discussed at length in the 'Sir Alex's biggest mistakes' thread, stop watching us struggle from the best seats in the house, because it just encourages other teams to play better and other fans to laugh at us....
 
SAF and Gill are good choices..
SAF knew how to buy players for sure and the mentality
 
frostbite said:
Or perhaps he has a son or a grandson or a nephew who can?
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Gill does indeed have a son who I know for certain played for his school 1st XI and went on to play in and "old boys" league. ironically, given where Gill moved on to work, the lad's home pitch is now Chelsea's mega training base at Cobham. I know this as I use to regularly drink with others in that league and actually played there myself in my "twilight" days! The son would be much too old to play now but given the state of our team and the signings we are being linked with, who knows... :mad:
 
While they are there, they might as well ask where is the money that the club did not spend in january window supposed to be used for the new manager, eh?
 
Tom Van Persie said:




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I think this is really very ill-advised.

Let's put it this way: You have a CEO (Arnold), with a subordinate responsible for the sporting success of the club (Murtough). You then choose to be advised by a "think-tank" of four, of whom 3 have illustrious reputations and lots of opinions but zero responsibility, and one who has no reputation but all the responsibility. Does this make it easier for the guy with all the responsibility to do his job well? Murtough can talk to them and Arnold can talk to them, But Arnold should not talk to them as a group that also includes Murtough.

Or, they could just hire someone who's capable of running the club well without being told how to do it by icons of the past.
 
justsomebloke said:
I think this is really very ill-advised.

Let's put it this way: You have a CEO (Arnold), with a subordinate responsible for the sporting success of the club (Murtough). You then choose to be advised by a "think-tank" of four, of whom 3 have illustrious reputations and lots of opinions but zero responsibility, and one who has no reputation but all the responsibility. Does this make it easier for the guy with all the responsibility to do his job well? Murtough can talk to them and Arnold can talk to them, But Arnold should not talk to them as a group that also includes Murtough.

Or, they could just hire someone who's capable of running the club well without being told how to do it by icons of the past.
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I'm with you here. Also they should have realigned the front office before they chose the manager. Doing it like this feels amateurish and creates room for second guessing and too many voices.

Not that I think Sir Alex would work against EtH btw. But it can't be comfortable for a new manager who is installing a new culture. Murtough needs to handle this carefully I think, because the manager has to get support for what he wants not what he asks for after it has been checked and balanced by his personal cabinet.
 
Castia said:
Can we get Ed back?

Imagine saying that at the start of summer
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Imagine saying that now. Ed was worse.

Utd7 said:
The nepotism at this club is mind boggling. Run like a mom and pop shop.
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It's bizarre. It's like they don't know anyone in football that hasn't played or worked for United. There must be hundreds of qualified football directors and we got a manager who retired ten years ago, a captain from the 80s and a former executive. Imagine if Liverpool brought in Daglish and Alan Hansen to help them handle Klopp's departure.
 
I don’t think any amount of advice, counselling, prayer, or meditation is going to mask the fact that Jack-off Joel is an idiot and the Glazers are the worst owners in this league. If anything, the advice should be save your pay-checks because your going to be the next fall guy when this circus goes tits up.
As for Fergie and Gill, at this point I don’t think they give too many f**ks about this club. As long as they collect their blood money, I mean director’s fee, they’ll just play along, whispering sweet nothings into Arnold’s ears.
 
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