You might have a point actually! But as you know a lot of these things take time. I don't remember it being so easy for a United fan like myself to easily accept Henry's status 15 years ago when the rivalry was fresh. I, specifically, remember arguing that Van Nistelrooy was better and wouldn't have it any other way. Maybe in a few years, rivalries will be put aside and we will be able to see Agüero in more objective terms.
Overrated Players
- Thread starter JSArsenal
- Start date
The most overrated player of all time is unquestionably Denis Bergkamp.
Before I begin the argument, let me say that I think he was a great player - I enjoyed watching his skills even as a United fan. However, he is constantly referenced in the same breath as some of the greatest strikers in PL history. His numbers do not remotely stack up. He averaged 1 goal every 4 games for Arsenal and made no impact on the European scene due to his fear of flying.
I have seen ex-professionals trying to place Bergkamp in PL all time teams. There’s simply no way to place him above Henry, Shearer, Aguero, Rooney, Drogba, RVN. The Bergkamp sympathisers talk about how how he’s a ‘support striker’ which makes as much sense to me as Liverpool’s ridiculous notion that Kuyt was the best defensive striker in the world. If you’re up top, you show your worth with goals and assists.
Don’t get me wrong - he has an unbelievable highlights package. Some of his goals are my favourites but I feel like some people of my generation and older - I’m 37 - like calling upon this blind nostalgia to try to prove they know more about football by placing him on a pedestal. He was highly skilled, a joy to watch but not that effective when compared to the top strikers in the league’s history. This isn’t an anti Bergkamp post though; it’s just anti ‘he was god tier’ revisionist tripe.
Before I begin the argument, let me say that I think he was a great player - I enjoyed watching his skills even as a United fan. However, he is constantly referenced in the same breath as some of the greatest strikers in PL history. His numbers do not remotely stack up. He averaged 1 goal every 4 games for Arsenal and made no impact on the European scene due to his fear of flying.
I have seen ex-professionals trying to place Bergkamp in PL all time teams. There’s simply no way to place him above Henry, Shearer, Aguero, Rooney, Drogba, RVN. The Bergkamp sympathisers talk about how how he’s a ‘support striker’ which makes as much sense to me as Liverpool’s ridiculous notion that Kuyt was the best defensive striker in the world. If you’re up top, you show your worth with goals and assists.
Don’t get me wrong - he has an unbelievable highlights package. Some of his goals are my favourites but I feel like some people of my generation and older - I’m 37 - like calling upon this blind nostalgia to try to prove they know more about football by placing him on a pedestal. He was highly skilled, a joy to watch but not that effective when compared to the top strikers in the league’s history. This isn’t an anti Bergkamp post though; it’s just anti ‘he was god tier’ revisionist tripe.
Bergkamp scored more goals overall than Cantona. Was Cantona overrated then? It was a different era. Both scored goals, but they were more rated for their technical skills, influence and quality of their goals rather than being really prolific. Same goes for someone like Zola.
And yeah I think in that era bring a support striker or 2nd striker was far different than being a pure nr. 9.
What's Bergkamp assist numbers BTW?
Edit: 94 in the pl. I don't know if there is reliable data for his numbers before that.
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I always felt Zola was a bit overrated.
I completely agree.
Frank Lampard (But only as a midfielder)
Lampard wasn’t really a midfielder in any classic sense but rather one of those strange ‘off the front man’ ten's who aren’t playmakers. Lampard won’t be reminisced for his work off the ball, his reading of the game from deep, or his ability in possession while dictating play. Really Lampard was a striker playing in a withdrawn role. He scored a lot of goals with distance shots and well-timed late runs.
A top-tier Kevin Nolan who should be compared to Rooney rather than Gerrard or Scholes.
Lampard wasn’t really a midfielder in any classic sense but rather one of those strange ‘off the front man’ ten's who aren’t playmakers. Lampard won’t be reminisced for his work off the ball, his reading of the game from deep, or his ability in possession while dictating play. Really Lampard was a striker playing in a withdrawn role. He scored a lot of goals with distance shots and well-timed late runs.
A top-tier Kevin Nolan who should be compared to Rooney rather than Gerrard or Scholes.
Generally speaking, we overrate players unable to fulfil their primary task in their position yet able to unlock unusual patterns for their position. Example: Alexander Arnold and Cancelo are bad defenders in spite of their excellent attacking skills, in that becoming liabilities against same level opponents who fill the holes they leave behind.
I mean, prime Juventus 25 years ago had Zambrotta, a mediocre winger, playing full back… United had Valencia in a similar proposition. Both could defend at an acceptable level, though, while still offering something upfront. Arnold and Cancelo are neither wingers nor full backs… just unorthodox players unable to guard their zone on the pitch.
I mean, prime Juventus 25 years ago had Zambrotta, a mediocre winger, playing full back… United had Valencia in a similar proposition. Both could defend at an acceptable level, though, while still offering something upfront. Arnold and Cancelo are neither wingers nor full backs… just unorthodox players unable to guard their zone on the pitch.
Goals are not everything. Sometimes, players are able to lift the quality of the entire squad without really raking in the statistics for themselves. Drogba was just that.
There was a post here that suggested that Lampard was far better than Gerrard because he scored nearly 100 goals more than Gerrard did in nearly the same number of matches. It is total stupidity to judge players by stats alone.
There was a post here that suggested that Lampard was far better than Gerrard because he scored nearly 100 goals more than Gerrard did in nearly the same number of matches. It is total stupidity to judge players by stats alone.
It does seem daft to dismiss Bergkamp on goals.
Even dafter when the original post accepts that he was a support striker, aka number 10.
Totally dismisses that there were undoubtedly better defenders around back then too and how the game has evolved to suit the attacker more now.
Even dafter when the original post accepts that he was a support striker, aka number 10.
Totally dismisses that there were undoubtedly better defenders around back then too and how the game has evolved to suit the attacker more now.
Zidane is overrated for me. Talks of him being the best of a generation etc but he was a very inconsistent player. When he did show up, it was mesmerising and he was a big game player but over the course of a season, he'd have too many bad moments to be considered one of the top 3 in the world at the time.
Being overrated isn’t actually anything to do with how good you are - it’s how people perceive your ability. People quite rightly say that Cantona was a great player but outside of faint whisperings on United forums Cantona is never talked about as being in an all time Premier League 11. Bergkamp is constantly referenced in that conversation.
They are both great players for their respective clubs but there have been at least 5-6 players that have been better than them in their respective positions in the history of the league.
Sure as out and out strikers lots have been better than Bergkamp and Cantona, but it's hard to think of many who were better than the roles they had and positions they played in.
Our forwards. Rubbish.
I feel like Mane has become slightly overrated now that he has left Liverpool. I'm sure this is compounded by the fact that they aren't playing well right now, but he seems to have become elevated as this irreplaceable player that was getting them a goal per game. People seem to forget how he would go through weeks/months of inconsistency, Salah was always the superior of the two.
Drogba or RVN over Bergkamp? Wind your neck in lad. Bergkamp is 5th in all time assist stats and I'm sure he played fewer games than everyone above him barring Fabregas (that's a maybe and I'm too lazy to check)