Religion, what's the point?

Old Tommy Cooper joke.

I went to the shops to buy a pair of camouflage pants but I couldn't find any.
 
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Proof that God loves dancing

dude-dancing.gif
 
The only people who ever pooh-pooh that kind of think are extremist mulsims and the most ardent antitheists.
 
rednev said:
I'm just watching the Hillsborough memorial service at Anfield.

Why is there is a vicar using the tragedy to spew his cultist Jesus propaganda? What does any of it have to do with the tragedy? They just can't resist the chance to sink their claws in wherever they can...Whenever there's a death, a tragedy or a vulnerable person, they exploit this in order to indoctrinate.
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I got very angry at my mother's funeral which was the classic Catholic job. The hymns and ritual were comforting in a way but the 'she's gone to a better place' schtick was insulting and enraging.
 
peterstorey said:
I got very angry at my mother's funeral which was the classic Catholic job. The hymns and ritual were comforting in a way but the 'she's gone to a better place' schtick was insulting and enraging.
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My Dad's funeral wasn't religious and we didn't bother for my Mum as there was only us who knew her. Now we have 2 boxes of ashes and no idea what to do with them.
 
It was the right thing to do for my mum and everybody else, the classic stuff 'remember man that thou art dust and unto dust thou wilt return' was moving, and the rest of the rite was OK. The priest added all the crap about better place etc, etc.
 
If my Mum's marbles hadn't rolled significantly I might well have gone down the religious route for my Dad but I could have made it a Scientology/Bollywood fusion and she wouldn't have noticed. As it was the hardest things was to get her to stop heckling me during the eulogy.
 
My mother was as sharp as a tack until the day she died, I think it has been very painful for friends who've had to cope with mental disintegration on the road to death.
 
It is really shit. My Dad went the whole way with dementia. Hideous to watch. My Mum died of a heart attack while in hospital for something else (actually waiting for the ambulance to take her back to the nursing home) which wasn't a bad thing as she was getting worse and worse mentally and incontinence and worse was in her immediate future.
 
tough to hear Wibbs. both my parents went with heart attacks.....the thing is I was not prepared to let them go.....think I never got over both of them leaving...my dad was the toughest guy I knew...but he just gave up after my mum went...and he died about a year after...

it took me years to get over.....perhaps I never did....I still sometimes wake up in the middle of the night calling my dad....
 
My mate's ma had cancer but was too mentally incompetent to understand it - truly horrific.
 
Wibble said:
Wait? What?

Dancing and music are going against Allah? Surely not?
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Obviously it depends on which absolutely definitely true and unavoidably correct single interpretation you go with. Most sensible muslims would say it's all about your intentions. A lot of those against simply think women dancing with men is haram (I say simply to give them undeserved credit for being comparatively low on the oppressive misogyny scale) but some will go as far as declaring all music haram. I'm sure Quakers or the Amish wouldn't be too happy with this kind of shit either. It's amazing how many people define their faith by how many fun things they can resist doing.
 
Red Dreams said:
tough to hear Wibbs. both my parents went with heart attacks.....the thing is I was not prepared to let them go.....think I never got over both of them leaving...my dad was the toughest guy I knew...but he just gave up after my mum went...and he died about a year after...

it took me years to get over.....perhaps I never did....I still sometimes wake up in the middle of the night calling my dad....
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That is tough for you. I guess the consolation is that it isn't the worst way to go for them.
 
Mockney said:
Obviously it depends on which absolutely definitely true and unavoidably correct single interpretation you go with. Most sensible muslims would say it's all about your intentions. A lot of those against simply think women dancing with men is haram (I say simply to give them undeserved credit for being comparatively low on the oppressive misogyny scale) but some will go as far as declaring all music haram. I'm sure Quakers or the Amish wouldn't be too happy with this kind of shit either. It's amazing how many people define their faith by how many fun things they can resist doing.
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All very odd
 
Were you/they young? I found some comfort in that my parents were both in their mid 80's and both in terminal decline when they died. Particularity in my Dad's case as he was petty much a vegetable by the end with advanced Alzheimer's and a brain hemorrhage from a fall. My wife's Father and Uncle was murdered in NI when she was 12 which is of course an entirely different level of trauma.
 
peterstorey said:
I got very angry at my mother's funeral which was the classic Catholic job. The hymns and ritual were comforting in a way but the 'she's gone to a better place' schtick was insulting and enraging.
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I have a relative whose young son died a couple of years ago. He is a staunch atheist and despises religion but had to put up with an OTT religious funeral because his wife (who he was separating from) thought it was the right thing to do, even though she wasn't particularly religious. I can't imagine what he was thinking when the vicar was talking the usual bollocks.
 
Wibble said:
Were you/they young? I found some comfort in that my parents were both in their mid 80's and both in terminal decline when they died. Particularity in my Dad's case as he was petty much a vegetable by the end with advanced Alzheimer's and a brain hemorrhage from a fall. My wife's Father and Uncle was murdered in NI when she was 12 which is of course an entirely different level of trauma.
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yeah man...they were relatively young...it made me 'hover' over my children especially my girl...not good...worry...you know. funny cause I used to get into crazy things......when I was younger...I mean I am lucky to be alive...to have lived this long...have never been afraid to die...except worry what will happen to my wife and kids...but the kids are older...but still I get nervous when one of em is not where they were supposed to be. Should have got counselling...but never did.
 
rednev said:
I have a relative whose young son died a couple of years ago. He is a staunch atheist and despises religion but had to put up with an OTT religious funeral because his wife (who he was separating from) thought it was the right thing to do, even though she wasn't particularly religious. I can't imagine what he was thinking when the vicar was talking the usual bollocks.
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He will have been incandescent with rage but unable to do anything about it, without causing a lot more grief.
 
So a government minister in Spain has decided to give the country's top policing award (usually reserved for officers who have died in duty) to a statue of the Virgin Mary.

Spain's government is being taken to court over a minister's decision to give the country's top policing award to a statue of the Virgin Mary.

The country's interior minister, Jorge Fernández Díaz, singled out an icon of the Virgin Mary, in Málaga, to receive the gold medal of police merit – which is normally reserved for police who have died in terrorist attacks.

Announcing the award in February, Díaz lauded the Virgin and her congregation for "maintaining a close collaboration with police, particularly during the acts celebrated in Holy Week, and for sharing police values such as dedication, caring, solidarity and sacrifice".

The award has infuriated secularists, who are demanding the medal be revoked, given that the Virgin and her congregation had "failed" to meet any of the minimum requirements.

"The norm specifies clearly that the medal is given to people not immaterial beings," said Francisco Delgado, of Secular Europe. "It's meant to recognise exceptional acts of service by police."

His group has joined forces with the Movement Towards A Secular State (Movimiento hacia un estado laico) to bring the interior minister to court. The case will be heard in June.

Although Spain's 1978 constitution enshrines the separation of church and state, the boundary between the two remains blurred, said Delgado, whose organisation was created in 2001 by a group of professors dismayed at the slow pace of Spain's transition to secularism.

"There are still so many ties to the church that Spain has never got rid of. The Spanish state still provides millions of euros a year to the Catholic church, there are Catholic schools financed heavily by the state."

This year the interior minister was taken to task by the opposition for saying that Saint Teresa was "making important intercessions" for Spain "during these tough times".

The Virgin Mary, in Málaga, is not the only Virgin to have been recognised by the minister. In 2012, the Guardia Civil's highest honour was granted to Zaragoza's Virgin of Pillar, the institution's patron saint. In the decree, Díaz said the award paid tribute to the "deep roots of the patronage of the Virgin of Pillar, which remains part of the heritage of the Guardia Civil".

Still, the medal awarded in February caught the national police by surprise.

José María Benito, from the police officers' union, told the online daily El Boletín: "Give the Virgin whatever you like, take her some flowers, make her the patron saint of our people, but don't give her a police medal, least of all one reserved for police officers who have lost their lives in an attack."As the government muddies the line between church and state, Delgado's group has consistently lodged complaints. However they had shied away from court action until now, said Delgado. "The little separation between political and judicial power in Spain means that the justice system often sides with politicians."

This time the clear-cut nature of this case emboldened them to take the risk, he said. "We thought it time the courts pronounced on these acts that seem to be more from the 18th century than the 21st." The case will be heard in June.
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http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/29/spanish-govt-court-after-award-given-to-virgin-mary

With men like Jorge Diaz in positions of power, it's good to know the the countries of Europe are in good hands.
 
peterstorey said:
I got very angry at my mother's funeral which was the classic Catholic job. The hymns and ritual were comforting in a way but the 'she's gone to a better place' schtick was insulting and enraging.
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2 weeks ago I attended the funeral of a friend's uncle, who passed away at 44 and left a wife and 4 kids. The ceremony was heartbreaking enough, but the officiating pastor kept on urging the saddened congregation to "cheer up, because he is in a better place and god has a plan". Infuriating.
 
Mockney said:
Obviously it depends on which absolutely definitely true and unavoidably correct single interpretation you go with. Most sensible muslims would say it's all about your intentions. A lot of those against simply think women dancing with men is haram (I say simply to give them undeserved credit for being comparatively low on the oppressive misogyny scale) but some will go as far as declaring all music haram. I'm sure Quakers or the Amish wouldn't be too happy with this kind of shit either. It's amazing how many people define their faith by how many fun things they can resist doing.
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But Mocks, why would you dance and be happy when you could be performing a pilgrimage while lashing your backside?
 
rednev said:
I have a relative whose young son died a couple of years ago. He is a staunch atheist and despises religion but had to put up with an OTT religious funeral because his wife (who he was separating from) thought it was the right thing to do, even though she wasn't particularly religious. I can't imagine what he was thinking when the vicar was talking the usual bollocks.
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Went through a similar OTT funeral when an ex-gf offed herself. Her mother's side (poor, uneducated, religious) held a funeral at their church while the father's side (well off, educated, nonreligious) sat there just taking it in (her parents had been split for many years). I sat there in disbelief when this pastor went into a thirty-minute speech on suicide and God's salvation. 1) I don't care for your religious views, and 2) this is not the time for your personal beliefs, was how I felt about this pastor's sermon at a funeral. I didn't know the mother's side but was acquaintances with most of her father's side. I asked about their thoughts towards the sermon and almost all of them were quite put off by it.
 
On face value, there's no way I can actually take what I read in the Bible as proof that the Christian God exists. The Bible itself is so vague in its meanings that you can't actually take what you read to be facts. So I decided to google some of the answers, and the one that struck me the most was how most debates end with 2 words, "Holy Spirit".

The one thing I'm really curious about is how people can say that the Bible becomes clearer as the "Holy Spirit" or something of that sort guides you into understanding the book better and that's the reason why they believe in Christianity. I mean, if someone already understands the Bible after the "Holy Spirit" guided them, why isn't there a guide that actually makes it clearer for people like me to understand the Bible?

Okay, so you can say that the "Holy Spirit" is different for everyone. But how can it be possibly different for everyone, are you saying that I should be interpreting the Bible differently from the person next to me? Does that make any sense at all?
 
Apologies folks, the other thread got wiped during a botched merge attempt. Use this one instead.
 
I posted for the first time in that thread and then you murdered it. I could start thinking you had it in for me. :)
 
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