Play Diego tonight

[lchk]

Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>

What made you so sure that we will definitely get a striker in Jan? And even if we really get one, chances are that the new striker may be just as poor as Diego or Veron. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Refer to the official site.

Not if the new striker is guhdjohnsen

I think fergie will be buying a proven striker of european calibre

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>Refer to the official site.
Not if the new striker is guhdjohnsen
I think fergie will be buying a proven striker of european calibre</strong><hr></blockquote>

What sort of a goal record would you like a potential new striker to have?

 

[Jason F]

Lets give Diego a chance and stop calling him a striker, it is quite clear to everyone Forlan isnt a striker, never was, never will be. The guy is a winger, if it looks like a winger and plays like a winger chances are its a winger!

If we take some of this pressure of the lad be not playing him up front and putting pressure on him to score he might appear a bit more settled!

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Jason F:
<strong>a winger!

If we take some of this pressure of the lad be not playing him up front and putting pressure on him to score he might appear a bit more settled!</strong><hr></blockquote>

I suggested that last season when it looked apparent to me that Diego isn't a striker - he plays too deep to be a natural front-runner.

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>

I suggested that last season when it looked apparent to me that Diego isn't a striker - he plays too deep to be a natural front-runner.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hes not one to lead the line, similar to sparky if he had a bit more meat on him. It would be nice to see him get a few games playing off Ruud. How many full game shas he played for us now its still to early to judge him imo.

 

[Julian Denny]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Hes not one to lead the line, similar to sparky if he had a bit more meat on him. It would be nice to see him get a few games playing off Ruud. How many full game shas he played for us now its still to early to judge him imo.</strong><hr></blockquote>

For how much longer do you think you'll be saying that ?

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Hes not one to lead the line, similar to sparky if he had a bit more meat on him.</strong><hr></blockquote>

He's nothing like Sparky!!! For a start, Sparky
was one to lead the line.

For goodness sake Murt. Use him when we're in a position to gamble a bit - but if he hasn't scored just one goal in 9 starts plus sub. appearances, then I find that a bit of a worry.

You can't just throw him in and play him just because we bought him and he must be good.

As a midfielder he will be useful. But as yet, as a second striker he's a disaster.

I would continue to use him as a sub. but giving him longer than 15 minutes, and hopefully not when we're chasing a game. If he can score a goal then, give him a bit longer next time, and then start him regularly maybe.

We're crying out for goals in the PL. Now isn't the time to experiment.

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Julian Denny:
<strong>
For how much longer do you think you'll be saying that ?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hww long did you give Andy Cole and Teddy Sheringham before you gave up on them?
Two of Englands finest strikers at their peaks, well used to the English style of play etc, surely they clicked within weeks of joining?
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">

 

[Jason F]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>

I suggested that last season when it looked apparent to me that Diego isn't a striker - he plays too deep to be a natural front-runner.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I completely agree with you, he pulls wide alot of the time, he naturally plays deep and all of his goals i have seen from his Independiente days are all resonably long range, he just isnt a natural striker. I personally wouldnt like to see him playing off Ruud, id rather see him used as a back up winger and see us bring another couple of strikers.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

What sort of a goal record would you like a potential new striker to have?</strong><hr></blockquote>

EG is my top choice

a proven premiership strike rate is always a good benchmark

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>He's nothing like Sparky!!! For a start, Sparky
was one to lead the line.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
ok sparky took down long passes but he normally wasnt the furthest man forward and drifted deep into midfield.
The normal occurence was a ball to sparkys chest who layed it off to Robbo or whoever and a pass was hit to the partner who was looping a timed run

ie brucie-Sparky-robbo-striker

¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨-&gt;-----o-----------&gt;&gt;o&gt;&gt;striker
¨¨¨¨¨¨BR--&lt;----o--------&lt;-o--MH
¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨¨-----o-----&gt;
SB---o----------&gt;

Diego is 23, if he put on some weight which he naturally will do

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Hes not one to lead the line, similar to sparky if he had a bit more meat on him. It would be nice to see him get a few games playing off Ruud. How many full game shas he played for us now its still to early to judge him imo.</strong><hr></blockquote>

So if he continues to be mediocre or even off-form until the end of the season, will you change your tune?

 

[Jason F]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

EG is my top choice

a proven premiership strike rate is always a good benchmark</strong><hr></blockquote>

I think he is a bit overrated myself, we already have OGS and RVN who are similar to Eidur, i would like to see a blazingly fast striker and a link up man like Teddy.

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

EG is my top choice

a proven premiership strike rate is always a good benchmark</strong><hr></blockquote>

Andy Cole and Sheringham were both proven premiership goalscorers and it took them ca 3 respectively 2 seasons to really settle
If Eidur came and didnt score after 9 starts and a couple of 15 minute runs at the end would you give up on him too ?

 

[Julian Denny]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Hww long did you give Andy Cole and Teddy Sheringham before you gave up on them?
Two of Englands finest strikers at their peaks, well used to the English style of play etc, surely they clicked within weeks of joining?
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Personally I'd rather have either of those two any day and it didn't take either of them very long to prove their worth. Unfortunately it seems Diego is a complete misfit. Anyhow seeing as for some reason you're talking about partnerships, with whom would you want to partner Diego and how long are you going to give him to "click" ?

 

[Livvie]

If Forlan eventually starts to put the ball n the net, then great.

But to compare him to Mark Hughes.........

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

So if he continues to be mediocre or even off-form until the end of the season, will you change your tune?</strong><hr></blockquote>

I supported Andy Cole all through his time at Utd and i will do the same for Diego. After ca 2 seasons with us Cole was rumoured to be off to Everton for 3 million or so which shows how bad things were going for him.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Jason F:
<strong>

I think he is a bit overrated myself, we already have OGS and RVN who are similar to Eidur, i would like to see a blazingly fast striker and a link up man like Teddy.</strong><hr></blockquote>

EG over-rated? I don't think so, check out his performances last season and he has a bit of pace too though certainly not to the level of a thunderbolt like henry.

More importantly, this lad can create and finish moves - something we are sorely lacking upfront when rvn and/or ogs aren't around.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Jason F:
<strong>

I completely agree with you, he pulls wide alot of the time, he naturally plays deep and all of his goals i have seen from his Independiente days are all resonably long range, he just isnt a natural striker. I personally wouldnt like to see him playing off Ruud, id rather see him used as a back up winger and see us bring another couple of strikers.</strong><hr></blockquote>

And yet he was bought to replace Andy Cole?

Gee, did martin ferguson recommend the wrong player?

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

EG over-rated? I don't think so, check out his performances last season and he has a bit of pace too though certainly not to the level of a thunderbolt like henry.

More importantly, this lad can create and finish moves - something we are sorely lacking upfront when rvn and/or ogs aren't around.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Totally agree.

We need three, preferably four, strikers who have proved themselves.

We're not a charity. Forlan was bought on the strength of goals scored in a crap league.

He may well come good, I'm not saying he won't. But I'm not going to lavish false praise.

Forlan should play when we're leading comfortably, so that there's no pressure on him. A couple of goals might give him confidence, and then if that's the problem, it might be a springboard.

But suppose it's not a confidence thing.....

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Andy Cole and Sheringham were both proven premiership goalscorers and it took them ca 3 respectively 2 seasons to really settle
If Eidur came and didnt score after 9 starts and a couple of 15 minute runs at the end would you give up on him too ?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Will he? that's a hypothetical question

So the question is who amongst Eidur and Forlan is more likely to succeed at OT?

you know the answer....

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

I supported Andy Cole all through his time at Utd and i will do the same for Diego. After ca 2 seasons with us Cole was rumoured to be off to Everton for 3 million or so which shows how bad things were going for him.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Was he that useless?

How many goals did he score for us in his first season? I remember something like five past ipswich in one game or something like that....

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>If Forlan eventually starts to put the ball n the net, then great.

But to compare him to Mark Hughes.........</strong><hr></blockquote>

Forlan with weight = Sparky


<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

I supported Andy Cole all through his time at Utd and i will do the same for Diego. After ca 2 seasons with us Cole was rumoured to be off to Everton for 3 million or so which shows how bad things were going for him.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Andy Cole didn't take three seasons to settle in. Throughout his career here there was an element who didn't rate him highly. But by the time he scored five against Ipswich he was recognised as our top striker at the club. And Sheringham's lack of acceptance was because people were still missing Cantona and unfortunately Teddy suffered because of it. But imo Teddy settled in quicker than Cole did.

Murt - champion of the underdog. Nice trait, but won't win us any prizes.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>

Totally agree.

We need three, preferably four, strikers who have proved themselves.

We're not a charity. Forlan was bought on the strength of goals scored in a crap league.

He may well come good, I'm not saying he won't. But I'm not going to lavish false praise.

Forlan should play when we're leading comfortably, so that there's no pressure on him. A couple of goals might give him confidence, and then if that's the problem, it might be a springboard.

But suppose it's not a confidence thing.....</strong><hr></blockquote>

SAF has already stated that he wants a goalscorer who can do it in the premiership since all the top european targets are cuptied anyway

and Eidur just happens to be the best amongst the realistic targets who have proven themselves in the premiership

Let's hope SAF and PK have already started talks with Ken Bates....

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>


Andy Cole didn't take three seasons to settle in. Throughout his career here there was an element who didn't rate him highly. But by the time he scored five against Ipswich he was recognised as our top striker at the club. And Sheringham's lack of acceptance was because people were still missing Cantona and unfortunately Teddy suffered because of it. But imo Teddy settled in quicker than Cole did.

Murt - champion of the underdog. Nice trait, but won't win us any prizes.</strong><hr></blockquote>

As fans, we should all support our team and players when they out on the pitch.

But let's be level-headed, this is a forum after all and constructive criticism should be as welcomed as praise.

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

As fans, we should all support our team and players when they out on the pitch.

</strong><hr></blockquote>

Agree with that one hundred per cent.

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>Andy Cole didn't take three seasons to settle in. Throughout his career here there was an element who didn't rate him highly. But by the time he scored five against Ipswich he was recognised as our top striker at the club. And Sheringham's lack of acceptance was because people were still missing Cantona and unfortunately Teddy suffered because of it. But imo Teddy settled in quicker than Cole did.
Murt - champion of the underdog. Nice trait, but won't win us any prizes.</strong><hr></blockquote>

It wasnt until Yorke came that Cole really hit form with us. Im sure the likes of itchy would have been calling for him to be gone by then.
Sheringham was a disapointment in his first season, missing a peno in his debut at spurs didnt do him any favours.
Goals wise they didnt do terrible but they still got criticised.Fergies perseverance in both of them payed off.
If two of the premierships greatest strikers were given so long to hit from surely a 23 yr old from the argentinain league should be given at least the same amount of time.
Remember im not saying he should be first choice, he should be 4th, just like Cole and Olle have been. its unfortunate for him that hes been thrown in like he has been.

 

[MancFanFromManc]

Forlan will continue to get support. He has plenty of attributes, unfortunately to date, scoring isnt one of them.

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

I'm not saying he should be first choice, he should be 4th, just like Cole and Olle have been. its unfortunate for him that hes been thrown in like he has been.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes you are. You're saying he should be given a run playing behind Ruud - which is as first choice as it gets.

And at the moment that's too much of gamble.

When we're desperately short of goals we don't experiment! Bearing in mind too, that to accommodate Forlan, we leave out Scholes or Ole.

Supporting a player is one thing - but remembere that by supporting one you are discarding another. In this case, supporting one who has done nothing as yet, to discard another who has done plenty.

 

[Raoul]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>Diego?

Now that fergie has stated his intention to purchase a striker during the Jan transfer window, I doubt you'll see forlan starting another game after that.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Frankly I'm shocked that you're criticizing one of our players.

 

[golden_blunder]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

It wasnt until Yorke came that Cole really hit form with us. Im sure the likes of itchy would have been calling for him to be gone by then.
Sheringham was a disapointment in his first season, missing a peno in his debut at spurs didnt do him any favours.
Goals wise they didnt do terrible but they still got criticised.Fergies perseverance in both of them payed off.
If two of the premierships greatest strikers were given so long to hit from surely a 23 yr old from the argentinain league should be given at least the same amount of time.
Remember im not saying he should be first choice, he should be 4th, just like Cole and Olle have been. its unfortunate for him that hes been thrown in like he has been.</strong><hr></blockquote>

The difference is, when Cole first came to OT, he may have missed a load of chances but the still gave the impression that he may score. He had a goal threat.
I never get that impression when i watch Forlan.
He had one decent opportunity inside the box last night to shoot, yet he passed to someone else. By all means stick him on the wing as hes quick and good on the ball, but we should never rely on him to get us a goal.

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>Yes you are. You're saying he should be given a run playing behind Ruud - which is as first choice as it gets.
And at the moment that's too much of gamble.
When we're desperately short of goals we don't experiment!</strong><hr></blockquote>

Our 3rd and 4th strikers often got starts, ie OGS, Cole & Sheri ca 98, 99, 00.
I think it was right to play Diego last night, he got a lovely assist and match practice. Hell be back to nr 3 again on Saturday and rightly so.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Im sure the likes of itchy would have been calling for him to be gone by then.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

You know me that well?

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />

 

[Murt]

Originally posted by golden_blunder:
<strong>He had one decent opportunity inside the box last night to shoot, yet he passed to someone else. </strong><hr></blockquote>
He had 1 chance and got it on target.

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Raoul:
<strong>

Frankly I'm shocked that you're criticizing one of our players.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I don't see a winkie in your sentence

 

[Livvie]

Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>

Our 3rd and 4th strikers often got starts, ie OGS, Cole & Sheri ca 98, 99, 00.
I think it was right to play Diego last night, he got a lovely assist and match practice. Hell be back to nr 3 again on Saturday and rightly so.</strong><hr></blockquote>


You're contradicting yourself Murt. You said he should have a run of starts behind RVN.

 

[Raoul]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>

I don't see a winkie in your sentence</strong><hr></blockquote>

You don't deserve any. Just alot of grief for your panic buying ways...

 

[lchk]

Originally posted by Raoul:
<strong>

You don't deserve any. Just alot of grief for your panic buying ways...</strong><hr></blockquote>

And yet you are advocating that we should buy a striker no matter what the circumstances are be it cuptied etc

So much for panic buying

 

[Raoul]

Originally posted by lchk:
<strong>And yet you are advocating that we should buy a striker no matter what the circumstances are be it cuptied etc

So much for panic buying</strong><hr></blockquote>

I've always advocated we needed at least one more striker. I never advocated we needed an entirely new defence though. Shall we unearth some of your threads from last year...Panic Buyer ?