Out of control dogs/dog attacks

2mufc0 said:
And you should be, dogs are unpredictable and there are some terrible and arrogant owners out there with the 'he's a friendly dog' attitude which doesn't help the situation .
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I ran a doggy day care / overnight facility in Atlanta years back. Our overnight services were contingent upon at least one day care session so we could assess the new dog & see of any issues might arise.

We would get bully parents heading to the airport trying to drop their dog off for overnights at the last possible minute. The attitude some of the owners would show when we informed them of our rule was hilariously predictable; they were absolute caricatures. The dogs would also exude similar traits.
 
Bert_ said:
Dogs have been selectively bred since the first wolf was domesticated for various purposes. That breed was crafted to fight to the death in dog fights. Nothing else. May as well have a pet hyena and take that for a walk.
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Yep. The whole ‘nanny dog’ thing is literally a myth that just perpetuated over time.
 
Not only should pitbulls be illegal, but the police should actively look for them and put them down. They're a constant threat to the public, and it's inevitable that many more people and children will die a painful death because of them.
 
zaafi said:
Not only should pitbulls be illegal, but the police should actively look for them and put them down. They're a constant threat to the public, and it's inevitable that many more people and children will die a painful death because of them.
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Pitbulls are actually already illegal in the UK but I believe this is only for pure Pitbulls so people circumvent this law by mix breeding.
 
I actually believe that dog ownership is a wonderful way to assess the overall level of understanding and respect people have for animals. Which is in many cases next to nonexistent.
It isn’t just that many people still love dangerous breeds because they serve as a nice penis enlargement for them. It’s also the huge amount of breeds that basically shouldn’t exist. What kind of cruel person buys an animal bred without the ability of breathing normally, because that very defect is a direct consequence of them looking cute? „Oh look that cute dog I got. It can’t breathe properly and will probably die if it runs more than three metres, but I like how his face looks. So that makes it ok.“
Or people who keep a solitary husky they walk twice a day for 30 minutes, ideally living in an area where the temperatures cross 30 degrees in the summer.
The amount of people who absolutely give no shit whatsoever about the dogs well-being, as long as they like it’s cuteness, aggressiveness or whatsoever is incredible. And these are people who often enough will tell you with a straight face how much they love animals.
 
zaafi said:
Not only should pitbulls be illegal, but the police should actively look for them and put them down. They're a constant threat to the public, and it's inevitable that many more people and children will die a painful death because of them.
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It's not only pitbulls that are a threat, they're probably just the most lethal. It's always someone else's dog, that's the trouble with dog owners.
 
If the little dogs were allowed to carry guns, it would be safer all round.
 
Wibble said:
All muzzled? Why torture all dogs to protect from a few breeds?
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If someone can accurately distinguish which dogs are absolutely “safe” then good luck

I remember when I was a kid, one of the neighbours had a Labrador which was as vicious a dog as I’ve ever seen. Whenever it got out of their backyard it would go for anything. My mum used to walk a small dog for a pensioner and one day this big monster lab attacked the small one which was happily enjoying its walk on the lead. My mum had to put herself between them and she got bitten on the arm.

but labs are friendly family dogs normally, so how do you distinguish?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
That’s excessive. Although I guess it’s tricky to accurately categorise the dangerous ones.
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Errrr let’s see…deaths by American Bully XL and other such breeds in UK recent years: Multiple. In fact, mostly them.

Deaths by Labs, Chihuahuas, St. Bernard’s, Corgis, Jack Russells, Shih Tzus, Retrievers etc. (take your pick): ZERO. Maybe one or two.

There, categorised for you.

ETA: even if we are generous and categorise danger just by attacks and not necessarily deaths I bet bully type dogs and the like will still outnumber anything else by a landslide
 
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golden_blunder said:
If someone can accurately distinguish which dogs are absolutely “safe” then good luck

I remember when I was a kid, one of the neighbours had a Labrador which was as vicious a dog as I’ve ever seen. Whenever it got out of their backyard it would go for anything. My mum used to walk a small dog for a pensioner and one day this big monster lab attacked the small one which was happily enjoying its walk on the lead. My mum had to put herself between them and she got bitten on the arm.

but labs are friendly family dogs normally, so how do you distinguish?
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You can probably make almost any dog badly behaved if you try hard enough. Not a good reason to treat all dogs so badly.

It can't be that hard to ban the truly dangerous breeds.
 
Sara125 said:
Errrr let’s see…deaths by American Bully XL and other such breeds in UK recent years: Multiple. In fact, mostly them.

Deaths by Labs, Chihuahuas, St. Bernard’s, Corgis, Jack Russells, Shih Tzus, Retrievers etc. (take your pick): ZERO. Maybe one or two.

There, categorised for you.

ETA: even if we are generous and categorise danger just by attacks and not necessarily deaths I bet bully type dogs and the like will still outnumber anything else by a landslide
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Yep, anyone that has a dog with jaws bigger than most folks neck should be aware that their dog is dangerous. Don't leave any dog off a leash, period, but be extra vigilant with the bigger ones (or even outright ban them).

We've got a staffie, a proper one. Not one of the snarling, bull mastiff cross breeds or American Pitbull ones that they unfairly get compared to. He's the dumbest, most gentle, friendly dog I've ever met. He's amazing with people, kids, small dogs, cats. A sparrow hopped past him the other week when he was lounging in the back garden. He just sniffed it and flopped his head back down on the grass. Then one of the cats swiped at him because she's an arsehole. Still doesn't do anything.

But bigger dogs? He used to try and dominate them. He wouldn't bite or snarl or anything but he would try and tower over them, so he never got out of his harness when we were out in case he saw a German shepherd that he wanted to argue with. Even if it was just small dogs or other people nearby he would still be on the leash until we found clear fields. Same thing applied at home. Spend time around the kids, absolutely, but not alone with the youngest. Now that he's an old boy he mostly spends his days eating food and farting, but you still just need to take extra precaution because you never know what can happen. It's really not difficult.

I love the daft bastard. He's one of my best friends. But, if I'm being honest, even staffies shouldn't be a breed that's available in the UK, let alone pitbulls. Once he's left us to go chase (or sniff) rabbits and birds in doggo heaven we're not getting another breed like him because our odds of getting another one like him are low.
 
HTG said:
I actually believe that dog ownership is a wonderful way to assess the overall level of understanding and respect people have for animals. Which is in many cases next to nonexistent.
It isn’t just that many people still love dangerous breeds because they serve as a nice penis enlargement for them. It’s also the huge amount of breeds that basically shouldn’t exist. What kind of cruel person buys an animal bred without the ability of breathing normally, because that very defect is a direct consequence of them looking cute? „Oh look that cute dog I got. It can’t breathe properly and will probably die if it runs more than three metres, but I like how his face looks. So that makes it ok.“
Or people who keep a solitary husky they walk twice a day for 30 minutes, ideally living in an area where the temperatures cross 30 degrees in the summer.
The amount of people who absolutely give no shit whatsoever about the dogs well-being, as long as they like it’s cuteness, aggressiveness or whatsoever is incredible. And these are people who often enough will tell you with a straight face how much they love animals.
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Our next-door neighbour has 2 huskies, they are almost always in their pen or in the paved area in front of his house. We get temps up to 38/39C on a regular basis in the summer. I know they love the dogs, but they are just clueless about the breed.

Our most recent dog acquisition is a mutt, a cross-breed who'd lived in no-kill kennels for 8 years. Black Lab with other things added in which make him smaller. He's 10 now, he's absolutely healthy and easy to look after. Mongrels are so often healthier than pedigrees.
 
I'm pretty sure that most pitbulls are chill and that if you buy from a reputable breeder and do just an average job training it, then the chances of it biting someone is 1 in 1000.

The problem is that people can't be trusted. And even if we could, 1 in 1000 is still too dangerous when the bite is deadly. There is a reason for why pitbulls are illegal in many countries. An aggressive but harmless breed is ultimately better for society than a teddy bear that suddenly murders.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
We've got a staffie, a proper one. Not one of the snarling, bull mastiff cross breeds or American Pitbull ones that they unfairly get compared to. He's the dumbest, most gentle, friendly dog I've ever met. He's amazing with people, kids, small dogs, cats. A sparrow hopped past him the other week when he was lounging in the back garden. He just sniffed it and flopped his head back down on the grass. Then one of the cats swiped at him because she's an arsehole. Still doesn't do anything.
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Staffies are great. Love them.

Maybe I got hit by a propaganda piece, but I think Staffies are the only breed that has something resembling human empathy. The way they tested it was by checking which breeds would console a crying stranger even when their owner was present. Most breeds don't care (especially if their owner is present). Some breeds get curious. Some breeds feel stressed out. The Staffy jumps up on their lap and lick their face. That is also why Staffies are terrible watchdogs. They'd probably help the burglar if they could :lol:
 
Scandi Red said:
Staffies are great. Love them.

Maybe I got hit by a propaganda piece, but I think Staffies are the only breed that has something resembling human empathy. The way they tested it was by checking which breeds would console a crying stranger even when their owner was present. Most breeds don't care (especially if their owner is present). Some breeds get curious. Some breeds feel stressed out. The Staffy jumps up on their lap and lick their face. That is also why Staffies are terrible watchdogs. They'd probably help the burglar if they could :lol:
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I'm not sure either about the empathy part but we've always said that if we were ever burgled, and he was home, he would probably just welcome them in and happily follow them when they left :lol:
 
Tonnes of misinformed and outdated cliché posts in here. "Pitbulls" are old news in such circles who choose to weaponise dogs; there are arguably stronger, bigger more lethal breeds about now who you could eliminate every pitbull on the planet and not have dealt with the issue of lethal breeds in society.

Punishments for owners of dogs who attack should be as severe as those humans receive.

By the way, this discussion is an infinite loop. Not sure how many times it's been done on the caf itself, but I've encountered it countless times across Internet fora. The discussion is practically word for word the same. Have to wonder if this will ever be resolved, well, you don't; it won't.
 
Fortitude said:
Have to wonder if this will ever be resolved, well, you don't; it won't.
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There are definitely some parallels between this debate and the US gun debate. And if you can't get Americans to agree on guns, then good luck trying to convince people to end a highly popular dog breed. A breed that is incredibly affectionate and also quite healthy. If pitbulls had the temper of a chihuahua and the breathing issues of a pug then it would have been a lot easier to convince people. But even then it would be hard.
 
One of those things in society when its clear common sense says certain dogs e.g. xl bullys etc should be banned, there should be bigger repercussions for owners of dog attacks, fines for dogs being off leashes and probably should be some licence for owning dogs. As usual nothing will be done.
 
flameinthesun said:
One of those things in society when its clear common sense says certain dogs e.g. xl bullys etc should be banned, there should be bigger repercussions for owners of dog attacks, fines for dogs being off leashes and probably should be some licence for owning dogs. As usual nothing will be done.
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All dogs should be registered to an owner, those kind of dogs should require a muzzle and leash whilst out of the owners property. If people can follow those rules whilst owning a Greyhound, then anyone can. But yeah there's such a reluctance to legislate for responsible dog ownership.
 
It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest to learn that most of these folk who can't even be arsed putting their dog on a leash don't bother with the simplest levels of training either. They're usually the twats you see coming along the road you're walking your own dog, shouting "he's fine, he's dog friendly". Well, my dog isn't dog friendly when it comes to bigger dogs, because he was once attacked by one, so he'll be very nervous hence why I've got him on a fecking leash. And if your dog is just running up to him what am I meant to do at that point?

My dog doesn't go for other dogs, he doesn't go for people, he's incredibly friendly. Guess what? He still stays on the fecking leash.
 
Saw the biggest dog I've ever seen the other week out on a run. Looked like a pit but absolutely massive. Certainly bigger than an XL. It was friendly but feck me, I wouldn't want to be on the end of it losing its shit. Absolute tank of pure muscle.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
And if your dog is just running up to him what am I meant to do at that point?
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I'm sure you know this but make sure you are the obstacle between your dog and the other one. It offers some protection and will increase the trust your dog has in you.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest to learn that most of these folk who can't even be arsed putting their dog on a leash don't bother with the simplest levels of training either. They're usually the twats you see coming along the road you're walking your own dog, shouting "he's fine, he's dog friendly". Well, my dog isn't dog friendly when it comes to bigger dogs, because he was once attacked by one, so he'll be very nervous hence why I've got him on a fecking leash. And if your dog is just running up to him what am I meant to do at that point?

My dog doesn't go for other dogs, he doesn't go for people, he's incredibly friendly. Guess what? He still stays on the fecking leash.
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Completely agree. It really pisses me off when I am walking with my dog on a leash and you have some one walking and sometimes running with a dog without a leash. It is so arrogant that they think the dog is so well trained etc. Perhaps that is the case but where I live dogs have to be on leashes!
 
Mr Pigeon said:
It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest to learn that most of these folk who can't even be arsed putting their dog on a leash don't bother with the simplest levels of training either. They're usually the twats you see coming along the road you're walking your own dog, shouting "he's fine, he's dog friendly". Well, my dog isn't dog friendly when it comes to bigger dogs, because he was once attacked by one, so he'll be very nervous hence why I've got him on a fecking leash. And if your dog is just running up to him what am I meant to do at that point?

My dog doesn't go for other dogs, he doesn't go for people, he's incredibly friendly. Guess what? He still stays on the fecking leash.
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Me neither. I hike a lot. The amount of times some dogs jumped at me and the owners just laughed it off is staggering. The shock when I don’t laugh back but actually react angry is always baffling. These idiots can’t even comprehend that I don’t want to be jumped by their dogs. Apparently it’s something everybody should enjoy.
 
HTG said:
Me neither. I hike a lot. The amount of times some dogs jumped at me and the owners just laughed it off is staggering. The shock when I don’t laugh back but actually react angry is always baffling. These idiots can’t even comprehend that I don’t want to be jumped by their dogs. Apparently it’s something everybody should enjoy.
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Oh yeah the laughing owners are just as annoying. I'll always remember one who was giggling as their dog kept trying to jump over my dog to get to me, and when their dog suddenly started growling the owner's giggles turned into an angry "He doesn't have this problem with other dogs" like my one was the problem.
 
My mate trains Police dogs and has also trained sheep dogs too, even he says to me that you can have the best behaved dog in the world, the friendliest dog ever, and it can have amazing recall. 99 times out of 100 the dog will come back if trained properly, but there's always that one time, and you can never be sure when that one time will be, especially around other dogs or if they get a whiff of a cat, rabbit or fox and just go after it.

Dogs sense things we don't and they also will just meet another dog they just don't like at all. I trained my fox red lab from a puppy during lockdown and I had him sorted, he would always come back, but then one time he didn't and he ended up half fighting with a much smaller dog who he just wouldn't leave alone and that was on a lead. His owner was upset and as I have had dogs come up to him and start a fight numerous times I instantly apologised and now never let him off his lead, even in the giant fields we have at the back of our house. We now pay to take him to a private field once a week where you book an hours time slot and they can run around to their hearts content.

I remember you used to have to have a license for your dog in the UK, but for some reason they scrapped it. I think it should be brought back and that chipping dogs should.be compulsory too.
 
When you go to places like Turkey, which has wild dogs throughout the country, incidents that we're seeing here (dogs attacking kids, etc) is so rare out there. Dog packs end up fighting with other packs, but dog fighting with humans is very rare.

Maybe dogs should just be wild and free, like in Turkey.
 
langster said:
My mate trains Police dogs and has also trained sheep dogs too, even he says to me that you can have the best behaved dog in the world, the friendliest dog ever, and it can have amazing recall. 99 times out of 100 the dog will come back if trained properly, but there's always that one time, and you can never be sure when that one time will be, especially around other dogs or if they get a whiff of a cat, rabbit or fox and just go after it.

Dogs sense things we don't and they also will just meet another dog they just don't like at all. I trained my fox red lab from a puppy during lockdown and I had him sorted, he would always come back, but then one time he didn't and he ended up half fighting with a much smaller dog who he just wouldn't leave alone and that was on a lead. His owner was upset and as I have had dogs come up to him and start a fight numerous times I instantly apologised and now never let him off his lead, even in the giant fields we have at the back of our house. We now pay to take him to a private field once a week where you book an hours time slot and they can run around to their hearts content.

I remember you used to have to have a license for your dog in the UK, but for some reason they scrapped it. I think it should be brought back and that chipping dogs should.be compulsory too.
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I run almost daily with my aussie and she's off leash then, but yeah I have to be on the lookout that we don't encounter other dogs. I trust mine a lot and she stays with me but you never know what the other might do, so there's that.

My sister-in-law has a 9-month old baby and that's what I'm most anxious about, he just started crawling, so now I never take our dog off leash when he's around; wouldn't be able to forgive myself if anything happened to him. Even though she's playful around him, she does make some unexpected movements, does not know her own power and impact and a dog is still a dog. Sister-in-law has a 10-year old toller retriever herself and she literally trusts him with the baby everywhere, even left alone. I don't get that but it's her own responsibility at least.
 
Whenever I go into Lewisham centre or walk around near where I live here, I will see at least one or two of the dangerous dogs and they are rabid. Terrifies me whenever they're in the vicinity of children playing.
 
SilentWitness said:
Whenever I go into Lewisham centre or walk around near where I live here, I will see at least one or two of the dangerous dogs and they are rabid. Terrifies me whenever they're in the vicinity of children playing.
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You live in Lewisham or thereabouts? Used to live in Grove Park
 
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