That's how I feel too. He stepped up due to the injuries; just being able to play with his illness is incredible. The man has iron cast balls, last person to deserve abuse in this United squad.
PL D FA Premier League
Burnley 0:0 Manchester United
Post-match discussion
Sat, 30 August 2014
When your best player on the pitch is someone who has only trained twice with the rest of the team, then it's going to be difficult to play good football and win matches. However Di Maria helped our midfield a lot today, the only time we looked somewhat threatening was when he tried to speed up our build up with his direct runs and one touch passing through the middle.
It's also going to be very difficult to score goals when all your forwards are in terrible form. We have tried lots of players in different positions, i see no reason why we shouldn't try Januzaj or Kagawa up front with either Rooney or RvP, someone who would move wide and try to link with others and not just wait for the final pass in the box. I understand why LvG picks both Rooney and RvP but, with both of them out of form, it is just unbearable to watch us trying to create chances.
It's also very difficult to win matches when all your players, with the exception of Jones and Di Maria, struggle to win a single 50/50 challenge in a whole game. There is no nerve, no agression and no energy, there is no will to force things happen.
LvG saw improvement today and i hope that's true and things will get even better. I'd just want to say that when our most creative player, Mata, has the ball he still has no options available to him, De Gea is still very uncomfortable on the ball and that we still need an awful lot of time to get the ball forward.
And one last thing, i love Fletcher but we can't have a player who can't run 5 meters with the ball on the pitch. After today's match i would get Blind on the phone and tell him to fly to Manchester asap. I don't care if he is going to be top class in two years time. We just need someone who will not be a liabilty in our midfield, so that we don't have to pray Carrick doesn't pick another injury.
It's also going to be very difficult to score goals when all your forwards are in terrible form. We have tried lots of players in different positions, i see no reason why we shouldn't try Januzaj or Kagawa up front with either Rooney or RvP, someone who would move wide and try to link with others and not just wait for the final pass in the box. I understand why LvG picks both Rooney and RvP but, with both of them out of form, it is just unbearable to watch us trying to create chances.
It's also very difficult to win matches when all your players, with the exception of Jones and Di Maria, struggle to win a single 50/50 challenge in a whole game. There is no nerve, no agression and no energy, there is no will to force things happen.
LvG saw improvement today and i hope that's true and things will get even better. I'd just want to say that when our most creative player, Mata, has the ball he still has no options available to him, De Gea is still very uncomfortable on the ball and that we still need an awful lot of time to get the ball forward.
And one last thing, i love Fletcher but we can't have a player who can't run 5 meters with the ball on the pitch. After today's match i would get Blind on the phone and tell him to fly to Manchester asap. I don't care if he is going to be top class in two years time. We just need someone who will not be a liabilty in our midfield, so that we don't have to pray Carrick doesn't pick another injury.
:young:
Fletcher's illness is getting out of control. Is Manchester United suddenly became a rehab center of some sort ? If the player can't get into shape of the Premier League standards then he shouldn't play, simple as that.
If Darren needs further time to get better which I'm sure is not easy after chronic illness he had then he should focus only on that. First team matches only destroys his confidence and esteem even more.
If Darren needs further time to get better which I'm sure is not easy after chronic illness he had then he should focus only on that. First team matches only destroys his confidence and esteem even more.
It's been evident for a while. We pass it back more then any other big team. Some of the pass backs have been shocking. It's a real negative mindset. I think that's something we need to address because a lot of the time when we do it, it's a complete waste of time. I've seen players play it back while in miles of space. LVG should be pulling these players and asking them why is your first thought to pass back when you're in space you dickless wonder? We did it under Sir Alex too but I think more and more we're seeing a certain group of players who are negative and will pass it back without really being aware of what's around them
This must be a record even for Rooney. It's three games in and he has hit is slump already.
Very true. Hopefully the others step up to his level, rather than him being dragged down to the shite level we're at now.
If we can get bodies in midfield after the international break, he might get that rest. If Carrick had been fit, Fletch would have been eased in through the pre-season, he ended up playing most of the time in testing conditions. All these injuries have been disastrous for us.
Unless LVG can somehow give Rooney and RVP some pacey new legs and the ability to beat a defender 1v1 I don't see how that front 3 get's much better in 3 months.
If he isn't good enough, he shouldn't be playing, I don't see how that is any different to other players like Young, Valencia, Anderson, Cleverley, Fellaini who all have received so much shit.
People really need to get a grip, what do you think Fletcher is doing this from the good of his hearth, playing for us, carrying the burden of vice captaincy ? He gets paid millions a year from United and he got paid millions a year whilst he was out injurred for more than a year. The guy is so damn lucky the club stuck by him and didn't end his contract and give him another chance at top football, because at any other top club there simply would have been no way of that ever happening. I'am very sorry for him his career went this way and I respect the person Fletcher, but the footballer is done with, over and out, he isn't good enough anymore and he doesn't deserve to be on the pitch anymore than other players that aren't good enough anymore. If he thinks himself good enough to still play for United and even thinks he is good enough to be vice captain and expects to be paid a shitload of money for playing for us than he should be doing alot better, people being upset with his performances and lack of any tempo, skill or winners menaltity on the pitch are rightfully pissed off at thim and are deservedly criticising him.
God I hate all this sentimentally about certain players, It drives me mad and it has been destroying our club slowly like a cancer for years now. It is just the same with Scholes that came back at 36, Giggs that overstayed his time as a player by atleast 4 or 5 years, Cleverley that has been overprotected by our fans so many years, Vidic and Ferdinand that overstayed their time and so on and on. These players don't deserve to be in the team anymore than other players that aren't good enough, the team is more important than any individual. Having Fletcher playing all minutes for us on that midfield is doing the club no good at all, people are rightly pissed off by it, he isn't good enough end of story. Either he should acknowledge he isn't good enough anymore and retire or something or he should be doing alot better. But claiming vice captaincy and earning millions for playing like a pussie with no skill and no tempo certainly is a poor way to payback the club.
He's not in the same league as a Robson, a Keane, or a Buchan that's for sure. You'd expect to see a captain encouraging, cajoling, or when necessary, berating his team mates. Rooney doesn't do that but there again, neither does anybody else. I don't know what the answer is but I suspect that Van Gaal is still a bit shocked to discover what it is he's dealing with. Last season, we lost the ability to really play as a team and that has carried on. I think we're seeing a bit of the old Matt Busby syndrome here, and there are many parallels. Three months I think is overly optimistic, especially if the CM position isn't resolved. We've had far too many square pegs in this team for the past couple of seasons and under Fergie, it worked to a degree. Not any more though.
Once Carrick, Herrera and Blind are back (or in Blind's case, arrive), Fletcher won't play.
It's like a prayer, isn't it?
I tend to agree. They are too slow and predictable. You're looking for one of them to produce something special and then happens less frequently all the time.
If Valencia and young are so shit at key positions of WB, and it cripples our whole team, why not play with Blackett and Varela as (dodgy) full backs in a system that gets the best out of our forwards?
We may let some in, but you don;t win by not scoring.
Fletcher has been poor, but I think he should get some sympathy today, as he was virtually our only midfielder.
We may let some in, but you don;t win by not scoring.
Fletcher has been poor, but I think he should get some sympathy today, as he was virtually our only midfielder.
Yep. Captain of Manchester United, captain of England, and he plays for 90 minutes with his mouth shut. I really thought that he was the obvious choice, but I suppose those who remonstrated against his appointment may have been on to something. Charlton ought to take him to one side and give him a few tips on how to really lead a team on the field.
A nice read indeed, but the main concerns are as follows:
1. How long will it take to start getting results in this system? Does our squad suit this system?
2. Will this system succeed in EPL? Will it be effective against direct counter-attacking teams?
3. What happens to the potential deal with adidas and LvG's career at United, if we are out of CL next season?
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What are you even on about? Sentimentality?
Fletcher did very well to be able to play again, it's up to the manager to decide what to do with him and if/how to play him. Heap your abuse at van Gaal if you feel ranting is cathartic.
Feck me, get Diouf back
Cheers, probably about as balanced a post as I'll get in this thread. Can't tell which posters are posting with their agendas and which ones aren't. I missed the game so I'll catch it on MOTD...
De gea got put into shit positions by our defenders mostly.
I still hope he can come out of his shell. Should have a lads night out with Robbo, Keano, and Bruce, followed by an early morning meating with Sir Bobby the next day.
Captain of United and Captain of England -- no more hiding.
I still hope he can come out of his shell. Should have a lads night out with Robbo, Keano, and Bruce, followed by an early morning meating with Sir Bobby the next day.
Captain of United and Captain of England -- no more hiding.
Forgot Brucie. Another great skipper who led by example. Put the fear of the Almighty in the opposition as well as his own team mates. Eric too, but in a more subdued and Gallic fashion. As for keeping up with Robbo during a lad's night out, Rooney would be under the table before 9 o'clock.
The players that were having most of the ball in the final third today were Valencia and Young.
That is a problem!
That is a problem!
I took a lot of abuse here when I said it at the time, but Mata was a panic buy. Mourinho was laughing all the way to the bank. He was not what United needed then and he's not what the team need now. It's not that he isn't a good player, but he's not being played to his strengths.
As for Rooney, if you were making more money in a week than some people earn in a lifetime, and it's guaranteed for five years, what incentive is there? Enjoy life, relax, and don't over-exert yourself. You get the money anyway. (Another way of saying that is was downright stupid to give him that contract.)
If Valencia, Anderson, and Young really are that bad, why even play them? Despite injuries, which every team face, surely the squad is deep enough to play other options.
3-5-2 isn't working, but it's indicating something deeper than that: Van Gaal chooses a system and shoehorns players into it. That's ass about face. You build systems and strategies around the strengths of your players. We know that Van Gaal is a bully at the personal level, and maybe that's needed right now, but that trait becomes very negative if you're also intransigent and unteachable.
Ant it was Young who actually stuck to the wingback role and that is why we had far more luck on the right flank. I don't have a problem with wingbacks, but absent good holding play in the middle, they are far less effective as out-and-out wingers.
imo the main issue us that the team is not balanced. Putting levels of performance aside, i think we d be better off with a more dynamic player (Herrera) instead of Mata and a striker with more pace (Welbeck) replacing either Rooney or rvp.
It's our worst start since 2007/08. 2 points from 3 games.
True, my point was alluding to that fact, if Valencia and Young are having the biggest share of the ball then the likes of Mata/Rooney etc are not helping out enough.
City 0 Stoke 1 = according to some on here =relegation for City
Rooney shouldn't be in a position where he has to do the donkey work. Mata just isn't that type of player. The return of Carrick and Herrera will ease things a bit but we cannot rely on Rooney and Mata to play roles they are unsuited for. It's the old "square peg" story that I keep banging on about. Sometimes, I think we've got eleven utility players on the pitch.
Sparky's revenge.
He did well in the USA, which is why LVG gave him the armband, but now he looks scarred, frightened, he doesn't show an ounce of leadership and he doesn't even look like somebody who should be playing football at PL level end of story.
How is that not his fault and why shouldn't people critcise him for it.
Because he is a Manchester United player for such a long time, people like him and respect him even more after coming back from that nasty disease, how in godsname isn't that sentimental ?
He is vice captain, he gets paid a ton and he is one of the worst on the pitch = people can criticise, deal with it !
So true that bolded part.We need to have a 'What's being a United player really about?' seminar for this wet lettuce generation - a week with Buchan, Law, Robbo, Keano, Brucie, and Eric - also featuring Irwing, Pally and Choccy, sponsored by Boddingtons (and Moët for Eric). An epiphany for certain players, I'm sure.
We need to have a 'What's being a United player really about?' seminar for this wet lettuce generation - a week with Buchan, Law, Robbo, Keano, Brucie, and Eric - also featuring Irwing, Pally and Choccy, sponsored by Boddingtons (and Moët for Eric). An epiphany for certain players, I'm sure.
Indeed. Pampered bunch of pansies.
I'm dealing with it by telling you to stop abusing the wrong player.
The man did his best to get fit again, van Gaal saw fit to let him play these games (given all our injuries).
What the hell do you want him to do, throw himself on the sword?
I want him to apply himself and start playing beter, feck sake, is it sinking in yet ?
Man of the Match
Runners-up
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16%
Phil Jones
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7%
David de Gea
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2%
Tyler Blackett
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2%
Anderson
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1%
Antonio Valencia
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1%
Ashley Young
Player Ratings
Total Average Rating
Highest Rated Player
Lowest Rated Player
Compiled from 473 ratings.
Score Predictions
559,189,81
- Man Utd win
- Burnley win
- Draw
Detailed Results
- 17% Burnley 1:2 Man Utd
- 12% Burnley 0:2 Man Utd
- 11% Burnley 1:3 Man Utd
- 10% Burnley 0:3 Man Utd
- 7% Burnley 5:0 Man Utd
- 6% Burnley 2:1 Man Utd
- 6% Burnley 1:1 Man Utd
- 4% Burnley 0:4 Man Utd
- 4% Burnley 0:1 Man Utd
- 3% Burnley 2:0 Man Utd
- 3% Burnley 1:4 Man Utd
- 2% Burnley 2:2 Man Utd
- 2% Burnley 0:5 Man Utd
- 2% Burnley 3:0 Man Utd
- 2% Burnley 3:1 Man Utd
- 2% Burnley 1:0 Man Utd
- 1% Burnley 2:3 Man Utd
- 1% Burnley 0:0 Man Utd
- 1% Burnley 2:4 Man Utd
- 1% Burnley 4:0 Man Utd
- 1% Burnley 1:5 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 3:2 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 5:1 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 3:3 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 5:2 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 3:5 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 4:2 Man Utd
- 0% Burnley 4:5 Man Utd
Match Stats
- Burnley
- Man Utd
- Possession
- 36% 64%
- Shots
- 9 7
- Shots on Target
- 3 2
- Corners
- 3 6
- Fouls
- 10 14
Referee
Chris Foy
Man Utd Lineup
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-
-
-
-
-
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replaced by Anderson
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replaced by Adnan Januzaj
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-
-
replaced by Danny Welbeck
