Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4

Is Ole a good appointment?

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Phil Osophy said:
Still winning his own league by some margin.

http://solskjaertabellen.com/ (I love the website :drool:)

+5 points to Liverpool and City
+7 to Arsenal
+8 to Spurs
+13 to Chelsea

It tells you everything about how disastrous was our situation before he came, that even after a run like this we're still 5th and 6th if Chelsea win his remaining league game. Even the excellence in terms of results and breaking historic records every week could not be enough to get us top-4.

I say this in anticipation, because if we ended up 5th or 6th I can see some people telling how he isn't good enough because the man isn't able to get even a top 4 place in the league. So when we analyze things let's remember where we come from and the general context.

No pre-season, no signings, learning about his players and changing our approach along the way, and still getting more points than the league challengers. I'm not sure if everyone is aware of the magnificence of all this.
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I never thought Top 4 should be the target, since it be history making to reach if from where we were. And indeed, if we got top 4 due to some calamity of the teams above us (like a points deduction) that wouldnt guarantee him the job either. It was always about his performances in the round, and trying to see if what he was doing would work on a permanant basis.
 
Ole must be given the permanent job in my opinion. Not only has he improved the morale of the team and the dressing room but also the supporters. We have intelligent support here at Old Trafford and we know exactly how good and bad our team is. What's more encouraging is, Ole knows exactly where we are at the moment and how we can improve from here on in. He has given us a huge boost by showing players that they're on a high pedestal and only hard work plus consistency will keep them here. He has never said one bad thing about the players. The best thing i can say about him is, even Young has improved a lot since we have started playing on the floor. No more long ball crap for us unless we aim to find the player with the pass, the wingers are staying wide and we're able to push from both sides and get into the box more often.

We have improved defensively because of our midfield improving so drastically! well done Ole and i hope to be onboard the train for as long as possible.
 
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Phil Osophy said:
Still winning his own league by some margin.

http://solskjaertabellen.com/ (I love the website :drool:)

+5 points to Liverpool and City
+7 to Arsenal
+8 to Spurs
+13 to Chelsea

It tells you everything about how disastrous was our situation before he came, that even after a run like this we're still 5th and 6th if Chelsea win his remaining league game. Even the excellence in terms of results and breaking historic records every week could not be enough to get us top-4.

I say this in anticipation, because if we ended up 5th or 6th I can see some people telling how he isn't good enough because the man isn't able to get even a top 4 place in the league. So when we analyze things let's remember where we come from and the general context.

No pre-season, no signings, learning about his players and changing our approach along the way, and still getting more points than the league challengers. I'm not sure if everyone is aware of the magnificence of all this.
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Great Post and I totally agree. Ole has been having to learn this squad, it's strengths and weaknesses on the fly and to do what's he's done is brilliant, Ole has the wheel.
 
Phil Osophy said:
Still winning his own league by some margin.

http://solskjaertabellen.com/ (I love the website :drool:)

+5 points to Liverpool and City
+7 to Arsenal
+8 to Spurs
+13 to Chelsea

It tells you everything about how disastrous was our situation before he came, that even after a run like this we're still 5th and 6th if Chelsea win his remaining league game. Even the excellence in terms of results and breaking historic records every week could not be enough to get us top-4.

I say this in anticipation, because if we ended up 5th or 6th I can see some people telling how he isn't good enough because the man isn't able to get even a top 4 place in the league. So when we analyze things let's remember where we come from and the general context.

No pre-season, no signings, learning about his players and changing our approach along the way, and still getting more points than the league challengers. I'm not sure if everyone is aware of the magnificence of all this.
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His points-per-game ratio has just sneaked ahead of City's outrageous haul last season. 100 vs 100.2

To expect to win leagues now, this, or close to this, has to be the standard.
 
TRUERED89 said:
United have won 8 consecutive away games for the first time in our history, OGS has come in and smashed that record like it was joke. What a man!! I wonder where we would be if Jose was sacked in October/November. We are 5 points off 3rd also, one of the best performances under OGS considering the injuries.
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Probably in the fight for the title. If we interpolate the results of these 11 matches for the entire season (it makes no sense, but why not) we are in course for 100.12 points, which would be an EPL record.

Jose deserves to be judged for crimes against football.
 
hocane said:
Anyone think the likes of Giggs, Neville, Butt or Scholes could do something similar? They also knows the club inside out
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Neville was horrible in Valencia, Butt looks good in academy but hasn't ever coached a first team, Scholes is coaching in fifth league or whatever, and Giggs hasn't done anything of note yet. In his brief spell to us, based on the documentary, he was the most generic manager ever and didn't show absolutely nothing.

People at times forget that Ole is not a novice. He has coached for a decade now (more than 300 matches), won back to back titles with a team who hasn't won a title since or before, as a huge underdog passed the group stage of Europa, and on the other hand of the spectrum, got relegated with a team who was going to get relegated anyway. He has a lot of experience, while at the same time also failures to learn from. He is not a novice and was easily the best choice from all our legends.
 
Trizy said:
#
What a strange post given we have had so many academy players in the last 2 games :wenger:.

Greenwood and Garner at 17, players that young rarely start a PL game for any club.
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Rooney in Paris said:
Very strange, it's actually surprising that he's put as much emphasis on youth (in pressers, bringing them with the squad, handing a couple of debuts) given he's only interim manager.
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Not the first time @Bola has made this point for whatever reasons known to no-one bar him.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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First question, is your first name Jose? This is just utter bollocks and here are some stats for you.
Since Ole has taken over we have concided 10 goals in 15 games and that means 0,66 goals per games.

If you look at some stats and to compare them with this:
Season fewest goals conceded:
99/2000 Liverpool with 0,78 goals
2002/2003 Man Utd with 0,89 goals
2003/2004 Arsenal with 0,68 goals
2017/2018 Man City with 0,71 goals

So trying to say that the defence is not good is just plain wrong as stats do not lie, do they Jose? And Ole has managed to do that while playing good attacking football at the same time, go figure.
 
Whatever happens from here, I'll always be grateful to Ole and Phelan (who I think is just as important in all this) for bringing back what I thought was gone forever.

I had reached the point where I was watching out of a sense of duty under each of our previous 3 managers. I was watching in hope rather than with expectation. I was baffled time and again that a group of such talented players could be so bad, so often for so long.

I sure do hope he gets the job because he's shown way more than just new manager bounce and smiling a lot.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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Agreed, it's not getting better (this is sarcasm). PL Games below, defensive stats:

Jose
Total Games - 17
Total Conceded - 29
Conceded Per Game - 1.7
Opponents Shots Per Game - 12.2
Opponents Shots On Target Per Game - 4.7
Opponents Shots Off Target Per Game - 4.5
Opponents Shots Blocked Per Game - 2.9

Ole
Total Games - 11
Total Conceded - 7
Conceded Per Game - 0.6
Opponents Shots Per Game - 11.1
Opponents Shots On Target Per Game - 3.5
Opponents Shots Off Target Per Game - 5.3
Opponents Shots Blocked Per Game - 2.4

To conclude:
- Significantly less goals conceded
- Less Shots per game
- Less Shots on Target per game
- More Shots off Target per game
- Less Shots blocked per game

So across the board our stats have improved. From the 11 games we've played in the PL the only clubs that have managed more than 3 shots on target against us has been Burnley (4), Leicester (6) and Tottenham (8).
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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Worst post I have seen in a while. Impressive stuff.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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Must have slept through the start of this season? To summarise for you: we are much, much better defensively under Ole using the same players as Mou had. Doesn't mean we're the finished article but we're miles better.
 
Rolaholic said:
Solskjaer.jpg


A couple of other options while we're at it...

ole2.jpg


1214650.jpg


7449ca62-f637-4145-b4dd-ff84293f7c34.jpg


1214530.jpg
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Thanks, much better quality. Was considering the goal one and then these:

More relevant today maybe
images


Always loved this
1548419614094.jpg
 
Wedge said:
Great Post and I totally agree. Ole has been having to learn this squad, it's strengths and weaknesses on the fly and to do what's he's done is brilliant, Ole has the wheel.
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But he's had Fergie to lean on and there's no doubt the Wizard saw a lot sitting up there in the stands during Jose's tenure.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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I felt a bit like this initially, but since Smalling's come back from his injury and Shaw's stepped up his form it feels like we're barely conceding any chances and look much more assured and comfortable. If we had an actual RB instead of a winger (no disservice to Young but he's not great defensively), I daresay we'd have one of the strongest defences in the league.
 
glazed said:
By doing something new. I'm all for returning to club tradition and ditching the awful post SAF football. But that on its own won't be enough to win the big prizes and we all know it. Ole will have to add something special to beat Klopp and Pep, or get to the last eight in Europe, and I look forward to seeing what it might be.
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You write as if we now play with the same tactics Ferguson used (and as if he himself didn’t use and upgrade our tactics several times during his reign). Surely that’s not what you mean?

Formation-wise we have played mostly 4-3-3 with variations of 4-2-3-1, 4-4-2 diamond and even 3-5-2 which only sparsely overlaps with Fergusons most used formations (4-4-2 wings, 4-4-1-1 with shades of 4-2-3-1 later, 4-5-1 away in Europe and for a period 4-3-3 with Rooney-Tevez-Ronaldo.

Our use of interchangeable high press with directness, low press with zonal defence and counterattacks, or possesion with fb’s for width, based on game situations and oposition, is very modern football, based on eclectic use of inspiration from Klopp, Pep, Mourinho or perhaps rather Egil Drillo Olsen. Ferguson himself was eclectic, but used other sources. IMO.
 
Moriarty said:
But he's had Fergie to lean on and there's no doubt the Wizard saw a lot sitting up there in the stands during Jose's tenure.
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One thing that’s interesting, is all the speculations about: ‘Is it really the work of Carrick and McKenna we see?’, ‘Is it Phelan’s work?’ ‘Is it Fergie that’s behind it all?’ ‘Is it Mourinho’s work only without handcuffs?’ ‘Is it just catering to what the disposable players are good at?’.

Sometimes these plausible-sounding ideas are presented as a ‘maybe-it’s-not-about-Ole-(and-Poch-me-or-or-Ince-could-have-done-the-same). I tend to think they are all true, and that probably no one but Solskjær could make all these things count at the same time in a coherent way.
 


A perfect example of how stats can be conjured to any argument if you look hard enough.

Anyone with a pair of functioning eyes could see how we dealt with Palace and the injuries we had in a controlled and professional manner, as well as the overall performance during the game where we didn't look under much threat, if at all, from Palace's attackers.

I was at the game, and there was not a single point of the match where I was nervous. The result was never in doubt, and yet according to xG, we were shaded by Palace's superior performance? :confused:

Even if this was the case, a stat like that is totally devoid of the context of 5/6 of our first choice attack and midfield being unavailable.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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Sorry but our defence IS clearly getting better.
All the stats back it up. And if you watched how we evolved from when ole first took over up till now, it's bloody obvious.
 
rotherham_red said:


A perfect example of how stats can be conjured to any argument if you look hard enough.

Anyone with a pair of functioning eyes could see how we dealt with Palace and the injuries we had in a controlled and professional manner, as well as the overall performance during the game where we didn't look under much threat, if at all, from Palace's attackers.

I was at the game, and there was not a single point of the match where I was nervous. The result was never in doubt, and yet according to xG, we were shaded by Palace's superior performance? :confused:

Even if this was the case, a stat like that is totally devoid of the context of 5/6 of our first choice attack and midfield being unavailable.
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What absolute gobshite from a clown that likely didn't watch the match.

Indeed stats say what one wants them to. The thing about the above and comments from posters saying we give too many chances to the opposition: it's like they've forgotten what it was like to watch the United of days gone. We were never a team to suffocate a game with possession or sit back and stifle the opposite side to no chances and nip a goal ourselves. We played fast, expansive football and were often having to deal with a swift counter. But usually our attacking nous was so effective the opposition chose caution...we still had matches here and there like, say, David Bentley scoring a hattrick. There were plenty of narrow games we held onto , but they were exciting. That's always been my interpretation of the United way, where we "make it difficult for ourselves".

Right now giving a chance or two more away than we would like is not a bad price to pay for the results (we made up so many points!!!) and the feel good factor, especially considering the circumstances to which Ole arrived. It's unrealistic to expect more. Plus if we appoint Ole ful time, and then add reinforcements and bed them into this mentality we will improve there and be in for a treat.
 
rotherham_red said:


A perfect example of how stats can be conjured to any argument if you look hard enough.

Anyone with a pair of functioning eyes could see how we dealt with Palace and the injuries we had in a controlled and professional manner, as well as the overall performance during the game where we didn't look under much threat, if at all, from Palace's attackers.

I was at the game, and there was not a single point of the match where I was nervous. The result was never in doubt, and yet according to xG, we were shaded by Palace's superior performance? :confused:

Even if this was the case, a stat like that is totally devoid of the context of 5/6 of our first choice attack and midfield being unavailable.
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Not sure what's worse. xG or him saying Ole should be smart and reject ManUtd offer.

This xG has really fecked up how people watch football.
 
rotherham_red said:


A perfect example of how stats can be conjured to any argument if you look hard enough.

Anyone with a pair of functioning eyes could see how we dealt with Palace and the injuries we had in a controlled and professional manner, as well as the overall performance during the game where we didn't look under much threat, if at all, from Palace's attackers.

I was at the game, and there was not a single point of the match where I was nervous. The result was never in doubt, and yet according to xG, we were shaded by Palace's superior performance? :confused:

Even if this was the case, a stat like that is totally devoid of the context of 5/6 of our first choice attack and midfield being unavailable.
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agreed, it was only the schlup chance immediately after we scored and switched off which he missed and that spell of 10-15 minutes or so which was entirely precipitated by Young's brainfart and cockiness where we looked vulnerable but in general, subjectively seeing our games we look more 'secure' and 'assured' during games so i'm not sure where the ones who are saying we look extremely vulnerable defensively are coming from if they are actually watching these games and still having that perception. Maybe they panic too easily and feel the oppo shouldn't even have possession in our third?
 
Ban said:
Really, xG is one of the stupidest things around.
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That stat is partly why I can't stand other footballing communities like "r/soccer". It's treated like the holy grail of football stats, but like most stats it lacks any context. We had 5 very good goal scoring opportunities yesterday yet our xG is only 0.86? Absolute nonsense.
 
I am feeling positive today, and I am starting to wonder what Ole is capable of, given time and financial backing. How much better can this squad become in his tenure? We are seeing the most of the squad looking reinvigorated under him, after just a little time, so how could it look, say, in 2021? Guardiola took a little time to create his azur monster, and without any further comparisons, I wonder what Ole potentially could create here. Could he take United to another level?
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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We have conceded just 1 goal against Spurs, Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool. Compare that to 10 we conceded against them in the first half of the season and if that doesn't convince you, nothing will.
 
rotherham_red said:


A perfect example of how stats can be conjured to any argument if you look hard enough.

Anyone with a pair of functioning eyes could see how we dealt with Palace and the injuries we had in a controlled and professional manner, as well as the overall performance during the game where we didn't look under much threat, if at all, from Palace's attackers.

I was at the game, and there was not a single point of the match where I was nervous. The result was never in doubt, and yet according to xG, we were shaded by Palace's superior performance? :confused:

Even if this was the case, a stat like that is totally devoid of the context of 5/6 of our first choice attack and midfield being unavailable.
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At the end of the season:

Ed: Congratulations Ole you finished 3rd and won Fa Cup
Ole: Thank you, so when do I start as permanent manager??
Ed: Permanent manager?? Are you crazy have you see the xG stats you were outperformed by Fulham and Crystal Palace!! You are not getting the job

:wenger:
 
Another test passed I was fearful for us last night with all those injuries. Yes at times it wasnt pretty but we still won the game and scored 3 goals.

Whatever happens with Ole it makes you wonder what on earth Mourinho was doing- Ole has signed no one so has exactly the same squad yet look at his results. So glad we acted and removed him while we could potentially salvage top 4 and not when it had mathematically gone. However makes you wonder what might have been had we acted in the summer when he was already starting to play up the warning signs were there in pre season couldn't even beat small clubs. But then would we have got Ole.
 
breakout67 said:
Our defence is definitely not getting better. We concede chances galore against any decent team and we just try to outscore them. That is the major difference, instead of sitting back and relying on a suspect defence we make the gamble that our forwards will do the job better than their forwards. This works out in most games because our forward line is very good, but becomes undone when we are up against a world class team who have more quality than us.
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I guess it is luck that we have had very few goals scored on us in comparison to other teams since OGS became manager then, right?
 
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