Rugby 2017 Discussion

Per World Rugby laws regarding the offside late in the game:

11.6 Accidental offside

(a)When an offside player cannot avoid being touched by the ball or by a team-mate carrying it, the player is accidentally offside. If the player’s team gains no advantage from this, play continues. If the player’s team gains an advantage, a scrum is formed with the opposing team throwing in the ball.


11.7 Offside after a knock-on
When a player knocks-on and an offside team-mate next plays the ball, the offside player is liable to sanction if playing the ball prevented an opponent from gaining an advantage.
 
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the offside at the end, i feel the All Blacks should have taken a drop goal in that last passage of play. It's admirable to try and win games scoring tries, but you win games by scoring more points than your opponent and a well taken drop goal would have done the trick.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the offside at the end, i feel the All Blacks should have taken a drop goal in that last passage of play. It's admirable to try and win games scoring tries, but you win games by scoring more points than your opponent and a well taken drop goal would have done the trick.
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Or Barrett (or someone else) hitting one of their missed kicks earlier.
 
Refs decisions are way too important in rugby - but there's so much going on it's an almost impossible job.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
Or Barrett (or someone else) hitting one of their missed kicks earlier.
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Yup. Would have been 17-6 at half time if he put those kicks over. The two misses were regulation misses too. 17-6 at half time was probably series over. He has a bad habit of missing regulation kicks and it has contributed to the All Blacks not winning the series.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Whatever the rights and wrongs of the offside at the end, i feel the All Blacks should have taken a drop goal in that last passage of play. It's admirable to try and win games scoring tries, but you win games by scoring more points than your opponent and a well taken drop goal would have done the trick.
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I'm pretty sure that they were lining up a guy in the box when Faletau turned it over in the 77th minute. On reflection, and I know that no-one on that field would ever agree right now, it was pretty well balanced. So a win on either side might have been harsh.
 
The ref shit it.
Great game though, great series. NZ should have won the game
All I have to say.
 
The atmosphere here in Auckland is incredible! Lions everywhere in town!

Also How can it end in a draw?! Travesty!
 
unchanged_lineup said:
Were you at this match? Atmosphere was amazing til the final whistle.
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No, wasnt at the game, wish I was, could here the crowd noise from my backyard.

Love how all the BS before the tour started looks so stupid now. The arrogance of our own media thinking it was going to be a 3-0 drubbing and the AB's would just cruise it. The lack of respect for Gatland by the British media looks ignorant to me now more than anything else. However the things that work with every Lions tour always win through in the end, the Lions fans are always awesome and the actual rugby each tour makes people want more. Its been that way for me since 1970.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Yup. Would have been 17-6 at half time if he put those kicks over. The two misses were regulation misses too. 17-6 at half time was probably series over. He has a bad habit of missing regulation kicks and it has contributed to the All Blacks not winning the series.
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The NZ commentator at his 1st attempt:
"44 metres and straight down the barrel. Oh, he's pulled it".
 
Pretty odd coming from that really, like everyone in stadium....something that happens once every 12 years needs extra time, and I'm now sure they'll probably put it in there to not be needed for like 100 years. Kind of came from it a bit empty really.

Gotta thank SBW though, for making it a series. And Barrett's muddling kicking, he's a classy player no doubt, but feck how does he miss some of the stuff he did.....he made some very tough shit too, which makes it even more baffling. Farrell came through in the clutch.

Itoje was a beast. Reckon England can take those bums. Though it's a year down the line.....can't wait.
 
I enjoyed this as my first ever rugby match. Don't quite understand all the rules yet. What is scrumming even about? Why does it often look like only one team gets to lift a guy up on a throw-in?

Are there any great classic rugby matches I could watch? Preferably available on YouTube or similar. I'm downloading a couple of Olympics 2016 matches, NZ vs Japan and Fiji vs GB. And a women's rugby match, NZ vs GB :D
 
whatwha said:
I enjoyed this as my first ever rugby match. Don't quite understand all the rules yet. What is scrumming even about? Why does it often look like only one team gets to lift a guy up on a throw-in?

Are there any great classic rugby matches I could watch? Preferably available on YouTube or similar. I'm downloading a couple of Olympics 2016 matches, NZ vs Japan and Fiji vs GB. And a women's rugby match, NZ vs GB :D
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- Scrum: not sure if this was the original intention, but it ties up 8 players into a big pushing contest :D You've got that competition, or if it exits earlier, you've got a lot more space now in the open field for backs vs backs. A good scrum gives you an attacking base to run some pre-rehearsed moves from.

- Lineout: the throwing team have the element of surprising in knowing where the ball is going to be thrown to. Also, if you don't compete in the air, it's easier to be set defensively if the attacking team try a maul (kind of like a scrum formed in open play)

If you're finding ones with Japan, SA vs Japan from the last world cup was great. Which country are you from? My choice of favourite matches is likely to be biased towards ones from mine :D But France New Zealand from 1999 is a favourite.
 
This is a stretch, but I think there were a few occasions in the tests that ABs weren't pinged for being well ahead of the kicker.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/ru...cks-were-denied-final-shot-at-glory-1.3148488

I've been wondering about something since the match yesterday. If the roles had been reversed, and there were 3mins left to go with ABs having a tricky penalty on halfway, would they have kicked the three and then gone for the win, or gone for the corner? Setting aside Barrett's poor kicking form.
 
whatwha said:
I enjoyed this as my first ever rugby match. Don't quite understand all the rules yet. What is scrumming even about? Why does it often look like only one team gets to lift a guy up on a throw-in?

Are there any great classic rugby matches I could watch? Preferably available on YouTube or similar. I'm downloading a couple of Olympics 2016 matches, NZ vs Japan and Fiji vs GB. And a women's rugby match, NZ vs GB :D
Click to expand...

South Africa vs New Zealand at Ellis Park 2013, Ireland vs New Zealand in Dublin, 2013, Australia vs New Zealand 2000 in Sydney and Ireland vs New Zealand in Chicago last year are all worth watching for some cracking rugby.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
South Africa vs New Zealand at Ellis Park 2013, Ireland vs New Zealand in Dublin, 2013, Australia vs New Zealand 2000 in Sydney and Ireland vs New Zealand in Chicago last year are all worth watching for some cracking rugby.
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Easily the best game I have seen. Wait no that's the Johannesburg one.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
- Scrum: not sure if this was the original intention, but it ties up 8 players into a big pushing contest :D You've got that competition, or if it exits earlier, you've got a lot more space now in the open field for backs vs backs. A good scrum gives you an attacking base to run some pre-rehearsed moves from.

- Lineout: the throwing team have the element of surprising in knowing where the ball is going to be thrown to. Also, if you don't compete in the air, it's easier to be set defensively if the attacking team try a maul (kind of like a scrum formed in open play)

If you're finding ones with Japan, SA vs Japan from the last world cup was great. Which country are you from? My choice of favourite matches is likely to be biased towards ones from mine :D But France New Zealand from 1999 is a favourite.
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Still don't get the rules of the scrum though. When/why is it called? At some point in NZ vs B&I the defending(?) team collapsed and went to ground and the other team got a penalty kick?

I'm from Norway. Got no real favorite among rugby playing countries. :)

Watched the Rugby Sevens Olympics final between Fiji and GB. Was fun to watch sevens even though this match was no real contest, very one-sided. 7v7 makes 15v15 look really congested :)
 
JPRouve said:
Easily the best game I have seen. Wait no that's the Johannesburg one.
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Yeah that was in Johannesburg. The two games in Joannesburg after that between RSA and NZ were excellent too. I reckon the game between Australia and New Zealand in 2000 at the Olympic Stadium was as good as the 2013 game you referenced.
 
whatwha said:
Still don't get the rules of the scrum though. When/why is it called? At some point in NZ vs B&I the defending(?) team collapsed and went to ground and the other team got a penalty kick?

I'm from Norway. Got no real favorite among rugby playing countries. :)

Watched the Rugby Sevens Olympics final between Fiji and GB. Was fun to watch sevens even though this match was no real contest, very one-sided. 7v7 makes 15v15 look really congested :)
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Scrums get called for a few different reasons, the most common being when you accidentally drop the ball forward. Once the scrum has been set, there's a few possible ways a penalty can result - if one team is deemed to collapse it, if one team doesn't bind properly, if they don't follow the referees instructions when setting it, if a player goes into another player on an illegal angle, if one team pushes the other so much that they completely destroy their scrum... most of those penalties come from the front row, the front 3 players in the scrum.
 
whatwha said:
Still don't get the rules of the scrum though. When/why is it called? At some point in NZ vs B&I the defending(?) team collapsed and went to ground and the other team got a penalty kick?

I'm from Norway. Got no real favorite among rugby playing countries. :)

Watched the Rugby Sevens Olympics final between Fiji and GB. Was fun to watch sevens even though this match was no real contest, very one-sided. 7v7 makes 15v15 look really congested :)
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It's very difficult to explain succinctly but:

- It's one of the four options when you have a penalty(Scrums, Kick at goal, kick for a lineout and quick tap)
- When the ball is fumbled but not recovered by a teammate that is offside, otherwise it's a penalty for offside.
- When the ball is passed forward.
- There is a five meters scrum when the attacking team reaches the end zone but fail to ground the ball, unless they go out with the ball or kick it out.
- There is a five meters scrum when the defense brings the ball in the end zone and ground it or a maul is created with the defense in possession.
- When the kickoff goes directly out of play.
- It can be used to restart the game, if it was stopped for some reasons.
- When a maul is collapsed and the ball can't be played.
And I'm sure I'm missing something.

In recent years, collapsing a scrum has been sanctioned with a penalty but for many years it was mainly a free kick, unless the the referee was fed up by a multitude of infringements.
 
Mitchell Nicholas said:
Per World Rugby laws regarding the offside late in the game:

11.6 Accidental offside

(a)When an offside player cannot avoid being touched by the ball or by a team-mate carrying it, the player is accidentally offside. If the player’s team gains no advantage from this, play continues. If the player’s team gains an advantage, a scrum is formed with the opposing team throwing in the ball.


11.7 Offside after a knock-on
When a player knocks-on and an offside team-mate next plays the ball, the offside player is liable to sanction if playing the ball prevented an opponent from gaining an advantage.
Click to expand...

Been thinking about the decision and the ref definitely made the right call, according to these laws. Whichever way you look at it, the last Lions player to touch the ball did not gain an advantage by doing so. He immediately dropped the ball and allowed an All Black to come through, pick up the ball, un-contested, and have a run at the Lion's line.

Where the All Blacks can feel hard done by is why he didn't allow play to continue? If you're not awarding a penalty because you think the Lions didn't gain an advantage from the offside, then surely you have to give the other team every chance to make the most out of that situation?
 
The referee Andrew Merhtens described as a ''peanut'', will get the Rugby Championship underway. Five of the 12 games will be refereed by French refs, seven from 12 by Northern Hemisphere referees. Whatever people say about French refs, World Rugby must think they're doing something right.

Refereeing schedule for 2017 Rugby Championship:
August 19

Australia v NZ- Jerome Garces (France)

SA v Argentina - Romain Poite (France)

August 26

NZ v Australia - Wayne Barnes (England)

Argentina v SA - Pascal Gauzere (France)

September 9

NZ v Argentina - Angus Gardner (Australia)

Australia v SA - Glen Jackson (NZ)

September 16

Australia v Argentina - John Lacey (Ireland)

NZ v SA - Nigel Owens (Wales)

September 30

SA v Australia - Ben O'Keeffe (NZ)

Argentina v NZ - Jaco Peyper (SA)

October 7

SA v NZ - Jerome Garces (France)

Argetnina v Australia - Mathieu Raynal (France)
 
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Mitchell Nicholas said:
South Africa vs New Zealand at Ellis Park 2013, Ireland vs New Zealand in Dublin, 2013, Australia vs New Zealand 2000 in Sydney and Ireland vs New Zealand in Chicago last year are all worth watching for some cracking rugby.
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Is this the one?
 
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