Rasmus Hojlund (Out)

The biggest problem for me is that Hojlund doesn't have any stand out abilities which would gather my patience.

Zirkzee for example is less clinical but atleast he has some decent hold up play and some skill moves that makes me more patient about his development.

Hojlund from the start of his united career has been a bit of an uninvolved tap in merchant except from a few nice goals vs Newcastle & Tottenham.

I don't think his finishing is exactly jaw dropping either because he is never in the right spot at the right time.

I think he has regressed with both speed and pressing aswell & Zirkzee seems to be upping his pressing game to seem like there's nothing really between the two.
 
Havak said:
I know he's struggled, but I'm quite surprised at the reaction in this thread!

I'm not going to do the stat-digging for comparisons, but Hojlund has 50 career goals at senior level (plus 7 international goals) at the age of 21. It would be interesting to see how this compares to some of the best forwards we've seen at that age across Europe when they were the same age. I get that more is expected of young players these days, but it doesn't mean every single one has to achieve that standard right away. I wonder what Ronaldo, van Persie, van Nistelrooy, Kane etc were doing at that age?

He has to improve in every area, but he has 23 goals in 71 for us. 12 in 48 PL games which is 1 in 4... We really should have a both a better team around him and an experienced striker playing more than him at this point, but we don't. I don't think he's someone we should be writing off by the time he's age 22. So many attacking players don't start to produce until they're 22-23.

Madness.
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Out of those 48 games, he hasn't scored in 36 of them.
 
golden_blunder said:
Was starting to play well, that animal shaw broke his leg, we signed Cantona as his replacement and the rest is history. I wouldn’t call him a flop
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Won us the game against Southampton after two opening defeats. That set us on a great journey. Yeah unlucky but he was a decent player.
 
Paul778 said:
Think Falcao was worse than all of the above. Just wasn't interested.
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Falcao's spell at the club was poor, no doubt. But it was clear he hadn't fully recovered from the ACL injury he'd sustained the previous year, which hugely impacted his mobility. Nothing at all to do with his application and him not being 'interested'.
 
Swordsman said:
we should get either Viktor or Victor then.
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Who is the better replacement out of those two. Personally think Gyokeres is better all round player but Osimhen is an absolute menace in the air, so it's a tricky one as ideal if we signed someone capable of finding him on a regular basis.
 
Giggsy13 said:
He’s only just turning 22 this season. What happened to having patience with young players given the dumpster fire this club has been from a management and footballing structure standpoint? Ten Hag stunted his development but with time he can thrive under Amorim. We should be looking at a stop gap option to perhaps lift the pressure off him and Zirkzee. Someone like Welbeck for example would be a decent short term option given the club’s finances.
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We are in-between a rock and a hard place, we need to sell before buying, but we also do not have the luxury of waiting to see if he develops. For the money we paid we needed a bonafide starter not a project striker.

And we should not make that mistake again, historically we have always gone for the finished article up front, it's too much of a crucial position.
 
Seems a bit hasty to me. There’s a player in there somewhere, and he’s only 21. If we’re only going to get back half of what we paid, why not see if we can improve him? I understand a new coach needs his players, but at the same time isn’t he also expected to actually coach some of them and improve them?
 
This is a non-story. Hojlunds performances have been terrible (True) + United will sell any player at the right price (True) + Juventus/Milan have been generally in the market for forwards (True) = Lets make up something

The club won't sell him for anything less than approx. £45m this window or approx. £38m in the summer (based on remaining book value excluding any add ons). No club, let alone the Italian clubs would be coming in for him at those fees based on his performances this season. Also no chance that the clubs sells him at a loss no matter what as you have to remember that this is a club that apparently cut stewards bonuses of £50 as a part of cost cuts. Best option would be to loan him out next season away from the pressure and scrutiny at United and allow him to develop.
 
If we do sell him, then that whole 2023 looks awful for us in terms of players brought in and contracts given. Mount - 55-60m pounds while he had year left on his contract, big wages and injured almost all the time. Onana 47m pounds, hardly improvement over De Gea. Hojlund 64-72m pounds, he's young and would write him off but obviously could be gone in summer. Add giving Rashford a 325k wages and a 5 year contract that summer and giving Shaw a 4 year contract. Could turn out worse than 2022 despite Antony signing from that year (and Casemiro fee + contract and wages).
 
I understand why it's a discussion point because Hojlund has been really poor recently but I do still think it'd be a bit premature to sell him.

I think the raw materials are there for him to be a good striker but he's still pretty young and the flaws in his game are pretty telling. He has to make an effort to get on the ball with more regularity, really use his pace and take a lot more shots.
 
BorisManUtd said:
If we do sell him, then that whole 2023 looks awful for us in terms of players brought in and contracts given. Mount - 55-60m pounds while he had year left on his contract, big wages and injured almost all the time. Onana 47m pounds, hardly improvement over De Gea. Hojlund 64-72m pounds, he's young and would write him off but obviously could be gone in summer. Add giving Rashford a 325k wages and a 5 year contract that summer and giving Shaw a 4 year contract. Could turn out worse than 2022 despite Antony signing from that year (and Casemiro fee + contract and wages).
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I remember thinking that at the time
 
I know he's not currently doing it for us, but I am sure he'll be playing well for a big European side within the next few years and come back to haunt us.
 
2 man midfield said:
Seems a bit hasty to me. There’s a player in there somewhere, and he’s only 21. If we’re only going to get back half of what we paid, why not see if we can improve him? I understand a new coach needs his players, but at the same time isn’t he also expected to actually coach some of them and improve them?
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He is...but when? They've barely had actual training time. But that's not the problem to me. It's just that there's nothing in his game that's particularly outstanding. He's not great at being a poacher and he can't create his own opportunities. He's rarely in a good position to receive and when he is, his 1st touch isn't great. He's doesn't have blazing speed and while he's big enough, doesn't win physical battles. I honestly can't remember...are any of the goals he scored with his from a header? I just read that he's had 7 starts (out of 13) this season in which he didn't register a shot. He has only 13 shots in the entire season. There's many fullbacks that have more shots.

It just doesn't seem like he ever really knows where to be. He makes a run that takes himself out of the play or he's hiding behind a defender when there's a chance for a cross in.

I'm not sure if we should give up on him, yet...but we need someone else ahead of him that can be productive because Zirkzee is not ever going to be a volume scorer.
 
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2 man midfield said:
Seems a bit hasty to me. There’s a player in there somewhere, and he’s only 21. If we’re only going to get back half of what we paid, why not see if we can improve him? I understand a new coach needs his players, but at the same time isn’t he also expected to actually coach some of them and improve them?
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I am tempted to agree but also as someone who likes Hojlund and would like to see him do well I actually believe it is in his best interests to get out of this club as fast as he can. Right now the pressure coupled with the behavior of some very toxic fans is clearly beginning to have a very detrimental effect upon him both on and off the pitch.

Signing him at 20, off the back of one season as a backup in Italy, and then making him our main striker was setting him up to fail. The fact that we are a terrible attacking team just compounded that error. He is a United fan and was never going to turn down the move but honestly it was a terrible career choice and he would have been much better off continuing to develop in Atalanta where they had a clear plan for his development. I do think he could be successful here but the move has come far too soon and we are not in a place where we have the stability and structure to develop a raw talent properly.

For those saying he is never going to be good enough, you may be right but I think there is an excellent chance he is scoring 30+ a season for a CL club by his mid twenties, just does not look like it will be us. Many here are wetting themselves with excitement at the notion of Gyokeres and yet at 21 he was going goalless during a loan spell in the Championship with Swansea, players of this age are far from the finished article and making definitive judgements on them is a mugs game.

I hope he gets a move, I hope we get a decent fee and I hope he goes on to smash it wherever he goes because once a red always a red and if nothing else, we will always have the Kyle Walker moment and the legendary FA Cup win celebrations.
 
I’d keep him until the summer then look for a loan to raise his value a bit before selling him

He’s young I’ll give him that but this squad isn’t in the position to carry a striker for possibly 2-3 more years in hope he improves and we need money to reinvest in the team….never looked like a 70m player we’ve been had yet again
 
We really are just going to spend the next 4 transfer windows selling each and everyone of Ten Hag's signings from the pre-INEOS era aren't we? Incredible incompetence but it needs to be done.
 
Paul778 said:
Think Falcao was worse than all of the above. Just wasn't interested.
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Falcao got injured at the same time as Walcott that year with the same cruciate ligament injury and was signing for us in August while Walcott didn’t play until January. He was rushed back from injury and really struggled to maintain his balance if I remember, he slipped a notable amount of times. I don’t think it was a case of lack of interest and more to do with the injury because he was very good then again a few years ago for Monaco. It was still a classic Woodward signing though where he never should have joined, no looking at the fine print that he might struggle after a serious injury.
 
2 man midfield said:
Seems a bit hasty to me. There’s a player in there somewhere, and he’s only 21. If we’re only going to get back half of what we paid, why not see if we can improve him? I understand a new coach needs his players, but at the same time isn’t he also expected to actually coach some of them and improve them?
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I 'd be inclined to see what Ruben can coach into him at the end of the season. At the moment, he's a long way from the standard we require.
 
The basic notion of economy is to buy as cheap as possible and sell as high as possible, we seem to think that doing the exact opposite is the way to go.
We bought Hojlund when he was overhyped and overpaid big time and now, when he is at his lowest point, we want to sell? That's the worst moment possible. Plus he is still young and can improve.
The same happened with Pogba, Rashford to some degree, and many others.
 
Rasmus should be deployed in the final 20-30 minutes of a game we are winning to bully and batter the center backs. He’s a big unit and works better against tired defenders (true of all attackers basically). He has time to sort out his finishing and his back to goal ability. I think a loan would be a good option for him, get him in a team that will give him the ball (not just hopeful points from the goalie) and let him develop. Loans can work. No one is buying him for anything close to what we paid so we should look at his as an asset to be developed.
 
The biggest issue with him vs Zirkzee is, like many have said a lack of essential attributes along with costing circa 70m. Zirkzee has some quality and was cheap enough to give us some time to try develop that. Hojlund has had much more chances and has shown less than even Zirkzee.
 
CM said:
I understand why it's a discussion point because Hojlund has been really poor recently but I do still think it'd be a bit premature to sell him.

I think the raw materials are there for him to be a good striker but he's still pretty young and the flaws in his game are pretty telling. He has to make an effort to get on the ball with more regularity, really use his pace and take a lot more shots.
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Let’s wait he has no value at all.
 
Pretty sure ETH said he was a project striker and not someone for right now but someone for in a few years.

Simply we couldn’t afford to buy a fully developed striker at the time (Kane) and we still probably can’t. Was he the best available option on the market at the time, debatable. I think he has something, he just needs development and for our team to actually function.

However it looks like from now on our shopping is going to be development talent, so expect a few more Rasmus’s before we find ourselves back in a financial position to be able to buy more fully developed players.
 
Feel like we couldn't get too much for him now but if we can then by all means, get rid. He's at an age where he needs to be playing, but playing here is doing nothing for his development as he's not ready for this league. He needs to play in a league that is closer to his level, with less pressure. There's no use being a backup here if we buy a CF because at that point, he'll never actually develop into anything anyway if hes just a backup here.
 
Sell him while he still has some value. I said in his player performance thread that he has no world class attributes. For the size of him, he's weak as piss physically. Can't get my head around that. Constantly falling over. He's 100% not worth being patient with. He was diabolical against Fulham. Like really really bad. For 72M you'd want to be doing more than running around, Rasmus.
 
Prefer a loan for him to raise his confidence in an environment suited for him, and raise his value. Atalanta are in a title challenge and may want to have another option in someone who’s already been proven to be good there.
 
UnitedSofa said:
He will make it here if there’s someone who can help him, expecting him to lead the line at 21 was ridiculous
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Sesko is the same age as him and he bangs in goals. He’ll make it if he’s good at the simple things but he can’t even hold up the ball.
 
I don't think his stock is that high. The max we'd get for him is €20/25 million.

I think we could potentially get £35 million. I am probably being optimistic, but we might be able to play on his promise he showed at Atalanta and his age. Was really hoping Amorim could do something similar to what he did with Gykoress . But has gone backwards.
 
Florida Man said:
Prefer a loan for him to raise his confidence in an environment suited for him, and raise his value. Atalanta are in a title challenge and may want to have another option in someone who’s already been proven to be good there.
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We should do a loan swap with juventus. We take Vlahovic and they take Hojlund on loan.
 
DJ_21 said:
Sesko is the same age as him and he bangs in goals. He’ll make it if he’s good at the simple things but he can’t even hold up the ball.
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Man Sesko is only getting rated this highly because you lot dont watch him every week. He would be eaten alive here.
 
No more young strikers, our next stop should be a loan for now and Gyokeres in the summer.
 
Hojlund is not playing well. But it is hard to play well if the ball is not being passed to you only launched at you. Check the Opta Analyst for the Fulham match not one United player has a pass map to Hojlund. He and Zirkzee are really living on scraps. United are too slow with their passing into the forwards as can be seen with Maguire's 33 passes to Martinez and his next highest number of passes to De Ligt at 18. If only United had some players with speed in the wide areas or up front who can take on players with a quick release ball?

With an XG of 0.25 how can any forward do well?

On the other side of this argument Hojlund dosen't put himself about enough of make run's across the box enough.

One final question who would work in this slow system we are using now?
 
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