He looks potentially very good from what I've seen.
Ryan Gravenberch / signs for Bayern Munich
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Well I guess Ajax are willing to hold onto him for another year rather than sell on the cheap
Decent player, has a lot to learn. Mentally not the strongest. It's not a steal tbf. If he didn't play at Ajax but a Heerenveen of Groningen he'd be half that price.
Not technically good enough.
I know he is far from an end product, but people calling £15m expensive is interesting. He's so young you'd be able to resell him for that much no matter how he performed really. It's a very good fee imo.
Id say that honour goes to Karlson (or is it Carslon? Karlsen? The Scandinavian winger).
It might be interesting to you as a supporter of the current top spending club in the world, but outside of your bubble this is indeed very expensive for a teenager.
Only in Ingurland.
£15m is INSANELY cheap for such a highly-rated youngster with such a big reputation.
Edit: Jesus, it's only €15m. That's insanely cheap guys, come on.
Edit: Jesus, it's only €15m. That's insanely cheap guys, come on.
Name me a young player that has 10 plus international top level and 60 plus first team caps that'll go for similar money? Even with one year left on his contract.
Daniel james cost us more than the upfront fee mooted here!
Bayern always seem to get these kind of deals.
His style of play reminds me of Pogba. He would have been worth a punt, oh well at least with Ralf hopefully moving upstairs he can help us identify a good few bargains.
There's a reason he plays for Ajax and not those teams though, and that's the reason he is costing 15m euros, which in relative terms to todays transfer market is a steal.
Some clubs have been paying higher loan fees than 15mill euros!
That's all true and I'm not meaning to portray this as this huge risk or impending catastrophy. But I have my doubts whether this transfer will be satisfying for both us and the player, with the player ultimately having more to lose. And in relation to what we've spent in recent windows, it's a chunk of our budget.
Then again, if I think of what was payed for and to De Ligt, I guess it really is a steal in comparison.
I'm just burned from the Renato transfer.
As for the last bit - that's strange, we get Championship players for free too
Richards
How's he done for you? Obviously I know he wasn't bought in to play every week.
I think he's doing just fine, good backup and fun to watch. I like him a lot. Not getting much gametime, but holding his own when he gets it.Richards
How's he done for you? Obviously I know he wasn't bought in to play every week.
But it's not the Premier League's fault the rest of the Bundesliga is only to happy to bend over and give you it's players for free or on the cheap
Don't mean this to sound harsh, but the fact that Bayern can poach players for free with such ease, and the fact you think £12m is expensive for a 19 year old talented player means you are the ones in a bubble.
Adama Traore - 30m.
Ferran Torres - 50m.
Vlahovic - 70m.
Three deals this past window outside the PL for big money.
Madrid have been paying 30m for teenagers for years. Rodygo, Vinicius, Camavinga, Renier.
The bubble here is bayern tbh. The fact you view £12m for a talented (far from an end product yes) teenager expensive, is a skewed view. Even if he flops you can resell him for that with ease.
So you cite three top end deals involving Barca and Juve, Vlahovic being very much a marquee signing, as proof that the average deal for standard players is 30m-50m €? And then present Real Madrid's transfers to close the case? Yeah, no need to discuss further on that level.
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We have paid 35 million euros for an 18 year old Renato Sanches. Not including possible add ons of another 45 million euros. The rumoured fee for Gravenberch is very much doable and fair.
The rumoured fee would be a fecking steal; don't know why people are picking this ridiculous hill to die on 
He will go for more though, as he is worth more
He will go for more though, as he is worth more
The rumoured fee would be a fecking steal; don't know why people are picking this ridiculous hill to die on
He will go for more though, as he is worth more
You make it sound as if he was carrying his team. So far, he's nothing more than a prospect.
Also Osimhen to Napoli around 70 million Euros. I wouldn't say those prices are deemed averages but football transfers are undeniably going through a form of inflated valuations since the PSG / Neymar transfer.
Romano also made a valid point that free transfers can cost just as much as fee's between club's but that bonuses (including signing on fee's) payed to the players / agents are undisclosed. Bottom line is no matter what league, region or division inflated prices for players is something that's progressively becoming worse.
...did you quote the wrong post? I said nothing about him as a player.
If you're referring to the fact that I am saying he is worth more...he patently fecking obviously is. Even transfermarkt, a website notorious for giving lowball estimation of fees, has him as £31.5mill.
If we got our finger out and secured Ten Hag for next season, I think there's just as good a chance that he would join us. Perfect replacement for Pogba imo. We are so slow though that we'll probably go for a player who was highly coveted 3-5 years ago instead.
I'm sure United will be open to taking him off your hands, win-win in the eyes of our board.
The rumoured fee would be a fecking steal; don't know why people are picking this ridiculous hill to die on
He will go for more though, as he is worth more
Exactly, this point some Bayern fans are trying to make about how £12m is only a steal for english teams is just some sort of weird flex.
£12m for a teenager who is highly regarded, is a steal, end of. Even if he flops he'll be worth that much. I am aware he isn't a top class talent, but if he was he'd be going for £30m, not £12m.
If you want another clear example, Moriba went from Barca having played 550 minutes to Leipzig for a higher fee. Gravenberg has played 10 times for the NT, and CL games and multiple seasons for Ajax, and is going for less. (well that's what we're discussing, might end up more).
Yet apparently it's only english teams that view £12m as cheap??
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We're talking 25m € here, not 12m GBP
It's 15m Euros rising to 25m no?
In which case, as someone said, the additional 10m euros will likely only be met if he's actually playing well and contributing a lot. The 15m base fee is what we've been discussing.
Bold statement. Leaving aside Pogba's inconsistency he is on his day one of the 5 best midfielders in European football and whilst Gravenberch has a lot of potential he has a hell of a long way to go to get anywhere close to that level and there really is no guarantee he will thrive away from Ajax as we have seen with any number of Dutch wonderkids.
Bayern are used to poaching the best players in their league for a pittance, it shouldn't really come as a surprise. They got Lewandowski on a free at 25 years old when he was already one of the best strikers in the world.The rumoured fee would be a fecking steal; don't know why people are picking this ridiculous hill to die on
He will go for more though, as he is worth more
That league doesn't operate in the same way as it would for any of the other top clubs in Europe.
He's looked up to the challenge in the Champions League when I've seen him but still a raw talent. Similar in terms of his stature combined with good technical ability. I'd rather Tchouameni but I think he'll be off to Madrid most likely, both are capable of the sort of forward runs and ball carrying that Pogba used to provide in his younger years.
Which is a bit disingenous, isn't it? If he comes around any good, Ajax would get those 25m. Which is, again, a fair evaluation for a 19yr old wth a year left on his contract and not much to show for other than promise.
He came here for free, because he chose us. He could have gone anywhere he wanted, not like we forced him at gunpont, you know
When do you really consider add-ons in the transfer fee? For example, the Moriba valuation I gave also has another 6m in add on fees, but you don't see that in the fee. Odegaard fee everyone quotes £29m, not the £35m it is including add-ons. etc etc
Add-on should always be considered, because they are a part of the fee, if the player meets expecations. And if RB Leipzig overpays for a player, it's their fault. And they obviously did, they already loaned him to Valencia, iirc.
Hm maybe in your eyes but not in the mass consensus of transfer values.
And yes maybe in hindsight, but my point is £12m relatively to the majority of clubs is a good deal. For Bayern maybe not, because you can get a lot of cheap deals it seems for whatever reason.
To be fair, it's not just Bayern, for example I seem to remember Werder Bremen buying Serge Gnabry from Arsenal for 6m €.
Now that ..was a steal.
So you're just naming a random transfer from 6 years ago? :S
We signed Martinelli for 6m. What's your point there.
Adjusted for inflation and counting in the post-Neymar valuations, it’s hardly a large fee for a player that is guaranteed to bring back at least 75% or the full amount should he fail (even spectacularly). Bargain.
Why would Ajax sell for only 25m. Munich are cheap. Ajax can hold for the summer and they will get at least 10m more.
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