Players 'close' to going on strikes - Rodri

golden_blunder said:
You would for a couple of years then you wouldn’t be able to sustain it
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This idea that elite athletes work less hard than anyone with a 9-5 is divorced from reality.

They work HARDER than we do. They’re not just talented folks knocking a ball about for a little bit. It’s truly exhausting to be an elite athlete.

Add in all the stress from not having any control over large swathes of your week. Be here at this time for this flight, never knowing where you’re going or settling in one place as you fly across Europe.

Loads of being a professional footballer is shit.

All of the upside is playing football and being paid loads of cash to do it. But anyone not being able to find empathy with players carrying injuries, playing, having massage, ice, injections, and peer pressure to play when unfit, with genuine concerns around a long term injury affecting or ending a career… is a little odd.

You can’t just pay athletes to be fit. When a player that’s just won a Euros, PL, League, Club World Cup, and a Treble, while being paid £350k a week, is complaining about working conditions, people should just listen.

Rodri is a peak physical specimen. 6’2”, built like a cruiserweight, and was in the top 10 in distance covered in the PL and CL for the last two seasons. If HE is complaining, there’s a problem. Of course the inverse can be true, he’s exhausted as he’s in the top 10, but that’s arse about face I think.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
This idea that elite athletes work less hard than anyone with a 9-5 is divorced from reality.

They work HARDER than we do. They’re not just talented folks knocking a ball about for a little bit. It’s truly exhausting to be an elite athlete.

Add in all the stress from not having any control over large swathes of your week. Be here at this time for this flight, never knowing where you’re going or settling in one place as you fly across Europe.

Loads of being a professional footballer is shit.

All of the upside is playing football and being paid loads of cash to do it. But anyone not being able to find empathy with players carrying injuries, playing, having massage, ice, injections, and peer pressure to play when unfit, with genuine concerns around a long term injury affecting or ending a career… is a little odd.

You can’t just pay athletes to be fit. When a player that’s just won a Euros, PL, League, Club World Cup, and a Treble, while being paid £350k a week, is complaining about working conditions, people should just listen.

Rodri is a peak physical specimen. 6’2”, built like a cruiserweight, and was in the top 10 in distance covered in the PL and CL for the last two seasons. If HE is complaining, there’s a problem. Of course the inverse can be true, he’s exhausted as he’s in the top 10, but that’s arse about face I think.
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Fans are becoming disconnected from players because of the obscene salaries. They think it should equate to being on to form every week, not missing a pass, finishing chances, playing through injuries.
I can understand the frustration and anger, but we need to understand players are human not robots. Their bodies will break if pushed too far for too long.

We’ve been talking around this issue for years but still the calendar keeps getting added too. FIFA, UEFA, all the FAs, all the clubs, they are constantly thinking about more money. They’ve forgotten the roots of the game.

I’m all for strike action
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
This idea that elite athletes work less hard than anyone with a 9-5 is divorced from reality.

They work HARDER than we do. They’re not just talented folks knocking a ball about for a little bit. It’s truly exhausting to be an elite athlete.

Add in all the stress from not having any control over large swathes of your week. Be here at this time for this flight, never knowing where you’re going or settling in one place as you fly across Europe.

Loads of being a professional footballer is shit.

All of the upside is playing football and being paid loads of cash to do it. But anyone not being able to find empathy with players carrying injuries, playing, having massage, ice, injections, and peer pressure to play when unfit, with genuine concerns around a long term injury affecting or ending a career… is a little odd.

You can’t just pay athletes to be fit. When a player that’s just won a Euros, PL, League, Club World Cup, and a Treble, while being paid £350k a week, is complaining about working conditions, people should just listen.

Rodri is a peak physical specimen. 6’2”, built like a cruiserweight, and was in the top 10 in distance covered in the PL and CL for the last two seasons. If HE is complaining, there’s a problem. Of course the inverse can be true, he’s exhausted as he’s in the top 10, but that’s arse about face I think.
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I agree with most of your points so far but disagree that either they or us work harder than the other. That's subjective.
 
golden_blunder said:
You would for a couple of years then you wouldn’t be able to sustain it
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People that have not done it don't realize that athletes are in constant pain and constantly tired. It starts during teenage and doesn't stop.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Tell that to the player that sat in a press conference and said ‘Players are at breaking point’.

Again, for the umpteenth time…

Would you rather;

- 50-60 games a year played by teams with fit squads.
-70-80 games a year played by teams missing players.

And yes, I’m a UK supporter and I don’t give a feck about my team playing friendlies overseas. I think it’s silly and I’d cancel them all because I don’t care about them at all.

By all means be happy that Governing bodies are adding games, and clubs are adding even more in pursuit of money… but it’s proper wrong end of the telescope stuff. What you’re saying is ‘I’m happy to pay more money, to see unfit players, play less well’. I’ll never understand that.

This ‘put up and shut up’ attitude from fans towards players is so self defeating. They are the ones you want to watch. Why on earth do you prize a balance sheet over players? I feel it’s the same group that forever complains about players being injured. Madness.
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Oh so we should protect the 1% of players because they play for the biggest clubs?
I have been hearing this "players are at a breaking point" for number of years, yet I have not seen 1 footballer retire from football or leave a top club in his prime and go somewhere else based on workload.

Instead I keep seeing the opposite, players not willing to sign for clubs that aren't in Europe, players pushing for moves to clubs playing in europe... guess what if you sign for a club in Europe, you will have to play more games? Who would have thought? definitely not you.

Your point is basically invalid, Arsenal played alot of games last season had a good injury record, Brentford, Bournemouth and other clubs who have less games had alot of injuries, so its not actually true that less games = more players fit. Are you saying that if we reduce the games by 28% injuries will reduce by that?

So are you saying you would rather not play in CL or any European cups so you can have a "fully fit" squad for the season?

Or are you saying you would rather Manutd not be able to sign top players because they cant afford them?

Then that is fine, if you think that money has no relevance, to me it is a direct relevance. To attract top players, you need to do the following:
1. Compete for trophies
2. Play in the CL
3. Pay higher wages
4. Pay higher transfer fees.

To do that, under FFP / PSR whatever you want to call it, you need to have a revenue to match. So you need commercial deals and fans all around the world, which as a United fan I am proud to say we are supported well across the globe. Believe it or not, the more fans a club has the higher revenue it generates, shock to you but its true.

So your plan is instead, lets forget about the international support and keep Manutd only to Manchester, how do you think the club will make up for lost revenue? Increase ticket prices, oh who does that impact? fans that go to games. You would rather pay more to go watch, than to have fans in Asia watch their team for 2 weeks?
 
He is right. The greed in football and from the institutions is causing harm and needs to be more balanced imo
 
SilentWitness said:
I agree with most of your points so far but disagree that either they or us work harder than the other. That's subjective.
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Ok, I’ll qualify. Very few people work as hard as elite athletes.

It’s subjective. But people are delusional if they think their 9-5 is as hard as an athletes schedule. We project that on them as they’re bopping about buying Gucci at 4pm.
 
SilentWitness said:
Why should the answer be quitting something instead of changing to make it more manageable?
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I agree. But they should take their grievances up with the owners of their respective clubs first and foremost. Or maybe i missed their uproar when the elite clubs (the ones that play the most games per season) announced their plan to run a whole new league parallel to the domestic ones (insert show me the money GIF).
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Ok, I’ll qualify. Very few people work as hard as elite athletes.

It’s subjective. But people are delusional if they think their 9-5 is as hard as an athletes schedule. We project that on them as they’re bopping about buying Gucci at 4pm.
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I agree with that. I think people just see football as the game, without thinking about the training, recovery, travelling etc.
 
romufc said:
Oh so we should protect the 1% of players because they play for the biggest clubs?
I have been hearing this "players are at a breaking point" for number of years, yet I have not seen 1 footballer retire from football or leave a top club in his prime and go somewhere else based on workload.

Instead I keep seeing the opposite, players not willing to sign for clubs that aren't in Europe, players pushing for moves to clubs playing in europe... guess what if you sign for a club in Europe, you will have to play more games? Who would have thought? definitely not you.

Your point is basically invalid, Arsenal played alot of games last season had a good injury record, Brentford, Bournemouth and other clubs who have less games had alot of injuries, so its not actually true that less games = more players fit. Are you saying that if we reduce the games by 28% injuries will reduce by that?

So are you saying you would rather not play in CL or any European cups so you can have a "fully fit" squad for the season?

Or are you saying you would rather Manutd not be able to sign top players because they cant afford them?

Then that is fine, if you think that money has no relevance, to me it is a direct relevance. To attract top players, you need to do the following:
1. Compete for trophies
2. Play in the CL
3. Pay higher wages
4. Pay higher transfer fees.

To do that, under FFP / PSR whatever you want to call it, you need to have a revenue to match. So you need commercial deals and fans all around the world, which as a United fan I am proud to say we are supported well across the globe. Believe it or not, the more fans a club has the higher revenue it generates, shock to you but its true.

So your plan is instead, lets forget about the international support and keep Manutd only to Manchester, how do you think the club will make up for lost revenue? Increase ticket prices, oh who does that impact? fans that go to games. You would rather pay more to go watch, than to have fans in Asia watch their team for 2 weeks?
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Mate, I don’t care about International fans getting the ability to see our players joh around in LA or Seoul. Dont give a Fcuk. Never will. It’s an utter irrelevance. Pursuing that money is making the game worse, not better.

To be clear… I’m not saying United bow out of all the money grabbing bollocks. I’m saying EVERYONE does. So all that other mental gymnastics you posted above would be rendered moot. The less money there is, the less money is needed everywhere. Lower the tide line.

Also, wang on about Arsenal if you like. I watch them loads. Saka was fecked. Martinelli a shadow of his former self. Odegaard and Rice were running on fumes from March onwards. They’re not the example you’re looking for.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
So you’ll support the players if they boycott internationals? Great. Same outcome mate. You clearly only had a problem over the how.
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Let's be honest. If a relatively young player boycott his national team in order to rest, he will be the target of an entire nation. It's the most nonsensical proposition that people tend to make on this topic.

Again the solutions are relatively simple, Football introduced subtitutions and larger squads to fix this issue. If clubs refuse to do what they are supposed to, then they should be forced to do it. That's what Rugby is doing these days, international players have mandatory rest and in Top 14 players have now a maximum of 6 consecutive games before a mandatory week of rest.
 
Berbaclass said:
That’s different to normal people working a trade how?
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It's not and when people that work a trade decide to strike for better work conditions, I support it.

Also you are the one who suggested that they aren't comparable, when they are.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Mate, I don’t care about International fans getting the ability to see our players joh around in LA or Seoul. Dont give a Fcuk. Never will. It’s an utter irrelevance. Pursuing that money is making the game worse, not better.

To be clear… I’m not saying United bow out of all the money grabbing bollocks. I’m saying EVERYONE does. So all that other mental gymnastics you posted above would be rendered moot. The less money there is, the less money is needed everywhere. Lower the tide line.

Also, wang on about Arsenal if you like. I watch them loads. Saka was fecked. Martinelli a shadow of his former self. Odegaard and Rice were running on fumes from March onwards. They’re not the example you’re looking for.
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So you prefer Manutd to stop these international deals and pay less to players and become a mid table team, then I agree with you Feck everyone, Feck the sponsors. Charge the fans more to pay the wages and transfer fees.

Have you got the data to prove they were running on fumes?

Martinelli is a shadow of himself? what self? a player who has had 1 good season in his entire career ? He had a summer off and still looking crap... maybe the player isnt as good as you think he is.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
So if they strike for that, you’ll support it?
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They can do what they want... lets see if this strike is real or not first.

Talk is cheap, lets see if he actually has the balls to strike and say I am not playing until we limit the season to 40 games overall.

And if he does that, I will say well done lad, I back you.
 
JPRouve said:
It's not and when people that work a trade decide to strike for better work conditions, I support it.

Also you are the one who suggested that they aren't comparable, when they are.
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They are comparable in the broad sense that they are people with jobs yes.
 
romufc said:
So you prefer Manutd to stop these international deals and pay less to players and become a mid table team, then I agree with you Feck everyone, Feck the sponsors. Charge the fans more to pay the wages and transfer fees.

Have you got the data to prove they were running on fumes?

Martinelli is a shadow of himself? what self? a player who has had 1 good season in his entire career ? He had a summer off and still looking crap... maybe the player isnt as good as you think he is.
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No. I want all of football to stop it.

If;
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed

Maybe just stop? Take less money from overseas sponsors. No demand for tours. No extra money for players. Fewer games for teams. Players get more rest.
 
romufc said:
They can do what they want... lets see if this strike is real or not first.

Talk is cheap, lets see if he actually has the balls to strike and say I am not playing until we limit the season to 40 games overall.

And if he does that, I will say well done lad, I back you.
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So you agree with him, and with a lower threshold than I’d support.

You’re MORE on his side than me. Man alive! We got there.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
No. I want all of football to stop it.

If;
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed

Maybe just stop? Take less money from overseas sponsors. No demand for tours. No extra money for players. Fewer games for teams. Players get more rest.
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In a world where its about global money, yep lets make the PL a English only owned, english only players ?
Why support a club that is global then? What you are saying is what clubs in lower divisons are like. They dont have big sponsors, the players are not on astronomical wages, no overseas tours. Maybe you should change who you support because you believe in nothing what Manutd is about.

UnrelatedPsuedo said:
So you agree with him, and with a lower threshold than I’d support.

You’re MORE on his side than me. Man alive! We got there.
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No, I will back him for standing up to himself rather than just barking in a press conference.

Its like when super league was announced, fans could easily cry about it online but the fact that the fans cared so much and went out to protest showed the clubs, oops this is a mistake and things need to change.

Rodri if he had something about him would actually strike.. will he ? No because he wont get the 200k in his bank.
 
romufc said:
In a world where its about global money, yep lets make the PL a English only owned, english only players ?
Why support a club that is global then? What you are saying is what clubs in lower divisons are like. They dont have big sponsors, the players are not on astronomical wages, no overseas tours. Maybe you should change who you support because you believe in nothing what Manutd is about.


No, I will back him for standing up to himself rather than just barking in a press conference.

Its like when super league was announced, fans could easily cry about it online but the fact that the fans cared so much and went out to protest showed the clubs, oops this is a mistake and things need to change.

Rodri if he had something about him would actually strike.. will he ? No because he wont get the 200k in his bank.
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Listen to Rodri’s interview. He’s a players advocate. He wasn’t talking solely about himself.

Quit being a fanny about all the English nonsense. I said nothing of the sort. If you’re advocating for a sponsor dictating where my football club HAS to tour, it’s you that’s upside down on the issue.

Go well mate.
 
It's understandable why the players are frustrated. Competitions are expanding and adding extra matches not for the sanctity of the competition but for pure greed. It's ridiculous that the top English clubs are competing in four competitions.

I honestly think the League Cup should be scrapped. There's no need for England to have two domestic cups.
 
Todd said:
It's understandable why the players are frustrated. Competitions are expanding and adding extra matches not for the sanctity of the competition but for pure greed. It's ridiculous that the top English clubs are competing in four competitions.

I honestly think the League Cup should be scrapped. There's no need for England to have two domestic cups.
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Just remove teams playing in Europe. Or give them the option. Award National league teams to make up the required numbers every year if needed.

Crystal Palace et al would love to win it. No need to take that away because the top teams need to limit match numbers.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
No. I want all of football to stop it.

If;
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed
-Sponsors pay big money
-Expect overseas tours
-Players demand more
-More sponsorship is needed

Maybe just stop? Take less money from overseas sponsors. No demand for tours. No extra money for players. Fewer games for teams. Players get more rest.
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You are assuming that sponsors exist to pay players wages when they exist and will always exist because Football clubs are highly visible and it's valuable for sponsors and club owners/executives. There is only two reasonable outcomes here, either players get a fair share or owners get the share that players currently have on top of what they already have themselves.
 
UnrelatedPsuedo said:
Listen to Rodri’s interview. He’s a players advocate. He wasn’t talking solely about himself.

Quit being a fanny about all the English nonsense. I said nothing of the sort. If you’re advocating for a sponsor dictating where my football club HAS to tour, it’s you that’s upside down on the issue.

Go well mate.
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Is it? How many players are signed up to his agency?

I never said a sponsor dictate where has to take place. When a club is a global brand, they want to give something back, which is why they go to America, Australia, Asia.

If you dont like how a big club operates support a team that meets all your criteria of not having sponsors, not playing CL, not needing 200k a week. There are plenty of clubs like that.
 
romufc said:
Is it? How many players are signed up to his agency?

I never said a sponsor dictate where has to take place. When a club is a global brand, they want to give something back, which is why they go to America, Australia, Asia.

If you dont like how a big club operates support a team that meets all your criteria of not having sponsors, not playing CL, not needing 200k a week. There are plenty of clubs like that.
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So, I have this bridge. It is for sale.
 
This could all be resolved by affected players asking to have a limited amount of minutes/games worked into their contracts. They work just about everything else in so why not this, if it is such a concern. They are just worried they will end up having to take a little less on the salary side...oh no...really this affects only a slight percentage of players, most of the others are only too happy to have more games.
 
I'm not at all sympathetic to these complaints. They're paid extremely well and if any one of them has a medical or fatigue problem at any point in time they can work it out with their manager, whether of the club or national team.
 
lex talionis said:
I'm not at all sympathetic to these complaints. They're paid extremely well and if any one of them has a medical or fatigue problem at any point in time they can work it out with their manager, whether of the club or national team.
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You know what is funny about this situation, that players say if they get rested for 2/3 games will moan that they not getting played.
 
romufc said:
In a world where its about global money, yep lets make the PL a English only owned, english only players ?
Why support a club that is global then? What you are saying is what clubs in lower divisons are like. They dont have big sponsors, the players are not on astronomical wages, no overseas tours. Maybe you should change who you support because you believe in nothing what Manutd is about.


No, I will back him for standing up to himself rather than just barking in a press conference.

Its like when super league was announced, fans could easily cry about it online but the fact that the fans cared so much and went out to protest showed the clubs, oops this is a mistake and things need to change.

Rodri if he had something about him would actually strike.. will he ? No because he wont get the 200k in his bank.
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Referencing the first part of your post, what on earth are you talking about? Nobody said that the PL should go English players and English owned only?

By the way clubs including United used to do their preseason to UK, Ireland and occasionally Europe. They still had global pull.

The only reason they go to the states or China is money. What do we gain from it apart from money? Injuries, tiredness. No thanks. It’s pointless
 
lex talionis said:
I'm not at all sympathetic to these complaints. They're paid extremely well and if any one of them has a medical or fatigue problem at any point in time they can work it out with their manager, whether of the club or national team.
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Yes, I agree. Initially, I had some sympathy. But Rodri here is speaking as if all the players first of all would strike. You can ask players from a mid-table to bottom-dweller team and they probably would not have any concerns. He gets compensated for those extra games a lot more than those players... it's part of the deal. Dont take the contract otherwise.
 
How much is too much?

Clearly the league campaign can not be reduced, so what about the cups?

Personally I'd do away with International Friendlies and the Carabao Cup. The FA cup is an institution and I don't want to see it diluted in any way.

Any other guff is purely about money and nothing else - ridiculous vanity competitions in far flung countries that span the majority of the summer break, bloated european campaigns...
 
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