It's not the end of the world for him if he stays either. But him moving is the best option for both him and the club. We seemingly have other players in the radar for that role (mainly Amrabat).
Scott McTominay | Transfer discussion not performance discussion
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It's not the end of the world for him if he stays either. But him moving is the best option for both him and the club. We seemingly have other players in the radar for that role (mainly Amrabat).
Pretty sure Newcastle didn't bid for him. Also he was injured for like 20 games in the second half of last season so that might have something to do with him not playing.
Ah I just think he'd rarely play if he stayed. Not the end of the world, but he would start at a lot of good clubs.
We have signed that midfielder, he is called Mason Mount. We do not need a squad of 30+ players.
I think we sign another midfielder only if McTominay and Fred both leave. VDB is irrelevant either way cause he barely plays.
With Lucas 100 percent going on strike between now and the end of the window. West Ham will be back and the price might go up.
Still think he leaves personally
Good one, you can get that etched onto his statue.
Aye, part of the over running in midfield came from having lazy wingers not working back. You still saw it at times last year. They ended up having to try and plug gaps coming from the wide areas and left the middle exposed too often, they didn't have the authority or control to make sure players around them did their jobs properly.
For me it comes down to quality on the ball neither of them are anywhere near good enough.
I still think he was let go too early, I also think LVG was the worst manager in terms of squad management post Fergie. He sold players for shag all and replaced them with worse players for more money.
When it comes to McT and Fred, sometimes you just have to cut your losses,they are good players, can do a good job at a mid table club, but they just aren't good enough for Utd. That's really alll there is to it.
I don’t think either one should be kept. I will say that both have their uses. Neither one is a 6 and we were constantly asking them to do that job. Both are 8s and not particularly technical 8s. They are both below average in distribution and progressive passing and neither are good breaking the press (Eriksen so much better!).
Fred is pretty good as a ball winning 8 in the high press. Very good work rate. He’s used that way on the Brazil team. When we bought him for 50m and he started playing for us, I thought, feck me, we’ve bought the only Brazilian in the whole fecking country who can’t pass or shoot
. He doesn’t fit us, Ten Hag’s tactics (cept the high press), I want him gone, but he does have his uses IMHO.McTominay I always thought of as the classic SAF squad player, this generation’s Darren Fletcher or John O’Shea. Not a lock for the first 11 by any means, but against the right opponent, with the right players around him, a good once-in-awhile option. Like O’Shea and Fletcher, seems to pop up in big matches with goals and big performances — Liverpool, City, Leeds, etc. I think the difference is that the high press and playing out of the high press in modern football is an absolute must, and it’s just not his strength. Also time to sell.
Just to be clear, both Fred and Scotty are miles better than Donny who managed to spend 4 years here without a single memorable moment.
I love that we are getting back to the days when SAF would sell his rejects off to Everton, West Ham and the like. You could argue the entire club changed the day we started buying from Everton with Fellaini and Schneiderlin. Everton is the type of club where we send Darren Gibson and Kieran Richardson, we should never buy from them unless it’s a 18 year old teenager who is a lock to be a star.
Torn about McTominay's possible departure / United career, to be honest.
On the one hand, I think he's lucky to have played the amount of games he has given that he's mostly been used out of position and hasn't really looked up to the standard needed in the role he's mostly played.
On the other hand, I feel there's a very decent #8, box to box CM, in him that we've failed to utilise correctly and that he really could have become a very decent squad player with us had we used him more, when selected, in his best role.
So he feels a bit of a wasted talent, and I think a move to West Ham, under Moyes, could really get the best out of him if they play him in the #8 role and let him get forward into the box well. Wouldn't at all be surprised to see him perform for them as Lingard did during his loan.
On the one hand, I think he's lucky to have played the amount of games he has given that he's mostly been used out of position and hasn't really looked up to the standard needed in the role he's mostly played.
On the other hand, I feel there's a very decent #8, box to box CM, in him that we've failed to utilise correctly and that he really could have become a very decent squad player with us had we used him more, when selected, in his best role.
So he feels a bit of a wasted talent, and I think a move to West Ham, under Moyes, could really get the best out of him if they play him in the #8 role and let him get forward into the box well. Wouldn't at all be surprised to see him perform for them as Lingard did during his loan.
VdB barely played last season, his minutes can go to Mainoo/Mejbri. Fred has been replaced by Mount. If McT stays, we are not getting Amrabat, I think that's obvious.
The reports have been that Amrabat will be signed when Fred and DVB are sold. No mention of Scott.
Whether That’s true or not remains to be seen.
Also Mejbri is likely to get loaned if Scott stays.
It makes no difference if Donny barely played, we need more midfielders that can play, we were knackered in midfield at the end of the year.
It's imperative we get McTominay off the books this summer. I get that the club want to maximise any transfer value we can for him, and fair fecks to them if they manage to get £35-40m for him, but he absolutely shouldn't be a Manchester United player by the end of the window. This idea that McTominay is a valuable squad player needs to die a death.
No. All the news has been VDB and Fred out then Amrabat in.
Yeah and think that's very much the case
Vlasic has been sold and Downes is going on loan to Southampton.
But Fred and VDB are still here without any concrete updates.
Even at £45m, McTominay is an insanely good deal. Home grown, international player, strong mentality, versatile to the manager’s needs, entering his peak years. To get him for half the price of Declan Rice should be a no brainer for West Ham. They would hardly get academy players from likes of Chelsea or Man City for that kind of price. He’s not as surplus to our needs as Maguire so it’s the right thing to do for us to hold out on a respectable fee.
Sociedad and VDB is still ongoing. Fred updates have gone cold.
When he was fit Fred was always ahead of him and even Fred is seen as surplus to requirements. As much as people rate scott I don't see where he will get minutes and that should be reason enough to sell.
there has been nothing in it. Just some rumoured talks
Yeah, McTominay in a counter-attacking low block team would be top class. Big strong and very quick and he can play a bit too. About £38m seems about the mark it should settle at.
He’s one of the luckiest players in modern football. There are far more talented young players than him who have been let go. I would imagine we’d get a far greater return if we invested 250 games in Hannibal over the next 5 years, but he’s struggling to get a game. Scott was not even a player of note in the youth set up, and could have joined Forest Green at 20 and nobody would have batter an eyelid.
The fact that he’s played so many games for United has guaranteed his next step would not be too low. There’s this default ‘not good enough for us = good enough for any other team not trying to win the CL’ mentality, but I don’t agree. The handful of teams in the league he is good enough to get into would never spend what we’d ask on him, and if they did, they would almost certainly buy a much better player, invariably. West Ham themselves spent 45m on Paqueta last year, and could now sell him for double. Newcastle spent 55m on Tonali. Buying Scott McTominay makes zero sense for any team. The opportunity cost is too high, they could tempt a very promising midfielder on the continent for the same fee and salary. 45m would pretty much make him West Ham’s record signing. Imagine that. Scott McTominay, a non-passing central midfielder.
More fool West Ham if they do this deal, but I don’t think their 30m offer was unfair personally. People keep going on about ‘the market’ clubs are simply not buying midfieders of McTominay’s level for in and around 50m.
No, there’s been confirmed talks. Not rumoured talks.
I would like to keep Scott if we getting rid of Fred and VDB.
Confirmed talks that resulted in exactly nothing so far. With Fred, there have at least been bids
Yes confirmed talks that are ongoing, finally got there.
in that setup Antonio and Mctominay are potentially their two furthest forward players, I’m literally pre-vomiting at the idea of watching it, it’s Michael Ricketts and Kevin Nolan 20 years later
Fully agreed.
Yet, he is a mainstay of Scotland. Managed to rise through the ranks at Manchester United under multiple coaches. Picked for some of the biggest games under multiple managers. Moyes, who has been a manager for decades and won trophies with different teams is interested in what he has to offer. Are you sure you are not missing anything?
I know people are going to disagree with you, taking the Top Red route, but this is pretty much bang on. I don't think he's a Forest Green player per se, but he's very limited in certain key regards.
Take someone like Ross Barkley, just moved to Luton. RB's a better player in almost every sense, except for the injury record, but many people (including some supporting retaining McT or de facto retaining) would understandably be in minor uproar if we signed him. Barkley's faults, in terms of positioning and certain forms of off the ball awareness, are Scott's, but McT doesn't have Barkley's creativity/ability to break the lines with anything but running, or willingness to take the ball in tight areas. Neither of them are great tacklers and so on, but at least Barkley doesn't masquerade as a 6 amongst his other positions. You put either in a team with lower expectations where they can just run about and drive with the ball, often get turned over and then have a team-mate recover it, take potshots, attack the ball at setpieces etc, and they'll do Ok. It's why we can't use McT's Scotland form as a way of defending his retention...
If you see a match compilation of a great player, it usually last 2-3 min. Only covering when the player is on the ball. That is approx five percent of the time the ball is in play. Meaning, off the ball movement, both when your team have the ball and not, accounts for 95 % of the game for a footballer.
Scott McTominay is significantly better than Barkley for 95 % of the time. And during the last five percent, he, unlike Barkley, knows his limitations well.
People pretending that it is just chance that managers like van Gaal, Mourinho, OGS and his team, Rangnick kept giving him game time is deluded. Right now Man Utd, led by EtH, are reluctant to sell for anything less than £40 mill. That is not chance either. And an experienced coach like Moyes will push his club to pay that amount. That is not chance either.
I think selling him for £35-40 mill is the right move. But the talk about McTominay being the «luckiest player in the world» is ridiculus.
Looks likely he'll stay now unless West Ham are doing a separate deal?
he will be the most loved scot this club has ever had, mark my words
There will be a ton of business done before the window closes. West Ham are still interested even with the JWP deal and now to add to that there is the possibility of Paqueta leaving. The window is all about dominos falling, there are teams with interest in Scott but waiting to see what else happens in terms of getting their desired targets or having their own players poached.
Very.
Some of this sounds a bit mean, exaggerated a little, but it’s essentially true, imo.
You realise he advised who originally broke the story right?
Fred was ahead because he usually came on for Eriksen who can't really last 90 minutes. Fred is surplus because we're not gonna offer him the multi-year contract he'd want and so we're selling because he has a year left on his deal. It's not necessarily about Fred's quality but his circumstances.
If Paqueta goes it will be for very large money (80-100m I've been told, probably more likely though 60 + a player) with that money its likely we go back in for Fofana, whom at 50-60m is deemed too much right now, but with another 60+ in the bank suddenly becomes 1st choice. Mctom is 2nd choice behind if money was no option. It all depends whether City will cough up the required amount. I think its probably more likely next summer he moves at this point though given the fanbase is already utterly angry at how this summer has unfolded, Sullivan will be opening up pandora's box (anyone remember the Burnley match which nearly turned nasty...) and I;m not sure he wants to go down that path again at his age.
It's hard to evaluate McTominay, I watched him be terrible up front for the reserves and could not believe my eyes when I saw him included in his first match day squad out of nowhere. Much less being deployed in midfield.
He seemed all but certain to be out of the door when Ole came in then he had a good FA Cup against Reading, then another good game against Palace in the league and actually did well as a lone 6 against Liverpool at home, he just kept doing alright or good until Ole got the gig full time and then he fell off a cliff again.
It has been like that ever since, in fairness, he started the 2019/20 season really well and then got injured and hasn't had a consistent patch of good form since.
It's no secret that he was bad for the reserves, he was part of an academy group that had more talented players than him who never got a real chance. He could absolutely be in the bottom half of the football league had he not been given the chances he was based on his height.
He seemed all but certain to be out of the door when Ole came in then he had a good FA Cup against Reading, then another good game against Palace in the league and actually did well as a lone 6 against Liverpool at home, he just kept doing alright or good until Ole got the gig full time and then he fell off a cliff again.
It has been like that ever since, in fairness, he started the 2019/20 season really well and then got injured and hasn't had a consistent patch of good form since.
It's no secret that he was bad for the reserves, he was part of an academy group that had more talented players than him who never got a real chance. He could absolutely be in the bottom half of the football league had he not been given the chances he was based on his height.
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