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2017-18 Performances


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6.1 Season Average Rating
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37
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6
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I am usually good at calling out people who chat shit and say a player is garbage. I'll just ask on the spot what particular assets suck so bad and what makes them so terrible and it's either "Errr, errr..." or it's something regurgitated that I've personally seen as a headline on some media outlet. It's very seldom a genuine opinion formed on what's actually happened. I watched the France-Argentina game with a Pogba hater that doesn't think he's good enough to play in England and he was slating him the whole game saying how bad he was and was doing nothing even when he was winning the ball, splitting the defense, spreading the ball and he'd laugh when France scored because it wasn't Pogba (despite being a Messi and Argentina fanboy). The game was more about Pogba than Argentina-France. Every touch is "He's shit. He's shit".

The obsession in general with Pogba is insane. I work with a bloke who's a United fan and he's the same after every game "Pogba this. Pogba that". The media really got through to people on him and most are too stubborn to just view something objectively now.

This is spot on. There are some that can't view Pogba objectively. I've heard a few people say that Pogba was horrible against Uruguay and it was a 'typical brainless performance'. These are people who don't even watch United and get to see Pogba less than 10 times a season at most.

Bear in mind that these people are educated and intelligent people that I know, but football does something to their brains and they turn into idiots.
 
http://www.espn.com/soccer/club/man...shines-for-france-and-will-benefit-man-united

Crucially, he is now playing in much the same setup for France as he is for United, within a 4-2-3-1 formation. As a result, when he returns to club duty there will be little need to adjust his game. The only challenge for Mourinho is to ensure that he continues to be surrounded by the same kind of speed that he has around him at international level, which is a strong argument for retaining the services of Anthony Martial.

Mbappe has been devastating for France in the same inside-right position which Martial could yet make his own at United, and so it would make sense to give Martial an extended run in the team there.

For now, though, it is simply good to see Pogba excelling for France in the manner that many knew that he could. If he returns to the Premier League in this sort of form then Mourinho can take credit for his development, and both manager and player should see plenty of success from his progress.

Hopefully Jose feels similar
 
This is spot on. There are some that can't view Pogba objectively. I've heard a few people say that Pogba was horrible against Uruguay and it was a 'typical brainless performance'. These are people who don't even watch United and get to see Pogba less than 10 times a season at most.

Bear in mind that these people are educated and intelligent people that I know, but football does something to their brains and they turn into idiots.
I see that often with Liverpool fans especially - Liverpoolitis I call it - where they can be reasonable and logical on all things football except anything having to do with LFC or United. Then everything defies logic and reason. Similar with Pogba, who can apparently do no right for some.
 
Hopefully Jose feels similar

:lol: The article says that the speed is what has helped him in the France setup. Then shoehorns Martial into the United team despite him being a statue of a player that always wants the ball to feet. He must be a part of Martial FC.
 
This is spot on. There are some that can't view Pogba objectively. I've heard a few people say that Pogba was horrible against Uruguay and it was a 'typical brainless performance'. These are people who don't even watch United and get to see Pogba less than 10 times a season at most.

Bear in mind that these people are educated and intelligent people that I know, but football does something to their brains and they turn into idiots.
Yeah, I know a couple that say "I never watch United. They are boring", so only watch them against Liverpool and I ask "Well how can you say he's so bad when you don't see him play?", they said "Against Liverpool he was awful he was the worst player on the field" and of course he didn't play either game against Liverpool last season. I point that out and it's just "He's shit he's shit".

It would be sweet if France win the world cup and he keeps playing like this and he gets to lift the cup provided England aren't to win it of course. A Pogba goal in a final would be very sweet. I'd like to see how it's spun.
 
Yeah, I know a couple that say "I never watch United. They are boring", so only watch them against Liverpool and I ask "Well how can you say he's so bad when you don't see him play?", they said "Against Liverpool he was awful he was the worst player on the field" and of course he didn't play either game against Liverpool last season. I point that out and it's just "He's shit he's shit".

It would be sweet if France win the world cup and he keeps playing like this and he gets to lift the cup provided England aren't to win it of course. A Pogba goal in a final would be very sweet. I'd like to see how it's spun.

It might be a bit sacrilegious but I wouldnt mind France or Belgium beating England in the final because of Pogba and Lukaku. Of course I would want England to win, but watching one of them lift the cup would be some consolation. Over the years my patience for England has waned especially considering how they have treated United players and idolised non united players.
 
It might be a bit sacrilegious but I wouldnt mind France or Belgium beating England in the final because of Pogba and Lukaku. Of course I would want England to win, but watching one of them lift the cup would be some consolation. Over the years my patience for England has waned especially considering how they have treated United players and idolised non united players.

Club > country, always.
 
It might be a bit sacrilegious but I wouldnt mind France or Belgium beating England in the final because of Pogba and Lukaku. Of course I would want England to win, but watching one of them lift the cup would be some consolation. Over the years my patience for England has waned especially considering how they have treated United players and idolised non united players.
My sentiments exactly 100%. Lukaku is another one that I always have to hear nonstop nonsense about.
 
Club > country, always.

This is unique amongst United fans I think, because we have been the arch enemy of every club due to dominating the league for so long. Non United fans seem to take pleasure in slating United players when they play for England. I have never had any desire to do that, and want England to do well regardless of who plays.

My sentiments exactly 100%. Lukaku is another one that I always have to hear nonstop nonsense about.

Yep, Lukaku was called a donkey and Morata was seen as the clearly better player by loads of people. Lukaku proved people wrong and I love it.
 
One was tapped as the "intelligent" option while the other was tapped as simply "pace and power" - surprising, I know...

Yep, stereotyping Lukaku into a box that he did not fit whatsoever. Morata is almost useless outside of headers while Lukaku's biggest weakness is his back to goal in physical confrontations.

The way the two were portrayed was the opposite of reality.
 
Club > country, always.



Hoping England win it all but I’d be happy with france, England or belgium winning the World Cup. All have players from united on them that I like.

Really hope Belgium beats Brazil next match ... id hate to see England vs Brazil final and have Brazil win
 
That should go for Martial himself. I meant it's clearly tactic wise how Mourinho wants to use Martial & Rashford. Rashford has the willingness for the role, but Rashford ain't tidy enough with his dribbling and had been through a bad form. Martial is just very different from Mbappe in quite many ways. For that role to work it requires Martial cooperation and willingness to change. This season he had been sharper compare to the previous but his game is still the same.

I am fine with us have more option to change tactic to midfield 3 to get more out of Pogba. Not to gamble our season on wishful thinking Martial would make huge change in his game.
 
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From what I can see, Pogba had one of his best games that I have seen in recent years against Argentina. He routinely won the ball back and was constantly looking for the forward pass. Sometimes I think people think he isn’t trying/ showing urgency because of his style of locomotion (he has a very long stride.)

I felt it was his presence in midfield that allowed Mbappe to really shine, as he allowed their forwards to bypass the flimsy Argentinian midfield. His decision making also seemed better , with him seemingly knowing when the obvious pass , and when to turn on a bit of flair, or go for the raking cross field
Ball.

Up until this game still, I felt he was quietly effective , coming up with a goal or two, despite the oh so predictable criticism. I can’t recall the number of times I have heard a bbc or ITV commentator mention his Hair. I thinkI heard the co commentator (I’m pretty sure it was Lawro) say in his laborious drone “He’s got a normal hairstyle for once” It’s his life and his money ffs I’m sure it’s not just me and Paul seems to get particularly nasty Criticism for this ? It’s just really distasteful and screams ABU to me.
 
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It's not about wanting ball at his feet. We don't have any right wingers and Martial is very quick, so that article author is just hoping that Martial can make that spot in own as he has pace (which Mbappe has used to his best). Obviously to do any better first he should start making runs from right side but it's not something that can't be taught or learned.

I know you and few others loves to shit on Martial for some reason but he is highly rated and journalist just pointed out that he should be given extended run as Right winger as his pace might help Pogba to spray passes from deep. Nothing to do with shoehorning, if that's the case then that journalist would have said bench Sanchez who has lost bit of pace and play Rashford and Martial as wingers but that isn't the case.

For someone who is very supportive of few ManUtd players, you have some issues when it comes to Martial.
Pace is just one thing. Willingness to run, movement is another thing. Rashford is closer to that of Mbappe's style, yet the journalist decided to namedrop Martial instead. It's more a lazy case of compatriot comparison rather than looking at the players themselves. Let's not forget there was outrage on here with people saying plenty of thing about how Martial was pushed out of his favorite position to play on the right! Mbappe has underwhelming game here and there too. The difference is the effort, enthusiasm he puts into his game wherever he is employed in the team attack.

Same shite with Pogba. How he needs to play on left side of midfield 3*in Mourinho voice*, b2b without defensive responsibility... yet now he is doing decent enough in a double pivot, just as he did for most part with us and in the past with France NT. Sometimes people just talk, even if they would slap themselves with their own word later on
 
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Pace is just one thing. Willingness to run, movement is another thing. Rashford is closer to that of Mbappe's style, yet the journalist decided to namedrop Martial instead. It's more a lazy case of compatriot comparison rather than looking at the players themselves. Let's not forget there was outrage on here with people saying plenty of thing about how Martial was pushed out of his favorite position to play on the right! Mbappe has underwhelming game here and there too. The difference is the effort, enthusiasm he puts into his game wherever he is employed in the team attack.

Same shite with Pogba. How he needs to play on left side of midfield 3*in Mourinho voice*, b2b without defensive responsibility... yet now he is doing decent enough in a double pivot, just as he did for most part with us and in the past with France NT. Sometimes people just talk, even if they would slap themselves with their own word later on

I deleted my post was later I realized this argument was made numerous times and it just ends up in circles.

Anyways point is we have Sanchez who will be first choice for sure and we don't have any right wingers. So it's something outrageous to think Martial or Rashford might get chances as RW. Yes, journalist could have used Rashford as example but considering he is French he used Martial as example, no different to all the outrage about Rashford game time in English media and not a word on Martial.

I said it in my post that to this to work Martial should start making runs from right side, this can be coached. Now only way these 2 players can get game time is as right wingers or whenever Sanchez is rested. So maybe they will again get games as right wingers.

Re Argentina game, France didn't play 4-2-3-1, that article made a mistake by going with what was shown on paper. Matuidi played as midfielder rather than as winger.
 
If it comes to England vs France in final, and for England to win the world cup, I can guarantee that everyone in England would think Pogba is by the biggest flop so far, Henderson bossed him and how crap he is even if he's been very good for France this game but rest of his teamate didn't perform so well as they expect.

The media did the pretty good job of getting to people's minds and convinced them that Pogba is a flop, all he care about hair and social media.
 
I deleted my post was later I realized this argument was made numerous times and it just ends up in circles.

Anyways point is we have Sanchez who will be first choice for sure and we don't have any right wingers. So it's something outrageous to think Martial or Rashford might get chances as RW. Yes, journalist could have used Rashford as example but considering he is French he used Martial as example, no different to all the outrage about Rashford game time in English media and not a word on Martial.

I said it in my post that to this to work Martial should start making runs from right side, this can be coached. Now only way these 2 players can get game time is as right wingers or whenever Sanchez is rested. So maybe they will again get games as right wingers.

Re Argentina game, France didn't play 4-2-3-1, that article made a mistake by going with what was shown on paper. Matuidi played as midfielder rather than as winger.
It's similar tactic to game vs Peru which I wrote summary about key difference to the definite midfield 3 of France first game somewhere in this thread. Mbappe has a pseudo forward/right winger role. It's not full freedom, yet not fully restriction placed on him. His game intelligence is not stated enough. He had to provide enough width to lest the ball being played too much outwide in the build up toward Pavard for the obvious reason, yet he is needed to help linkin gup, unlocking opposition defense centrally, even on the left side when the play is in final third. He did all those while leaving very little gap, hiccup in transition. Matuidi would, but many occasion he was played as left winger to provide width. It's not the kind of tactic that can be written down by number, but needs more analysis. Midfield double pivot was maintained in longer period of the game than midfield 3, so the article is not very wrong

Where to position, where to run to can be coached. However, the instinct to be ahead of the curve is something that can't be matched. The contrast in preferred approach between Martial and Mbappe is high. People here again were outraged about Deschamps didn't use Martial as much for the WC and instead giving Coman game time. Me and few others pointed out how Coman was better at offering width when he had problem with decision making too. Mbappe has no problem provide a different dimension which meet tactical requirement from Deschamps, which he is a mainstay for Deschamps team, even when his form was always not as good as expected.
 
If it comes to England vs France in final, and for England to win the world cup, I can guarantee that everyone in England would think Pogba is by the biggest flop so far, Henderson bossed him and how crap he is even if he's been very good for France this game but rest of his teamate didn't perform so well as they expect.

The media did the pretty good job of getting to people's minds and convinced them that Pogba is a flop, all he care about hair and social media.
Dont worry. I dont think England can get past Sweden.
 
It's similar tactic to game vs Peru which I wrote summary about key difference to the definite midfield 3 of France first game somewhere in this thread. Mbappe has a pseudo forward/right winger role. It's not full freedom, yet not fully restriction placed on him. His game intelligence is not stated enough. He had to provide enough width to lest the ball being played too much outwide in the build up toward Pavard for the obvious reason, yet he is needed to help linkin gup, unlocking opposition defense centrally, even on the left side when the play is in final third. He did all those while leaving very little gap, hiccup in transition. Matuidi would, but many occasion he was played as left winger to provide width. It's not the kind of tactic that can be written down by number, but needs more analysis.

Where to position, where to run to can be coached. However, the instinct to be ahead of the curve is something that can't be matched. The contrast in preferred approach between Martial and Mbappe is high. People here again were outraged about Deschamps didn't use Martial as much for the WC and instead giving Coman game time. Me and few others pointed out how Coman was better at offering width when he had problem with decision making too. Mbappe has no problem provide a different dimension which meet tactical requirement from Deschamps, which he is a mainstay for Deschamps team, even when his form was always not as good as expected.

Yeah same against Peru too. Matuidi isn't a winger, Matuidi always played that role, he was a work horse who made so many runs and helped his team defensively. He was a midfielder.

I made a point few weeks back about Pogba, he is playing restricted role (not as in very defensive). He has clear zone where he is playing. He isn't playing completely defensive to provide the cover or too attacking to make runs to the box, it's between the box to box and he is a playmaker than a attacking player. This sort of role actually suits him as he can make full use of his passing but limits his runs to the box.Very well defined role where he has set way of playing which was good to see. He carried out playing like that with very good discipline.

If you check Matuidi's heat map and touches, it's shows he was playing as left midfielder, Kante more defensive and Pogba in the zone between 2 boxes. It works for them.

Re Martial and Mbappe, don't think article said he will be as good, he just offered a solution (which he believes can work), obvious it won't be as effective as Mbappe who is on different level. If you keep on practicing, it will become your routine. I have always argued that technical skills can be improved even after certain age, for making runs also I believe the same. It's also to do with intelligence and ability to see the game without possession, these things can be improved.

I'm not saying we have to play him as right winger, i'm saying that's the only position available for Rashford and Martial now.
 
Yeah same against Peru too. Matuidi isn't a winger, Matuidi always played that role, he was a work horse who made so many runs and helped his team defensively. He was a midfielder.

I made a point few weeks back about Pogba, he is playing restricted role (not as in very defensive). He has clear zone where he is playing. He isn't playing completely defensive to provide the cover or too attacking to make runs to the box, it's between the box to box and he is a playmaker than a attacking player. This sort of role actually suits him as he can make full use of his passing but limits his runs to the box.Very well defined role where he has set way of playing which was good to see. He carried out playing like that with very good discipline.

If you check Matuidi's heat map and touches, it's shows he was playing as left midfielder, Kante more defensive and Pogba in the zone between 2 boxes. It works for them.

Re Martial and Mbappe, don't think article said he will be as good, he just offered a solution (which he believes can work), obvious it won't be as effective as Mbappe who is on different level. If you keep on practicing, it will become your routine. I have always argued that technical skills can be improved even after certain age, for making runs also I believe the same. It's also to do with intelligence and ability to see the game without possession, these things can be improved.

I'm not saying we have to play him as right winger, i'm saying that's the only position available for Rashford and Martial now.
Not always that role. That's for sure. You can pull up France qualification game, or Juventus and see distinct difference in the role. The heat of this game show a U shape (same color intensity). So it fits what I described Matuidi had to stick out wide to help defend the flank when Argentine. He would need to help prodive width when France build up the attack. Other time he stationed centrally, it's around middle third of the pitch. It's not a side midfielder heat map. As I said you can compare his own heat map from games in the past for Juve, PSG and France outside of this WC. It's a new role being worked out to patch issues from the Australia game (I also wrote about it how Australia exploit the space on the flank to avoid confrontation in midfield battle. I disagreed with people saying A.Mooy boss the midfield battle. It's a tactical exploit from Australia, but they didn't have quality to see it through. Deschamps didn't have a counter and had to rely on individual quality for the result).
 
Not always that role. That's for sure. You can pull up France qualification game, or Juventus and see distinct difference in the role. The heat of this game show a U shape (same color intensity). So it fits what I described Matuidi had to stick out wide to help defend the flank when Argentine. He would need to help prodive width when France build up the attack. Other time he stationed centrally, it's around middle third of the pitch. It's not a side midfielder heat map. As I said you can compare his own heat map from games in the past for Juve, PSG and France outside of this WC. It's a new role being worked out to patch issues from the Australia game (I also wrote about it how Australia exploit the space on the flank to avoid confrontation in midfield battle. I disagreed with people saying A.Mooy boss the midfield battle. It's a tactical exploit from Australia, but they didn't have quality to see it through. Deschamps didn't have a counter and had to rely on individual quality for the result).

Well I'm saying more or less the same, point is it wasn't 4-2-3-1 like mentioned in the article. He had different roles when France had possession and when when they were defending. He wasn't a pure winger and wasn't a pure CM.

Edit: When I said he always played that role, I meant when he was played as CM (at least as per team sheet), he made same runs and made lot of attacking rune and then dropped back to help defensively.
 
If it comes to England vs France in final, and for England to win the world cup, I can guarantee that everyone in England would think Pogba is by the biggest flop so far, Henderson bossed him and how crap he is even if he's been very good for France this game but rest of his teamate didn't perform so well as they expect.

The media did the pretty good job of getting to people's minds and convinced them that Pogba is a flop, all he care about hair and social media.
I remember Pogba absolutely bossing the England midfield in a friendly in Paris last year. I'm sure if it came to an France vs England final he would do the same again.
 
I remember Pogba absolutely bossing the England midfield in a friendly in Paris last year. I'm sure if it came to an France vs England final he would do the same again.

Yep that was proper men against boys stuff.

EDIT: Actually just rewatched some highlights of that game, probably Pogba's best ever international performance that I can remember. He was all over us all game, showed every aspect of his game to the full, and honestly looked as if he was having a kick-about with some kids in the park.
 
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I remember Pogba absolutely bossing the England midfield in a friendly in Paris last year. I'm sure if it came to an France vs England final he would do the same again.

He's playing that bad that you have to rewind a year? :p
 
I remember Pogba absolutely bossing the England midfield in a friendly in Paris last year. I'm sure if it came to an France vs England final he would do the same again.

He would, and it’d be painful to watch as an England fan.
 
It might be a bit sacrilegious but I wouldnt mind France or Belgium beating England in the final because of Pogba and Lukaku. Of course I would want England to win, but watching one of them lift the cup would be some consolation. Over the years my patience for England has waned especially considering how they have treated United players and idolised non united players.
can't be English. I would never imagine a French person wanting Brazil to beat them because of Neymar. That's just weird. They are players, employees of a club you follow, nothing more. They will break your heart just as easy and go and play for another club. Pogba did this already.
Me too. I have never had the pleasure of seeing my home nation win anything. I have been around for 2 of United CL wins. I have fond memories of euro 96 when I was a boy.
I would too, without a second thought tbh.
yep.
 
I am absolutely English, and I cried my eyes out when Ronaldinho knocked us out in 2002 from that free kick. I was watching it with about 10 other people and only one other person supported England, we both were crushed on that day.

However, the next 10-15 years have really tested my relationship with them. It's like a wife you've been with for 20 years that has constantly pushed your buttons and you've always had it in the back of your head that she's cheated on you. You wouldn't mind a divorce.
 
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