[Adebesi]

Well I want to see us go with 2 striker and have a go at Chelsea - our defence is weak so I think the only way we can get anything from this game is to go for the kill.

Also RvP and Falcao have linked up very well - they seem to have formed an instant understanding

You mentioned that before. Not quite sure "very well" is how Id put it but theyve had their moments for sure. I feel both would play better alone up front but it looks like Van Gaal agrees with you anyway so we'll see how it develops.

Personally I fear your idea sounds good but will see us get torn apart. It seems tactically naive to me, I can imagine Mourinho would like nothing more than for us to throw the kitchen sink at them but Ive never claimed to be any kind of tactician myself and I trust Van Gaal's abilities in that respect. So, again, we'll see.

 

[Rood]

You mentioned that before. Not quite sure "very well" is how Id put it but theyve had their moments for sure. I feel both would play better alone up front but it looks like Van Gaal agrees with you anyway so we'll see how it develops.

Personally I fear your idea sounds good but will see us get torn apart. It seems tactically naive to me, I can imagine Mourinho would like nothing more than for us to throw the kitchen sink at them but Ive never claimed to be any kind of tactician myself and I trust Van Gaal's abilities in that respect. So, again, we'll see.

Well I more meant very well for players who have only just played a couple of times together.

2 strikers is a bit of gamble and quite possible that it could backfire completely - we are at home so it would be my personal choice (away to City is a different scenario) but lets see how LvG plays it. He is a big game manager and Im sure he has a specific plan in place already.

 

[Patchbeard]

Well I want to see us go with 2 striker and have a go at Chelsea - our defence is weak so I think the only way we can get anything from this game is to go for the kill.

Also RvP and Falcao have linked up very well - they seem to have formed an instant understanding

Sorry Rood, I just haven't seen this. A few bits of movement has looked good, but I would say that comes as standard as one is just doing the opposite of the other (front/back post). Hope I am proved wrong on Sunday though.

 

[Adebesi]

He is a big game manager and Im sure he has a specific plan in place already.

No doubt.

 

[Rood]

Sorry Rood, I just haven't seen this. A few bits of movement has looked good, but I would say that comes as standard as one is just doing the opposite of the other (front/back post). Hope I am proved wrong on Sunday though.

Falcao has already set up 2 goals for RvP (and that is coming from a player who very rarely got any assists at all while at Athletico) - if that's not an instant partnership then I dont know what is. Just compare Rooney and RvP who have barely managed to complete a pass to each other in the space of 2 years!

 

[Adebesi]

Theyre both great players and yes they have linked up already. But is it a partnership that is equal to, let alone more than the sum of its parts? Will it get the best out of Falcao? He hasnt looked that sharp for us, and yet when he played for Colombia I get the impression he did - though I didnt actually see the game. I just think if you have one of the world's best finishers at the club its a shame if he ends up in a partnership where his main role becomes provider for RVP. Maybe there are people who would be better doing that. And maybe Falcao would be doing better if he had someone worrying about providing for him. But its very early to be drawing too many conclusions about this anyway. This is precisely why we all knew it would "take time for everyone to gel" - and why having so many changes in the team all at once would always prove disruptive, there is going to be a certain amount of trial and error while we establish what works and what doesnt.

 

[Patchbeard]

Falcao has already set up 2 goals for RvP (and that is coming from a player who very rarely got any assists at all while at Athletico) - if that's not an instant partnership then I dont know what is. Just compare Rooney and RvP who have barely managed to complete a pass to each other in the space of 2 years!

Basically @Adebesi put what I would try and say in much better terms. I feel like the partnership is probably hindering each of them from the way they would be most effective.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Not to mention that playing the two of them together means one less player in other areas of the pitch, where we're likely to be significantly out-gunned as it is.

 

[Speak]

I don't really see any partnership developing either. It's inevitable that they'll set each other up occasionally. But they both do better individually. If Falcao must have a partner, then Rooney's more equipped.

 

[Manucho the boss]

I don't really see any partnership developing either. It's inevitable that they'll set each other up occasionally. But they both do better individually. If Falcao must have a partner, then Rooney's more equipped.

While that may be true, I don't think it's fair to use Rooney's suspension as a stick to beat RVP for the performance against West Brom.

At least he was available to do his job.

 

[Adebesi]

Honestly, Im repeating myself here but I cant shake the image of Mourinho rubbing his hands together with glee at the thought of us attacking them with gay abandon. It brings to mind the very last scene from Blackadder IV where they are all about to go over the top, the dramatic irony of knowing how that was going to end.

You can say our defence is shite so lets just attack the hell out of them and not worry about defence. Or you can say our defence is shite so we need to do everything we can to give them a chance and trust our excellent attacking players to nick something for us. I know the latter isnt The United Way TM but while we look as hapless as we have been of late to be honest Id rather compromise on that score than watch us get humiliated.

Once we are up and running and more comfortable executing what Van Gaal is asking of them Ill be much more comfortable about taking the game to a team like Chelsea. Right now I think we have to be a bit more... well, tactical.

 

[Speak]

While that may be true, I don't think it's fair to use Rooney's suspension as a stick to beat RVP for the performance against West Brom.

At least he was available to do his job.

I'm not? It's not based on the West Brom game at all.

I'm saying that Rooney's more equipped to play in a partnership than van Persie. Especially if the partner has good movement, and releases the ball quickly - like Falcao.
Ideally we don't play two up top, but if we must, then I think Rooney and Falcao would be our best bet.

I haven't seen much by the way of a partnership to suggest van Persie and Falcao wouldn't be better off without each other.

 

[sizzling sausages]

What way would people like us to set up if not two up front? I think the diamond is the best fit right now for the players we have.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

What way would people like us to set up if not two up front? I think the diamond is the best fit right now for the players we have.

Bit of a catch 22 actually. Ideally, I'd like us to go with one up top and three in central midfield. However, it's abundantly clear that RvP is no longer mobile enough to play as a lone striker and Falcao has looked only marginally more mobile in his games for United thus far.

 

[Adebesi]

Are you pining for Welbeck, Pogue?

 

[goin4glory]

Taking into account that Falcao is a striker who thrives in a crossing team he should really be starting ahead of RVP for us. Di Maria is regularly putting crosses into fantastic areas and he's barely moved.

 

[Speak]

What way would people like us to set up if not two up front? I think the diamond is the best fit right now for the players we have.

It's difficult. We still don't have the required players for either the diamond or 4-3-3.

I feel a diamond with Rooney and Falcao up top could be okay. But then you'd have Mata in the '10' - which isn't ideal.
A 4-3-3 with Falcao up top, Di Maria wide left, Rooney wide right perhaps? Herrera, Carrick and Blind in midfield? Still not great.

At the moment I don't see anything looking quite right.

I'd go with the 4-3-3 personally. Give Falcao a go up top on his own. It seems that Herrera could probably do with the extra midfielder behind him too. I wouldn't mind that approach (but Valencia wide right) against Chelsea. It may be too soon to start Falcao up top on his own in this sort of game though, which is annoying.

 

[JUPITER]

Not to mention that playing the two of them together means one less player in other areas of the pitch, where we're likely to be significantly out-gunned as it is.

This. Crazy to play them both, and pointless.

 

[sizzling sausages]

Bit of a catch 22 actually. Ideally, I'd like us to go with one up top and three in central midfield. However, it's abundantly clear that RvP is no longer mobile enough to play as a lone striker and Falcao has looked only marginally more mobile in his games for United thus far.

It's difficult. We still don't have the required players for either the diamond or 4-3-3.

I feel a diamond with Rooney and Falcao up top could be okay. But then you'd have Mata in the '10' - which isn't ideal.
A 4-3-3 with Falcao up top, Di Maria wide left, Rooney wide right perhaps? Herrera, Carrick and Blind in midfield? Still not great.

At the moment I don't see anything looking quite right.

I'd go with the 4-3-3 personally. Give Falcao a go up top on his own. It seems that Herrera could probably do with the extra midfielder behind him too. I wouldn't mind that approach (but Valencia wide right) against Chelsea. It may be too soon to start Falcao up top on his own in this sort of game though, which is annoying.

I would like us to switch to that eventually but I don't think we have the wingers to do it now. Januzaj hasn't impressed when given game time and Mata is out of form too and would leave Rafael very exposed if he was to play there. That only leaves Valencia and I'm not even sure if he's fit, is he? Even if he is, while he would help out with Hazard, he offers nothing going forward so isn't ideal either. Rooney playing there for a one off game might not be too bad but he didn't exactly convince there against Madrid two seasons ago, IIRC.

 

[Adebesi]

Id go 4-2-3-1 like we did (on paper) against WBA, it didnt look very good on the day but for me it still looks like the best deployment of our resources. Id like to see Blind and Carrick as the 2, Di Maria, Herrera and Mata as the three and then Falcao up front. Or maybe Fellaini as the wildcard in the middle of the 3 with Di Maria and Herrera either side of him. Im not sure about that but given how Mata and Januzaj looked last game its food for thought.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Are you pining for Welbeck, Pogue?

 

[Speak]

Id go 4-2-3-1 like we did (on paper) against WBA, it didnt look very good on the day but for me it still looks like the best deployment of our resources. Id like to see Blind and Carrick as the 2, Di Maria, Herrera and Mata as the three and then Falcao up front. Or maybe Fellaini as the wildcard in the middle of the 3 with Di Maria and Herrera either side of him. Im not sure about that but given how Mata and Januzaj looked last game its food for thought.

That could work. Mata would really really need to put a shift in though.
He would need to in that role anyway , but it goes without saying that Chelsea fight for the ball better than anyone.

It's him or Valencia. By playing Mata you're effective trading that high level of work rate for the chance he might pull out something special

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It may be too soon to start Falcao up top on his own in this sort of game though, which is annoying.

The kid gloves with Falcao is kind of confusing me. Hadn't he played a bunch of games in France before we signed him?

Surely we should be considering him as fully fit by now? I know where you're coming from as I keep thinking of him as being about to break down any moment. No idea why. Probably because of all my anxiety about the injury when we signed him. At the end of the day, though, he's been passed fully fit to play competitive football and has already played a decent number of games for club and country. He cost us a frigging fortune and has a reputation of being one the very best strikers on the planet. He has to start every game, surely?

 

[Adebesi]

Yeah, enough of the pussyfooting around with Falcao now. Time for him to man up. And get a bloody haircut while he's at it, the fanny.

 

[JUPITER]

Id go 4-2-3-1 like we did (on paper) against WBA, it didnt look very good on the day but for me it still looks like the best deployment of our resources. Id like to see Blind and Carrick as the 2, Di Maria, Herrera and Mata as the three and then Falcao up front. Or maybe Fellaini as the wildcard in the middle of the 3 with Di Maria and Herrera either side of him. Im not sure about that but given how Mata and Januzaj looked last game its food for thought.

Yeah, I'd also like to see Carrick sat next to Blind as an extra man and just 1 up top (Falcao). I'd also be welcome to seeing a well drilled Valencia to defend the right channel and cover for Rafael in big games...

-----------------------DDG-------------------
Rafael--------Jones--------Rojo--------Shaw
--------Carrick-----------------Blind----------
Valencia------------Herrera-------------ADM
----------------------Falcao-------------------

 

[Adebesi]

Yes, Valencia on the right would work for me too for this one.

 

[Speak]

The kid gloves with Falcao is kind of confusing me. Hadn't he played a bunch of games in France before we signed him?

Surely we should be considering him as fully fit by now? I know where you're coming from as I keep thinking of him as being about to break down any moment. No idea why. Probably because of all my anxiety about the injury when we signed him. At the end of the day, though, he's been passed fully fit to play competitive football and has already played a decent number of games for club and country. He cost us a frigging fortune and has a reputation of being one the very best strikers on the planet. He has to start every game, surely?

Yeah, I don't really know why I think this to be honest. Probably time to just get him up there, and give him full games.
Would love to see him given games as the lone striker once Rooney's back.

 

[Speak]

Yeah, I'd also like to see Carrick sat next to Blind as an extra man and just 1 up top (Falcao). I'd also be welcome to seeing a well drilled Valencia to defend the right channel and cover for Rafael in big games...

-----------------------DDG-------------------
Rafael--------Jones--------Rojo--------Shaw
--------Carrick-----------------Blind----------
Valencia------------Herrera-------------ADM
----------------------Falcao-------------------

Would love that. Would like to see it with Rooney in Valencia's role for a bit, perhaps after these two games have been played.
What that definitely shows is that the first team still needs work.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah, I'd also like to see Carrick sat next to Blind as an extra man and just 1 up top (Falcao). I'd also be welcome to seeing a well drilled Valencia to defend the right channel and cover for Rafael in big games...

-----------------------DDG-------------------
Rafael--------Jones--------Rojo--------Shaw
--------Carrick-----------------Blind----------
Valencia------------Herrera-------------ADM
----------------------Falcao-------------------

Exactly the team/formation I'd go with.

 

[Rood]

Yeah, I'd also like to see Carrick sat next to Blind as an extra man and just 1 up top (Falcao). I'd also be welcome to seeing a well drilled Valencia to defend the right channel and cover for Rafael in big games...

-----------------------DDG-------------------
Rafael--------Jones--------Rojo--------Shaw
--------Carrick-----------------Blind----------
Valencia------------Herrera-------------ADM
----------------------Falcao-------------------

I cant believe that people think that Carrick, who hasnt played a single minute of this season or even preseason, is ready to start in a huge game on Sunday - we had this discussion on the podcast this week as @Duafc was suggesting the same. Anyway that's probably more for the Carrick thread

I personally would go with RvP and Falcao - but I seem to be in a minority

 

[Rood]

The kid gloves with Falcao is kind of confusing me. Hadn't he played a bunch of games in France before we signed him?

Surely we should be considering him as fully fit by now? I know where you're coming from as I keep thinking of him as being about to break down any moment. No idea why. Probably because of all my anxiety about the injury when we signed him. At the end of the day, though, he's been passed fully fit to play competitive football and has already played a decent number of games for club and country. He cost us a frigging fortune and has a reputation of being one the very best strikers on the planet. He has to start every game, surely?

He has started the last 3 games before WBA - clearly he was left out on Monday due to international duty so I dont think there are any kid gloves being used here.

 

[markhrad]

I cant believe how people are writing off RVP. He constantly moves around the box we just need to find him more. Against Everton he was double-marked but got more freedom when Falcao came on.
One thing I really like about LVG is that he is a man of his word. He said he was giving everyone a chance to prove themselves and that is what he has done and continues to do. He is obviously giving the RVP-Falcao combination a chance to prove itself. If he thinks it cannot work he will change but I think it can, at least we have two strikers now who look to pass to each other.

 

[JUPITER]

I cant believe that people think that Carrick, who hasnt played a single minute of this season or even preseason, is ready to start in a huge game on Sunday - we had this discussion on the podcast this week as @Duafc was suggesting the same. Anyway that's probably more for the Carrick thread

I personally would go with RvP and Falcao - but I seem to be in a minority

Depends how it's approached really though. If Carrick has been training for that specific role in these two specific matches (as Fergie used to do with Fletcher and Park in big games), then I believe he's a player who's easily got the experience to step in and pull off that role. Especially sat next to Blind who's a busy player, with Carrick just providing that extra bit of cover against two very strong midfields.

Put it this way - I'd rather that than playing both RvP and Falcao who will end up isolated and ineffectual and actually benefit Chelsea or City.

Having a well trained, intelligent, experienced head like Carrick sat next to Blind will make it harder for Chelsea or City to walk through us, that's enough for me.

 

[Amethyst]

Another article on Eurosport about van Persie being finished this week, they really don't like him it seems.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

His football wasn't great last season compared to what he's capable of, but I think it's a bit harsh to say he was shite. His goals return was still fairly respectable. Injuries probably held him back a bit, although that's obviously another major problem which could potentially result in his decline coming now, as a lot feel it is.

Yeah was harsh but true. During our last title winning season he was amazing every single game. He scored some amazing goals and you could always rely on him to bag a goal. Last season under Moyes and so far this season it's the exact opposite. He's lost pretty much everything that made him special. Yes I think the injuries have finally caught up with him. The Dutch want him dropped from the national team and Even my 73 year old nan who has supported United all her life said he's finished.

 

[Iron Stove]

Another article on Eurosport about van Persie being finished this week, they really don't like him it seems.

The Eurosport website is a joke in fairness, but yeah.. step it up Robin.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He has started the last 3 games before WBA - clearly he was left out on Monday due to international duty so I dont think there are any kid gloves being used here.

The kid gloves were being used in the post I was responding to (and my own head!)

 

[NoPace]

What way would people like us to set up if not two up front? I think the diamond is the best fit right now for the players we have.

I think the diamond would be too risky against either Chelsea or Citeh, though playing Herrera as the 10 and bringing in Valencia or Fletcher on the right would help there.

If we want to play RVP and Falcao up front it probably has to be a deep-lying 4-4-2 like Atletico play, with Di Maria on one wing, Blind in the deep (Tiago) role, Herrera as the running around (Gabi) CM and someone tucked in on the right, I suppose Valencia.

 

[matherto]

4-2-3-1.

Drop RVP.

Get Blind and Carrick as the base, Herrera in front of them and Di Maria + another either side.

 

[Speak]

4-2-3-1.

Drop RVP.

Get Blind and Carrick as the base, Herrera in front of them and Di Maria + another either side.

It seems most of us are in agreement.
I'd actually feel semi-confident of beating Chelsea with that side. City's a different matter though.