When you look at the pattern of players putting in similar performances under different managers, the answer is actually quite simple. Most managers that get sacked usually end up losing the dressing room in some way. They get sacked because objectives could no longer be met, and/or the players are no longer performing to their expected level for whatever reasons.
Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?
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The following players played under Jose and are still here today: Pogba, Rashford, Martial, Matic, Lindelof, Baily, Lingard, Henderson, Mata, Tuanzebe, Shaw and Jones. That's a strong core of players who are now senior squad members with an influential voice in the dressing room.
Now, what's the first thing that springs to mind when you read those names above? The one thing they all share, that common denominator? Yep, bang on. Every last one of those players has, to varying degrees, flattered to deceive in their time at the club.
That core of players helped Jose finish second and win the EL, only to play like relegation candidates the following season, which ultimately saw Jose sacked and replaced by Ole. Then, as if by magic, they went on an 11-game winning streak - beating the likes of Spurs, City and PSG in the CL - before dramatically burning out and finishing the season with a whimper. They gradually progressed over the next two seasons, finishing second ahead of Liverpool and reaching the EL final again, only to play like relegation candidates the following season, which ultimately saw Ole sacked and replaced by Ralf. They played like world-beaters for 30 minutes in Ralf's first game, only to play like relegation candidates for the remaining 60 minutes, which may ultimately see Ralf lose his advisor job. Except it won't, not this time. This time the parasites are getting shipped out so we can begin anew.
Ralf Rangnick might be the worse manager we've ever had, that might be the case. I honestly do not know. The only thing I know for sure is that the ore of players above have been ever-present throughout our worst period in 4 decades. They simply have to go.
Oh FFS, again with the wall post.
Sorry, they weren't meant to turn out that way, but this is what these cnuts do to me
Sorry, they weren't meant to turn out that way, but this is what these cnuts do to me
Statistically he is the worst manager we've had since the early 80's though. Some may resent him but just stating that fact doesn't necessarily indicate that someone does resent him.
I don't mind him, don't dislike him or anything but he's definitely been the worst manager we've had in my 30 odd years following the club.
I don't know mate, I suppose we won't know until a few autobiographies come out. But something went seriously wrong with this group of players this season even before Ralf came in, I don't think he's helped the situation at all. But on the same token I can't heap all the blame on him either.The players have let everyone down, whoever the manager is they are better than they've shown this season.
Some definitely dislike him, I think it's a recency thing though, when LVG was here he was the worst thing since unsliced bread, then JM then OGS. What sets RR apart is he's an interim and interims aren't brought into steady ships nor has he been given much help in terms of signing players.
He is the worst but it belies the situation.
Why does this keep being repeated like it's an either or situation?
So if we'd came 4th this season after putting a few wins together at the end of the season then we wouldn't let ETH rebuild the side?
No they do mate I'm not trying to say some don't hate him. Only pointing out that stating he's been our worst manager in about half a century doesn't mean you despise the guy.
To be fair Interims are usually brought in to do exactly that steady the ship and salvage a season that's going badly.
I have absolutely no idea why anyone is surprised he wasn't allowed to sign any players, when he first came he said the squad was too big now things have gone tits up spectacularly all of a sudden he's telling anyone who will listen he didn't get the players he wanted.
How many clubs would spend tens of millions to sign a load of players for an Interim manager that the permanent manager might not want 6 months later?
I am not sure why it needs to be said to the press during press conferences and interviews when he is here trying to get us to the Champions League.
"Alright lads, so I just spent a while talking to a journalist about how shit you are. Now lets unify this dressing room and get some solid teamwork going, who is with me?"
Like, there are hundreds of people on these forums that have been right about their assesment of the squad. Ralf for all his qualifications has brought nothing to the table and made everything worse. No one in their right mind cant genuinely find it positive that Ralf has thrown everyone but himself under the bus since he got here, and that is all he has achieved.
The only way his time at United will be remembered positively is if his 6 hours a week consultancy results in us signing the next Mane and Haaland. (Just ignoring that our former manager insisted the club sign Haaland and the club refused to do it, but I digress)
Initially when I was critical of Ralf, it was merely of his performance as the manager. But what really rubbed me the wrong way about him was his inability to take any bit of responsibility. Sorta like what it was with Jose for me towards the end of his time here. I don’t dislike him but the quality of him I mentioned is not the one I respect.
This. It’s borderline insanity. Everyone I see defending it wants to play it off as some sort of 4D chess. It’s weird.
A true genious. Put any of us from the forum in his position and we wouldn't be able to expose it as well as he did.
if we had a proper manager we would have walked top four easily.
Even with this disfunctional as feck team, we should have easily been in the CL.
Even with this disfunctional as feck team, we should have easily been in the CL.
It was only a matter of timeI find it amusing, and weird, that so many are desperate to solely pin the blame on the players. Ralf, in the position as interim manager, has failed to the point where we‘re performing worse than we did under Ole. He’s come in, failed to improve us and made us worse. I said it at the very beginning, apart from the opening two matches we’ve looked poor and the numbers also backed up that impression. The bandwagon stated that it was a massive improvement, and we were no longer struggling in defence (
We have an entire group of players underperforming, to the point where we’d be relegation candidates if Ralf managed us for a season, and apparantly this only translates to Ralf exposing the squad, great. If anything, it simply makes Ten Hags job even worse, because when an entire group of players fail it is more likely to be caused by the managers rather than the quality of the players.
nothing of note and should never have been anywhere near the united job but it was only interim and these are usually lower achievers. You aren't going to get some legendary interim or he'd already have a job.
Ralf rangnick reckons we’re signing about 6-8 players in the summer. Can’t see it myself we will probably sign about 3/4 tops. Have we ever signed 6 players in 1 window?
We’re having a pretty drastic clear out.
Pogba, Cavani, Mata, Lingard, Matic and Greenwood are definitely gone. And we already arguably needed a ST/MF/RW.
I can see some promotions to fill squad roles but we do need a starting holding midfielder, a top striker and a right wing - those will be the main signings. And then I can see us making a couple of shrewd moves to bolster the squad.
We aren’t signing 10 players. Nor are we signing 6 first team players. But I can definitely see us signing three bigger players and then a couple of smaller ones.
What is his reputation out of interest? Inventing gegen pressing?
How does that make him the expert on what we need? That's the big question.
How many the season we signed Ole. That was 5 or 6 wasn't it?
Maguire, AWB, James and Bruno in January. The most we have signed in a window was Lvgs 1st summer. Shaw, Herrera, di Maria, Blind, Rojo and falcao
What makes no sense is that the same people giving Ralf a free pass and hailing him are the ones who hated Ole and called him a clown.
“Ralf can’t get a performance of these players because they’re shit, unprofessional etc”
Okay then so surely Ole is excused for the terrible results as he was working with the same players?
“Err… but Ole couldn’t coach…”
Okay so Ralf can, so he’d get better performances with the same group right? Except no, it was the other way round and by some distance.
Ole smashed it as an interim, not because he’s a genius coach (far from it) but he did what an interim does and that is reinvigorate the dressing room, give the players confidence again and get back to basics.
Ralf did the opposite of all these things and ended up with half the win rate Ole had as an interim.
“Ralf can’t get a performance of these players because they’re shit, unprofessional etc”
Okay then so surely Ole is excused for the terrible results as he was working with the same players?
“Err… but Ole couldn’t coach…”
Okay so Ralf can, so he’d get better performances with the same group right? Except no, it was the other way round and by some distance.
Ole smashed it as an interim, not because he’s a genius coach (far from it) but he did what an interim does and that is reinvigorate the dressing room, give the players confidence again and get back to basics.
Ralf did the opposite of all these things and ended up with half the win rate Ole had as an interim.
I would guess one of the major differences is that Ole played a large part in formulating the current crop of players. It would be a bit of an own goal to then use the defence that the players are unprofessional and unsuited to the club's ideals. For Ralf the squad composition is some mitigation as a dealt hand. Not much, but some.
The reality is they've both failed in different ways so what does it really matter who is defended and who isn't. Ole's task was to compete at the top end of the league and we didn't come consistently close and then it went beyond downhill. RR didn't improve things in his tenure.
If he was brought in to be a consultant from the off then he’s done great, but he was brought in to be the manager and he’s failed miserably. I don’t get why that isn’t allowed to be factored in. Yes the players are shit but there is no way the board wrote off top 4 during November, not with the financial risk at play. Baffling.
Not sure that anyone coming in to manage the club would have expected the dire fitness condition Of the team, poor tactical use, disharmony in dressing room and lack of real leaders. Possibly wasn’t the prefect choice, but be honest, Ole and Woodward led the downward spiral, who could have seen that and then improved direction. A somewhat impossible challenge that needs a compete reset.
Absolutely bizarre how everytime I check in on this thread people still talk about Ole. When will you people learn to let go? Two facts are that Ole's gone since long ago and Rangnick completely shat the bed managerially. He failed to get absolutely anything out of this team..
As for the CL, of course it would be nice to see Erik and the team in that competition but at the same time let's not fool ourselves into thinking this core of players deserve CL footie anyway. They are where they are in the table because they deserve it. Because they don't work hard enough and more than half of them are not good enough.
I like ETH and the fact that Ralf seems to do so as well. One thing I can guarantee is that this club will only move forward if Erik has the bollocks to get rid of all the passengers and build his own side without many of these scum who can't even bother to put a shift in.
As for the CL, of course it would be nice to see Erik and the team in that competition but at the same time let's not fool ourselves into thinking this core of players deserve CL footie anyway. They are where they are in the table because they deserve it. Because they don't work hard enough and more than half of them are not good enough.
I like ETH and the fact that Ralf seems to do so as well. One thing I can guarantee is that this club will only move forward if Erik has the bollocks to get rid of all the passengers and build his own side without many of these scum who can't even bother to put a shift in.
If we sign 6-8 players, will Ralf get any percentage for each of them as a "consultant"?
I don't understand how this man can be our "consultant" not only after this shambles of a job he's done here, where he's shown anything but the acumen required to even be a decent manager, but now that he's accepted the Austria job, what's the point? He'll be too busy dealing with that to be a consultant here. Which is probably for the best anyway.
People tend to forget that about Ole, whether conveniently or not. That's exactly what he did. He came in as interim manager and straight away we went on that amazing 15-game run. Rio was gushing on TV. So was Neville, everybody was. United caved and gave him the permanent gig.
When Ralf came in, he even said himself that he would possibly consider putting himself forward for the manager's job at the end of the season. That was probably at the back of his mind all along when he took the job and no doubt if he had achieved what Ole had done, he might have been part of the four-man shortlist.
But we can all see how his tenure has panned out.
Maybe but it's not like Fletcher would win a game. Relative to what we have even a failed stint as interim manager still has him overqualified for the role. One of his most basic suggestions that one would think would be commons sense is recruitment by profile not by name. For example I'm glad to have Sancho but his ending up as a left winger is so typical of us. Even the Ronaldo transfer, we shoehorned a poaching number 9 between two shot happy inside forwards (greenwood and rashford) and were shocked when it looked dysfunctional. Imo Rangick just spouting occasional common sense is an improvement on what goes on around here.
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This guy is a shit interim manager. Thats all I can say. Hopefully he does a better job as a consultant. Cant wait to see him get the f out of the dugout and to his office desk.
That’s the issue. His reputation as a DOF is signing young talented players and flipping them for a profit a few years down the line. This is what he’s advocating for us going forward. We are not RBL. Our rivals that we want to catch buy the players RBL sign once they’re established, that how you become a top club. Under Ralf’s vision there’s a danger we become a perennial Europa League side dreaming of top 4.
That's it. I've seen some suggest any criticism of Ralph is from ole "fan boys". Rather than criticism of the fact we haven't been any better since Ole left and have had as many thundering as then, but with more failures to beat toilet teams.
Would ole, or Carrick have got us lower than 6th? Doubt it to be honest.
The bar is on the floor. Any novice would be able to do a better job as a consultant than he has as a manager. Our expectations shouldn’t be that low.
This is extremely harsh. The quality of our players is the bar that has never been lower. RR has exposed that so that hopefully our expectations won’t continue to be so low.
I mean I've read some bullshit in this thread on both sides of the argument but the idea that Interim managers aren't brought in to steady the ship and salvage a season has to be right up there. If they're not brought in for that reason you'd have to wonder what the point of sacking your manager and hiring an Interim manager would even be, might as well just keep the manager you have.
I'm interested if everyone means the same thing when they say Ralf has exposed the players. Do some people mean that our atrocious performances and disastrous run of results under Rangnick has exposed the players?
Ralf’s comments along with the players showing their lack of quality well before his arrival and properly downing tools since.
This.
Ralf is a fecking catastrophe. He has left a shit stain on this club worse than Mourinho in his last days.
At least Mourinho brought us some trophies.
The performances and results have been utter shit under him, but they were utter shit before he arrived. He hasn't succeeded in turning our season around, but I have no idea whether that is because he's a terrible coach, or whether this group of players is unmanagable.
What I do know is that the team could be coached by Kermit the frog and it wouldn't be an excuse for the type of performances we've seen this season.
What I do know is that the team could be coached by Kermit the frog and it wouldn't be an excuse for the type of performances we've seen this season.
So Solskjaer was exposing the players too then?
I cited a combination of three independent factors to answer your question and you proceed to highlight only one.
But to answer your question, no Ole scratched and scraped for every excuse he could find for the players throughout his tenure. They exposed themselves with their performances, as I said before.
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