With so much data available, the weather forecast has become accurate. Similar to what is being done with data in football. A sport that is famous for the moments of brilliance is gradually being taken over by quantification. Pep, Klopp and the rest use them. Whoever the next coach is should combine these approaches with the United DNA. Still, I think Solskjaer will be okay against Liverpool and City. He has pulled out a draw after a draw against these big teams.
Ole Sack Watch
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Expecting anyone to make them title winners this season isnt realistic. But this group of players is good enough to win the league, the manager isn't. I just want a young, progressive, attacking manager. We should have got Nagelsmann a year ago, but that ship has sailed. So right now Ten Hag. And if not him there's load of others who'll do better.
I am convinced no one as long as Pep and Klopp (but especially Pep and City‘s deep squad) remain in the league.
However with an upgrade in DM (and Ole had enough time to buy one) a better manager could at least come close or do a Tuchel and win the CL.
Sack ASAP.
This season can still be salvaged.
It is beyond obvious what will transpire if we don't make a change. Ole isn't going to magically become a great manager overnight. This is who he is. This is how we'll always look.
Phone up Ajax and pay whatever it takes to buy out Ten Hag from his contract.
This season can still be salvaged.
It is beyond obvious what will transpire if we don't make a change. Ole isn't going to magically become a great manager overnight. This is who he is. This is how we'll always look.
Phone up Ajax and pay whatever it takes to buy out Ten Hag from his contract.
I'm not sure, if we lose the next two. That Tottenham game could be pivotal. I also think losing the next two is very possible.
I think it goes deeper than a DM. The midfield needs a complete revamp, with the forwards we have now.
It’s all banter on Twitter. Liverpool fans are making #Olein trend and you got things like this
With respect, that's an absolute pile of bullshit.
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I don’t think it was realistic to win the league with this squad whoever was in charge. It’s fantastically filled with attacking talent but woefully short in a key position midfield.
Ten Hag the answer the man to take United above City, Liverpool and Chelsea?
This season we realistically were competing for the best runner up and top 4. The Ronaldo signing has skewed the perception of what we are capable of.
Who are these loads that will do better?
This is my issue. I don’t see an available manager who I am confident would do a better job. Ole isn’t perfect and he’s not going to win the league this season. But he’s changed the squad for the better and improved the culture at the club. A terrible defeat to Leicester doesn’t change that.
Who are these better managers for United? Who could walk in and improve this side? Because right now we look like a side fighting for the champions league places and in our current state that’s probably where we are at.
This question is always asked like ‘no one is available at the moment so let’s stick it out with Ole’. At this stage getting anyone in is better than our current trajectory under Ole. Why do we need to wait to things get really bad? This isn’t about this season. The same issues have arisen since Ole has been in charge. Lack of consistency, set pieces, slow tempo especially in the first half of games.
The club is Manchester United. They like to sell themselves as the biggest club in the world. Poach a decent manager from another club.
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I agree we could lose the next two. I just don’t see that happening personally. I think this was a woeful defensive performance made worse by in hindsight a poor decision to rush Maguire back and a line up that went too much for the jugular too soon. We lacked defensive stability in midfield.
@VP89 why?
Our issue clear as day is that line breaking passes come through our midfield centre too often. We don’t get spun in behind and our flanks are relatively secure too.
I now 100% see why Fred and McTominay are the CM pair because while it isn’t world class and pretty it hides our biggest flaw.
At least acknowledge that this isn’t about one defeat.
I voted yes change the manager, but feck Zidane. He's not the right man for the job.
You should read his next post
Why?
you are having a laugh. Did anyone expect Chelsea to win the CL last year with that squad ?
Ole is the worst PL manager by far and as soon as he’s gone he’ll fall into oblivion Di Matteo style.
he spent half a billion to achieve nothing so far and this is another season down the drain.
having said that most of the Ole cult followers deserve him to stay in charge for as long as possible to watch this type of football and where he will put us in the end.
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I’m not saying nobody could but anybody is not always better. We’ve had the manager merry go round with the supposed world class talent or those with clear visions or philosophies and they haven’t worked.
Ole isn’t in my mind the absolute elite manager but he’s a good fit for the club right now and our squad is in a much better shape than when he took over.
I’ve always thought that Ole would be the one to hand the keys over to another manager at the right time and that this new manager would be the one to reap the rewards of the foundations he built but I don’t see where this new manger is coming from and I don’t think we’re in such a dreadful state that we need to cut loose.
We can still achieve top 4 and build on that for next season. We weren’t ever in my mind down as potential champions this season.
Who would you poach?
You're calling Chelsea beside Liverpool and City but I'm sure if Tuchel was available at Psg and never went to Chelsea you'd still be saying no one can improve this side
This is downright ridiculous its funny
Plus he had a philosophy. It may be boring but he wanted to play possession football.
Hides our biggest flaw which we have chosen not to address for two seasons? We know upstairs are clueless, but Ole should be demanding this every year.
We get bypassed through attack and midfield far too easily, Leicester in two passes today we’re at our defence, we look like headless chickens 95% of the time.
Yeah, I don't either for what's it's worth. That being said I see Atalanta playing very similar to Leicester today and Liverpool are clearly ahead of us, so I am a bit worried.
Definitely agree on the defensive side, it was shocking. I do have a feeling with the forwards we have, we then need a hustling midfield like McFred, but they're also not top quality. If we want to play Pogba and matic, we need an energetic pressing front line - Rashford, Cavani and Greenwood would work.
Overall, it just feels like we haven't hung our hat on where we really want to be as a team and stuck in Limbo. Today's lineup look so imbalanced it was a joke and the rushing back of Maguire, was there for all to see.
Love Ole, he's done really well to bring the feel good factor back to United the last season or two but he's never been the long-term answer. Top man and a wonderful player for us but far too limited as a manager for a club that aspires to win the league.
100%. We have a squad capable of challenging, with a coach that just isn't making the most out of it. If we don't want to waste this squad, waste this season and start handicapped next season, then we need to get rid of him asap. It's not too late to save the season and fight for serious trophies. But it just won't happen with Ole.
Isn’t this the exact problem? We just signed Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo but as fans we shouldn’t expect to win the league. Why? They are three world class players capable of getting into any team. Expectation has to be higher than top 4 prior to the season. Ole has reduced expectations because no one expects us to do anything. Liverpool have barely signed anyone for two seasons and they are still miles ahead of us.
Right now I’d take any manager who wants to play high press, fast paced football. It’s the way football has gone and we are so far behind the top clubs on this. At present I would go for ten Hag. If it doesn’t work out get another manager in until it does work. We don’t need to give managers 3 years every single time. We should be rewarding success. Managers should have to buy time by winning silverware.
With the right players it might even have been similar to City, I remember before Shaw got injured we was very threatening from the left. But once Shaw got injured we had no creativity.
We have a DM who never gets a chance. What makes you think getting a DM is going to sort our problems? We added a CB. In fact two CBs. England CB and French CB. We got a forward for over 70 million. We got one of the best forwards in the World. One who has won the Ballon d'Or 5 times. One who has won the CL 5 times. The Euros once. PL, La Liga and Serie A many times.
We have spent too much on players. If we had spent half of that to get a top class manager we would have already won trophies.
Like how we finished 2nd and reached a final last season and were supposed to build on that this season?
It's not going to happen. All downhill from here.
In my opinion he's a bit like Ole but for Real. Club legend. Great man manager. But I never thought his sides played great football which is what I think we're lacking right now. We need someone who will instill clear patterns of play and who will make us work collectively instead of the current system which is based on individual talent
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I absolutely understand the concerns of reasonable fans. I understand the frustration and hurt at losses. I know for many it’s not just this defeat but I also think for many unrealistic expectations are the issue here.
This squad is and absolutely should be a top 4 squad. Anything less is failure of management. However to write off Ole in spite of the fact that is still achievable with no clear alternative is what I’m currently finding hard to justify.
Im sure you all think I’m just being a “too red” or whatever but I don’t think the solution currently lies in a new manger I think we’re short of defensive midfielders of the requisite quality to win the league.
No but they had the basis of a solid side. Their midfield base was solid and helped keep them in games for knockout football.
I can’t really take you too seriously when you revert to hyperbolic statements.
It’s not another season down the drain if we can secure champions league football and attract the right midfield signings for next season. That’s crunch time for me.
Im saying Chelsea’s squad is better than ours. Do you not agree? I would say Klopp and Pep are comfortably better mangers than Tuchel but Chelsea have a better squad than Liverpool.
In hindsight it may have been better to keep him. He may get the best out of the younger players. He has a set way of playing and has the right set up and formation. I said even when he was appointed that it is a huge mistake to hoist Giggs on him as the assistant manager. For the reason I have seen a lot his teams and he does not play the way United played under SAF. Plus the Rooney saga. Rooney is not a LVG kind of player.
Agree with you. Building from being second is to win. We are not going to win the PL. We are not going to be even second.
Bingo.
The single most important spend in the entire club.
And we have got it wrong.
Most clubs get it wrong most of the time but we seem to spend double the amount of time that other clubs do to work out we’ve fecked it up.
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So you think we had more of a chance of the title at the start of the season than Liverpool, City and Chelsea?
Ole addresses it with the players he has. Fred and McTominay. How do you know he isn’t wanting a DM but the board won’t sanction the £100m for Rice or whoever?
We get bypassed today with a midfield pairing of Pogba and Matic. Does that happen with Fred and McTominay?
I think you and I agree on all these points.
I said this from the start I don’t think Ole is that “elite” manager but I also don’t see where this elite manager is coming from.
He should make way when the time is right and we’ve found a long term solution. Right now he’s in my mind the extended caretaker who has made significant progress in improving the side. We can still achieve our realistic targets for the season under him of top 4 and cup success.
I understand the frustration but I also know that you don’t win the league nowadays without that solid midfield. I’m sure Ole knows this too hence his reliance on McFred.
Liverpool have an older squad at their last peak years. They should be ahead of us now. But next year…
So your plan is to cycle through managers who play high pressing football until one works? Ok.
Who is this DM you speak of?
I thought we would have bought a DM never in a million years did I think we’d have Ronaldo instead.
I don’t share your pessimism.
We know Ole can't, so sticking with him doesn't achieve anything, much better to take a chance on a promising candidate to see if they can. Maybe the Ajax guy or Rose from Dortmund. Last season was the time to change with Tuchel, Nagelsmann and Poch available and we stuck with Ole.
Ole out
I have doubts about Zidan though. He looked very good at a good Madrid side. I'd like to see him elsewhere before considering him a top tier manager.
We need a modern manager with a clear modern way of playing. Who that could be, I'm not to sure.
Conte could work for a season or two but we all know how it would inevitably turn out. Is that the way nowadays though? Short term managers for sporadic success?
I'm hoping for a manager that brings an exciting style of football, a plan that the players can work at during the game and a manager that doesn't use the term 'the United way' as a get out of jail free card during an interview . Leadership from the dugout and a strong sence of purpose in their work.
Honestly, it pains me to feel like we need to start again from scratch but that's how it feels. Work on a formation that is current and that suits our lads. Start playing attractive football. Have the balls to drop the names that don't play how we want them to. Personally, I'd like to see a 433. Yes we need a build a midfield for it but with Rashford, Sancho and Greenwood we'd have exciting wide players that suit. Bruno could fit well into one of the three in midfield and we'd have to buy two others. Shaw bringing the width on the left and a new RB. It's easy on paper but a man can dream.
I can't see us parting with Ole unless fourth is mathematically out of reach and although the next month of fixtures are challenging, I'm sure we'll pick up a few wins and we'll be told to 'trust the process'
I just feel that the few good times we've had over the Ole years were dispite him being our manager and not because he is.
I have doubts about Zidan though. He looked very good at a good Madrid side. I'd like to see him elsewhere before considering him a top tier manager.
We need a modern manager with a clear modern way of playing. Who that could be, I'm not to sure.
Conte could work for a season or two but we all know how it would inevitably turn out. Is that the way nowadays though? Short term managers for sporadic success?
I'm hoping for a manager that brings an exciting style of football, a plan that the players can work at during the game and a manager that doesn't use the term 'the United way' as a get out of jail free card during an interview . Leadership from the dugout and a strong sence of purpose in their work.
Honestly, it pains me to feel like we need to start again from scratch but that's how it feels. Work on a formation that is current and that suits our lads. Start playing attractive football. Have the balls to drop the names that don't play how we want them to. Personally, I'd like to see a 433. Yes we need a build a midfield for it but with Rashford, Sancho and Greenwood we'd have exciting wide players that suit. Bruno could fit well into one of the three in midfield and we'd have to buy two others. Shaw bringing the width on the left and a new RB. It's easy on paper but a man can dream.
I can't see us parting with Ole unless fourth is mathematically out of reach and although the next month of fixtures are challenging, I'm sure we'll pick up a few wins and we'll be told to 'trust the process'
I just feel that the few good times we've had over the Ole years were dispite him being our manager and not because he is.
It's over. He's done. They don't believe anymore. I don't think there's any coming back.
Because you're wrong. The problem is that we are working in a chaotic system, bunching in attacks and having zero organizational structure when we get turned over. Throw Kante in and at least two of the Leicester goals go in today. Its that simple.
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Do we?
What if coming to a league in which they have zero experience with zero major success they end up failing too?
You say I’m wrong but then end up agreeing about midfield with me. We didn’t have a good structure today with Pogba and Matic and I said before we were too attacking and in hindsight playing a not fully fit Maguire was a mistake.
We do have structure most of the time but given the above factors, injuries and ineligible players today I can see why we had these problems and I know from post match comments Ole can too.
This is an interesting and potentially unpopular opinion that bears exploring. How much of the temporarily feel-good lift was down to Ole himself? Or was it the fact the fans and players were relieved to see Mourinho and his toxic brand leave the club more than anything. Granted there's the feel good factor about a United legend taking over and winning a couple of games (notably that comeback at PSG), but the rest of it I feel was down to players like Bruno coming in and lighting the place up during Ole's time here.
I also feel that if many of us were honest we could see the signs very early on that this wasn't going to work, but decided to prolong the euphoria of no longer having Mourinho and that PSG comeback being an amazing feat, to the point where we'd actively look to make excuses to absolve Ole of his shortcomings - e.g: Glazers not backing him, its not his team yet, doesn't have an adequate midfield or defence, etc. I think its just reached a point where even the most ardent of Ole supporters can see most of those excuses are no longer valid and he himself is the problem.
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