Qatar or Ineos - which owners would you prefer? | Vote now Private

Which owners would you prefer?

  • Qatar

    Votes: 961 62.8%
  • Ineos

    Votes: 570 37.2%

  • Total voters
    1,531
  • Poll closed .
If Ineos gets the club, a lot of fans will be upset but do nothing.

I just wanted to know if Qatar gets the club will the minority against it also do nothing?
 
The thing is, our fanbase is so huge that both The Athletic poll and the the one in this thread is covering such a tiny sample size.

Only a 1000 people have voted in this thread - it's nothing.

It's a decent number to get an idea of fan opinion, I think RedCafe represents our global fanbase quite well too - Im not that sure about who exactly is voting in The Atheltic poll but interesting to get a completely opposite result

I think thats quite rare in these types of poll to get such a wild difference


Polls on Twitter have shown massive support (80%+) in favour of the Qatari bid. In contrast, the polling done by The Athletic and the United We Stand fanzine had the Ratcliffe/Ineos bid with a clear majority of the support.

As always, it's a mixed bag and United fans are of course not a homogenous group - the results will vary wildly depending on which constituency you're asking.

Not sure which Twitter polls you refer to and if they are getting enough votes to make them meaningful - feel free to link them, always good to compare different polls on same question

UWS is definitely more representative of matchgoers though, but even among matchgoers I see a fair bit of distrust of the INEOS bid due to Ratcliffe trying to buy Chelsea and Nice struggling

Really I have massive reservations about both bids but will await more details before making an opinion
 
Funny how our fanbase has trashed the likes of Man City, PSG and Newcastle over the years for their sportswashing, and here we are with 63% of our fanbase wanting the exact same for our club. Some might call that hypocrisy.
I doubt many of our fans even thought about 'sportwashing'. They did think their growth was unfair and their fans plastic, whatever that means, but they thought that about Chelsea in exactly the same way.

If had you said wanting a load of free cash too was hypocritical you would have a point, but not with the political stuff.
 
Think you are getting the family members a bit mixed up. Are you talking about HBJ here? Because the Sheikh Jassim bidding for United is not the current Emir's brother, neither was his father (HBJ) at any point the Emir. It's understandable to get it mixed up due to the similarities in names and sheer number of family members but they are not as close as you make out (although they have direct connections) family-wise. Unlike PSG, who is owned by a subsidiary of the sovereign wealth fund, both UEFA and Premier League would have hard time proving that it's state-funded apart from the argument that "everybody knows".
Thanks. You are right. I mixed up the names, and you probably have a point that they might have a better case then.
 
If Ineos gets the club, a lot of fans will be upset but do nothing.

I just wanted to know if Qatar gets the club will the minority against it also do nothing?

We will undoubtedly see some protest. We'll also unfortunately see some scenes outside Old Trafford like those we saw at City and Newcastle:
0_Newcastle-United-v-Tottenham-Hotspur-Premier-League.jpg
mancity_fans.jpg
 
The thing is, our fanbase is so huge that both The Athletic poll and the the one in this thread is covering such a tiny sample size.

Only a 1000 people have voted in this thread - it's nothing.
I think it's probably a reasonably accurate reflection. There wasn't a notable reaction from the crowd on sunday either. Abramovich and City have changed football forever.
 
If you put it that way, I want us to win the PL this season and also your second choice is flawed from your perspective because I don't want the Qataris to own Man Utd just for the squad's sake. You know full well that we've been lacking in terms of infrastructure, stadium and training facilities, morale and so much more since over a decade. All this is definitely the reason I want the Glazers out. Actually, I don't mind even if Sir Jim took over because it doesn't matter who but I want the rascals out. They might've backed our previous managers but it was only when they were freshly appointed and needed to know that they were backed. Also it was never the right players and never the right system. We should've brought Pep right after SAF retired and imagine the picture then. He would've fixed a lot and was a young hungry coach as well but they didn't because our hierarchy was all wrong. Not until recently have we set things right and we need a reset at the top as well. You cannot say I don't enjoy the journey because I've watched every season since 2003-04 and I've been through a lot of heartbreak. This club and it's fans deserve a lot more than we are getting right now but I'm also happy to convey that EtH has been a delight and everything we asked for.
Pep would have failed miserably here, the setup was all wrong and our scouting/recruitment team wasn't good enough. His best team, still to this day, was the initial team he built who got 100 points and the next season won the domestic sweep and it was built on a KDB, Silva, Fernandinho, Aguero, Sterling who he inherited and Sane, Mahrez, Jesus plus the back line he bought after the first season went poorly. Everything City have built is built on a lie/cheating but the recruitment side was vastly superior to ours.

If you have watched us since 03/04 you've literally seen some of our golden years, what are you talking about?

03/04: FA cup winners
05/06: League Cup winners
06/07: PL winners
07/08: One of our greatest ever seasons
08/09: PL and League cup winners
09/10: League Cup winners
10/11: PL winners
12/13: PL winners
15/16: FA cup winners
16/17: Europa and League cup winners
 
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Thanks. You are right. I mixed up the names, and you probably have a point that they might have a better case then.

Just to add to that - KSA's sovereign wealth fund is the official majority owner (with 80%) of Newcastle, yet they managed to "convince" the Premier League that there won't be any state involvement in the running of the club, so would be surprised if a significantly way more diffuse connection to the State of Qatar would pass as state-owned in this case.
 
I think it's probably a reasonably accurate reflection. There wasn't a notable reaction from the crowd on sunday either. Abramovich and City have changed football forever.


Most United fans I know from Manchester are leaning towards Qatar. I think it's probably generational thing.
 
So, if Jassim didn't cook the books, no United fan would have had any remaining complaint? Everything else, we've been just fine with? And if people think we don't need the money, why is the forum full of posts anticipating the arrival of Mbappe and spending sprees to come? And why is 63% supporting Qatari ownership? Because they're such lovely people, and the former crown prince has a proven record running a top football club?

The answer is obvious: The Qatari bid gets support because people thinks it will put us on the same footing as City and PSG. Which is fair enough. But we can't have it both ways.

Oh, and City just delivered a better financial result than we did.
This is what gets me. I wish some would own their hypocrisy or whatever you want to call it about Qatari ownership. This notion that the Qatari ownership group will clear debts and invest in the infrastructure, all while not financially doping, sports washing, or caring about ROI, is deliberate naivety at best.
 
The Glazers rate, Ineos rate and the Qatar rate would all not be different though no?
My fundamental issue is the Glazers rate, which is strangling the club, refers to a 500M loan from the originally bargain buy.

If the rate is the same but the amount now 7x-10x that surely we are completely fecked? Feels like cutting the nose to spite the face.

I don't see any guarantee Ratcliffe is going to be any better. In fact, I'm at the point I'd rather skint owners than some Boehly type excited with his new toy and randomly signing players for fun. We've just literally had 10 years of that and it got us nowhere.
 
Most United fans I know from Manchester are leaning towards Qatar. I think it's probably generational thing.

What generation is represented by the majority?
 
You do know he's the older brother of the Emir, Tamim, and that his father was the former Emir? Nothing to do with the state at all. Except of course being the former crown prince and big brother of the monarch himself.
It will be very hard for him to convince anyone that this bid is not somehow connected to the state.

I reckon Ratcliffe would use Ineos means to finance the bid. What was your point?
You seem to be confused, seriously. Kindly check your facts well before arguing. The Sheikh 's father was the former prime minister of Qatar. His father has a lot of properties in the UK.
 
Who could possibly answer you that?

A lot of strong opinions on here. I just want to know what people are willing to do. I can tell you right now if Ineos takeover I’ll be angry but I will do absolutely nothing but vent on here everytime they mess up.
 
My fundamental issue is the Glazers rate, which is strangling the club, refers to a 500M loan from the originally bargain buy.

If the rate is the same but the amount now 7x-10x that surely we are completely fecked? Feels like cutting the nose to spite the face.

I don't see any guarantee Ratcliffe is going to be any better. In fact, I'm at the point I'd rather skint owners than some Boehly type excited with his new toy and randomly signing players for fun. We've just literally had 10 years of that and it got us nowhere.

I’m like you. I really don’t want a Todd Boehly. Going back to the Woodward era would finish me.
 
I've mainly spoken to younger fans.

That's interesting because I would assume that it's also the generation that is on social media all the time and was made aware of Qatar's transgressions the most.
 
You do know he's the older brother of the Emir, Tamim, and that his father was the former Emir? Nothing to do with the state at all. Except of course being the former crown prince and big brother of the monarch himself.
It will be very hard for him to convince anyone that this bid is not somehow connected to the state.

I reckon Ratcliffe would use Ineos means to finance the bid. What was your point?
Everything you have said here is false. - Luke Skywalker

It would be nice if people don't make wrong claims out of thin air and then present them as facts.
 
Baseless racism accusation
I've mainly spoken to younger fans.

Sounds about right. Older fans unfortunately will not want the club to be owned by a brown man. Unfortunate but it’s just the society we are in. In an ironic way it’s similar to the fight we have with the Middle East and human rights.

Hopefully as the years pass things change.
 
A lot of strong opinions on here. I just want to know what people are willing to do. I can tell you right now if Ineos takeover I’ll be angry but I will do absolutely nothing but vent on here everytime they mess up.
Fair.
I just meant nobody can answer you that. Of course people tend to have strong opinions online but rarely go beyond that in their actions. But we'll see.
 
That's interesting because I would assume that it's also the generation that is on social media all the time and was made aware of Qatar's transgressions the most.

:lol: Stop it. I’ve given you the answer, which most of us already know it is.
 
I'm really not an expert on this, but this information is available for anyone who cares to spend 1 minute to check. Jassim Al Thani's father was the former Emir (Dictator) of Qatar, and Jassim himself was the crown prince of Qatar before giving his claim to the throne to his younger brother Tamim, who is the Emir of Qatar today. He is part of the royal familiy ruling in Qatar, they are the state of Qatar and all their money comes from ruling Qatar. I guess they will try to convince UEFA it isn't statefunded, but I think they will have a hard time doing that, so my guess is they will try to lobby their way to getting UEFA to accept that clubs with the same owners isn't banned from European competitions out of fear of collaboration.

The state of this post.
You continue to do you, mate.

Cheers!
Totally wrong! Jassim 's father wasn't the Emir. Stop throwing dust into people's eyes.
 
In what way are they politically motivated? There’s been no mention of politics of any sort in their manifesto. Their goals and ours are aligned: we want United back to the top of the footballing pyramid. I couldn’t give a toss what happens outside of the football pitch - there’s hypocrisy on both sides and doesn’t concern your average Joe Bloggs fan in the slightest. Focus on the football.



I’ve not seen any evidence to suggest state ownership (which doesn’t seem to be the case with us anyway) has affected the political world in any way.

Just like how people lost their minds when Qatar were hosting the World Cup and it turned out to be one of the best finals in history, they’re throwing their toys out of the pram without even seeing what the benefits to the club might be.

You just aren’t going to find a 100% clean buyer. There’s shit on both sides of the spectrum. We just have to be selfish and go with the proposition that gives us the best chance in football.
Very naive view. Of course an owners politics or way of thinking will impact the club.
 
This is an infuriating stance when discussing Qatar. YES. It is possible to be highly sceptical about both for differing reasons. In fact, I get red flags when I hear anyone is definitely sure about either bidder.

They are both massively vague statements, which is all that you would expect to hear at this stage. Baring in mind we know that they have signed NDAs. We can only discuss with the limited information we have and anything after is speculation - of course this is fine to do, but it needs to be done in good faith.
Totally agree. Both the bids we know about have a mix of positives and negatives. Plus we don't know majority of the detail, only their PR.
 
You want Qatar to change its laws. You want Qatar to disregard the laws of its religion. That's not going to happen soon.

So I guess you're not really open to be swayed at all... There's no win-win here you know.
If they can't even make a commitment that LGBTQ fans will never be discriminated against in any capacity at United then they shouldn't take over.
 
You can keep isolating your words from the context in which they were said but it doesn't do anything.

It's not 'tolerance' to overlook institutional homophobia and sexism, which is what Tom was objecting to. He wasn't calling you out for 'tolerating' anything, he was calling people out for turning a blind eye to it.
Yes, United need money, and I doubt that Ratcliffe would make us competitive against the likes of City, Bayern, Real etc. We are also lagging behind in terms of facilities and infrastructure. As for City's charges, they cheated. Simples. I doubt Qataris would want to do that. They will invest money, but not cheat. No need to.
Qataris cheated at PSG and Malaga. Do you your homework. They would cheat here too.
 
Honestly this is a decision I'm glad I don't have to make, because I simply don't have the full insight required to do it. But let's throw out my line of thinking anyway.

Firstly, morals/ethics. I have an instant distrust of any billionaire so I don't believe the Ineos bid is suddenly/magically going to mean that we're in a clean situation when compared with Qatar. It wouldn't shock me if Ineos have a lot of business with Qatar or other states with questionable morals. Does this make them okay because it's a third party situation? I just assume anyone who takes us over is going to have done, endorsed or enabled a lot of terrible practices. The key difference is that with Qatar it's more in the spotlight because of the World Cup. It's sort of like how people complain that footballers earn way too much when in reality they earn a pittance compared to what you can get in the business world. The spotlight is on the footballer, so they get targeted by the public far more than those who grow up in a corporate environment. I reckon it's probably similar for Ineos. For me, based on endless precedent, I assume billionaires are guilty until proven innocent. Probably not fair, but if you want to argue that we should assume innocent until proven guilty, we should question why we slam on this particular, specific Qatar investment fund when they have yet to be convicted of any crime that I'm aware of. So as I say, you can assume guilty or assume innocent, but for me that still paints both options with the same brush.

With morals out of the way, the second thing I'd want is for fans to own the majority of the club. I don't expect this to happen regardless of who wins the bidding process. Short of government or FIFA/UEFA/FA enforced regulations, I don't think this will ever happen again, sadly.

With morals and fan ownership out of the way, we're left with who we feel will run the club better on football and financial fronts. For the football front, I think it's genuinely not possible for us folk to have any clue who will be smarter about how they work the football side of the club. I'm not sure anyone at all has any firm clue regarding this, to be honest. For the financial side, I think the Qatari group is better placed, it's safe to say. The financial side will impact the football side, too, so that does have a slight edge there but again it's just not enough to say they'll be better with any real certainty.

The financial edge is literally the only way I can separate the options so with that in mind, for now I vote for the Qatari group.

Regardless of who wins, I hope that it adds notable pressure on both of them to perform ethically and morally in all they do, because of course I do. I just don't have faith that either would be an ethical company because in my opinion you don't earn billions by being an ethical, moral company.
 
Why should they have to defend themselves against a view of them that's been created by western media?

They have business dealings all over the west and it has never been an issue. The evidence speaks for itself for anyone that hasn't brought into the propaganda.

They just seamlessly hosted a world Cup, with the greatest scrutiny ever and still people aren't satisfied.

Guess you can't beat ingrained bias.
Seamlessly! Do you know how many migrant workers died to make that World Cup "seamless" ?
 
A lot of strong opinions on here. I just want to know what people are willing to do. I can tell you right now if Ineos takeover I’ll be angry but I will do absolutely nothing but vent on here everytime they mess up.
Ha ha, the same.
I will feel exactly how i felt when Ole got contract. Absolutely devasted with knowing that our future is fighting for top 4 trophy.
For me this is now crossroads where we can go in glory path to become no1 club in the world (and England) or we can go on ...Spurs path.
 
If they can't even make a commitment that LGBTQ fans will never be discriminated against in any capacity at United then they shouldn't take over.

I don't think any Western Arab-owned football clubs have actively sought to undermine their LGBTQ+ fanbase. Generally - and this is based entirely from my surface perception - they've aligned with local attitudes towards the issues.
 
"The situation in which the owner of a sports club or franchise invests his or her own personal wealth into securing highly talented players to better their chances of success, rather than relying on the revenue the franchise is able to generate for itself."

There wouldn't be a need but that's exactly what they would do. I asked this before but surely you don't think they will buy the club, clear debts, renovate Old Trafford and then not invest obscene amounts of money on playing staff? You don't need Qatari money to renovate the stadium and has Ratcliffe said he won't renovate the stadium or upgrade the facilities?
FFP, or what it's called now, will have a big say in how much we can spend going forward (and it won't be gazillions like ante-Qatar posters would have you believe).
 
A lot of strong opinions on here. I just want to know what people are willing to do. I can tell you right now if Ineos takeover I’ll be angry but I will do absolutely nothing but vent on here everytime they mess up.
Why will you be mad?
 
So how is the idea of fans supporting a Qatar bid equivalent to Qatar using football to push their agenda? Fans can support a middle eastern bid purely based on what they have promised to do...and so far, they have promised to do things right, and they have done things right in similar clubs like PSG. Every single scary thing you think they will do goes against the evidence of how they have run their other European businesses
You are right.

I opted for Qatar after looking at the statements from both Jim and Jassim. I could rightly see one (Jassim 's statement) was more of sports related and was able to address a lot of pertinent issues facing our dear club whilst the other (Jim's statement) sounded homophobic.
And as a sports man,a teacher and Man Utd supporter, I had no other option than to support the stament with right sporting ideas.
Where the person comes from does not matter to me.