Rio - SAF's greatest defender?

bishblaize said:
In fairness that was because we sat so deep, pace didn't matter. However it was a lovely flash of the old days, Rio and Vida commanding the box.
Click to expand...

Probably, but he looked sharper and did go on a couple of runs also without looking like a snail as has often been the case lately.
 
Rossa said:
I thought he was terrific yesterday; wasn't caught out for pace and was great on the ball. That little chip he did after 20 seconds or so into the first half, then to sweep in behind Jones to prevent an attack one minute afterwards set the tone for his play.

I think it's about math for this guy. At his current very best, he is 80% of what he once was. He once said that United only had to play at 80% to win matches against the lesser sides. His problem is that he plays 80% of that 80% which, forgive me if I'm wrong, equates to 64%, which I think he too would agree is far too poor. If he can play at his best level, then he is a good option, but I think he relaxes too much against lesser opposition. Play like he did yesterday, and I for one would welcome his experience for next season.
Click to expand...

Rio / Vidic were great yesterday. The game was perfect for them as the strategy was to defend deep leaving no space behind where the lack of pace could be exploited. Defending deep has caused us loads of problems this season with massive gaps between defence / midfield / attack. We desperately need pace in the centre of the back four so that we can step-up and be more compact. In my opinion it is sadly time for Rio / Vidic to move on and for Smalling / Jones / Evans plus any acquisitions to take responsibility. Well though they both played yesterday I am not necessarily convinced that they will both play in Munich if Smalling / Evans / Rafael are all deemed fit.
 
REDMULLERS said:
Defending deep has caused us loads of problems this season with massive gaps between defence / midfield / attack. We desperately need pace in the centre of the back four so that we can step-up and be more compact.
Click to expand...

Yup, totally agree. I'm used to seeing United play at home with both centre backs on the half way line for a good proportion of the game, happy to tackle counter attacks two on two, or one or one. This season I often see both centre midfielders sat deeper than that.

Not sure whether this is about personnel or Moyes' tactics. Or Moyes' tactics based on personnel, perhaps.
 
REDMULLERS said:
Rio / Vidic were great yesterday. The game was perfect for them as the strategy was to defend deep leaving no space behind where the lack of pace could be exploited. Defending deep has caused us loads of problems this season with massive gaps between defence / midfield / attack. We desperately need pace in the centre of the back four so that we can step-up and be more compact. In my opinion it is sadly time for Rio / Vidic to move on and for Smalling / Jones / Evans plus any acquisitions to take responsibility. Well though they both played yesterday I am not necessarily convinced that they will both play in Munich if Smalling / Evans / Rafael are all deemed fit.
Click to expand...

I agree with this. I don't like our defense sitting so low for most matches as the distance between midfield and defense is too great, especially for Carrick-like players. Smalling and Jones have great pace, but so do Kaboul and Verthongen, and they've struggled immensely this season; Bayern also looked vulnerable when passes came in behind their defense, and Boating isn't slow - it's somewhat complicated that.

But yeah, agreed.
 
bishblaize said:
Yup, totally agree. I'm used to seeing United play at home with both centre backs on the half way line for a good proportion of the game, happy to tackle counter attacks two on two, or one or one. This season I often see both centre midfielders sat deeper than that.

Not sure whether this is about personnel or Moyes' tactics. Or Moyes' tactics based on personnel, perhaps.
Click to expand...

I hope its personnel / injuries and the need to accommodate Rio, pure and simple. Sure I've seen Moyes yelling at Rio to push up but naturally the old lad is reluctant to because he knows he will get taken to the cleaners. The WBA goal at Old Trafford case in point.
 
REDMULLERS said:
I hope its personnel / injuries and the need to accommodate Rio, pure and simple. Sure I've seen Moyes yelling at Rio to push up but naturally the old lad is reluctant to because he knows he will get taken to the cleaners. The WBA goal at Old Trafford case in point.
Click to expand...

It's quite impressive the amount of pace Rio has lost. Look at Distin, same age but infinitely faster, yet I wager that Rio was faster at his prime. The funny thing though, is that Rio looks the fittest player out there.
 
Rossa said:
It's quite impressive the amount of pace Rio has lost. Look at Distin, same age but infinitely faster, yet I wager that Rio was faster at his prime. The funny thing though, is that Rio looks the fittest player out there.
Click to expand...

Yes, definitely spends his fair share of time in the gym! Think he's had a lot of back problems though which can't help his mobility.
 
REDMULLERS said:
Yes, definitely spends his fair share of time in the gym! Think he's had a lot of back problems though which can't help his mobility.
Click to expand...

True. I had a backproblem and couldn't run to save my life - it was very weird, but my legs just wouldn't go, and I couldn't lift my knees properly. It's a pity though - if he could have kept his physique, he would still be great. I feel that is happening with too many United players - Rio, Neville, Evra, Giggs... (Overmars kept his pace better than Giggs and Cole arguably better than Evra, considering Evra was faster to begin with)
 
If you wanted to set up a team to camp in the box and keep a team out, I'd still go as far to suggest that Rio and Vidic are still two of, if not the best, penalty box defenders in the world. They're solid as a rock inside the box, their problems arise when we play with a regular, slightly higher line. Hence the need for Smalling and Jones to break through.

Good on them. I suspect that Rio's back injury has been a hell of a lot more difficult to manage over the past few years than has been known. You can't accuse him of a lack of pace without pointing out his debilitating back issue. Even now, he's in no fit state to be playing at this level, so fair play.
 
Best I've seen him in years. Personally thought that inclusion in the PFA team last year was pretty odd because last night was an example of him truly rolling back the years. He hoofs aimlessly more against the likes of flipping Norwich. His distribution was great at times last night!
 
Kag said:
If you wanted to set up a team to camp in the box and keep a team out, I'd still go as far to suggest that Rio and Vidic are still two of, if not the best, penalty box defenders in the world. They're solid as a rock inside the box, their problems arise when we play with a regular, slightly higher line. Hence the need for Smalling and Jones to break through.

Good on them. I suspect that Rio's back injury has been a hell of a lot more difficult to manage over the past few years than has been known. You can't accuse him of a lack of pace without pointing out his debilitating back issue. Even now, he's in no fit state to be playing at this level, so fair play.
Click to expand...


You read my mind, again.. When parking the bus as we did last night, it took away alot of the physical requirements of the game, and was far more mentally focused, in terms of reading the game, positioning etc, you see once again just how good Vidic and particuarly Rio are, would they work in a high line? clearly not but yesterday showed our last glimpse of just how exceptional they've been in their careers, two all time United legends and particuarly Rio for me, has been a wonderful buy in terms of service not just talent.

Who remembers when we purchased him and the first year up until coming back from his missed drugs test, the abuse he recieved from United fans? being on RedIssue at the time I still recall him being referred to as Wobbly Gobbed Tosser by the majority, where are these people now eh?
 
bishblaize said:
Easy to say that now. The guy was in the PFA Team of the Year last year. Few would have thought he would slide so quickly.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how he was though. He played ok and did enough to justify still being a United player, but he was hardly exceptional.

It's not been a sudden slide either. He's not been the same since he initially missed some time with his back injury around 4-5 years ago, and it'd gotten to the point he couldn't physically play in more than half our games. We bought in replacements to be fair but then Ferguson decided to use them as fullbacks instead of for the reason they were actually needed.

To be fair to Rio, he's redeemed himself a bit for me over the past couple of months. He's still not really been great but he's kept his mouth shut and I don't think there's been an issue effort/committment wise since he came back into the side (unlike earlier in the season when he was making lazy errors). He's just too slow and forces the whole team to drop back....not such an issue vs Bayern where we have to drop back anyway and his experience then works to his advantage, but definitely an issue in 95% of games.
 
I think it is very close between Rio and Stam as best CB buy for Fergie. I would be qiuite happy for Moyes to spend 30M on a similar player as Rio was when we bought him. Very good value for the service we have got out of him. I liked what I saw last night. Total concentration. I think we benefited last night from the fact that Bayern don't have a Suarez/Aguero type forward. Muller was pretty easy to mark. Only real threat coming from Robben and Ribery, with their clever movement.

If Rio keeps calm on the ball and has players moving around his distribution is great. However, both him and Vidic have a knack of bypassing the midfield with pretty poor hoofballs.
 
Nah, Stam and Vidic were his best CBs. Rio is third though with Bruce fourth IMO.

Vidic and Rio were Utd's greatest partnership though
 
As an irishman i'd have to say mcgrath but he doesn't have much to do with united and even less to do with fergie really.
Think he puts all but the absolute legends of the game to shame.

So yeah i'd give it to rio. Marginally ahead of pallister and vidic.
Stam had one season as good as vidic gave us for 4 or 5 years.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.