Redcafe Champions League Draft - Theon v NM/BD

[Theon]

Yeah for Fergus that is how I would use Messi Gio, I said the same to him.

I think Ronaldinho/Zidane is a better fit for his team though, but if he goes Messi Team Theon will welcome Ronnie with open arms.

BTW - the plan was to do the same as the AllTime Draft and make the draw before the picks, is that okay with everyone? It seemed to work alright in that draft and it helps remove the element of luck from the game i.e one team can draft an exceptional striker force but then get drawn against another team with brilliant strikers (so no reinforcement help for the semis), whereas another team can draft an exceptional midfield and then get lucky and be drawn against a complimentary team with amazing forwards (so huge help for the semis).

The idea of this way is that its fairer and puts everyone on the same page, you all know who you are up against so it removes the element of luck.

But this is open to you guys to decide, I am easy either way.

 

[Moby]

Yeah for Fergus that is how I would use Messi Gio, I said the same to him.

I think Ronaldinho/Zidane is a better fit for his team though, but if he goes Messi Team Theon will welcome Ronnie with open arms.

Throwing away the diamond then? (Both literally and figuratively).

 

[Theon]

Throwing away the diamond then? (Both literally and figuratively).

Probably not, formations overlap so much that they can be pictured in different ways.

If I had him he would play slightly ahead of Iniesta, as the deeper lying forward position where Kluivert played here, but would be much more natural at peeling out to the left and offering width - something Kluivert was rightly criticised for not doing. Then Crespo/etc would be the typical number 9.

You could draw the formation in virtually the same way that it is now, maybe move Ronaldinho slightly closer to Iniesta but it would still be virtually the same. Brazil played a similar staggered front three when they won the 2002 World Cup - Ronaldinho slightly deeper than Rivaldo, who was slightly deeper than Ronaldo.

He would be the ideal pick for you though I imagine, you could move Hagi infield and Ronaldinho feeding Romario is worthy of winning the draft.

 

[Moby]

Not sure how well he would work in that role. He's always been a left winger playmaker. AM at best, but in a front two, not sure at all. You could have had Aguero on the right with Iniesta through the middle in a 4-3-3 which would have him in his natural position. But then the midfield goes tits up.

 

[Theon]

Not sure how well he would work in that role. He's always been a left winger playmaker. AM at best, but in a front two, not sure at all. You could have had Aguero on the right with Iniesta through the middle in a 4-3-3 which would have him in his natural position. But then the midfield goes tits up.

He played there for Brazil.

As I said though, it isn't really a front two as Crespo/whoever is the actual striker. Ronaldinho is deeper with Iniesta, christmas tree/diamond either or would be virtually the same. Milan played the same way with Rui Costa and Kaka in the same side behind Shevchenko

 

[antohan]

Right. I was sleepy. I meant De Rossi when talking about Roma, but I was half asleep. I do remember the 2007 matches against Milan. To be fair, we did well (302 at OT) but then got thumped 3-0 in the middle of a title challenge at the San Siro..

I have no clue how I came up with Inzaghi. Sorry about that!

I noticed you had typed Inzaghi instead of De Rossi there but whe I read it you had done it ages ago and no one had picked it up. I treated it as an experiment, if no one queried I would stop writing on these threads.

 

[antohan]

Yeah that is absolutely true, Roma had that three at the back and Brazil played three at the back with Lucio/R Junior/Edmilson - but yeah, as you mention the point was just that he has played the right flank all on his own, in similar if not idenetical systems

Edmilson wasn't a permanent back three fixture though. He was deployed as an anchor who would drop back as a third CB. Brazil was 2-3-2-2-1 if you want the 5-4-1 broken up explicitly.

Roma did play with a sweeper.

That's why I queried in an earlier game what people thought about those different approaches.

 

[antohan]

@Aldo only talking up the Zidane and Messi case for Fergus and questioning how Theon would use Ronnie.

Obvious wolf, you can see those teeth a mile away

 

[Gio]

The pair (Theon/Aldo) of you are as transparent as each other.

 

[antohan]

Mmmm... reckon Theon may surprise us.

I would start planning life without Ronnie if I were Aldo, surely you would nab him for your right wing?

Cue Ronnie not being good enough there

 

[antohan]

Since NM himself has agreed this is done and dusted, should I draw the next matchups? I'm not sure I will be around when this finishes and it may be best for you guys to know what it implies instead of running draft scenarios for an umpteenth time

 

[antohan]

BTW, I agree with Theon that worked in the All-time one. There is an element of preparing for your oppo, almost no element of picking people so they can't and more than anything it allows you to take some calculated risks in full knowledge of what the reward at the end of the tunnel is.

For example, whoever faces Tito would probably want to get Ronaldo next and would pick here hoping for that striker to join and a non-CL spot to materialise. It's important information which doing the draft blind takes away from you, making the luck of the draw later have a greater impact than it should.

 

[Gio]

Yeah I'm not fussed Anto, crack on.

 

[antohan]

It would be driving me up the wall not to know! OK, I'll put you chaps out of your misery then.

 

[antohan]

Quick, over to the main thread!

 

[Cutch]

Points -
-You like the Milan/Italy/Roma links, but not my Arsenal,Chelsea,BArcelona links? My links are more proven, and with better teams.

As i was saying, i don't particularly rate Gilberto or Giuly. Good enough players but relative to others in the draft, not as good. Appreciate the effort you's made getting those partnerships together but it comes down to personal preference at the end of the day.

-Those fullbacks can provide width against Figo and Maicon on the other flank? Really? Theon is brainwashing a bit here

Cafu in particular will always provide width, doesn't matter who he's up against. The mans a machine. Candela while not as good has experience of being asked to do the same. I was satisfied width wouldn't be a problem for Theon, and i usually hate diamonds!

-Iniesta and Pirlo? I knew some United fans would be a little upst with a midfield of two of the best Chelsea and Arsenal midfielders ever, but ignoring Lampard and Vieiera is a bit sad

Its not ignoring them. I'm the guy that planned for a complete chelsea back 5. I've previously drafted players like Gerrard and Drogba. I don't mind picking cnuts when i have to. Pirlo and Iniesta are 2 of the greats but, so your 2 just fall short imo.

- Pace doesn't help them as Lloris will sweep balls over the top up.. And if you think Nadal can handle Barcelona but that Vidic will have any trouble with Crespo/Kluivert, I reckon you are massively overrating them. Especially Kluivert.

While not a huge fan of Nadal, i thought he was almost the best player to have to mark Drogba. I think Crespo/Kluivert did have the pace and power to worry your 2 centrehalfs, and i don't expect a keeper to be able to sweep up everything.

-Gilberto is there to do a job - You may not rate him, but without him, there would be no 50 game unbeaten streak. Giuly was specifically picked to counter other midfields in the draft - he can drift in, adding a body to midfield, and making Theon's midfield life a lot more difficult.

Fair enough, still don't rate them as highly as their opposite numbers.

You were very unlucky. I think i picked your team out at the start as being one of the strongest. I liked the physicality it had, with proven winners. Theon was just a terrible draw for you.

 

[Moby]

@Aldo only talking up the Zidane and Messi case for Fergus and questioning how Theon would use Ronnie.

Obvious wolf, you can see those teeth a mile away

Ssshhh!