Pogba is not a left winger

Another positive for Pogba out wide is if he does his I want to stand with the ball for AGES thing, it doesn't cost us nearly as much as when he does it in the middle of the pitch.
 
el3mel said:
Then we'll ultimately need to sacrifice one of them, and it'll be Pogba as Bruno is so important for Ole. Pogba isn't a winger no matter how much he tries. He can play some good games there but he'll never be a winger long term. He's an attacking midfielder through and through.

Pretty big headache for us to be able to play both in a balanced formation and in their positions while also not having to play with both Scott and Fred together.
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Yep I completely agree, personally I want us to sign a central midfielder who can control the tempo and pace of the game, not sure who that would be mind.
 
acnumber9 said:
We play Pogba on the left because our manager refuses to not pick Fred and McTominay every game and we need more than one player who can pass the ball.
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Pogba is not the answer in midfield either. He loses the ball too often in dangerous positions, tries to dribble right in front of the defence and gets tackled, and his defensive work isn't good either. And his influence on the game is always limited from that deep position. He needs to be played high up the pitch where he can hurt the opposition and not us.
 
His best position is the most advanced midfielder in a 3, not a number 10, but an 8 in a 3 man midfield. I can’t recall him ever playing that role for us other than a short spell when Ole was interim manager. Jose had him playing in a pivot with Fellaini ffs.
 
Valencia's Left Foot said:
Sell him. Not because I think he’s a bad player, but he’s just so damn hard to fit in a lineup. I would prefer to have CM who has a bit more versatility in regard to formation. He’s not good enough to dictate formations that don’t fit with the rest of the squad.
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This, in a nut shell, is my opinion on Pogba. Not all good players fit into every side. Replace with the right quality for the positions we actually need, and we'll be better for it.
 
Dominos said:
Pogba is not the answer in midfield either. He loses the ball too often in dangerous positions, tries to dribble right in front of the defence and gets tackled, and his defensive work isn't good either. And his influence on the game is always limited from that deep position. He needs to be played high up the pitch where he can hurt the opposition and not us.
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Possibly not. He’d certainly need a very good defensive player beside him and a better centre back. But we do need a player that can pass the ball like Pogba in there.
 
acnumber9 said:
We don’t bench Pogba because we need his passing. Us winning games again correlated with his return. After a run of shit form that correlated with him being injured.
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His passing is beneficial, especially against the likes of Villa, Burnley, Granada and Spurs (where he has hours of time on the ball and acres of space); however as OP implies we can't forget what we're sacrificing to accommodate some nice passing.

We're sacrificing our most proficient goalscorer (Rashford) in their preferred position and also sacrificing another proficient goalscorer (Greenwood) in their strongest position.

I think most would agree a front four of Fernandes-Rashford-Greenwood-Cavani, all playing in their preferred positions is better than Pogba-Fernandes-Rashford-Cavani whereby 2/4 are out of position.

If we need Pogba's passing in the system Ole wants to play it can only be instead of Fernandes'.
 
finneh said:
His passing is beneficial, especially against the likes of Villa, Burnley, Granada and Spurs (where he has hours of time on the ball and acres of space); however as OP implies we can't forget what we're sacrificing to accommodate some nice passing.

We're sacrificing our most proficient goalscorer (Rashford) in their preferred position and also sacrificing another proficient goalscorer (Greenwood) in their strongest position.

I think most would agree a front four of Fernandes-Rashford-Greenwood-Cavani, all playing in their preferred positions is better than Pogba-Fernandes-Rashford-Cavani whereby 2/4 are out of position.

If we need Pogba's passing in the system Ole wants to play it can only be instead of Fernandes'.
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I agree we should be playing Rashford left and Greenwood. Pogba should be playing in midfield. We need to start taking games to teams.
 
He's a cop out option for Ole at LW. I thought the same ages ago when we started it and it came up trumps against Milan. He's like a super skilful target man out wide. I think we play him there to hold up the ball against the press and help us get out. Makes my head spin to think this is what we've resorted to instead of just coaching and structuring the fecking team.

Just to add to this, the times Ole moved Martial to LW, Greenwood to CF and Rashford to RW... three players played in new positions just to get Martial going.
 
Works against teams that sit back, not against a team with possibly the best attacking right back in the league.

All stems from only having Mason as the only capable inside forward from the right, another one is certainly needed.
 
pocco said:
He's a cop out option for Ole at LW. I thought the same ages ago when we started it and it came up trumps against Milan. He's like a super skilful target man out wide. I think we play him there to hold up the ball against the press and help us get out. Makes my head spin to think this is what we've resorted to instead of just coaching and structuring the fecking team.
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You think we're using Pogba as we used Fellaini. Sure. No point even responding to shit like that.

pocco said:
Just to add to this, the times Ole moved Martial to LW, Greenwood to CF and Rashford to RW... three players played in new positions just to get Martial going.
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What are you talking about mate, Martial hasn't played in ages and when he has he's only played at CF.
 
Teja said:
You think we're using Pogba as we used Fellaini. Sure. No point even responding to shit like that.



What are you talking about mate, Martial hasn't played in ages and when he has he's only played at CF.
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When he was playing and stinking the place out up front, Ole did the above and thought it'd work. Even a moron knew it wouldn't. It's relevant with regards to OPS point about playing attackers out of position to shoehorn one player in.
 
Pogba is an enigma, not sure where to play him for the betterment of the team, can do some fantastic things on the ball, but overall he just doesn't appear that great. Easily beaten when being run at, dwells on the ball far too long, fails to track runners. I'm afraid that we may be stuck with him for another season, as all the supposedly interested clubs in him may face some form of sanction from UEFA.
 
acnumber9 said:
I agree we should be playing Rashford left and Greenwood. Pogba should be playing in midfield. We need to start taking games to teams.
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Did you not see TAA ghost past Pogba like he wasn't there when moved to central midfield? We have a huge body of evidence over the last few years to conclude that it's a failed experiment. Trying it again would be akin to moving back in with an abusive partner because you think they've changed.

To play Pogba in a midfield two you'd need Ferdinand-Vidic behind and Keane alongside. It's a fantasy.
 
Castia said:
We need a quality DM and he needs to play in midfield along side him. Rashford on the left.
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I've always said that Rice coming here could mean a 433 which gives the team so much more versatility in the attack.
 
The only way to fit everyone is is to sign a world class CDM that can let Bruno and Pogba play together.

Rashford----Cavani----Greenwood

Pogba--------CDM----------Bruno
 
Against oppositions who play with a low block, I like him playing there. It gives us that extra bit of creativity in the final third against a defensive line that allows very little space to run into.

Games like tonight, for example, where we need to be able to counter, then he's probably not the best option there.

Next season, I think he will be used as a LM and CDM. We just need to know when to do it.
 
pocco said:
When he was playing and stinking the place out up front, Ole did the above and thought it'd work. Even a moron knew it wouldn't. It's relevant with regards to OPS point about playing attackers out of position to shoehorn one player in.
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He played upfront and was shit. He gave him a chance on the left but that lasted maybe 1-2 games and then got dropped. I don't understand what the problem is.
 
noodlehair said:
Not sure why this needa thread to point out but apparently this compltely obvious fact isn't completely obvious enough for our own manager. So, here are some reasons

a) Pogba is not a left winger
b) Oppositon teams when he plays there just attack freely down that side for the entire game, often creating multiple chances as a direct result and scoring multiple times. e.g. Liverpool, right now.
c) Pogba is not a winger, he doesn't know how to play as one. He doesn't score often enough to play in a front three. I mean, he just isn't a winger. It's like saying that a circle isn't a square. It's impossible to break it down anymore simply because it is as obvious as it can possibly be already.

Here's some other things.
a) Rashford is a left winger
b) Rashford has 20 goals this season, as a left winger, making him our top scorer from open play and one of the most prolific left sided attacking players in Europe.
c) No other team, in the world, would sacrifice their most dangerous attacking player, in order to play a midfielder out of position, score less goals, and let the oppositon team score more often.
d) Scoring less and conceding more is not an effective way to win games.

I'm sorry but Ole undermines all the good work he does with shite like this. You may as well stick Shaw in goal and then persist with it all season and act like there's no connection between that and conceding goals due to goalkeeping errors. This is basic fecking common sense level stuff. If you HAVE to play Pogba, play him in his position, or in a position that you don't have someone better to play in. You wouldn't play him instead of Maguir because he'd be a worse centreback than Maguire is, so don't fecking play him instead of Rashford, in Rashford's position. Or at the very fecking least don't then shove Rashford into Greenwood's position instead of just playing Greenwood, just to play Pogba.
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A lot of good points in your post!
We needed Greenwood in the Leicester game two days ago because of some injuries and needed rest to Rashford. Otherwise I think Greenwood would have started in " his" position. But I agree in your point that Rashford is better on the left, and Greenwood on the right.
Pogba has done really good on the left as well so for me it is an option in some games, especially with Cavani up front.
Today it didn't turn out good though! I want to "blame" the CB's and CM's mostly for the pore performance in total. Defensive they didn't closed down the space between them and offensive they were horrible. Passing horrible, pushed forward in the wrong times and they just didn't helped itch other out good enough. The spine was all over the place today.
 
How many United players have there been have that caused as much discussion as Pogba over his "favoured position"? At what point does a good footballer become one by virtue of consistent performances, reducing such concerns over position to meaningless chatter as he simply does the required aspects of a role week in week out? It feels as if regardless of where he is played he is always going to be debated.

If he plays deep you get criticism of his work rate, his defensive positioning, his risk taking in deep positions. You do get the benefit of his talent too, let's be clear.

If he plays in a free midfield role...well...he can't. Not in the current lineup.

If he plays in an attacking role somebody else has to be moved and it feels like a concession because overall he doesn't produce enough in the way of goals.

He is a conundrum. In this side with 2 deep players and Bruno he is very, very difficult to accomodate. It is not because of the manager, it is not because of the tactics, it is because of Pogba's weaknesses. He should be able to fit into a fairly standard setup without us having to jump through hoops but he has a peculiar set of qualities that mean we do have these issues and it is probably at the heart of why he has been so inconsistent. Yes, you can build a setup with the perfect blend of midfielders as he seemed to have in the glorious Juve days we are so often reminded of. But there is a guy called Bruno, there is our defence, it is not all about Paul Pogba.
 
Crashoutcassius said:
Plays well there so .. also, simply can't play in a midfield two with any of our midfielders without us getting roasted
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This should be /thread. It's the managers job to get the best of his players. Hindsight is always 20/20
 
Can't play left wing.
Can't be trusted to play centre mid.

Should be able to play as a box to box player, has almost all the tools except he's lazy, he lacks concentration and he's a liability in defensive positions.
 
Chicharito_ said:
The only way to fit everyone is is to sign a world class CDM that can let Bruno and Pogba play together.

Rashford----Cavani----Greenwood

Pogba--------CDM----------Bruno
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Absolutely. I mentioned this in the other thread.

Does one exist though, and will we ever play that way?

Imagine though if we could get Pogba and Bruno playing in an advanced double-pivot, it would be crazy for breaking down those bogie teams we face. Bruno could do it, for sure, but does Pogba have the discipline?

One thing Pogba would bring there is the ability to really drive forward with the ball from midfield... we've seen McT do this a bit but not consistently, and he certainly isn't on Pogba's level as a dribbler/ball retainer.

It's an interesting idea, anyway.
 
finneh said:
His passing is beneficial, especially against the likes of Villa, Burnley, Granada and Spurs (where he has hours of time on the ball and acres of space); however as OP implies we can't forget what we're sacrificing to accommodate some nice passing.

We're sacrificing our most proficient goalscorer (Rashford) in their preferred position and also sacrificing another proficient goalscorer (Greenwood) in their strongest position.

I think most would agree a front four of Fernandes-Rashford-Greenwood-Cavani, all playing in their preferred positions is better than Pogba-Fernandes-Rashford-Cavani whereby 2/4 are out of position.

If we need Pogba's passing in the system Ole wants to play it can only be instead of Fernandes'.
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Amen

As skilful as he is I think it’s best we sell him this summer.
Too often against the best sides he disrupts the balance of our team.
 
I still think its probably his best position. Him fecking around and being inept on the left wing is so much less damaging than in the middle of the park.
 
Teja said:
He played upfront and was shit. He gave him a chance on the left but that lasted maybe 1-2 games and then got dropped. I don't understand what the problem is.
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Playing everyone out of position just to get Martial on the left. I mean, we all know Rashford is shite on RW and have since I think early Jose days.

Rashford got moved around a lot during that period and his form has now fallen off a cliff, even at LW.
 
It annoys me that we can talk about Casemiro - Kross - Modric or Busquets - Xavi - Iniesta or Fernandinho - Silva - De Bruyne but a DM - Pogba - Bruno is difficult because one player is too tired or lazy to do the the required work off the ball
 
Pogba's best position is in the final third. He loses defensive concentration anywhere else. I actually think playing him at LW has been an inspired choice by Ole and finally we could see a team with both Bruno and Pogba in without getting overrun in midfield. But the added creativity comes at the expense of Rashford/Greenwood. Until we get a proper DM/sell Pogba, that is how it's going to be.
 
jamesjimmybyrondean said:
It annoys me that we can talk about Casemiro - Kross - Modric or Busquets - Xavi - Iniesta or Fernandinho - Silva - De Bruyne but a DM - Pogba - Bruno is difficult because one player is too tired or lazy to do the the required work off the ball
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I think the work-rate is one aspect, and possibly the styles of play are another. Those players are notable in their ability to retain possession and control things and it is fundamental to the way they play and also the way they defend as a team.

We are a team that by Ole's own suggestion try to get the ball forward incisively. Bruno and Pogba pretty much try stuff off the cuff and turn the ball over a lot. If you have players coughing up possession routinely then the balance needs to be able to cover for that.
 
Pogba generally rips it up when we play him in his favoured area.

He's obviously a LCM but Ole won't move away from a 4-2-3-1, so the left wing is the closest we'll come to seeing Pogba being utilized optimally. The question is if Pogba goes and we go for Grealish, but Rashford still starts on the right, will it be déjà vu all over again?
 
passing-wind said:
I've always said that Rice coming here could mean a 433 which gives the team so much more versatility in the attack.
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Rice has only played in a double pivot for both England and West Ham. It’s different sharing responsibility to holding completely on your own.
 
He's not a central midfielder, either. We're yet to really find a way of getting him and Fernandes in the same side, and Fernandes is simply better than him.

I am still assuming he'll be moved on in the summer,
 
Chicharito_ said:
The only way to fit everyone is is to sign a world class CDM that can let Bruno and Pogba play together.

Rashford----Cavani----Greenwood

Pogba--------CDM----------Bruno
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This. Mc Fred needs to end. Play your best players in position.
 
Pogba's best position has always been LCM in a 4-3-3 problem with a 4-3-3 is it neutralizes Bruno so playing as a LW in a 4-2-3-1 with license to roam is the closest we'll get to having Pogba playing in a position that suits him as well as Bruno. Said it in another thread he's not a midfielder for a pivot even if we got a DM he'd still be a defensive liability especially in big games in a deep position where he's subjected to defensive duties. LW keeps him as far away as possible from our box and closer to the opposition box. Problem with this is Rashford having to play as a RW but in a more settled team he may adapt to that position especially knowing he's competing with Greenwood
So it's either 4-3-3 with Pogba/Bruno in midfield and Rashford LW while neutralizing Bruno as a No8, 4-2-3-1 with Pogba in a pivot where he's a liability with Bruno/Rashford in favored positions or 4-2-3-1 with Pogba LW, Bruno No10 and Rashford/Greenwood RW personally feel the latter is more balanced and will do well with a brand new pivot midfield
 
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