'Pep' Guardiola sack watch

[Bubz27]

I have a lot of time for Mancini but his next position after City was Galatasaray. It's safe to say that Pep won't end up at that level after City which says a lot about who had the better City tenure.

I know one or two City fans who rated Mancini's time there higher than Pep's. I personally think that's more to do with the expectations Pep's achievements place on him.

But it's kind of like a United fan saying Ole > Jose. On no planet is Ole a better manager, hut has he done a better job here? It feels like it.

 

[Acheron]

For the money he's spent, the legacy he's going to leave behind him at City looks potentially underwhelming.

Yup, I mean think he's only done slightly better than Pellegrini in terms of achievements but the backup both managers got wasn't nearly the same.

 

[footballistic orgasm]

Yup, I mean think he's only done slightly better than Pellegrini in terms of achievements but the backup both managers got wasn't nearly the same.

So Pellegrini's City broke records and was playing the kind of football Pep had them playing?

 

[GifLord]

So Pellegrini's City broke records and was playing the kind of football Pep had them playing?

Breaking EPL records? I thought they brought him to win the UCL.
Both Mancini and Pellegrini won the epl while spending half of what le grand Pepu did
Mancini 480mil€ in 4 years (2009-2013)
Pellegrini 400mil€ in 3 years (2013-2016)
el Spender 940mil€ in 4years (2016-2020)

 

[nuanced]

Breaking EPL records? I thought they brought him to win the UCL.
Both Mancini and Pellegrini won the epl while spending half of what le grand Pepu did
Mancini 480mil€ in 4 years (2009-2013)
Pellegrini 400mil€ in 3 years (2013-2016)
el Spender 940mil€ in 4years (2016-2020)

While undoubtedly Pepinho has spent massive amount on transfers, we should consider transfer fee inflation while comparing numbers between Mancini and Pep's tenure. Mancini got David Silva for 28 mil, and Pep spent the same to buy Danilo.

 

[padr81]

Yup, I mean think he's only done slightly better than Pellegrini in terms of achievements but the backup both managers got wasn't nearly the same.

Thats ridiculous anyone can clearly see the difference in class between Pep's City and Pellers. Pellegrini had 1 very good season and then almost missed out on the CL only squeezing in on goal difference. The reality of their careers is there for all too see. Pellers besides City has managed West Ham, Malaga etc.. Pep has managed Barca and Bayern and there is no way he ends up at a West Ham (with all due respect to them). Pellgrini was a nice guy who played very good football but there is a clear reason City fans see him as the worst of our title winning managers. He was miles behind both Mancini and Pep.

 

[padr81]

Breaking EPL records? I thought they brought him to win the UCL.
Both Mancini and Pellegrini won the epl while spending half of what le grand Pepu did
Mancini 480mil€ in 4 years (2009-2013)
Pellegrini 400mil€ in 3 years (2013-2016)
el Spender 940mil€ in 4years (2016-2020)

I'd love to know where this comes from? He was hired because he was seen as the best manager in the world at the time and had a relationship with Txiki and Soriano. Pep was hired for his brand of football and his huge status, there were zero champions league stipulations. He was very lucky to survive his first season but has earned the trust the board have in him over the last 18 months.

 

[el3mel]

I think 2 league titles in 5 years for the money spent will honestly be a poor return by Pep all things considered. At least one more league title would have been fine.

 

[padr81]

I think 2 league titles in 5 years for the money spent will honestly be a poor return by Pep all things considered. At least one more league title would have been fine.

Providing its 2 league title absolutely. 3 league titles will thankfully look much better with all the other trophies he'll pick up. don't quote me on this please!

 

[kaiser1]

I'd love to know where this comes from? He was hired because he was seen as the best manager in the world at the time and had a relationship with Txiki and Soriano. Pep was hired for his brand of football and his huge status, there were zero champions league stipulations. He was very lucky to survive his first season but has earned the trust the board have in him over the last 18 months.

I hear it a lot where people authoritatively say Pep was hired to win the CL

He seemed to be the only manager people know what he was hired to win

If you ask what specific trophy any other manager in football was hired to win, you will probably not get a definitive answer

E.g what was Mourinho hired to win at Spurs and Man utd, what was Klopp hired to win, OGS hired to win etc..

 

[padr81]

I hear it a lot where people authoritatively say Pep was hired to win the CL

He seemed to be the only manager people know what he was hired to win

If you ask what specific trophy any other manager in football was hired to win, you will probably not get a definitive answer

E.g what was Mourinho hired to win at Spurs and Man utd, what was Klopp hired to win, OGS hired to win etc..

Its insane, Pep is held to a stupidly high standard even in comparison to Sir Alex (whose the best manager of all time). Its unreal the expectations on him. While I think Klopp has replaced him and is currently the better manager, its ludicrous what people expect of Pep.

Person A: Pep is one of the top managers in the world
Person B: All his success was handed to him, he was lucky to have the players he has.
Person A: Pep has said this himself many times, that his success is down to the players and clubs he's been lucky to have. It still takes a good manager to get the best out of them.
Person B: Pep Guardiola is my idol, I dunno why you all think he's a God. He only has 2 CL's
Person A: 2 in 12 years isn't bad. I mean the best manager of all time got 2 in like 27 years.
Person B: Yeah but he had Messi.
Person A: Messi alone doesn't win CL's.
Person B: He failed at Bayern and City.
Person A: I don't know many Bayern or City fans who consider him a failure.
Person B: He didn't win his last 57 games 5-0.
Person A: No one does.
Person B: So he's not a God. Pep Guardiola is my idol.

This is literally 90% of conversations with Pep haters. Its surreal.

 

[GifLord]

Its insane, Pep is held to a stupidly high standard even in comparison to Sir Alex (whose the best manager of all time). Its unreal the expectations on him. While I think Klopp has replaced him and is currently the better manager, its ludicrous what people expect of Pep.

Person A: Pep is one of the top managers in the world
Person B: All his success was handed to him, he was lucky to have the players he has.
Person A: Pep has said this himself many times, that his success is down to the players and clubs he's been lucky to have. It still takes a good manager to get the best out of them.
Person B: Pep Guardiola is my idol, I dunno why you all think he's a God. He only has 2 CL's
Person A: 2 in 12 years isn't bad. I mean the best manager of all time got 2 in like 27 years.
Person B: Yeah but he had Messi.
Person A: Messi alone doesn't win CL's.
Person B: He failed at Bayern and City.
Person A: I don't know many Bayern or City fans who consider him a failure.
Person B: He didn't win his last 57 games 5-0.
Person A: No one does.
Person B: So he's not a God. Pep Guardiola is my idol.

This is literally 90% of conversations with Pep haters. Its surreal.

But you'd win league titles with almost any manager out there.
Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, de Bruyne, Fernandinho... These were/are Pep's best players
Pep's spent almost a billion on players yet i still don't know who his best signing is - Ederson?

 

[Maluco]

It’s true, he has been handed the world at City and will leave them with meager returns in relation to the wealth of advantages he has over other teams. It just basic logic that the more resources you have, the higher expectations will be.

If the new players aren’t good enough, that his fault. They were very expensive buys, so it’s his failure. They look as bad now as they did in his first season, and that is absolute madness after spending 1 billion.

 

[RedCurry]

I am big fan of Pep so I hope he gets sacked.

 

[acnumber9]

While undoubtedly Pepinho has spent massive amount on transfers, we should consider transfer fee inflation while comparing numbers between Mancini and Pep's tenure. Mancini got David Silva for 28 mil, and Pep spent the same to buy Danilo.

But that money was spent to add to the players already there. Many of which have been his best players.

 

[acnumber9]

City won two titles in 5 years before Guardiola and it looks increasingly likely they will match that under him. That’s not been a success.

 

[kaiser1]

Its insane, Pep is held to a stupidly high standard even in comparison to Sir Alex (whose the best manager of all time). Its unreal the expectations on him. While I think Klopp has replaced him and is currently the better manager, its ludicrous what people expect of Pep.

Person A: Pep is one of the top managers in the world
Person B: All his success was handed to him, he was lucky to have the players he has.
Person A: Pep has said this himself many times, that his success is down to the players and clubs he's been lucky to have. It still takes a good manager to get the best out of them.
Person B: Pep Guardiola is my idol, I dunno why you all think he's a God. He only has 2 CL's
Person A: 2 in 12 years isn't bad. I mean the best manager of all time got 2 in like 27 years.
Person B: Yeah but he had Messi.
Person A: Messi alone doesn't win CL's.
Person B: He failed at Bayern and City.
Person A: I don't know many Bayern or City fans who consider him a failure.
Person B: He didn't win his last 57 games 5-0.
Person A: No one does.
Person B: So he's not a God. Pep Guardiola is my idol.

This is literally 90% of conversations with Pep haters. Its surreal.

I know how that goes

Pre 2016 His style cannot survive in the EPL. He needs to prove himself in England
2017 We told you he cannot survive in the EPL Pep Guardiola is my idol
2018 He only won and broke records because he spent money
2019 The EPL titles don't count he was brought to win the CL
2020 He is finished

 

[padr81]

But you'd win league titles with almost any manager out there.
Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, de Bruyne, Fernandinho... These were/are Pep's best players
Pep's spent almost a billion on players yet i still don't know who his best signing is - Ederson?

Yet in his first season and during Pellers reign, Sterling was a failure and not good enough and should be sold. Even benched for Jesus Navas. Then we were told he'd be sold because he wasn't good enough when Bernardo came in, then Mahrez. I mean he we overpaid for him according to many on the CAF. Hindsight makes it easy to call. Maybe just maybe Pep made him better? Maybe he made them all better?

And no any manager can't win the league with any team. LVG, Jose and Ole have all managed the 3rd most expensive team in football history and have got nowhere near a title challenge with them. Its sadly not that simple. I'd say Sane was a great signing, Ederson too, Laporte and more. His fair share of clangers too like every other manager... Might sound harsh but no way three quarters of the current premier league managers win the title with that City team.

Pellegrini almost missed out on the CL with most those players at their peaks yet people are trying to say he did as well as Pep... He alone is proof that almost any manager wouldn't win as consistently as Pep.

He's been a manager for is it 11 seasons and has 8 league titles and 2 champions leagues... crazy expectations. If he doesn't win this season thats 8 titles in 12 seasons. Again unfair expectations.

 

[padr81]

City won two titles in 5 years before Guardiola and it looks increasingly likely they will match that under him. That’s not been a success.

I don't know about how spoiled United fans are but 4 titles in 10 years is pretty damn amazing to me.

 

[2 man midfield]

Pellers besides City has managed West Ham, Malaga etc..

He also managed a small little club called Real Madrid.

 

[acnumber9]

I don't know about how spoiled United fans are but 4 titles in 10 years is pretty damn amazing to me.

It’s not bad. But was that the expectation when Guardiola was appointed? To match the success shared by managers they deemed not good enough?

 

[padr81]

He also managed a small little club called Real Madrid.

He did and did well there but won nothing. The majority of his career hasn't been at top teams and there is a reason for that, just like there is a reason all of Pep's has. Pellers had 4 seasons at top teams and won 1 title, Pep 11 seasons and 8 titles. They are absolutely incomparable.

Is Pep lucky he didn't have to work his way up? Bar one season at Barca B, absolutely. But the fact is he stayed there for 12 seasons, maybe more.

 

[2 man midfield]

He did and did well there but won nothing. The majority of his career hasn't been at top teams and there is a reason for that, just like there is a reason all of Pep's has. Pellers had 4 seasons at top teams and won 1 title, Pep 11 seasons and 8 titles. They are absolutely incomparable.

Is Pep lucky he didn't have to work his way up? Bar one season at Barca B, absolutely. But the fact is he stayed there for 12 seasons, maybe more.

I’m not arguing that they should be compared, I just thought it was a tad disingenuous that you happened to leave out the biggest job the man ever had, whilst slating him for not having had big jobs.

 

[acnumber9]

He did and did well there but won nothing. The majority of his career hasn't been at top teams and there is a reason for that, just like there is a reason all of Pep's has. Pellers had 4 seasons at top teams and won 1 title, Pep 11 seasons and 8 titles. They are absolutely incomparable.

Is Pep lucky he didn't have to work his way up? Bar one season at Barca B, absolutely. But the fact is he stayed there for 12 seasons, maybe more.

Nobody really thinks Pellegrini is as good a manger as Guardiola. Unless they’re either stupid or just playing devils advocate. But, does that not further emphasise that he hasn’t done as well as could be reasonably expected of him given the squad he inherited and the money he’s spent?

 

[padr81]

It’s not bad. But was that the expectation when Guardiola was appointed? To match the success shared by managers they deemed not good enough?

Mancini was never deemed not good enough, he was deemed too volatile and the players hated him (the English ones in particular if rumors are to be believed). Even if Pep doesn't win another pot, he's bettered what Mancini and Pellers combined in 4 seasons to their He's won a domestic treble and in 2 seasons won 5 or 6 domestic trophies. A level of domestic dominance never seen before. Klopp has come along and beaten the shit out of him since but that doesn't change his successes.
The reality is Pep is clearly Cities most successful manager of all time as he is at Barca. He was at one 4 years and one 4 and a bit years.

 

[padr81]

I’m not arguing that they should be compared, I just thought it was a tad disingenuous that you happened to leave out the biggest job the man ever had, whilst slating him for not having had big jobs.

Fair enough, I was more implying where he started and ended. Real was of course a bigger job than City and had he not run into Pep's Barca, he'd possibly have a league title there too. Believe he came 2nd with 98 points or something.

 

[GifLord]

Yet in his first season and during Pellers reign, Sterling was a failure and not good enough and should be sold. Even benched for Jesus Navas. Then we were told he'd be sold because he wasn't good enough when Bernardo came in, then Mahrez. I mean he we overpaid for him according to many on the CAF. Hindsight makes it easy to call. Maybe just maybe Pep made him better? Maybe he made them all better?

And no any manager can't win the league with any team. LVG, Jose and Ole have all managed the 3rd most expensive team in football history and have got nowhere near a title challenge with them. Its sadly not that simple. I'd say Sane was a great signing, Ederson too, Laporte and more. His fair share of clangers too like every other manager... Might sound harsh but no way three quarters of the current premier league managers win the title with that City team.

Pellegrini almost missed out on the CL with most those players at their peaks yet people are trying to say he did as well as Pep... He alone is proof that almost any manager wouldn't win as consistently as Pep.

He's been a manager for is it 11 seasons and has 8 league titles and 2 champions leagues... crazy expectations. If he doesn't win this season thats 8 titles in 12 seasons. Again unfair expectations.

That's completely different. None of the managers mentioned inherited as good of a squad like Pep did not to mention Utd's board is completely different to City's.
Example
Utd needs fullbacks -> easy just convert wingers
City needs fullbacks -> here's a blank check

 

[acnumber9]

Mancini was never deemed not good enough, he was deemed too volatile and the players hated him (the English ones in particular if rumors are to be believed). Even if Pep doesn't win another pot, he's bettered what Mancini and Pellers combined in 4 seasons to their He's won a domestic treble and in 2 seasons won 5 or 6 domestic trophies. A level of domestic dominance never seen before. Klopp has come along and beaten the shit out of him since but that doesn't change his successes.
The reality is Pep is clearly Cities most successful manager of all time as he is at Barca. He was at one 4 years and one 4 and a bit years.

But he’s still the manager. A lot will depend on what he does through the rest of his reign but the signs aren’t promising at all.

Winning the league cup counts for next to nothing. There’s a reason nobody talks about City’s domestic treble outside of City fans. It was completely overshadowed by Liverpool winning the Champions League and then taking the title the following season.

He’s the best manager City have had, I don’t doubt it. But, if they end this season without winning the league, and I’d bet good money on it, then I would say he’s achieved the absolute bare minimum expected by matching what was done in the previous five seasons. He has a lot of work on to win another title before he leaves.

 

[padr81]

Nobody really thinks Pellegrini is as good a manger as Guardiola. Unless they’re either stupid or just playing devils advocate. But, does that not further emphasise that he hasn’t done as well as could be reasonably expected of him given the squad he inherited and the money he’s spent?

I'd say this season is the decider for me at City. If he wins the title than 3 in 5 years is a really good return (only bettered by Sir Alex after all). 2 in 5 years is kinda meh, neither a massive failure nor a roaring success, more par for the course for any top manager. And of course the other trophies don't matter unless a league title comes with them. Winning a league cup alone or FA Cup alone is seen as a poor season for Pep and City more so than other clubs but its hardly a disaster. When you've seen your team in league 1, you don't find coming 2nd and winning a trophy as much of a disaster.

I think United fans have these crazy expectations where they see anything less than winning 7 or so titles in 10 years as not amazing. But the reality is in England only 1 man could ever do that and only 1 man ever will. Being less successful than Sir Alex is not failing regardless of resources. The issue is the crazy expectations that are put on Pep. I've seen City coast games 2-0 vs bottom half teams and get slated as not playing well both here and in the media despite rarely breaking a sweat because the expectation is anything other than Pep beating someone bar the top teams less than 5-0 is unacceptable. I've seen him win 198 points and 2 titles in 2 seasons and heard people say "He has to win the CL", from the same people who were saying "He'll never make his style work here" just a year before hand. No matter what he does, he'll always have people belittling him. One poster went as far as saying if he wants to be taken seriously he needs to leave City and win the Premier League with Everton.

Its the same with Champions Leagues, Pep of course needs to win one without Barca before he retires but his CL record is bettered by very few. But there is no stipulation that says Pep is only signed to any club to win the CL, like any other manager he's signed to bring his brand of football and win as much as he can (plus in our case for exposure and PR as he's a bigger draw in world football than the club).

Like every dog he'll have his day and then he'll drop off. There are very few exceptions, football will pass him by, its already looking like he has to adapt or die but there is a huge area between being a tactical God and a failure but people refuse to see Pep as anywhere between.

 

[padr81]

That's completely different. None of the managers mentioned inherited as good of a squad like Pep did not to mention Utd's board is completely different to City's.
Example
Utd needs fullbacks -> easy just convert wingers
City needs fullbacks -> here's a blank check

The squad Jose inherited finished level on points with the one Pep inherited, and in 2 years there spending was close.
One poster on here who I won't tag cause I don't want to embarrass him told me in Pep's first season that the City squad was so washed up they would finish closer to Everton than United (which almost happened but only cause United imploded). This place was also full of people saying United had the better transfer window and the better squad after the window. If you read the pre-season predictions many fancied City to miss the top 4. Its easy with hindsight to say the squad he inherited was great.

 

[Get In Scholesy]

Feel like he will end up at PSG with Messi eventually

 

[Cait Sith]

He overstayed his tenure at City. He once stated that it was a mistake to stay at Barca for the 11/12 season and everything gets stale and boring after max. 3 seasons, motivation isn't as high anymore from all sides. So it's really confusing he is at his 5th season now at City.

I suppose he did not want this but kinda had to as it would look terrible on him if he left immediately after conceding the title to Liverpool. If he won the title last season he wouldn't be here now I believe.

Underachieved in the CL for sure but his league form is impeccable. Losing to a 99 point side is not a shame and the football and intensity he brought was miles above Mancini or Pellegrini. Mancini completely lucked the title in 11/12. Even after Man United gifted an 8 point lead with 6 games remaining, City were losing to 10 men QPR until the 90th minute in their last game. Whereas Pep got 198 points over 2 seasons, bringing point tallies to the EPL which people claimed was only possible in Sunny SPL.

 

[Acheron]

Thats ridiculous anyone can clearly see the difference in class between Pep's City and Pellers. Pellegrini had 1 very good season and then almost missed out on the CL only squeezing in on goal difference. The reality of their careers is there for all too see. Pellers besides City has managed West Ham, Malaga etc.. Pep has managed Barca and Bayern and there is no way he ends up at a West Ham (with all due respect to them). Pellgrini was a nice guy who played very good football but there is a clear reason City fans see him as the worst of our title winning managers. He was miles behind both Mancini and Pep.

I was still expecting a lot more from him (Guardiola) and the best CL campaign was with Pellegrini so I'm not sure if everyone is satisfied but maybe he has indeed reached the maximum potential with that team but he's still going to be there a few more seasons so he has still time to make things better.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

The squad Jose inherited finished level on points with the one Pep inherited, and in 2 years there spending was close.
One poster on here who I won't tag cause I don't want to embarrass him told me in Pep's first season that the City squad was so washed up they would finish closer to Everton than United (which almost happened but only cause United imploded). This place was also full of people saying United had the better transfer window and the better squad after the window. If you read the pre-season predictions many fancied City to miss the top 4. Its easy with hindsight to say the squad he inherited was great.

Number points don’t matter here if your manager didn’t do good job getting the best out quality players, there is a good reason why you moved on from your previous manager even though they gave you league trophy. KDB, Fernandinho, Aguero, Silva and Kompany. They are class, most of them were part of the league title winner under Pellegrini and Mancini and they are the main 5 players for reason why Pep were able to win PL title.

On the other hand, who the feck we had when Mourinho took in charged? 2 very young attackers Martial & Rashford, ageing past Carrick & Rooney and the two chuckle brothers as centre back with former wingers as full backs.

At least before you spent huge on full backs you could actually convert Jesus Navas to be right back, the guy is now or last season one of top 3 right back in la Liga. It shows even player that Pep got rid actually can still be good. Pep has to do better with what he has right now and what he had before.

 

[meamth]

I think this is the first time he has to rebuild the spine of a team right?

The cycle of successful City team is over, he needs to rebuild and that's normal for me.

2 league titles with emergence of Klopp in recent years is a tough ask. Pep despite his fraud claims, is still one of the best managers in the world. No doubt about that.

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

He overstayed his tenure at City. He once stated that it was a mistake to stay at Barca for the 11/12 season and everything gets stale and boring after max. 3 seasons, motivation isn't as high anymore from all sides. So it's really confusing he is at his 5th season now at City.

I suppose he did not want this but kinda had to as it would look terrible on him if he left immediately after conceding the title to Liverpool. If he won the title last season he wouldn't be here now I believe.

Underachieved in the CL for sure but his league form is impeccable. Losing to a 99 point side is not a shame and the football and intensity he brought was miles above Mancini or Pellegrini. Mancini completely lucked the title in 11/12. Even after Man United gifted an 8 point lead with 6 games remaining, City were losing to 10 men QPR until the 90th minute in their last game. Whereas Pep got 198 points over 2 seasons, bringing point tallies to the EPL which people claimed was only possible in Sunny SPL.

I think he genuinely enjoys the Premier League, the challenge of having quite a few decent teams. Also not the hysteria that would surround him if he didn't win the league or europe at Barca or Bayern.

 

[Jaqen H'ghar]

Its insane, Pep is held to a stupidly high standard even in comparison to Sir Alex (whose the best manager of all time). Its unreal the expectations on him. While I think Klopp has replaced him and is currently the better manager, its ludicrous what people expect of Pep.

Person A: Pep is one of the top managers in the world
Person B: All his success was handed to him, he was lucky to have the players he has.
Person A: Pep has said this himself many times, that his success is down to the players and clubs he's been lucky to have. It still takes a good manager to get the best out of them.
Person B: Pep Guardiola is my idol, I dunno why you all think he's a God. He only has 2 CL's
Person A: 2 in 12 years isn't bad. I mean the best manager of all time got 2 in like 27 years.
Person B: Yeah but he had Messi.
Person A: Messi alone doesn't win CL's.
Person B: He failed at Bayern and City.
Person A: I don't know many Bayern or City fans who consider him a failure.
Person B: He didn't win his last 57 games 5-0.
Person A: No one does.
Person B: So he's not a God. Pep Guardiola is my idol.

This is literally 90% of conversations with Pep haters. Its surreal.

I have no idea why, but I loved the way you shredded that strawman

 

[padr81]

Number points don’t matter here if your manager didn’t do good job getting the best out quality players, there is a good reason why you moved on from your previous manager even though they gave you league trophy. KDB, Fernandinho, Aguero, Silva and Kompany. They are class, most of them were part of the league title winner under Pellegrini and Mancini and they are the main 5 players for reason why Pep were able to win PL title.

On the other hand, who the feck we had when Mourinho took in charged? 2 very young attackers Martial & Rashford, ageing past Carrick & Rooney and the two chuckle brothers as centre back with former wingers as full backs.

At least before you spent huge on full backs you could actually convert Jesus Navas to be right back, the guy is now or last season one of top 3 right back in la Liga. It shows even player that Pep got rid actually can still be good. Pep has to do better with what he has right now and what he had before.

Fernandinho couldn't get in the team pre-Pep and was often rotated because Pellers believed he was no good on the ball. It was only in Pep's 10 games people started to realize "this guys a bit of a machine" and only when he got injured and our season fell apart that people realized just how good he was and important to Pep. While he rarely gets anything right I believe it was Paul Merson who said "Fernandinho is the only player in history whose valued has tripled on the back of being injured". KDB was of course amazing and Kun easily the best striker in the league at that point but people often look back on David Silva as peak Pep David Silva which he wasn't and Pep sadly never got the best of Kompany.

The squad Pep inherited had Joe Hart is goal (a keeper who after leaving City was laughed at it Italy, and flopped everywhere else in England), ancient fullbacks, cb's that were either an always injured Kompany or seen as a calamity. Plenty of quality in midfield. Players like Sterling who people now look on as great were a disaster under Pellers and Pep.

Jesus Navas transition to right back was very much Pep's doing and funny enough the only reason Sterling ever got in the team. We had a good squad for sure, I'd say better than Uniteds but after the transfer window not many believed we still were.
But the reality will be Pep turned Otamendi into a team of the season CB, David Silva into the David Silva we all remember. Took Sterling from flop to world class winger etc... Every single player in the squad got better under Pep even those past their peak ages. He obviously had his fair share of clangers too.

Heading into their first season its was largely regarded as
United have the better keeper DDG over Bravo (true)
United have the better backline Bailly and Smalling were better than Otamendi, Stones and a crocked Kompany.
United had the better fullbacks (largely through though both teams had shite fullbacks)
Pogba had evened up the midfields in some cases many here would say United had a stronger midfield than City.
IUp top that people said City had an advantage but Martial was regarded as a far better footballer than Sterling or Nolito and many argued Zlatan was better than Kun

Pep's first team at City was.
Bravo,
Sagna, Stones, Otamendi, Kolarov/Clichy
Fernandinho
KDB and Silva (who many thought couldn't play as an 8, myself included)
Navas, Aguero and Nolito.

Uniteds predicted team was
DDG
Valencia, Bailly, Smalling, Shaw
Herrera, Pogba,
Mkhitaryan, Mata, Martial
Zlatan

Uniteds squad also had older but still big names like Rooney, Carrick, young talent like Lingard (lots of people rated him), Rashford and Joses fave battering ram in Fellaini.
City's bench was what was deemed the big difference of course with us having a full 11 subs, including Yaya, Kompany, Delph, Sterling, Sane and Jesus.

Hindsight makes it very easy to see how things ended up but United fans were rightly confident going into the campaign if your consider how the players were rated in 2016. If I was to compare both those 11's back then I'd say United was the strongest but Cities squad having far more depth.

 

[padr81]

I think this is the first time he has to rebuild the spine of a team right?

The cycle of successful City team is over, he needs to rebuild and that's normal for me.

2 league titles with emergence of Klopp in recent years is a tough ask. Pep despite his fraud claims, is still one of the best managers in the world. No doubt about that.

Yup thats why its such a big part of his career, the truly great manager can rebuild when a team has run its course. Its what separates Sir Alex from Pep and Jose and co. right now imho. Pep refreshed Barca, Bayern and City and made some massive decision but no one would say he had to rebuild a team till now and at this point in time its balanced on a knife edge.

 

[padr81]

I was still expecting a lot more from him (Guardiola) and the best CL campaign was with Pellegrini so I'm not sure if everyone is satisfied but maybe he has indeed reached the maximum potential with that team but he's still going to be there a few more seasons so he has still time to make things better.

I can't say I was to be honest. He gave us easily the two best years in the clubs history winning 5 of 6 domestic trophies (7 of 8 if you're one of those weirdo's who count the charity shield). I'd say in terms of seasons at City so far, I'd say 6/10, 10/10, 10/10 and 4/10 and this season is looking pretty ropey so far. I guess thats modern football where 1 poor season can dismiss some great work and you are only as good as your latest results.