After bad performances they need to be aware of staying away from social media full stop. It's the fact that they do not seem to realise posting just leads to not very palatable replies.
Richard Arnold cleaning house | Making 'significant changes' to Social Media strategy etc.
- Thread starter L1nk
- Start date
I am asking a simple question mate
Some about of hot air spouted by numerous members... simply put to all of you..
Murtagh was in charge of Football development at Man United the last 9 years approximately... what exactly has developed at United on the football side since 2013 other than an absolute shambolic disaster with one comical decision after another?
There's a big, big difference between experience and winning / successful experience. Neil Warnock was an experienced manager, was he successful? You get the idea.
When Murtagh stepped into this new role as DoF he was lauded over his supposed "development" of Rashford, McTominay and Greenwood... give me a break. Mediocre players with egos and lazy attitudes who will amount to little in reality. That kind of thing got him the job as DoF.
No one should sign these things, let alone workers that are in a scarce market and any jurist will advise against it unless you really need that particular job or the employer pays that particular close handsomely. Also the language used is generally vague enough to justify abuse from employers, companies do not want precise language.
Now some clubs have a way around these issues, notoriously PSG. The wages that people see are generally not the base salary but the salaries including the "ethical clause", as long as the club has no issue with your behaviour you get the bonus otherwise you don't get it. The advantage for both parties is that legally it's not a sanction, it's not a fine and it can't lead to further legal actions but it serves the same purpose which is to police players' actions.
100%
Utd have been sinking slowly in comparative revenue and value, as City and Liverpool have caught up and now overtaken them (City have and Liverpool are about to).
Chelsea are not all that far behind and with their new ownership will come an expected financial and commercial drive, that could see them catch us up in the money stakes.
Woodward's commercial achievements will all be for nothing if we cannot arrest the downward trajectory on the pitch and get back to serious contention for the top honours.
Failing to get into the latter stages of the CL this season and now failing to get into the competition at all for next season, has already cost the club a small fortune in reduced sponsorship payments and reduced TV and advertising income.
Carry on like this and when those "big" sponsorship deals come to an end, the replacements may not be worth anything like as much.
Well said. The only thing we can do is acknowledge the fact that he has a vast experience in Football and in roles that are linked to his current job, he has also already done restructuring jobs at United, Everton and for the PL. Now none of that means that he will be a success, he could fail for a multitude of reasons. As someone mentioned in one the threads regarding Murtough, someone like Moncho who is without a doubt competent and experienced, failed at Roma.
Missed tagging yourself on my reply...
There's a massive difference to experience and successful experience. Neil Warnock was an experienced manager, should he of been a Man United manager? No.
He was head of our football development since 2013, what exactly has developed on the football side under his watch?
Quite surreal sentiments being put to me and when I ask a simple question about him in terms of development at the club, no one wants to answer it.
Source?
A quick google search will give you the answer... he joined the club with Moyes essentially and part of his set up and managed to survive the cull.
https://www.goal.com/en-ie/news/who...s-director-football/qlym46ybncsj1nec2y3td7lk7
Under his watch the club has arguable seen its worst performance in football in about half a century... and received a promotion for it.
This.
How do you know how he's performed though? Woodward will have had last say on anything. He could've had plenty of ideas that were never listened to.
As others have said. He helped create the women's team and restructured the youth team successfully. We know that much.
Such agreements are commonplace.
In my own professional life, I couldn't say anything publicly that would reflect badly on my employer and separately to that, I was also bound by the official secrets act, so I had to keep quiet about some aspects of the nature of my work.
My son has to sign confidentiality agreements in his particular employment field. Any breach would result in instant dismissal and the risk of his professional reputation being permanently tarnished.
My brother-in-law spent many years working in the City of London, where he was bound by strict confidentiality contracts, particularly when he moved between employers.
Even changing jobs on one occasion, resulted in agreement to not work in his professional field for 12 months, which secured his final pay-off.
Similarly my nephew cannot divulge anything potentially commercially sensitive, or potentially reputationally damaging about his employer.
These are all signed agreements.
Aaaand there it is... just right back to blaming Woodward. Woodward was tasked with the financial side of things and we've been a huge success in terms of revenue and profit under his tenure... now can you say the same of Murtagh and the football side?
He was literally the sole person tasked with working on and improving.. you know, developing the entire football structure at the club.
I've just seen JP commend him for his "rebuild" work here at United already... 9 years later we're talking of a revolution at the club.
Honestly, I couldn't give a fiddlers about the women's team and the youth team isn't exactly successful either, perhaps at youth level...but can we say we've promoted a single youth player and tag them as a genuine first team success? Rashford is the closest and he's realistically a very limited / average player and reached his level and won't improve to a world class level.
Facts are, under his watch the club has seen itself decline.
And just for the record, he isn't solely to blame by any means... but as he was the head of the football development, I absolutely think its more than fair to say he should be fired not promoted.
No one told you that they are not commonplace, I'm telling you that people shouldn't sign them. Now people will sign them because they have next to no leverage since they are generally not in-demand but that's not the case for top athletes who are in demand, the dynamic isn't comparable to your situation or mine. Also a small but important remark, not all clauses are actually legal, it's not because you signed it or that it's commonplace that it's actually legally enforceable, it depends on where you are and what is actually written.
There is undoubtedly blame on Woodward but my post was theoretical. It takes me back to the original point of you do not know anything about the inner workings of the club. Neither do I, which is why I frame it with questions instead of absolutes.
The answer is that he is not involved in the contractual side, he assists murtough in talking to players and telling them about the club, culture, history and selling the club as a prospect
Well we "absolutely" know the football side was and is a disaster.
It was Murtagh job the last 9 years to improve it and it has declined, that much we know.
He has been promoted on the back of that which is quite surreal.
No harm I suppose in him having a 2nd opinion from RR, still considering his previous 9 years and likely having to lean on RR input also... I see it as quite telling and still have concerns going forward.
I don’t think that sounds mad at all. Agents and selling clubs certainly knew it, and took thorough advantage of it.
Easily the most important update. Strange that it's hidden under a tagline of 'social media changes'. Who cares if our social media is terrible if we're winning football matches
Complains about hot air then spouts a bunch of guff which doesn't consist of proof of the previous statement at all.
Just look at the state of our women's team and their facilities. It's a disgrace. I don't it's harsh to say that he basically failed in all aspects other than the commercial side.
Thing is he was never really going to be liked. He represented owners the fans despise and he’s the banker that facilitated their leveraged buyout. The only way he was ever going to be liked was through changing minds by being very successful. The fans knew he was out of his depth very early on and as hard as he tried to act more competently as time went on his card was well and truly marked. Glad we are moving on
Well according the official site
"John will have overall leadership and responsibility for operations and strategy across all football functions, reinforcing the strong foundations already in place. This appointment builds on the work John has already undertaken in recent years, working closely with Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and the rest of the football staff to create the structures, processes and culture to deliver sustained success on the pitch. This has included successful overhauls of the club’s Academy and recruitment department. "
Therefore John had a big say in the 'successful' overhaul of the recruitment department which gifted us with this rubbish team.
I am glad that you have an idea of what Fletcher does. Rangnick has been in football for decades and he has still to figure out what he does.
I didn't know Rangnick was a Juventus legend.
Exactly, overhaul of the club's academy, and we have seen the success for that, reaching a youth cup final for the first time in 11 years, which shows he can be successful.
United won the U21 league title back in 2013 ie few months before Jon Murtough joined the club. So his 'overhauls' which lead to a youth cup final after 11 years is hardly a great achievement in itself. However that's not my point. There's a huge difference between the club's academy and the recruitment department. Now according to the official site the latter had already been successfully overhauled by Murtough prior to him becoming DOF. We all know how successful that overhaul was
Where have I said that?
It’ll be interesting to see whether we get back to being a good team who make serious challenges for silverware under Arnold, and then we can attribute the past decade of malaise down to Woodward.
I have this vision in the back of my head where Woodward told the Glazers he could do it all by himself and they need not worry, and they can stay in Tampa and watch their beloved Buccaneers, which is fine. We can’t force them to love us over the Bucs and we wouldn’t them to parade themselves as big United fans as it would drip with insincerity. I think Hicks and Gillett did that when they were at Liverpool and their fans kinda rolled their eyes at it. It‘s weird since Joel Glazer seems savvy enough to run a sports entity if the Bucs are anything to go by these days, and Bucs fans seem to deem him a good owner and he interviews pretty decently.
So Joel Glazer is more than welcome to run the Bucs as his main focus, but I hope he has delegated wisely with making Arnold effectively CEO this time.
I have this vision in the back of my head where Woodward told the Glazers he could do it all by himself and they need not worry, and they can stay in Tampa and watch their beloved Buccaneers, which is fine. We can’t force them to love us over the Bucs and we wouldn’t them to parade themselves as big United fans as it would drip with insincerity. I think Hicks and Gillett did that when they were at Liverpool and their fans kinda rolled their eyes at it. It‘s weird since Joel Glazer seems savvy enough to run a sports entity if the Bucs are anything to go by these days, and Bucs fans seem to deem him a good owner and he interviews pretty decently.
So Joel Glazer is more than welcome to run the Bucs as his main focus, but I hope he has delegated wisely with making Arnold effectively CEO this time.
Yes, it is obvious the scouting dept takes more than 1 year to show itself. You don't hire a scout today and get results tomorrow.
Its quite funny how you ignore one element, his overhaul of the academy and womens team but focus on the negative only.
Prior to that he was the also premier league head of development so I would say he has experience.
Also, he was reporting to Ole and Woodward, so you don't know the conversations they had in terms of transfers.
Already explained this to you before
Ed not only wanted to be liked but he thought he was a big swinging d*ck from banking (he actually wasnt that senior) and could waltz into football and be the next Perez and build Utd as the next galacticos. Instead others clubs saw a clueless idiot and took the p*ss both literally and metaphorically. Hence the shambles we see before us. Quite why it took so long for him to be outed can only be explained as showing that the Glazers really, really have no interest at all in what happens on the pitch.
Aren't they now getting facilities at Carrington, so that is a good sign, that now Woodward has left things are moving.
The facilities stuff with the women’s team was last year and prior. Not saying they couldn’t have done better, but this season they have their own area at Carrington, although the main building appears to be a temporary more fancy portacabin structure. They have rooms and offices, a gym and recovery. They need to expand Carrington so it’s fully permanent but it’s much improved.
Last official news from the women’s manager this week was they’d have 2 new pitches when they’re back after the summer.
Obviously because nobody in the comms department knows jack about soccer so can't see how mindboggling it is... nor do they have the ability to correct it as none of them could put the names on the pitch in any coherent way.
Mind you, you can't blame them when it's impossible to work out what we are actually playing at once they actually get on the pitch.
Sadly, I'm probably onto something here.
I don't know about that. Woodward has been at United since 2005-2006 and no one really heard about him outside of being the CFO. We don't really need to go far or make strange statements. Woodward was a competent CFO who replaced our previous CEO who was also a competent CFO. Unfortunately Woodward wasn't ready or fit to be a CEO and he also got the job without the security blanket that his predecessor had since our long time manager left the same summer.
If we are being honest, Gill and the Glazers are to blame for most of our issues. They gave an empty to shell to a newly appointed CEO, who had nothing to lean on outside of money.
If they want a women's teams they need good facilities to compete, especially medical facilities.
Typical of the Board to prioritise the Social Media platform over the team and players. Must sell more shirts to make more profit for the Glazers and hope Ten Haag will work a miracle and get us into the top four next season.
Wait, they prioritized the social media platform over the team and players?