Their options in central midfield have been much stronger than ours on paper for the last four seasons in a row.
From what i have seen, i think hes good on the ball, can move well with it, can pick a pass, hes quick, good in the air and can make a tackle. Hes a box to box player. Unlike Mikel, he will break the lines and burst though. Hes a dynamic player, like Essien. Oh, and he can score goals.
Im not claiming i have watched him for a long period of time, like the Chelsea scouts will have. But i have seen him as much as the muppets in the Ozil thread have seen Ozil.
True enough but ours rather alarmingly seem to be getting weaker and Chelsea’s going the other way, Carricks woefully out of form, Scholes is in all probability in his last year and Andersons out until late September and itll take him a while to get back up to speed after such an injury, we only really have Fletcher as a banker so to speak who we can rely on in there.
Well, you do have a tendency to unervalue United players.
Carrick
Scholes
Fletcher
Anderson
Giggs
Park
Looks like a good number of options there...
Well, you do have a tendency to unervalue United players.
Carrick
Scholes
Fletcher
Anderson
Giggs
Park
Looks like a good number of options there...
See my last post as to why im slightly concerned, its not about 'undervalueing' anyone its about looking at our options in a realistic light.
And Parks not a central midfield player.
Carrick - shit last season.
Scholes - quality, but on his last legs.
Fletcher - top player.
Anderson - more interested in going out drinking and cant keep control of a car. Suffering from whiplash.
Giggs - legend, but again, not long let on the clock.
Park - good player. Not really a match winner though.
Three games?
I reckon I probably count as one of the muppets in the Ozil thread and I've watched him in more than just the games in the WC, most memorably tearing the England U-21s a new arsehole.
Bit unfair to make such a definitive assessment of Chelsea's new signing after watching him in just three games, whilst simultaneously taking the piss out of people in another thread for deciding Ozil would be a great signing for United.
He is, if Malouda and Kakuta are included on Chelsea's list.
I can play this game too:
Essien - always out injured
Lampard - top player.
Ramires - unproven.
Mikel - a poor man's Makelele
Malouda - not really a central midfielder
Kakuta - unproven
Malouda looked pretty damn good in midfield last season. One of the reasons Chelsea won the league, imo.
You can put question maks against many players, but for me the big difference between the Chelsea and United midfield is that Giggs and Scholes maybe only have a season left.
The sad thing is if we had our full compliment available (and firing) id be more than confident in our options and confidently say our midfield was as good as anything in the league, the trouble is ones permanently dead, the others lost his balls, another’s recovering from a cruciate ligament injury and the other 2 are a combined age of 71!
Which leaves Fletcher.
So you are basically discounting any positive contribution from Carrick (because his form last season wasn't superb), from Anderson (because he's out injured for a couple of months) and from Scholes and Giggs (because of their age)?
No, thats not what i said at all.
No, thats not what i said at all.
No, thats not what i said at all.
Im saying when you combine the issues each and every one of those has it makes us rather brittle in an area of the field our main rivals are not….in my opinion which im quite within my rights to express on a forum.
No, its basically not.
By all means, of course you are within your rights.
But you have to expect people questioning your opinions as well.
I am of the opinion that United's midfield "issues" are overhyped, and don't understand how United fans so often underrate our players compared to players at other clubs.
What difference does that make for the coming season?
Are future seasons not important?
By all means, of course you are within your rights.
But you have to expect people questioning your opinions as well.
I am of the opinion that United's midfield "issues" are overhyped, and don't understand how United fans so often underrate our players compared to players at other clubs.
To be fair we don't have the kind of quality in midfield that we'd like.
Chelsea have Lampard and Essien who are top class players and the amongst the best players in the world at what they do (albiet I don't rate Lampard as highly as most do, he's extremely good at what he does). In addition they have Malouda who was brilliant last season and you have three midfielders there who can change games on their own, consistently.
I can't think of anyone we have in midfield of that quality, the highest quality. Fletcher is the best we have but he's just a notch below the likes of Essien and Lampard. Maybe Nani can get there but we'll have to wait and see. So IMO whether in terms of top players or goal threat our midfield is lacking compared to Chelsea's.
To be fair we don't have the kind of quality in midfield that we'd like.
Chelsea have Lampard and Essien who are top class players and the amongst the best players in the world at what they do (albiet I don't rate Lampard as highly as most do, he's extremely good at what he does). In addition they have Malouda who was brilliant last season and you have three midfielders there who can change games on their own, consistently.
I can't think of anyone we have in midfield of that quality, the highest quality. Fletcher is the best we have but he's just a notch below the likes of Essien and Lampard. Maybe Nani can get there but we'll have to wait and see. So IMO whether in terms of top players or goal threat our midfield is lacking compared to Chelsea's.
Fletcher is as good as Lampard in my opinion, just a different type of player.
We haven't got an Essien, granted. But they haven't got a player like Scholes, nor a player who can do what Carrick does when on form.
Nor have they got the quality on the wings that we have, seeing as you mention Nani.
Seeing as you're now including wide men in the discussion is there any reason you've decided not to mention Antonio Valencia and Ji Sung ParK?
Every season is important.
The current season is the most important. Always is.
If Scholes and Giggs play to their normal standard this season, and it happens to be their last season, why is that a problem?
They aren't top quality. I like Valencia and he's a very good player, but isn't there yet.
I can play this game too:
Essien - always out injured
Lampard - top player.
Ramires - unproven.
Mikel - a poor man's Makelele
Malouda - not really a central midfielder
Kakuta - unproven
What difference does that make for the coming season?
They are.
To be fair we don't have the kind of quality in midfield that we'd like.
Chelsea have Lampard and Essien who are top class players and the amongst the best players in the world at what they do (albiet I don't rate Lampard as highly as most do, he's extremely good at what he does). In addition they have Malouda who was brilliant last season and you have three midfielders there who can change games on their own, consistently.
I can't think of anyone we have in midfield of that quality, the highest quality. Fletcher is the best we have but he's just a notch below the likes of Essien and Lampard. Maybe Nani can get there but we'll have to wait and see. So IMO whether in terms of top players or goal threat our midfield is lacking compared to Chelsea's.
You misunderstood my post.The Essien thing really gets on my tits.
In his last two seasons, he has made 40 appearances. So the last time he was at his best was 07-08.
Fletcher has consistently been more influential for us than Essien has been for Chelsea in the past two seasons.
Really, Fletcher is every bit as good as Essien. Fletcher has been helping United in big games consistently for a long time now. Essien has, seemingly, been winning games from the treatment room, such are his powers.
Oh, and on the goalscoring front:
Essien - 21 in 179.
Fletcher - 18 in 255.
So lets not make out that he's significantly more dangerous as a goal threat either.
You're extremely biased. Valencia and Park as good as Lampard and Essien now?
Interesting.
You misunderstood my post.
Lampard and Malouda were the goal threats according to my post.
And no he isn't as good as Essien. He hasn't been fit so Fletcher being more influential means nothing. Essien is right up there with the best midfielders in the world. Fletcher is not on his level.
You misunderstood my post.
Lampard and Malouda were the goal threats according to my post.
And no he isn't as good as Essien. He hasn't been fit so Fletcher being more influential means nothing. Essien is right up there with the best midfielders in the world. Fletcher is not on his level.
No one thinking that he's a bit lightweight for the Premier league?
Essien is a much better player than Fletcher, and that's not to say Fletcher isn't a quality player. But let's not get carried away there.
