'Pep' Guardiola sack watch

Leroy The Red said:
He’s been bizarre this season. I know they have injuries at CB but missing Fernandinho from that midfield has been catastrophic. But above all else his love affair with Gundogan and David Silva in the same midfield is actually self destructive at this point. It clearly doesn’t work yet he insists on it. Im sure if you looked at all their dropped points this season a midfield of Gundogan and David Silva would feature.
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This 110% this, that midfield has no pace or when they play with KDB one player with energy and pace, yet Pep churns them out game after game. I
Than he wonders why we can't get back to defend counters...

Midfield 3's in games where we dropped points.
Palace - Gundo, D.Silva
Wolves - Obviously tainted by the red card but no Gundo or D.Silva.
United - D.Silva
Newcastle - Gundo, D.Silva
Liverpool - Gundogan
Wolves - Gundo, D.Silva
Norwich - Gundo, Rodri, D.Silva
Spurs - Gundo

Gundogan starting games sticks out as a huge problem. We should never start a game with 2 or Rodri, Guno or D.Silva in midfield. Play 1 with KDB and Fernandinho and take a chance with Walker at CB (he's not great but can't do worse than Stone).
 
Dec9003 said:
City fans aren’t even really bothered about the champions league are they? Most of the Bertie’s I know couldn’t care less about it.
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their owners are very bothered, and I'm sure their fans are too, but pretend not to be. They'd absolutely love it if they ever won it. And as they naver have, they likely don't even realise what it does mean! It's the pinacle for a club.

For their owners it's the grail, they bought the club to sports wash their image, to take it to an European level is what they are after. Nothing else will do, it's why Guardiola is there.
 
padr81 said:
This 110% this, that midfield has no pace or when they play with KDB one player with energy and pace, yet Pep churns them out game after game. I
Than he wonders why we can't get back to defend counters...

Midfield 3's in games where we dropped points.
Palace - Gundo, D.Silva
Wolves - Obviously tainted by the red card but no Gundo or D.Silva.
United - D.Silva
Newcastle - Gundo, D.Silva
Liverpool - Gundogan
Wolves - Gundo, D.Silva
Norwich - Gundo, Rodri, D.Silva
Spurs - Gundo

Gundogan starting games sticks out as a huge problem. We should never start a game with 2 or Rodri, Guno or D.Silva in midfield. Play 1 with KDB and Fernandinho and take a chance with Walker at CB (he's not great but can't do worse than Stone).
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Those stats don’t surprise me, you always look weaker with those two, they can’t press they can’t run can’t tackle. I can’t quite figure out why he’s not played Bernardo in the centre this season when he was good there last season when you missed de Bruyne.
Centre back, surely there’s a competent centre half somewhere in your academy ?
 
redman5 said:
Said he'll be at City next season, which is when his contract runs out if I'm not mistaken. No mention of him saying he wants to extend his contract as far as I know. Silva, Fernandinho, & Aquero will all be well past their peak come the summer of 2021. Maybe he doesn't fancy the job of trying to replace them.
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I've seen quotes that he'd been happy to stay at City beyond next season but the way things are going you just can't envision it can you? He'll be without Silva next season, Sane as well, Fernandinho and Aguero 1 season closer to needing to be replaced, massive rebuilding job on the cards which fecking sucks because Liverpool look to have a side capable of going for at least another 2 years
 
Borussin said:
their owners are very bothered, and I'm sure their fans are too, but pretend not to be. They'd absolutely love it if they ever won it. And as they naver have, they likely don't even realise what it does mean! It's the pinacle for a club.

For their owners it's the grail, they bought the club to sports wash their image, to take it to an European level is what they are after. Nothing else will do, it's why Guardiola is there.
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I think you’re probably right about the owners, but I genuinely don’t think City fans are that fussed.
The ones I know say they’d rather keep winning the league than win a champions league, I guess to try to catch up to the likes of United, Liverpool, Arsenal etc who have a lot of them.
 
Leroy The Red said:
Those stats don’t surprise me, you always look weaker with those two, they can’t press they can’t run can’t tackle. I can’t quite figure out why he’s not played Bernardo in the centre this season when he was good there last season when you missed de Bruyne.
Centre back, surely there’s a competent centre half somewhere in your academy ?
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Eric Garcia is probably better than Stones and has done ok in the team and Otamendi for all his faults is a better CB than both Stones and Fernandinho. Hell eve Kyle Walker can play in there. Honestly I think the issue is nothing other than Pep being stubborn.

I'd love to see us line up.
Ederson,
Cancelo, Walker, Otamendi, Zinchenko
Fernandinho, KDB, Bernardo
Mahrez, Aguero, Sterling

Or if Pep wants to continue his Rodri love in, put him at CB instead of Walker.
 
So so poor for this season, much like his first. For a guy who we were being told we should be grateful for gracing with his presence and of their inevitable decades of domination.

His transfer record at City is pretty poor in my opinion too, as I said last couple of years much of his success has been heavily dependent on the guys that were already there. As that side starts to break down can he actually build a team himself?
 
I haven't seen much non-United football this season but I did see bits of the recent City v Everton game. The passing was unbelievably crisp, well-drilled, great to watch, and totally on another level to their opponents. The little I've seen of Liverpool isn't like that.
Hard to understand how a team that good is struggling against lesser teams. Are they just not getting those passing spells long enough or is it a number of freak individual mistakes?
 
padr81 said:
I'm pretty sure I put that there in black and white in the message you jumped on in the first place... In fact you highlighted the line. That still doesn't mean they don't have an apathy towards it now because very many do for various reasons.
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Redman5's point is that it's an apathy born out of not having won the thing or even coming anywhere close to it. They've basically convinced themselves that they are not winning it because they aren't interested in winning it. But it's actually the other way around. I know from experience. I couldn't give a toss about the Club World Cup till a month ago. But now that we're World champions, the CWC is the highest team honour in club football and one that I want us to win again. :D
 
padr81 said:
I can't see Allegri or Simeone while Txiki and Soriano are in charge. It will always be a high possession attacking manager. Obviously won't be as good as Pep but honestly if he doesn't take another job in the mean time, I could well see Rodgers get a chance despite the Liverpool connection. Someone like Nagelsmann is also a good shout.
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Rodgers is a good option! To be honest, I hadn't even thought of him. No Liverpool fan would begrudge him going to the Etihad either. The football on offer with him in charge would be great to watch but he still needs to work on defensive issues and get some more European experience under his belt but with the players available at City, I think he'd do a great job
 
Alabaster Codify7 said:
I would bet my house on the fact that Pep will not be at City next season. I reckon he'll be at PSG.
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That would be so typical of him. He'll go his entire career without ever proving himself in a testing job, yet somehow be held in the same esteem as SAF and Wenger etc.
 
berbatrick said:
I haven't seen much non-United football this season but I did see bits of the recent City v Everton game. The passing was unbelievably crisp, well-drilled, great to watch, and totally on another level to their opponents. The little I've seen of Liverpool isn't like that.
Hard to understand how a team that good is struggling against lesser teams. Are they just not getting those passing spells long enough or is it a number of freak individual mistakes?
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It's a combination. When Pep gets the team set up right, we are genuinely unbeatable. He stumbled across a setup recently that got us back to our very best but yesterday he resorted to a setup and lineup that has been a big problem for us this season. We can't afford to carry Silva and Gundogan in a midfield 3 anymore. We end up playing at snails pace and trying to walk the ball in to the net.

That and having a defensive set up that allows at least one guilt edge chance to the opposition in a game has been our Achilles heel this season and will continue to be if we keep making the same mistake with selection and setup
 
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berbatrick said:
I haven't seen much non-United football this season but I did see bits of the recent City v Everton game. The passing was unbelievably crisp, well-drilled, great to watch, and totally on another level to their opponents. The little I've seen of Liverpool isn't like that.
Hard to understand how a team that good is struggling against lesser teams. Are they just not getting those passing spells long enough or is it a number of freak individual mistakes?
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First of all, to make a fair comparison, you should probably catch bits of the Liverpool vs Everton 5-2 match also and then tell us if you think Liverpool performed any worse than City. Secondly, you can pass crisply all you want in front of the opposition defence and they won't care. That's not where the goal is. That's why Liverpool's long balls in behind and crosses from TAA and Robertson cause chaos. And that's how Utd tore City apart at the Etihad.
 
padr81 said:
If you think City fans have anything other than apathy for the CL you clearly don't read or pay any attention to football. Its pretty well known.
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This is just whitewashing really. It's like when clubs miss out on a player & then say they didn't want him anyway.

The City fans i know were incredibly excited about merely qualifying for the CL in the early stages of the takeover. Latterly with spending huge amounts & bringing in Pep the last piece of the jigsaw was in place, Domestic & European domination beckoned. Now it hasn't happened the excuses start coming out about conspiracies & having no interest in the competition.
 
Considering their squad it is actually criminal how bad he has them doing regardless of their holes at CB.
 
DAK222 said:
Redman5's point is that it's an apathy born out of not having won the thing or even coming anywhere close to it. They've basically convinced themselves that they are not winning it because they aren't interested in winning it. But it's actually the other way around. I know from experience. I couldn't give a toss about the Club World Cup till a month ago. But now that we're World champions, the CWC is the highest team honour in club football and one that I want us to win again. :D
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And Padr's point is, that's literally what he said. OF course we'd care more if we won it. But right now if you asked most city fans, we'd rather have the league.
 
Pep just can't understand that 10 attacking midfielders/forwards + a keeper don't make a good functional team. Gundogan is not a DM, KDB/Silvas are not CM, Zinchenko is not a fullback, etc.
 
Weighing up expectations vs reality. They’re having just as poor a time of it as us.
 
DonnieDarko said:
Pep just can't understand that 10 attacking midfielders/forwards + a keeper don't make a good functional team. Gundogan is not a DM, KDB/Silvas are not CM, Zinchenko is not a fullback, etc.
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I know recency bias is a societal affliction but the last 2 seasons (last season especially, you Liverpool fans should know this well) make your point moot
 
adexkola said:
I know recency bias is a societal affliction but the last 2 seasons (last season especially, you Liverpool fans should know this well) make your point moot
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They had one world class DM playing actual DM, and other deficiencies were somewhat covered by the gulf in quality. Still we were more consistent last year because we had more functional team.
This season their only proper defensive player has to play CB, that's the difference.

We do have similar situation with TAA, who's not an RB, but we have at least 2 out of 3 midfielders whose job is to protect and control, which allows us to alleviate those issues.
 
DAK222 said:
Redman5's point is that it's an apathy born out of not having won the thing or even coming anywhere close to it. They've basically convinced themselves that they are not winning it because they aren't interested in winning it. But it's actually the other way around. I know from experience. I couldn't give a toss about the Club World Cup till a month ago. But now that we're World champions, the CWC is the highest team honour in club football and one that I want us to win again. :D
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I disagree on this though.. as a City fan I've always wanted to win it and would love it, but many rightly or wrongly feel Uefa have went out of their way to feck City and thus want nothing to do with their competition (again I'm not one of those). For many City fans the CL just genuinely doesn't matter and hasn't since the CSKA game where we got fecked over because they are racists. Nowhere else in Europe does 40k plus boo the anthem every time it's played. City fans just don't like the CL and going back to Redmans point that is exactly what I said and he quoted it and argued I was saying something different even though I said winning it would change the tune of many supporters.
 
padr81 said:
I disagree on this though.. as a City fan I've always wanted to win it and would love it, but many rightly or wrongly feel Uefa have went out of their way to feck City and thus want nothing to do with their competition (again I'm not one of those). For many City fans the CL just genuinely doesn't matter and hasn't since the CSKA game where we got fecked over because they are racists. Nowhere else in Europe does 40k plus boo the anthem every time it's played. City fans just don't like the CL and going back to Redmans point that is exactly what I said and he quoted it and argued I was saying something different even though I said winning it would change the tune of many supporters.
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A big part of the CL for the fans is the history of it and the great matches you've been involved in over the years vs the giants of football. City have only been it five minutes, there is none of that for them. It's just another trophy.
 
ExecutionerWasp001 said:
This is just whitewashing really. It's like when clubs miss out on a player & then say they didn't want him anyway.

The City fans i know were incredibly excited about merely qualifying for the CL in the early stages of the takeover. Latterly with spending huge amounts & bringing in Pep the last piece of the jigsaw was in place, Domestic & European domination beckoned. Now it hasn't happened the excuses start coming out about conspiracies & having no interest in the competition.
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Being the key part.. by a mile. FFP followed by 13/14 changing of the rules just to hook City set a bad taste in the mouth of many and it was Moscow that put many City fans against it (wrongly and stupidly in my opinion) but true nonetheless.

They've had no interest in the competition from before Pep and you are making stuff up saying that. One of the first things he asked upon arrival was that we stop booing the anthem. As I said it means a feck load to me but I understand those who feel the way they do. We won the lotto and for many they feel like their was a witch hunt to stop us rising up the ranks, than we got punished for CSKA fans being racist. Personally I don't buy any of it except the CSKA part, and besides if I had issue with Uefa I would want to win the CL to ram it down their throats, but really I want to win the CL because its the biggest comp in Europe.

No disrespect to Liverpool but I wouldn't feel we can claim we're the best team in Europe when they aren't national champions and CL champions (though Liverpool might have a case as they've won the prem and just waiting for the presentation.)
 
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DonnieDarko said:
They had one world class DM playing actual DM, and other deficiencies were somewhat covered by the gulf in quality. Still we were more consistent last year because we had more functional team.
This season their only proper defensive player has to play CB, that's the difference.

We do have similar situation with TAA, who's not an RB, but we have at least 2 out of 3 midfielders whose job is to protect and control, which allows us to alleviate those issues.
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Last season or last year? Last season they were more consistent. Last calendar year I think it evens out (considering Liverpool's stumble in the January period)

Anyway you really can't say that teams that won them a bunch of trophies including 2 PL trophies in a row, aren't good and functional. That's as sensible as me saying in 17/18 that Chelsea 3-5-2 approach wasn't good and functional, ignoring the previous year when it won the league with games to spare. Again, recency bias is a societal affliction.
 
VeevaVee said:
Lower league supporting but Liverpool arselicking mate saying they’re one of the best teams he’s ever seen, only second to peak Barca. It’s like people don’t actually watch them play. They’re obviously the best in Europe at the moment, but United, City, Arsenal have all played better football for an entire season at least, in the PL alone.
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Defensively they are imho for sure. They are also very well balanced.
 
padr81 said:
Defensively they are imho for sure. They are also very well balanced.
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Clicked on the wrong thread on my phone. They definitely don’t play football anywhere near as well consistently as the best teams of the last 30 years have. They’re a complete team though and highly motivated, with a few world class players thrown in, so they’re bound to do well.
 
VeevaVee said:
Clicked on the wrong thread on my phone. They definitely don’t play football anywhere near as well consistently as the best teams of the last 30 years have. They’re a complete team though and highly motivated, with a few world class players thrown in, so they’re bound to do well.
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In terms of going forward they aren't for sure, and aesthetically they are one of the worst amazing teams I've ever seen. They are brutally efficient at what they do. They remind me more of Joses Chelsea than the classic Liverpool or United teams.
 
padr81 said:
They've had no interest in the competition from before Pep and you are making stuff up saying that.
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The City fans i know are desperate to be thought of as part of the elite. To do this you have to win the CL. Your only goal before the takeover was merely PL survival due to what had happened before. When the investment came in, goals change & fans dream. When SAF came to Utd the aim was to win the PL, CL & finally to overtake Liverpool's title tally. The vast majority of City fans hoped the same would happen to them.
 
ExecutionerWasp001 said:
The City fans i know are desperate to be thought of as part of the elite. To do this you have to win the CL. Your only goal before the takeover was merely PL survival due to what had happened before. When the investment came in, goals change & fans dream. When SAF came to Utd the aim was to win the PL, CL & finally to overtake Liverpool's title tally. The vast majority of City fans hoped the same would happen to them.
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Honestly City fans just genuinely have no affinity for the CL. I'm in literally 50 fan groups on facebook and I'm one of the minority who absolutely do want to win it for the very reason you posted. The majority though just don't give a feck. Its kind of sad actually.
 
padr81 said:
Honestly City fans just genuinely have no affinity for the CL. I'm in literally 50 fan groups on facebook and I'm one of the minority who absolutely do want to win it for the very reason you posted. The majority though just don't give a feck. Its kind of sad actually.
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Yeah, obviously. City has the 2 highest point totals in EPL history and are relative to that CL underperformers. That's just (might even be unconcious) a mechanism to make their club look better. Pretend that you didn't fail, just didn't care that much.
 
Schneckerl said:
Yeah, obviously. City has the 2 highest point totals in EPL history and are relative to that CL underperformers. That's just (might even be unconcious) a mechanism to make their club look better. Pretend that you didn't fail, just didn't care that much.
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I genuniely don't believe it is. Our fans feel hard done by with Uefa and in particular what happened in Moscow (something I personally don't agree with). Add that to FFP being essentially "lets bring in a rule to stop City", than cutting a deal with City after quickly rewriting the rules and finally opening an investigation in City on the back of a (clearly dodgy) deal they made with the club and are trying to cover their arses from, following Der Speigel, some fans have issue with Uefa and the competition.

I don't know why people can't accept that... Like I said I want to win it and it would mean the world to me, but I understand why a huge portion of our fanbase have issues with UEFA and with their competition even if I don't necessarily agree with them.

Cities issues with Uefa and thus the CL runs far deeper than "oh they don't like it because they haven't won it." although I do believe winning it would win a few over. The majority just rightly or wrongly despise UEFA.
 
padr81 said:
I genuniely don't believe it is. Our fans feel hard done by with Uefa and in particular what happened in Moscow (something I personally don't agree with). Add that to FFP being essentially "lets bring in a rule to stop City", than cutting a deal with City after quickly rewriting the rules and finally opening an investigation in City on the back of a (clearly dodgy) deal they made with the club and are trying to cover their arses from, following Der Speigel, some fans have issue with Uefa and the competition.

I don't know why people can't accept that... Like I said I want to win it and it would mean the world to me, but I understand why a huge portion of our fanbase have issues with UEFA and with their competition even if I don't necessarily agree with them.

Cities issues with Uefa and thus the CL runs far deeper than "oh they don't like it because they haven't won it." although I do believe winning it would win a few over. The majority just rightly or wrongly despise UEFA.
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So what exactly have UEFA done to penalise City to such an extent that it's hampered your progress & chances of success ?
 
Absolute rubbish that City have been hard done by. The biggest rugby union side and reigning champions in England have just been relegated for cooking the books whilst City have had no meaningful punishment from UEFA the same crimes.
 
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