Nah, don't like the geezer and my plans are rather different.@Šjor Bepo nice pick mate, would’ve suggested the same actually.
Thought @antohan would be all over him.
Serie A 90's draft
- Thread starter 2mufc0
- Start date
Yeah absolutely and that will be one of the positives of the match day threads. There are a few picks that will split opinions.
Sure, that was just an extreme example. Plenty of more nuanced cases to be explored/argued to death in the match threads.
That's one of the good things. As @BeforeKeanetherewasRobson says, you generate a new discussion - partly because it's a lot of new players, but also because we are looking at a lot of the usual stars but some of whom perhaps played their best football elsewhere or earlier/later in their career.
I get the criteria. Makes sense.
Impressed by your passion also chaps.
Impressed by your passion also chaps.
hopefully you join us in the next one.....once you try you never go back.
Forget your 40-game peak, we had a 4-game peak in place for that Prem draft.
Jeez a 4 game peak. I mean Mickey Evans once won player of the month in the PL.
Who is Mickey Evans you ask?
EXACCHHHLY.
Ftfy
Cheers for fisting that for me.
- EAP - 1. M. van Basten 2. R. Donadoni 3. M. Tassotti 4. D. Stankovic 5. G. Pessotto 6. T. Brolin 7. M. Ambrosini 8. G. Pancaro 9. G. Signorini
- Onenil - 1. R. Baggio 2. A. Costacurta 3. D. Baggio 4. L. Minotti 5. Careca 6. J. Chamot 7. R. Mussi 8. F. Asprilla 9. G. Marocchi
- harms 1. Ronaldo 2. C. Ferrara 3. P. Montero 4. Y. Djorkaeff 5. C. Seedorf 6. A. Carboni 7. D. Fuser 8. W. Jonk 9. C. Taffarel
- Moby/Pat Mustard 1. G. Batistuta 2. F. Cannavaro 3. R. Mancini 4. M. Almeyda 5. E. Chiesa 6. Júlio César 7. D. Platt 8. L. Marchegiani 9. A. Di Chiara
- MJJ/Sjor 1. A. Del Piero 2. J. Veron 3. Aldair 4. A. Conte 5. S. Katanec 6. L. Di Biagio 7. T. Helveg 8. F. Toldo 9. D. Fonseca
- 2mufc0/Invictus 1. Z. Zidane 2. P. Vierchowod 3. Z. Boban 4. O. Bierhoff 5. J. Angloma 6. R. Jarni 7. F. Ravanelli 8. I. Tudor 9. C. Karembeu
- Lord Sinister 1. P. Maldini 2. G. Signori 3. A. Winter 4. V. Montella 5. M. Torricelli 6. Leonardo 7. M. Carrera 8. R. Di Matteo
- Gio/Theon 1. F. Baresi 2. G. Weah 3. D. Deschamps 4. P. Sousa 5. R. Sosa 6. G. Giannini 7. L. De Agostini 8. W. Zenga
- Enigma/The Red Viper 1. L. Matthäus 2. G. Bergomi 3. G. Vialli 4. R. Ferri 5. Dunga 6. Branco 7. A. Balbo 8. A. Lombardo
- idmanager 1. F. Rijkaard 2. E. Davids 3. H. Crespo 4. A. Di Livio 5. R. Ayala 6. M. Salas 7. G. Favalli 8. A. Recoba
- antohan 1. M. Rui Costa 2. J. Kohler 3. A. Benarrivo 4. S. Mihajlovic 5. R. Sensini 6. C. Caniggia 7. Alemão 8. A. Peruzzi
- prath92/Crappy 1. P. Nedved 2. C. Vieri 3. D. Albertini 4. D. Savicevic 5. M. Iuliano 6. P. Ince 7. A. Fortunato 8. P. Negro
- Tuppet 1. R. Gullit 2. A. Brehme 3. L. Blanc 4. T. Hassler 5. R. Voller 6. N. Berti 7. D. Petrescu 8. E. Scifo
- Cal? 1. M. Desailly 2. F. Totti 3. J. Klinsmann 4. C. Panucci 5. G Zambrotta 6. A Pirlo 7. G Lentini 8. G. Gattuso
- Oaencha 1. A. Nesta 2. J. Zanetti 3. G. Zola 4. F. Inzaghi 5. V. Candela 6. A. Tacchinardi 7. G. Pagliuca 8. H. Nakata
- Raees 1. Cafu 2. L. Thuram 3. D. Simeone 4. V. Jugovic 5. F. Couto 6. A. Möller 7. G. Buffon 8. E. Francescoli
- EAP - 1. M. van Basten 2. R. Donadoni 3. M. Tassotti 4. D. Stankovic 5. G. Pessotto 6. T. Brolin 7. M. Ambrosini 8. G. Pancaro 9. G. Signorini
- Onenil - 1. R. Baggio 2. A. Costacurta 3. D. Baggio 4. L. Minotti 5. Careca 6. J. Chamot 7. R. Mussi 8. F. Asprilla 9. G. Marocchi
- harms 1. Ronaldo 2. C. Ferrara 3. P. Montero 4. Y. Djorkaeff 5. C. Seedorf 6. A. Carboni 7. D. Fuser 8. W. Jonk 9. C. Taffarel
- Moby/Pat Mustard 1. G. Batistuta 2. F. Cannavaro 3. R. Mancini 4. M. Almeyda 5. E. Chiesa 6. Júlio César 7. D. Platt 8. L. Marchegiani 9. A. Di Chiara
- MJJ/Sjor 1. A. Del Piero 2. J. Veron 3. Aldair 4. A. Conte 5. S. Katanec 6. L. Di Biagio 7. T. Helveg 8. F. Toldo 9. D. Fonseca
- 2mufc0/Invictus 1. Z. Zidane 2. P. Vierchowod 3. Z. Boban 4. O. Bierhoff 5. J. Angloma 6. R. Jarni 7. F. Ravanelli 8. I. Tudor 9. C. Karembeu
- Lord Sinister 1. P. Maldini 2. G. Signori 3. A. Winter 4. V. Montella 5. M. Torricelli 6. Leonardo 7. M. Carrera 8. R. Di Matteo 9. M. Ielpo
- Gio/Theon 1. F. Baresi 2. G. Weah 3. D. Deschamps 4. P. Sousa 5. R. Sosa 6. G. Giannini 7. L. De Agostini 8. W. Zenga
- Enigma/The Red Viper 1. L. Matthäus 2. G. Bergomi 3. G. Vialli 4. R. Ferri 5. Dunga 6. Branco 7. A. Balbo 8. A. Lombardo
- idmanager 1. F. Rijkaard 2. E. Davids 3. H. Crespo 4. A. Di Livio 5. R. Ayala 6. M. Salas 7. G. Favalli 8. A. Recoba
- antohan 1. M. Rui Costa 2. J. Kohler 3. A. Benarrivo 4. S. Mihajlovic 5. R. Sensini 6. C. Caniggia 7. Alemão 8. A. Peruzzi
- prath92/Crappy 1. P. Nedved 2. C. Vieri 3. D. Albertini 4. D. Savicevic 5. M. Iuliano 6. P. Ince 7. A. Fortunato 8. P. Negro
- Tuppet 1. R. Gullit 2. A. Brehme 3. L. Blanc 4. T. Hassler 5. R. Voller 6. N. Berti 7. D. Petrescu 8. E. Scifo
- Cal? 1. M. Desailly 2. F. Totti 3. J. Klinsmann 4. C. Panucci 5. G Zambrotta 6. A Pirlo 7. G Lentini 8. G. Gattuso
- Oaencha 1. A. Nesta 2. J. Zanetti 3. G. Zola 4. F. Inzaghi 5. V. Candela 6. A. Tacchinardi 7. G. Pagliuca 8. H. Nakata
- Raees 1. Cafu 2. L. Thuram 3. D. Simeone 4. V. Jugovic 5. F. Couto 6. A. Möller 7. G. Buffon 8. E. Francescoli
@Gio
Ah, I thought he was the impact sub you were talking about earlier.
@Gio you have less than 1h30m to go
Are GKs being used to decide draws now? I don’t think it’s fair to add that rule now. Many of us (including us) would have probably picked a keeper earlier had we known that GKs would be important enough to affect results
Agree - it's not in the OP.
I opened the discussion on some of the previous pages. Think @2mufc0 has confirmed that he's sticking with it.
Thought he was really good at Napoli up top. Then injuries took their toll but still he was very good when on.
You don't rate him or looking for something different as a type?
Thought he was really good at Napoli up top. Then injuries took their toll but still he was very good when on.
We discussed this yesterday and @2mufc0 confirmed it.
Bit of both. Mostly that I'm looking for a different type.
I can't say I don't rate him, I'm just indifferent to him, primarily due to not liking him and his post-football activities as an agent. It's irrelevant to how he performs on the pitch for MJJ/Sjor but very relevant to whether I want him in MY team.
BTW, this notion that keepers are irrelevant and don't affect results has turned absolutely ridiculous.
The fact you are exclusively worrying about their relevance in the event that 20-30 people voting on a poll produce a draw is mindboggling. That is exactly why it was introduced and been in place in every draft since: people not factoring in keepers has gone too far.
I think it's a bit strange to introduce that rule when 3 goalkeepers were already picked, but whatever.
It's not really that it was introduced out of nowhere. It was in place at least in the last couple of drafts and, by all accounts, worked well. I gave it for granted and I'm sure I'm not the only one.
This is what I said when I picked Peruzzi, which prompted @Enigma_87 asking about it:
FOA of all managers
I think some fair points have been made, and it's my fault for not laying out the rules in the case of a draw at the start. Ideally i should have put in the average time pick like we did in the previous draft.
I'll leave it to the rest of the drafters to decide, if you think we should scrap the GK rule and choose between deciding draws by:
1) Penalties
2) I find a neutral who didn't vote in the game to decide it
3) Coin toss
Or continue with the GK rule.
I'll leave it to the rest of the drafters to decide, if you think we should scrap the GK rule and choose between deciding draws by:
1) Penalties
2) I find a neutral who didn't vote in the game to decide it
3) Coin toss
Or continue with the GK rule.
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It’s useful in an All time Draft where there are easily 10 goalkeeepers at the least who could be GOAT or thereabouts but it doesn’t make sense to use it in such a limited pool. Especially introducing it in the middle of the draft because had we known it earlier it would have made a difference to the way we draft.
Obviously Goalkeepers are important but unless specified earlier it seems a bit unfair to say that if your keeper isn’t as good as the other team’s then you could lose in the event of a tie. Essentially you are starting with a 1-0 deficit if you are up against someone like Pagliuca or Buffon.
I think that a simple coin-toss could be implemented, if everyone is tired of penalties (I'm not)
I think harms and prath have a fair point but IMO we should continue with GK rule. There is no other way to make GKs relevant in a draft. Only problem is that ranking of keepers in same ball park in this draft will get very contentious if it comes into play for some draw.
I have no problem either way. The issue is always introducing a rule midway through the draft as it affects people's choices in the round itself. For example 8 keepers have been picked since the last 16 picks or so. It definitely had a play in the picking process and it sucks to be in either end of the snake when that happens and you realize you'd most likely start the first game with 1-0 deficit.
Tie breaker rules should always be clear from the off if they are relevant to the picking process. For example swapping penalties with coin toss doesn't really matter, but picking time and picking keeper does.
I don't think we ever transferred tie breaker rules from successive drafts as a rule, neither the keeper being the tie breaker was a regular thing - think it was only used in the last draft.
It's up to @2mufc0 of course to decide whatever is best.
Tie breaker rules should always be clear from the off if they are relevant to the picking process. For example swapping penalties with coin toss doesn't really matter, but picking time and picking keeper does.
I don't think we ever transferred tie breaker rules from successive drafts as a rule, neither the keeper being the tie breaker was a regular thing - think it was only used in the last draft.
It's up to @2mufc0 of course to decide whatever is best.
My 2 cents on keeper business (not just this draft) is that I don't like trying to artificially make any position important. We all have been doing draft for quite long now and everyone has a decent understanding of the game, if everyone collectively doesn't rate / vote for keepers then may be they are not that important. Either way let the voters decide.
- EAP - 1. M. van Basten 2. R. Donadoni 3. M. Tassotti 4. D. Stankovic 5. G. Pessotto 6. T. Brolin 7. M. Ambrosini 8. G. Pancaro 9. G. Signorini
- Onenil - 1. R. Baggio 2. A. Costacurta 3. D. Baggio 4. L. Minotti 5. Careca 6. J. Chamot 7. R. Mussi 8. F. Asprilla 9. G. Marocchi
- harms 1. Ronaldo 2. C. Ferrara 3. P. Montero 4. Y. Djorkaeff 5. C. Seedorf 6. A. Carboni 7. D. Fuser 8. W. Jonk 9. C. Taffarel
- Moby/Pat Mustard 1. G. Batistuta 2. F. Cannavaro 3. R. Mancini 4. M. Almeyda 5. E. Chiesa 6. Júlio César 7. D. Platt 8. L. Marchegiani 9. A. Di Chiara
- MJJ/Sjor 1. A. Del Piero 2. J. Veron 3. Aldair 4. A. Conte 5. S. Katanec 6. L. Di Biagio 7. T. Helveg 8. F. Toldo 9. D. Fonseca
- 2mufc0/Invictus 1. Z. Zidane 2. P. Vierchowod 3. Z. Boban 4. O. Bierhoff 5. J. Angloma 6. R. Jarni 7. F. Ravanelli 8. I. Tudor 9. C. Karembeu
- Lord Sinister 1. P. Maldini 2. G. Signori 3. A. Winter 4. V. Montella 5. M. Torricelli 6. Leonardo 7. M. Carrera 8. R. Di Matteo 9. M. Ielpo
- Gio/Theon 1. F. Baresi 2. G. Weah 3. D. Deschamps 4. P. Sousa 5. R. Sosa 6. G. Giannini 7. L. De Agostini 8. W. Zenga 9. Zé Maria
- Enigma/The Red Viper 1. L. Matthäus 2. G. Bergomi 3. G. Vialli 4. R. Ferri 5. Dunga 6. Branco 7. A. Balbo 8. A. Lombardo
- idmanager 1. F. Rijkaard 2. E. Davids 3. H. Crespo 4. A. Di Livio 5. R. Ayala 6. M. Salas 7. G. Favalli 8. A. Recoba
- antohan 1. M. Rui Costa 2. J. Kohler 3. A. Benarrivo 4. S. Mihajlovic 5. R. Sensini 6. C. Caniggia 7. Alemão 8. A. Peruzzi
- prath92/Crappy 1. P. Nedved 2. C. Vieri 3. D. Albertini 4. D. Savicevic 5. M. Iuliano 6. P. Ince 7. A. Fortunato 8. P. Negro
- Tuppet 1. R. Gullit 2. A. Brehme 3. L. Blanc 4. T. Hassler 5. R. Voller 6. N. Berti 7. D. Petrescu 8. E. Scifo
- Cal? 1. M. Desailly 2. F. Totti 3. J. Klinsmann 4. C. Panucci 5. G Zambrotta 6. A Pirlo 7. G Lentini 8. G. Gattuso
- Oaencha 1. A. Nesta 2. J. Zanetti 3. G. Zola 4. F. Inzaghi 5. V. Candela 6. A. Tacchinardi 7. G. Pagliuca 8. H. Nakata
- Raees 1. Cafu 2. L. Thuram 3. D. Simeone 4. V. Jugovic 5. F. Couto 6. A. Möller 7. G. Buffon 8. E. Francescoli
Agreed. Although I did like the GK thing as well.
And since we don't reward the winners of the last draft with anything, how about he decides who wins the drawn games in the next draft. Super powers and shit.
Its sad how we disrespect gk position in drafts, one of the most important positions in football becames only slightly relevant if we use it for draws....
In this case, if we didnt have it from the start then its not fair to implement new rules half way through.
In this case, if we didnt have it from the start then its not fair to implement new rules half way through.
I think the opposite, it is particularly relevant when keeper quality is clearly different and, from what half of you are saying, you don't give two shits about it. If anyone sacrificed an important pick for a decent keeper instead of picking Simon Mignolet at the death in R14 they deserve the advantage (akin to the away goals rule, not a 1-0 deficit) for getting DDG in R7 instead.
It's a good rule which rarely needs to be applied but keeps things more honest and in line with real life.
That said, I'm fine with a coin toss (not the one neutral decides, that got made up on the spot in a final once and the moment the neutral was suggested I knew I had lost).
I probably would have picked Peruzzi anyway.
BTW @Enigma_87 @The Red Viper Theon already picked and forgot to tag you
Yeah I think it's shifted, a long way from when you could just stick 'goalie' in and get away with it. That said, we still see the odd clown keeper cause less voting problems than they arguably should, so I'm quite open to using it as a tool that is relevant to the match to separate draws. Prefer it to the pure lottery based resolutions, as least it has some resonance to the drafting process. It's also fairly proportionate given draws are rare and keepers can be underappreciated.
As for the here and now, I'm not fussed. While it would be in our interests to have it, I'm not arsed. One thing I'd say is that the OP didn't specify how draws would be handled so it was always going to be a mid-draft or even mid-game sort-out-job. Generally I prefer the resolution to be connected to the match in some way rather than pure lottery, whether that's keepers or something else entirely.
Was that Brwned suggesting Pete and you were built around players he didn't rate like Cruyff or Moore? Knew you were a dead-man walking.
I'm in favour of the keeper rule. Why don't we just have a vote on it and another solution that someone else can propose.
That rings a bell, not sure it was me though.
The one I'm referring to is the 50s final against Brwned, who was the mod himself. Not that he "fixed it" as the logic of using a draft manager who hadn't voted was applied before (the weird thing was PMing tactics and OP to your rival for him to start the thread
). There were two though and I knew both would vote either side but my fan hadn't been around for days 
Polaroid had originally drafted some key players in his gung-ho frontline while my setup was more of a nuanced setup (e.g. DLP Schüster, roaming Boniek and LB Breitner, etc) that needed a lot of explaining and not just someone who hadn't followed or bothered to vote popping in and deciding a final.
That was actually when I came up with LRC penos as an alternative but before it was considered Polaroid posted his measured but entirely predictable views.
That's why I was such an arse in the next draft. I had been shafted some way or another two finals in a row so I was hellbent on winning that one.
Anything other than fecking penalties to decide a draw is fine by me. My perception was that the 'lowest average pick time' experiment worked well in speeding things up a bit, and I wouldn't mind using that again here.