Ralf Rangnick's consultancy role has been scrapped

[Judge Red]

When he said we needed ten new players, the eleventh was De Gea. So there’s that.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

One of the most disrespected people that's been at our club.

 

[Rolaholic]

One of the most disrespected people that's been at our club.

People were claiming that his gripes about the club were simply him deflecting from his management job but he's a very competent and self aware individual.

He was the one seeing the clubs ins an
outs and seeing the players daily so he formulated his opinion based on that. An opinion that's far more qualified coming from within and without political agenda than so many external pundits and opposition fans who always have an agenda to push.

Now who's laughing/crying out?

He didn't come to his conclusions for shits and giggles, he pulled it out of what he saw with his very own eyes and he was slated and eventually sacked for it.

 

[izec]

We should have given him more or less Murtough's role and consulted with him on a manager that wanted to work with him before Austria came in.

 

[Leftback99]

Yes he was a shit manager but absolutely nothing that he ever said about the club and what we needed and had to do to move forward has been proven wrong...

To the contrary, he's being vindicated each day after being let go

True but nothing he said was anything groundbreaking. I said it all myself.

 

[Rolaholic]

True but nothing he said was anything groundbreaking. I said it all myself.

It wasn't because it's what the fans who watch the club day in and day out had already identified but it was groundbreaking in that it came from someone actually hired by and working for the club.

One would've thought that the call coming from inside the house would've been enough to truly alarm them and push them into action but it wasn't and none of the advice was heeded.

Here we are now with the same melts who worked with Woodward for years being the ones that we're supposed to believe will make the changes necessary to stop the rut...

It's depressing really

 

[R'hllor]

Dunno why people mentioning whole need for 10 new players, when in reality he was so wrong, real number is 20 plus but hey, thats not important, he is clueless because we didnt end up in top 4, imagine us in CL among top dogs, we would be nothing but a bitch for them to hopping on, just like in last few years.

 

[Kag]

I dread to think how much they paid him to keep his mouth shut.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

Right now if I was Arnold I would be on the phone begging for him to come in and replace Murtough

 

[Member 117152]

True but nothing he said was anything groundbreaking. I said it all myself.

People like that should be kept because they improve standards. This was Rangnick’s ability backroom wise he’s great and someone who knows what a well run club looks like.

Instead we hire him as manager and then say not good enough screw him. United are the failures here not Rangnick. I would much rather him than any of our backroom staff btw.

When you have good honest people it can breed a culture of positivity leading to success. We don’t.

Our club has silos both behind the team and in it. The owners simply want to keep it that way so nothing changes and they can hide in America. Everything is fragmented.

 

[led_scholes]

People are deluded thinking that any other manager, bar Conte or Simeone could have achieved top 4. We see again that these players are unable to adapt. Add the no transfer policy, and losing MG, then you have all the ingredients for failure.

 

[Acheron]

At the time it looked like a bad decision to let him go before his consultancy role even started. It wasn't so much about him, as he isn't the coach ever or the only who can put in place a proper football structure but more about United being so old fashioned and left behind compared to the rest of modern clubs and being so dependant on the manager. So I still believe they need to adopt a different model to stop being a joke of a club.

Ten Hag needs a lot more time but what is concerning is the transfer window and the bunch of dross players United are being linked to, and how much the team ends up paying for mediocre players. It's like there is no planning whatsoever and now they're panicking after two consecutive trashings.

 

[pseudo_canadian]

"Ralf said we're shit and it's making us play shit and prove him right"

What a bunch of fecking fannys

I hate these players.

 

[R'hllor]

I hate these players.

I refuse to believe thats real.

 

[InspiRED]

Cheeky attempt to sneak Ole as a victim. This is the product of his 3 year rebuild. A team that cant attack without shipping 5.

Yeah it’s annoying seeing those posts pop up. ‘I can really see how good Ole was now..’. Yeah. No.

 

[stevoc]

To some extent that's not relevant.

The senior management of any company are paid for their judgement. Sometimes people will make ideas that are not strictly within their remit. However, good business leaders will take note of solid suggestions. Regardless of where they come from.

If you employ someone who has a stellar rep as a Football Director, even if he's not employed as a Football Director, it would seem sensible to listen to him on issues of squad construction. Even if that isn't technically within his job description. You can take the computer says 'no' approach. Of course. However, to me, that would be unwise. That kind of strictly, hierarchical approach to input does not strike me as something that will help any business flourish.

Fair enough seems sensible but my point was if he never actually began his job as a consultant then his infamous assessments and dossiers (if they even exist) wouldn't have came into play because he's not at the club to share them. So while we don't actually know if he ever compiled reports/dossiers for the club or indeed ever handed anything over if he did then we can't say with any degree of certainty that his advice is being ignored.

 

[stevoc]

Misses the point. It doesn't matter how his job was defined because both by personal qualifications and as manager his views are obviously relevant, and also known. Just from public statements we and the whole world know RR thought there were fundamental problems with the squad and the club, which required forceful action. Obviously, he will have shared the same assessment internally in greater detail and clarity. The club clearly is not proceeding on the basis of sharing that assessment. Which means they are not taken seriously, because everyone thinks (correctly) that Ralf wasn't far off. And he's got the on-pitch awfulness to prove it.

It seems that you've missed mine.

And we don't obviously know what he shared privately.

 

[stevoc]

It's worth noting that Ralf's period in charge wasn't even the worst of that season. He had a superior points per game and goal differential than what Ole had before he got sacked. Indeed he was superior than Mourinho was the season he was sacked as well. The league results of all the managers we've had since Fergie in their final season (not counting the couple of games of Carrick and Giggs):

Rangnick 21/22
24 matches
37 points (1.54 points per game)
0 goal difference

Ole 21/22
12 matches
17 points (1.41 points per game)
-1 goal difference

Mourinho 18/19
17 matches
26 points (1.52 points per game)
0 goal difference

LVG
38 matches
66 points (1.73 points per game)
+14 goal difference

Moyes
34 matches
57 points (1.67 points per game)
+16 goal difference

Considering Moyes inherited the defending champions full of absolute winners (albeit on their last legs) and the other three built their teams themselves, I'd say all of them bar LVG were worse in their final seasons than Ralf was. Ralf had a terrible end to the season which makes it feel worse than it was, but before that he was actually doing fairly well (his first 12 games had 7 wins, 4 draws and 1 loss). Don't get me wrong, he obviously didn't do well. But how bad it actually was gets over-stated. Like I said, he wasn't even the worst of that season. Combine that with him taking over a dressing room that obviously had immense problems (thanks to the the previous guy who had done even worse), and I have some sympathy for him. It was bad, but there were things contributing to that that were completely out of his control.

So does Ralf's win ratio stack up when cup games are included?

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

People were claiming that his gripes about the club were simply him deflecting from his management job but he's a very competent and self aware individual.

He was the one seeing the clubs ins an
outs and seeing the players daily so he formulated his opinion based on that. An opinion that's far more qualified coming from within and without political agenda than so many external pundits and opposition fans who always have an agenda to push.

Now who's laughing/crying out?

He didn't come to his conclusions for shits and giggles, he pulled it out of what he saw with his very own eyes and he was slated and eventually sacked for it.

Like an episode of Ramsay's kitchen nightmares isnt it? When he goes in - tells them exactly whats wrong and what they need to do to fix it - goes away and comes back a few months later to see they listened to absolutely nothing and surprise suprise, they went broke.

 

[stevoc]

I was responding directly to someone saying that Ralf's time was the worst half season we've had in a generation. In reality there have been two worse just in the last four seasons (including one in the very same season).

Obviously the others did do better overall, but they were also able to build their own teams and didn't come in to such a bad situation. Once again, I'm not saying Ralf's time wasn't bad. Just that people go overboard about how bad it actually was.

Didn't he have the worst win ratio of any of the post SAF managers?

How does ralf's win ratio over his 31 games stack up against the last 31 games of Ole and Jose?

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

Didn't he have the worst win ratio of any of the post SAF managers?

How does ralf's win ratio over his 31 games stack up against the last 31 games of Ole and Jose?

Probably poorly. Largely irrelevant however. The players had clearly downed tools they werent going to press like that knowing they wouldnt be kept around next year for an interim coach...

 

[Ted Lasso]

DoNt ThROw tHe pLaYErS uNdEr thE bUs...

Open heart surgery needed indeed.

 

[stevoc]

To correct this area, I meant the club will continue with Ralf until they search for a long-term manager which is how I see this. It's obvious, that a new long-term manager will have a different approach and might not go with Ralf.

First, they have written -
" Following this period, Ralf and the club have agreed that he will continue in a consultancy role for a further two years. "
Next, they have written -
“Everyone at the club is looking forward to working with him during the season ahead, and then for a further two years in his advisory role.”

There is something to understand this point, sir. Consultant and Advisory are two different terms and meanings. Indeed, An advisory role is more of long-term involvement with the club whereas a consultant is something specific to the project generally short-term (which I believe, until the end of the season 2021/22)

Like I said before, Ralf had a conversation with Ten hag and later he decided not to be a part of his plan and moved on with a different opportunity or Ten Hag didn't want to work with Ralf. Hard to say, they must have had a detailed conversation after they decided to move apart and the club knows that. It's a little confusing though. That's it!

No honestly mate you've completely misinterpreted the statement and what was actually happening.

He was interim manager until the end of the season and then consultant for 2 years after that. It said it right in the clubs statement.

 

[LARulz]

I always liked him. Yes as a manager he was bollocks but had the right idea and was spot on

It's so fecking infuriating how many times we cut someone cos they point the truth and we don't like it

 

[stevoc]

Probably poorly. Largely irrelevant however. The players had clearly downed tools they werent going to press like that knowing they wouldnt be kept around next year for an interim coach...

Were they working their arses off in the periods that resulted in Jose and Ole getting sacked?

 

[Van Piorsing]

This chap was giving tips in his interview what to do in case of such rot from top to bottom. Couple of straight messages to ETH who was still Ajax bound what's actually waiting on him in few months.

Despite terrible results It was probably the only thing he could do, since someone cut spending in the winter and isolated him from entire process. Then it was just the typical circus of shifting blame on him as he's the manager.

With Pool game upcoming week, Erik next in line it seems.

 

[Sviken]

I never saw him throwing players in the bus, just clear, albeit blunt, and concise plan and suggestions on what needs to be done and how to do it. Ironically I do believe that if he was in Murtough's place, we'd already have a pretty decent squad for less money.

 

[B. Munich]

Why isn't Rangnick currently busy 'building a club' somewhere else if he's some kind of genius at it?

Because no big club will give him the absolute power he wants (and probably needs to this job).
He did it twice with 4th division sides and established them both in the Bundesliga.

He isn't the second coming of Pep or Klopp but he is a seasoned and descent coach. The troubles ETH now experiences don't surprise me at all as he is stuck with the same players and had even less experience.

 

[Oluwaplumpie]

Man would have helped us recruit well... But as usual, the Glazers don't want anyone who tells them the truth around. I loathe ETH for the nonsense he must have said to them during his interviews.

 

[justsomebloke]

It seems that you've missed mine.

And we don't obviously know what he shared privately.

Well then, perhaps you'd like to set me straight?

We don't know what he shared privately no, but on the other hand we have no reason to assume that the recommendations he gave to club contradict the assessment he, rather extraordinarily, made publicly.

 

[Attila]

He was so right about us but the board didn't want to accept the extent of our problems so got rid of him.

Sad state of affairs. We are fecked

 

[Yorkeontop]

One thing I've learned in the post SAF era is that it's a terrible sign when the previous manager starts to become vindicated.

 

[BlueHaze]

His knowledge and expertise in recruitment was literally what we have been crying out for a good many years... He had a good eye for a talent but the Glazer scum got rid of him. Also seemed like ETH didn't rate his opinions at all which if true is a massive shite move from Erik. Our recruitment this summer has been the worst I've witnessed. Absolute worst. Fellaini 10 minutes before deadline didn't beat this shit.

 

[V.O.]

One thing I've learned in the post SAF era is that it's a terrible sign when the previous manager starts to become vindicated.

It's mostly been a conveyer belt of vindicated managers. Almost like they're not the biggest problem.

 

[Foxbatt]

You can't believe the shit some are spouting here. When you look at their moniker the majority of them are the Ole in crowd.
This thread is about his consultancy role and not his managerial position.
Arnold should sack the current DFO and get someone competent like Ralf.

 

[RedPed]

You can't believe the shit some are spouting here. When you look at their moniker the majority of them are the Ole in crowd.
This thread is about his consultancy role and not his managerial position.
Arnold should sack the current DFO and get someone competent like Ralf.

Well considering he fecked off to Austria at the first opportunity and he didn't actually do any 'consultancy' at United, there's not really much to go over is there? And it's not even as if the role was defined so we don't even know what he would have been able to accomplish either.

And there's nothing to really support his competence so why do you keep hankering for a fraud like that?? The way you and the Rangnites lot go on about him, I'm surprised he's just managing Austria and not in some plum position at an elite club. You would have thought he'd be perfect for a project like Newcastle. Why haven't they got his number?

 

[NZT-One]

You can't believe the shit some are spouting here. When you look at their moniker the majority of them are the Ole in crowd.
This thread is about his consultancy role and not his managerial position.
Arnold should sack the current DFO and get someone competent like Ralf.

For what its worth: if we want to avoid ruffing any feathers, just bring in more expertise and let them do the shit together. If people feel comfortable Murtough so be it, then give him the best possible education and proficient advice as close as possible. It isn't rocket science, it is football. Bringing in somebody awesome would be great, but at this point (ironically just like with our midfield) somebody who helps to avoid the biggest feckups would do.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Might have been the best thing that ever happened to us post Fergie if we had kept him. Rumours are Ten Hag didn't want him?

 

[Bastian]

Well considering he fecked off to Austria at the first opportunity and he didn't actually do any 'consultancy' at United, there's not really much to go over is there? And it's not even as if the role was defined so we don't even know what he would have been able to accomplish either.

And there's nothing to really support his competence so why do you keep hankering for a fraud like that?? The way you and the Rangnites lot go on about him, I'm surprised he's just managing Austria and not in some plum position at an elite club. You would have thought he'd be perfect for a project like Newcastle. Why haven't they got his number?

He had quite clearly been frozen out by that stage.

 

[RedPed]

Because no big club will give him the absolute power he wants (and probably needs to this job).
He did it twice with 4th division sides and established them both in the Bundesliga.

He isn't the second coming of Pep or Klopp but he is a seasoned and descent coach. The troubles ETH now experiences don't surprise me at all as he is stuck with the same players and had even less experience.

Well if it's such a surefire thing and guaranteed to bear fruit, why wouldn't they?