Is Ole getting more votes yet?
[Poll] Next permanent United manager
- Thread starter Damien
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https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports-Talk--News/The-Gary-Neville-Podcast---Sky-Sports-p816781/
Gary Neville : "No manager should ever be allowed to enter Manchester United's football club or training ground to shape their own philosophy. United's philosophy is so deep and meaningful the way it is for Barcelona or Ajax. Winning will come as a result of doing these things right. "
Gary Neville : "No manager should ever be allowed to enter Manchester United's football club or training ground to shape their own philosophy. United's philosophy is so deep and meaningful the way it is for Barcelona or Ajax. Winning will come as a result of doing these things right. "
'Give 'em more time' Gary doing another about-face. He changes his tune like I change my socks.
Even Gary Neville can change his mind.
So flaky
How if we beat TTH in the end of the season by going up to 3rd and they are on the 4th or maybe 5th ?
Ole + rest of current staff seems perfect for us. Understand this club better than Poch, Allegri, Zidane or any other famous name.
My views against homegrown managers is well renowned. We don't have the history for it and you only have to hear the class of 92 or our former players speak in the media to feel shivers going down your spine. I was happy with Ole's appointment mostly because Mourinho was leaving rather then anything else and I was expecting Ole to be out by the beginning of summer.
But the more time passes the more my resistance against it is wearing away. Ole has hardly done anything wrong. He resisted the temptation of appointing one of his former mates from the media as assistant and opted instead for an experienced manager. He involved SAF's again and United are playing some of the best football I've seen since we replaced Cristiano with some random one trick pony. He's also the sort of man who listens to what more experienced people say which is a big plus
Don't take me wrong, I still think that Ole is so green that he pisses grass. However, if we invest heavily on the infrastructure of the club (which will be needed either way), bringing in SAF in the board at some capacity, someone like Zorc as DOF and Mitchell as head of recruitment then I actually think Ole would be a decent decision as manager.
But the more time passes the more my resistance against it is wearing away. Ole has hardly done anything wrong. He resisted the temptation of appointing one of his former mates from the media as assistant and opted instead for an experienced manager. He involved SAF's again and United are playing some of the best football I've seen since we replaced Cristiano with some random one trick pony. He's also the sort of man who listens to what more experienced people say which is a big plus
Don't take me wrong, I still think that Ole is so green that he pisses grass. However, if we invest heavily on the infrastructure of the club (which will be needed either way), bringing in SAF in the board at some capacity, someone like Zorc as DOF and Mitchell as head of recruitment then I actually think Ole would be a decent decision as manager.
Ole for me. It's a no brainer. Managers don't come bigger than Jose and LVG yet they struggled here. There is a unique culture and spirit at United. We need someone who gets it and Ole does. He fits in like a glove in hand. I agree he has not been really tested consistently but I say we give it a shot.
At this point, now he have United back again, I'm won over for Ole getting the job - I don't care about previous leagues, cups, trophies - sometimes you can have the right person at the right time.
We tried the big names, we tried to change the fabric of the club - none of it worked. OGS just 'gets' it.
We tried the big names, we tried to change the fabric of the club - none of it worked. OGS just 'gets' it.
Gary has become an utter idiot and a shit pundit a long time ago. Cant listen to his "I sit so high on the horse and only I know whats right" crap
TBF, both were past their expiry date. I personally love what Ole is doing and I hope he keeps it up. However, it is still way too early to judge him properly. We need to see how he does when things go the wrong way and if he can keep everything up over a longer period
I disagree about Jose being expired. He will be back and he will win again despite struggling here (even though he still won us two trophies, got us to second and an FA Cup final). When Real Madrid is considering hiring you, you still have something. But Jose was just a bad fit for us. LVG? Perhaps.
But that's besides the point. I totally agree with your view on Ole. As much as I like him and want him as our permanent manager, you are right about the need to see how he performs in different circumstances over time. I have a feeling he will come out in flying colours.
Still amazed that so many still want Pochettino. Another risk, give Ole a 3 year contract. He can’t do any worse than the other 3, give him a go
Jose will not be back and win major trophies, I will bet on that. He will take over an Italian team or a national team without winning anything. He was past it just before he went to Chelsea. Not just as a manager, but also from a personal point of view. On top, his philosophy is from 10 years ago, in a very specific setup. No other successful team plays that way
I've been banging this drum since Ole took over. He's the only manager who hasn't tried to make himself bigger than the club or struggled with the demands of the club. We should stop with the Chelsea/Madrid model of manager hire and look more at the Barcelona/Ajax way of doing things. We're an institution that dictates what the manager should be, not the other way around.
In the high of winning against Spurs I have thought (and probably made some post too) the same the last two days. Everything so far told me that Ole is the man to take over. For someone who has only seen United under Sir Alex, it has felt strange being managed by outsiders in Moyes, Van Gaal & Jose these last 6 ears. They never felt part of club and didn't make an effort to understand the culture. With Ole it just feels right.
However, today I looked at our fixture list for the rest of the season and felt we need to hold our horses a bit. We have a minimum of 18 games in the next 105 days or a maximum of 25 games in the next 108 days (excluding the finals which are on May 18th (FA) & June 1st (CL). Starting with the Arsenal away in the FA cup we could have a game every 4 days on an average. It would take all managerial acumen Ole has acquired in his career to come out on top with that many games and a overall squad of out quality. The last 6 game have been wonderful but tougher tests are still to come.
I am hoping and praying he succeeds because there is nothing more that would please me than him taking over as our permanent manager. But I think we need to wait till late Mar/early April before we can have any conclusive evidence regarding his suitability to manage us long-term. We need a bigger sample than 6 games to be judge how he rotates the squad and keeps them motivated while playing attacking football.
This thing about getting experience in lower leagues or smaller clubs might well be nonsense. You're set up to fail; so many managers have heroic promotions from the championship only to be let go in 6 months time as they flounder on the bottom of the Premier League table as the club owner gets notions about their stature. So even though Ole had a pretty torrid time of it at Cardiff, given the right caliber of player he's gone on a pretty great winning run.
There is an addendum or two though (and really I am still in camp Poch for the moment); the teams we've played have mostly been poor and we rode our luck against Spurs for sure. He will ultimately be judged on how he fares against City, Liverpool and PSG. If he can get some good results there and sneak into the Champions League positions then I think he'll have more than earned his shot at the job full time. Maybe a more experienced top level DoF would offset any concerns about Ole's lack of big team management experience as well.
There is an addendum or two though (and really I am still in camp Poch for the moment); the teams we've played have mostly been poor and we rode our luck against Spurs for sure. He will ultimately be judged on how he fares against City, Liverpool and PSG. If he can get some good results there and sneak into the Champions League positions then I think he'll have more than earned his shot at the job full time. Maybe a more experienced top level DoF would offset any concerns about Ole's lack of big team management experience as well.
I guess we can only wait and see then. Let's both try and remember this conversation two - three seasons from now. I guess it will come down to the man himself. How badly does he want to remain relevant in football?
Best of luck to him anyway. Football for me is a game and when the heats of the sporting moments are gone, I wish managers and players the best in their careers, even when they are or were rivals.
But my point was about Ole getting the position. That's what I will really like to see. He has been doing a cracking job! I just love how he seems to click in so well with the spirit and culture of United.
I think that our last 3 appointments were horrible and went against everything football is heading to. These days football is mostly man management something SAF excelled in and lvg/mou/moyes failed miserable in
Ole is far from perfect. He's green and he needs ample help to succeed. However he has the right attitude to develop into what we need. He listens to his seniors, his man management is top notch, his ideas make sense and he believes in the right sort of football
Ole's will need assistance but that will be needed irrespective whom we will be signing. Modern managers are head coaches these days and can't be expected to cover SAF role anymore. So instead of spending 50m on pochs who would want to move to real at one point i wonder if it would be wiser to keep ole and spend that money to bring SAF in some capacity, lure the best DOF and head of recruitment available. Id rather have a promising rookie who has the right ideas and is willing to listen to more experienced staff then a more experienced head coach who thinks he deserves the same control SAF had simply because he sat in his former office
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I agree with you about how getting experience lower down is almost being set up to fail for someone who wants to manage a big club. Pep Guardiola is a great coach but he has been open about how he needs great players to play the way he wants to play. If you gave Pep the Huddersfield job, and he tried to keep them up by telling them to outpass the opposition, it wouldn't work. People holding what happened at Cardiff against Ole need to wise up. The football Ole prefers simply doesn't work at a relegation threatened club. If Cardiff would've had players good enough to attack in the style Ole inherited from Sir Alex they wouldn't have been facing relegation. Simple as.
Where I disagree with you is seeing a brighten future under Pochettino than under Ole. I'm firmly on the OleIn bus and I don't think what happens against City, Liverpool and PSG matters. PSG is a one off knock out against a team that, objectively speaking, is better prepped for success at present. Also, in all honesty, we're extremely unlikely to win the title this season. Therefore what happens against City and Liverpool is likely to be irrelevant, the other teams around us e.g. Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal are every bit as likely to lose to them as well. We are where we are because we lost against the likes of Brighton and West Ham. It will be Ole's ability to get results against the so-called lesser lights that will decide whether we can qualify for the Champions League next season. Going from double digits off top four to within touching distance is IMO creditable enough for Ole to be prime candidate to be permanent manager.
I'm not saying its definitely brighter under Poch, just that Poch has proven himself capable over a much longer time frame.
The thing about Ole is no one expected anything of him, so he's been able to throw caution to the wind and go all out with a team whose morale was already rock bottom. Its essentially a free hit where you can point at Mourinho's failings if it doesn't go well. If Ole starts next season as manager then it might not be quite as easy to go gung ho in all matches. He might not be so motivational and positive if things go tits up. Also i am not yet convinced he is the person to solve our defensive issues (though in fairness he hasn't had a chance to bring in players so far).
Poch to me has proven himself consistently and has shown he can improve teams and get the most out of talented players like Kane, Ali and Erikson so i would be happy to see him at United. Would love for Ole to work out too though, but just as things stand I'd go for Poch.
I reserve the right to change my mind again if the wheels fall off, because right now I am desperate to see Ole get the job so I have switched my vote from Poch
And yes, it probably is a heart over head thing if I'm being 100% honest. But who gives a shit, I haven't enjoyed watching United this much since Fergie retired (I didn't even find much joy in Jose's Micky mouse European Cup run) and isn't enjoying watching your team play the most important thing?
I spend the whole week looking forward to the next game after finding the team depressing under the previous manager. That change is 100% down to Ole (I even love watching his press conferences) so why wouldn't I vote for him?
And yes, it probably is a heart over head thing if I'm being 100% honest. But who gives a shit, I haven't enjoyed watching United this much since Fergie retired (I didn't even find much joy in Jose's Micky mouse European Cup run) and isn't enjoying watching your team play the most important thing?
I spend the whole week looking forward to the next game after finding the team depressing under the previous manager. That change is 100% down to Ole (I even love watching his press conferences) so why wouldn't I vote for him?
The way that Ole's inability to turn it around at Cardiff has hung around his neck shows there's no such thing as a free hit. Solari hasn't been able to justify his struggles by saying but Lopetegui was doing worse, even though he's tried. In football memories and forgiveness are short.
Its not easy to come into a failing team and turn things around as quickly/effectively as Ole has. Pochettino has managed more games than Ole at senior level but Ole has won titles and managed in Europe regularly as a coach, which shouldn't be underplayed. Ole has the advantage of being a club legend and that gives him a certain amount of kudos that won't be easy for other coaches to match. He also has the club's principles written onto his chest and, unlike with another top manager, he will not clear out the coaching staff and bring in his trusted aides from outside. The only coach he has brought in, Mark Dempsey, is another ex-red and former reserves coach. These people get the club. I want them all to stay with Ole at the wheel much more than I want any outsider coming in.
I think the true test of a great manager is how they deal with defeat and there reaction too it, were going to lose a match sooner or later, maybe even two in a row, which is fine, happens to the best but the top managers can continue to get over the hurdle and motivate the players to get back to winning ways,
Maybe Ole will be fantastic with this, I hope he is because i'd love nothing more than one of our own leading this club forward.
Maybe Ole will be fantastic with this, I hope he is because i'd love nothing more than one of our own leading this club forward.
It would be nice to think that Roy Keane could have come in as caretaker and got the same results as Ole, but I don’t think that. Ole is doing everything with a smile on his face and even if he’s not the right man for the job, he’s the right kind of man for it in 2019. He’s getting the best out of the players, the fans love him and he’s giving the media nothing negative to work with. As a complete package, it’s now a case of finding someone who can do as well as he’s done so far.
Everyone accepts that the romance of it plays a big part, but that’s why the guy who won the Champions League for the last three seasons with the club he played for and is currently out of work isn’t favourite to take over here.
Everyone accepts that the romance of it plays a big part, but that’s why the guy who won the Champions League for the last three seasons with the club he played for and is currently out of work isn’t favourite to take over here.
This whole saga is making me wonder whether Giggs - with the right people around him - might've been the best option post-Fergie after all. If it genuinely is impossible for another manager to come in and bend the club to his will, then maybe we'll only ever truly succeed if a manger totally buys into what we're about, rather than vice versa.
I find that hard to believe (it's not as if every successful manager ever has had to adapt to their new club) but it seemed to be the case with the likes of Zidane, Guardiola, Cruyff etc, so maybe applies to us too?
On that basis, Ole might just work.
I find that hard to believe (it's not as if every successful manager ever has had to adapt to their new club) but it seemed to be the case with the likes of Zidane, Guardiola, Cruyff etc, so maybe applies to us too?
On that basis, Ole might just work.
The thing that OGS has done so right and amazingly none of the others did, is see the bloody obvious. He's instantly recognized our best midfield combo and played them in their right roles, he's benched lukaku as he is so very limited in his play, Mata is also on the bench owing to his lack of pace. The front 3 pick themselves and he's done that consistently.
In addition he's managed to keep a positive mindset, both on and off the field and that's made football enjoyable.
I hope he's seeing the obvious gaps in our squad equally well and if he can get the right players in the transfer market to fill those gaps then what can be better. It's really not necessary that he gets all big names as we've seen where the likes of Mata, lukaku and Sanchez are these days.
He's done everything so very well and taken a simple approach, that in itself should make him a very strong contender for the job.
In addition he's managed to keep a positive mindset, both on and off the field and that's made football enjoyable.
I hope he's seeing the obvious gaps in our squad equally well and if he can get the right players in the transfer market to fill those gaps then what can be better. It's really not necessary that he gets all big names as we've seen where the likes of Mata, lukaku and Sanchez are these days.
He's done everything so very well and taken a simple approach, that in itself should make him a very strong contender for the job.
Spot on! I really hope Ole succeeds. However, at some point things won't go our way as they did against Spurs (spirit and confidence got us over the line and that is largely down to Ole) but it would be good to see how Ole reacts when things don't always go our way and how he manages a change in team dynamic if we bring anyone in in January.
If Ole carries on impressing then he should be number one choice but we should keep our options open until the end of the season.
If we want Ole to be a realistic candidate, we have to get the right DOF in. He has no record in the transfer market that allows us to have any confidence in giving him the job, but he certainly seems a good head coach. Get the DOF right and there is a great case for him being the no 1 candidate if he carries on this way.
As a first-team coach type, Ole's starting to look pretty ideal to be honest (and I am quite unromantic in this regard). I'd still like to see what happens when we lose a few matches, not so much from him as he seems very composed and objective, but from the squad - as in do we start getting the same bickering and sulking from the players that we had under the previous 3 managers towards the end. But other than that, it seems the turnaround is a bit more than just from putting a smile on players' faces - he knows how to set a team up, he's playing players in their position (hallelujah), and rather than feel threatened by the club's history and institutions, he's using them to his advantage.
It does put an even bigger onus on us getting the right DOF/recruitment structure though. If we weren't sure under the previous managers, I think it's clear that Ole wouldn't have the ultimate say in transfers. I think most of us feel the same way, we desperately need some long-term stability when it comes to recruitment and playing style, so we'll be looking at how the club re-organise the wider structure too.
It does put an even bigger onus on us getting the right DOF/recruitment structure though. If we weren't sure under the previous managers, I think it's clear that Ole wouldn't have the ultimate say in transfers. I think most of us feel the same way, we desperately need some long-term stability when it comes to recruitment and playing style, so we'll be looking at how the club re-organise the wider structure too.
Giggs took over for 4 matches after Moyes. The side still looked like crap. Much different to what Ole did.
Zidane is still my first choice. There’s no replacing winning mentality.
My current choices.
1. Pochettino.
2. Zidane.
3. Ole (If current form continues till May)
1. Pochettino.
2. Zidane.
3. Ole (If current form continues till May)
I don't disagree with you. He definitely will need help with a Dof, a recruitment team, funds and what not. All I am saying is that we need to wait before deciding to give him the job as much as we may feel it to be the right appointment at this moment. And by bigger tests I do not mean results in games against the likes of PSG, Liverpool, City and the likes. I would be more looking at his overall body of work for the next couple of months before coming to a decision, even if the results are not all positive in those specific games.
I’ve changed from Poch to Ole, feck it.
He knows the club inside out and is getting us playing the right way.1-2 quality additions in defence and maybe someone who can play from the right side and I think we’ll be good to go.
He knows the club inside out and is getting us playing the right way.1-2 quality additions in defence and maybe someone who can play from the right side and I think we’ll be good to go.
Exactly. If coaching was just a case of trading off what you did as a player at your old club Solari would be shining at Madrid.
Many mocked Paul Ince's comment yesterday. However, all he did was say in plain English what a lot of pundits, press and even people on the CAF have been suggesting: That anyone could have done what Ole's done. Personally, I can't believe how many people buy into that idea. Maybe the way Ince got slammed for saying what they've been hinting will help change their minds?
At some stage people need to stop treating Ole like he's a cheerleader, simply putting smiles on faces, and accept he's a good coach and that's the reason he's been doing a good job.
Once a week? hihihi
It's a small sample size compared to the mass of evidence that idiosyncratic (LvG, Jose) managers with a very specific (dull) way of playing hasn't worked though isn't it?
If we sustain our current form till the end of the season - both style and results, then Ole should comfortably get the job without any competitions imo. Why change something that is working very well?
If we sort out our structure and get the right people in behind the scenes ie DOF there's no need for another manager. Ole is more than capable, he understand the philosophy of the club and that's why I wasn't worried about his previous stint at Cardiff when he got appointed. Managing small team is not the same as managing big team with quality players. That's if you're an attacking manager.
The bit about adapting to the club and not vice versa is absolutely correct. It's why the 3 past managers failed - despite two of them being experienced and decorated at the highest level. Because they tried to shape the team into their own images starting from scratch rather than embrace the existing philosophy and build upon it.
The bit about adapting to the club and not vice versa is absolutely correct. It's why the 3 past managers failed - despite two of them being experienced and decorated at the highest level. Because they tried to shape the team into their own images starting from scratch rather than embrace the existing philosophy and build upon it.
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